If you have an old debt, you may wonder if you still have to pay it? Can your creditors really take you to court after this long?
English law says a creditor only has a limited amount of time – typically six years – to take you to court. The term for a debt that is so old that it can’t be enforced in court is “statute barred”.
(You may have heard the phrase being time-barred, that means the same thing. Sometimes it is called status barred because the term statute-barred has been misheard.)
This article answers the most common questions people have about statute-barred debt, including when the six-year period begins.
If you live in Scotland, the laws are very different. Phone National Debtline on 0808 808 4000 as they have Scottish advice experts.
Contents
An overview
What is statute barring?
Creditors have to take legal action about debts within certain times which are set out in the Limitations Act 1980. For most sorts of debts and bills in England and Wales this time is six years.
If the creditor doesn’t start court action within this time, the debt is not enforceable because it is “statute-barred”. When a debt is statute-barred it still exists legally, but because you cannot be taken to court for it, you do not have to make any payments to it.
This six-year period begins when the creditor has a cause of action – this is the point at which the creditor could go to court for the debt.
In January 2019 there was a decision in the Court of Appeal (Doyle v PRA) that changed the point at which the six-year period starts for some debts including credit cards and loans.
If you are making the normal minimum monthly payments to a debt, you can’t be taken to court for it. It is only when you have missed payments and the creditor can go to court that the 6-year period starts.
Think of a timer that runs for 6 years – which can be reset
A good way to think of statute barring is that there is a 6 year timer. This is set running when the creditor has a cause of action. The sand takes 6 years to drain slowly through… at the end, your debt is statute barred.
But if you make a payment to the debt or acknowledge it in writing during the six years, the clock is reset back to start at 6 years again.
So if you are making monthly payments, even tiny ones, a debt will never become statute barred as the clock resets back to 6 years every month. For you this article isn’t relevant, instead read Can I stop paying this old debt?
What is a cause of action?
Someone can’t sue you for a debt unless they have a good reason to – this is their cause of action. What that good reason is depends on the type of debt, how it is regulated and, sometimes, what the contract for the debt says.
This has always been complicated for some debts such as overdrafts which don’t have regular payments. You may have stopped using your overdraft 8 years ago, but your bank may not have realised this for a long while – so when would they have the right to sue you?
The January 2019 court judgment decided that a creditor’s cause of action does not start for some credit debts (including some loans and credit cards) until the creditor has sent you a Default Notice. The problem here is that you may not remember when you got that or if one was ever sent. Also the creditor can just delay sending you this so your debt may never become statute barred.
How can I tell if my debt is statute-barred?
Unsecured debts, including most loans, credit cards, catalogues and overdrafts will normally be statute-barred in England and Wales if you can say YES to all the following four points:
- it had been more than six years since you last made a payment; and
- the creditor has a cause of action more than six years ago; and
- you haven’t acknowledged the debt in writing during this time; and
- the creditor hasn’t already gone to court for a CCJ.
With a joint loan, it matters if either of you makes a payment. If you have split-up, you may think a debt is statute-barred but it isn’t because your ex has made a payment to it in the last 6 years.
Acknowledging the debt has to be in writing. If you haven’t done this, it doesn’t matter if the creditor has written to you, or you have discussed the debt on the phone – this won’t stop the debt being statute barred. If you have reclaimed PPI, this is likely to have acknowledged the debt.
The cause of action is the most difficult point to determine here. See this National Debtline factsheet which has a section on When Does the Limitation Period Start Running?
If you can say Yes to points (1), (3) and (4) but are unsure about point (2) on the cause of action, I suggest you call National Debtline on 0808 808 4000 and talk through your situation with them.
Sometimes the exact date a debt becomes statute barred matters:
- if you write saying that a debt is statute-barred and you are wrong because the debt isn’t, then your letter is likely to have “reset the clock” by acknowledging the debt;
- if you have received a court form about a debt, you need to know whether you can defend the case on the grounds the debt is statute barred.
Questions about different sorts of debt
When does a CCJ become statute barred?
It never does. But if the creditor hasn’t taken any enforcement action in six years, they will need to apply to the court for permission if they want to enforce the debt by using bailiffs. This is unusual.
If you are contacted after 6 years about a CCJ that you have not been paying, phone National Debtline for advice.
Statute barring for mortgage shortfalls and secured loans
If your debt is still secured – you are still living in the house there is a mortgage or a secured loan on – then statute barring isn’t relevant. What matters is if you get too far into arrears the lender can go to court to repossess your house.
But what about when the house has been sold so the security no longer exists but you still owe money on the debts?
For a debt resulting from a mortgage shortfall, the time allowed in the Limitations Act is twelve years. But many lenders follow the old Council for Mortgage Lenders code, now part of the MCOB Rules (Mortgage Conduct of Business), that says:
anyone whose property was taken into possession and sold more than six years ago, and who has not been contacted by their lender for recovery of the outstanding debt, will not now be asked to pay the shortfall.
See National Debtline’s Factsheet on Mortgage Shortfalls for more details, such as what does “contact” mean? And phone National Debtline if you are contacted about a mortgage shortfall debt which is between 6 and 12 years old.
Do tax debts or benefit overpayments become statute barred?
Tax debts such as Income tax and VAT do not become statute barred. If you are wondering if your debt is a “tax debt”, HMRC has a list of “not tax debts”, which do become statute barred.
The situation regarding benefit overpayments is more complicated – although they can become statute-barred, there are other ways the debt could still be recovered. You should take advice about these sorts of debts – contact National Debtline or your local Citizens Advice are very good with benefit issues.
What about old council tax arrears?
A council should not go to court and ask for a liability order for council tax arrears more than six years after the council tax became due. But if the council already has a Liability Order, this will never become time-barred.
If you get a letter out of the blue about a Liability Order for council tax arrears from ten years ago, this may feel very unreasonable. One of the main reasons time limits exist is that people don’t keep paperwork forever, so you may have no way of proving that you paid the debt at the time. This is one of the rare occasions when it may be worth asking the creditor to Write-off the Debt. It may also be worth getting a local councillor involved for council tax arrears.
What about utilities?
Gas, electricity and water bills become statute barred 6 years after the date on the bill. There are also rules regulating when a supplier can “back bill” – send a new bill for charges more than 12 months old. If you think you have a problem with back billing, go to your local Citizens Advice and ask for their help.
Getting letters and court forms about a debt you think is statute barred
Can I ignore a letter about a statute barred debt?
Are you 100% sure that it is statute barred? If you aren’t certain talk to National Debtline.
If you do not recognise the debt you should probably write a “Prove It” letter to your creditor. This is worded so that it doesn’t acknowledge the debt.
If you recognise the debt but you are certain it is statute-barred, you could ignore a letter. But it might be less stressful to reply pointing out that it is statute-barred rather than get more letters and possibly court forms. National Debtline has a template letter you can use – phone them about this.
Creditor says I made a payment in the last 6 years but I didn’t
Ask your creditor for the date of this alledged payment. Then get your bank statements for that month – you can still get these even from closed bank account going back 6 years.
If there is no trace of you making this payment, complain to the creditor and attach a copy of the bank statement. Ask them for further defails of the payment.
If the creditor persists, take this complaint to the Financial ombudsman.
Can I ignore a Letter Before Action/Claim about a statute barred debt?
This is a bad idea. It is much easier to challenge a creditor by saying the debt is statute barred using the Reply Form than it is to defend a court case.
See How to reply to a Letter before Action which looks at what you should do when you think the debt is statute barred.
I have been sent a Claim Form for a statute barred debt – what should I do?
Do NOT ignore the Claim Form. If you do, a judgment will be made against you in default because you haven’t replied, even if your debt is statute barred.
So if the creditor takes you to court, you must defend the claim on the grounds that it is statute-barred. And also look at whether you have any other defences eg can the creditor produce the CCA agreement?
If you are unsure what to write on the defence form, phone National Debtline and talk to them.
Other FAQs about statute barred debt
My debt is statute barred, do I still owe the money?
Yes. Your debt still exists, it hasn’t been written off, it can still get sold on and you may still receive letters about it.
The Financial Conduct Authority’s rules about statute-barred consumer credit debt (loans, credit cards etc) are here. They say that if you state you will not pay a statute barred debt, the creditor cannot continue to ask you to pay it.
If you want to get rid of the debt completely and you are absolutely sure a debt is statute-barred, you could consider making a very low Full and Final Settlement offer, perhaps under 10% – see Full & Final Settlements for more details. Your letter should point out that the debt is statute barred and hence unenforceable.
A debt has dropped off my credit record – is it statute barred?
Obviously your debt is old but it may not be statute barred.
The six-year period for the Statute of Limitations is NOT the same as the six-year period that a debt stays on your credit file after a default. If a debt isn’t showing on your credit file it may be statute barred but it may not be.
A debt will stop showing on your credit record six years after any default was recorded. But if you have made some payments to it in the last 6 years, perhaps just a token £1 a month, then it isn’t going to be statute barred.
My debt has been sold, does this effect becoming statute barred?
No, it doesn’t matter if your debt is sold. The sale doesn’t “reset the clock”. If it was already statute-barred at the time it was sold, it remains statute barred. If it wasn’t yet statute barred, it will be 6 years after the “cause of action”, see above.
My debt is statute-barred – if I make an affordability complaint will this re-open the debt?
Once a debt is statute barred this is permanent, it can never become “unbarred” so making an affordability complaint won’t change this.
But if your complaint is upheld, the lender will sometimes not send you the money but set it off against the remaining debt – even though it is statute barred the debt still exists. In this situation don’t use a claims company, or you could end up owing them money.
Also it can be hard to win affordability complaints about very old debts. If you are being asked to pay this old debt, it may be simpler to just tell the creditor it is statute barred and not pay – National Debtline has a template letter that you could use, so phone them.
I can’t give you advice on whether your debt is likely to be statute barred. If you are concerned about a specific debt, phone National Debtline on 0808 808 4000. Or you could use their good web chat.
But if you have a general question about statute barred debt, ask it in the comments below.
why pay a debt that isn’t on your credit record
What to do if you receive a court form
Ask for the CCA agreement for old debts
Hugo says
Hello Sara, just an exact question for you I had a house possessed In March 2009.but it was left vacant and unsold till 2014 it sold leaving a gigantic shortfall when does the 12 year period commence at the point of repossession or at the time of the sale. Thank you for any clarification you can give Hugo
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Is this still showing on your credit record?
Who was the lender? have you ever been chased to repay the shortfall?
what a pity you did not go bankrupt in 2009, having this hanging over you all the time.
Hugo says
Thanks Sara I don’t know if it is on my credit file I have not applied for it. I do not want to “ show “ myself YET the lender was a German bank. I have had no contact since the eviction day. My mother who had lived in the house but was not on the mortgage was after she had a stroke and was then living In a care home pestered by a collection agency to give them my address which she never did she died 6 years ago. What I want to know is does the 12 years run from the day of eviction in 2009 or from the date of sale in 2014 . When will I be statute barred. Do I need to wait another 5 years. Thank you so very much
Sara (Debt Camel) says
National Debtline have written a good factsheet on Mortgage Shortfalls: https://www.nationaldebtline.org/fact-sheet-library/mortgage-shortfalls-ew/. As you can see from that, although your question sounds simple, the answer may not be… So I suggest you phone National Debtline on 0808 808 4000 and talk through your mortgage and what happened. They are best placed to give advice and suggest what you should do to find out if there is no clear answer.
Chris says
Hello,
I had a student loan in 2016 for a degree I did then. The student loan is collected through my pay check and this system is fine. However the SLC said I received an overpayment of £7,000. They wrote to me about this in 2018 and I have been disputing it with them since. I haven’t made a payment to this and they have sent the debt to be recovered with a number of different agencies. Is this debt subject to being statued barred after 6 years or is this debt not valid for that?
Just to confirm the situation – The reason they said I received the overpayment was that they later decided I was not eligible for the full amount they gave me, although at the time they said I was, so I did receive the money but it was offered as a non-repayable grant.
This debt is not on my credit file and never has been.
Thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest you talk to National Debtline on 0808 808 4000 about this SLC debt and whether it may be statute barred.
Andy says
I am a UK citizen who left the UK in 2005 to move overseas. Back then, I was young and stupid. I left the UK with debt owing to 4 different credit cards (all unsecured) which already had CCJ’s from 2004. I was struggling to pay them back and was never able to make a dent in them due to barely affording minimum payments. In mid-2005 I left, didnt notify them, and aside from the odd email for the first year – stopped receiving anything. They all went to collection agencies in 2006 and as mentioned, they all had CCJ’s which meant they would not have been statute barred after 6 years.
Now, 16 years later, I am moving back to the UK. Realistically – what will have happened to these debts, and even though they had CCJ’s at the time, after 16 years – are they still enforceable?
Weatherman says
Hi Andy
You’re right that these aren’t statute-barred – which means they are enforceable. But after 6 years, the creditor would have to re-apply to the court to be able to enforce it. (If they know you’ve been abroad for that time so not able to be contacted, the court might accept this as reason to grant the re-enforcement)
Realistically, if you’ve had no contact from anyone about these debts, they have probably given up on you as a lost cause! But the only way to be certain would be to repay them now if you’re able to, or arrange a repayment plan.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
National Debtline says
“If your CCJ is more than six years old, and the creditor wants to use enforcement action, they must first get permission of the court… Contact us for advice.”
As Weatherman says, realistically they probably gave up on you a long while ago. You might also find it a lot of hassle to find out who to contact if you did want to pay these old debts!
I suggest you ignore them and talk to National Debtline if you are contacted. It is VERY rare for a court to give permission to enforcean old CCJ in this situation.
But try to avoid applying to thise credit cards/banks for accounts in future, as they may be able to see the very old debt on their own records. there are plenty of other cards/banks, so avoid those.
Andy says
Thanks! As I said, I was young and stupid. I’m not proud for leaving debt behind, but it is what it is. It was to the tune of 10,000 GBP all up across all accounts, so I’m certainly not a big fish too fry. I wouldn’t even know who to contact on my return anyway.
I’ll take your advice when I finally get home and open accounts with other institutions – and call Debtline if ever contacted. Believe me, I have learned my lesson and am much more of a responsible person with my money now.
Thanks for your help
Hannah says
Hi Sara
I had a credit card with vanquis which I took out in 2014 . In July 2016 I made my last payment to vanquis and after that from August I have never made a payment. In August 2017 the account got sold to a debt collector and I ask for credit card statements to raise a case with the ombudsman but never made a payment. They have never contacted me since sending the statements . I am still not in position to payback the £3000 . I am not sure where I stand is the account statute barred from September. Also the default date is June 2022 which is at nine months. I would hate a ccj now to affect my credit file as I have almost cleaned it up fully. Any help would be appreciated.
Thanks
Hannah
Weatherman says
Hi Hannah
What was your reason for raising a case with the Ombudsman?
From what you’ve said, this debt wouldn’t be statute-barred util August 2023 – six years after you last acknowledged that you owed the debt by asking for statements.
If you’re not in a position to pay back the debt, or to make payments towards it, I suggste you speak to National Debtline: 0808 808 4000.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I agree with Weatherman.
Two other thoughts. When you asked for the statements, were you asking Vanquis or the debt collector? And did you just ask for the statements? Or did you also ask for the Consumer Credit Act agreement for the card?
And the £3000 debt – was this because Vanquis raised your credit limit too high?
Hannah says
Hi Sara
Thanks for getting back to me , I asked the debt collector by email as my mental health wasn’t in a good place and didn’t want to speak on the phone . Yes just for statements not for cca . I needed the information for an affordability case against vanquis with the ombudsman but unfortunately lost the case as I had gambling winning being refunded back into my account which were above minimum payments. And was told as these were paid in that this was affordable and my limit was okay to raised.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
OK, so you have already made an affordability complaint so you cant make another one.
One option is to ask the debt collector (not Vanquis) for a copy of the CCA agreement. See https://debtcamel.co.uk/ask-cca-agreement-for-debt/ for how to do this and why it can be a good idea for debts sold to a debt collector that are marked as defaulted.
This is not guaranteed to work. But if it does, you then don’t have to pay the debt as you cannot get a CCJ for it.
Asking for this resets the statute bar again. But as Weatherman says, it isnt going to be statute barred for more than 2 years anyway. The chance of this happening is pretty slim!
If the CCA can be produced you will need to make a payment arrangement.
National Debtline can talk through all these options including asking for the CCA.
Ste says
I have an ex partner who is trying to sue me for money they said i taken 13yrs ago, aswell as interest for the time scale. The police never pursued any criminal proceedings, but now they are trying to make a claim. I have defended the claim and advised I Dont owe them nothing. can this be thrown out due to time Limitation?
Weatherman says
Hi Ste
If this is about money they say you borrowed from them with an agreement to repay, then it sounds like it’d be statute-barred, yes. But I wasn’t quite sure if that’s what the ex-partner is claiming (e.g. are they claiming this was theft?).
Statutes of limitations do exist for other issues, but you’d need to speak to someone with legal training to understand what applied in your case. Try your local Citizens Advice if it’s not a debt matter.
Dennis says
I had some CCJS 16 years ago, am starting a new job with BQ. I need to tell Experian some things, will it show on my credit record. Or auy where else.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
My guess is Experian just want your details to send a credit report to BQ.
CCJs taken 16 years should not show on a current credit report.
Only the creditors for the CCJ may still have any records about the CCJs
Dennis says
Lets hope so, Many thanks.
Mandy says
Hi Sarah, there was an Mbna credit card that I had in 2009 and in 2011 I had breast cancer and with all the treatment, surgery etc I had to leave my job in 2013. I had 9 creditors chasing me and was on payment plans with them all. This one though went to Britannica, Arrow global westcot, wilkinson and Chapman and then shoosmiths. And now capquest. I was making regular monthly payments and at times payments to MBNA and the DCA. In 2015 when it changed to Wilkinson and Chapmen they said there were several missing payments and was really confusing me. I spoke to them and asked to show a statement of account which showed cheque payments, dd, standing orders? And payments to paragon. This again was so confusing so I said I would stop paying until they sorted it out as nothing added up. In 2016 Arrow global were behind w&c and shoosmiths and i told them it wasnt correct. In the end in 2016 I sent a cca request and statement of account request and heard nothing. I lost my house and everything and moved.in 2020 I had letters from Capquest and I told them about the cca request and statement of account I sent to Arrow global was not fulfilled.
to cut a very long story short, they have sent it, the statement of account was sent over by Idem, who have never owned this account and the ref number does not relate to anything. I have always contacted them when they wrote to me but they have not supplied a correct statement of account. It says last payment was on 28th April 2015 which will be Statue barred. They recently wrote to me threatening to send someone to my home. I called them and sent an email to say it is statute barred. They now say a payment was made on 2and June . I told them I am complaining to the FCA and they have written up a complaints procedure to reply in 3 days. What is my next move please?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
can I ask if this is your only remaining debt? How large is it?
Mandy says
Hi Sarah, I have managed to pay some of my debts off and 4 debts could not supply the CCA so have not paid those. This is for £4,700
Thank you
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I think given your long hisory with this debt, including health problems, you need help from a debt adviser.
Talk to your local Citizens Advice. It may be best to ask them to write off the debt, see https://debtcamel.co.uk/debt-options/less-common/write-off/, and this request often comes better from a debt adviser than from you.
Also, they can look at the “CCA agreement” you were sent and decide if it looks OK or not.
Mandy says
Thank you so much Sarah
Mandy Bradshaw says
Hi Sarah, I emailed, and spoke to CAB and they spoke to me on the phone. As I dont have dementia or a severe mental health issue I am not classed as vulnerable, they also couldnt look at the cca. What has happened now is that Capques are looking at my complaint in detail and have put it on hold and have now sent me another statement of account that said last payment was June 2015. Would I be best placed now to contact MBNA myself and ask them for a cca and statement of account from before they sold it in 2012. Thank you
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Well wait for a reply to your complaint.
Do NOT ask MBNA for the CCA – you don’t want the CCA at all, you want the debt collector to be unable to produce it.
Clive Gammon says
Hi Sara
I have received a ppi award from a loan I defaulted on in 1993 I have not made a payment on this for around 20 years . I enquired about ppi through a company but didn’t sign anything or ask them to act for me. Then I received a letter saying I was owed some money. The bank want me to fill out my bank details so that they can put the money in my account. If I do this am I restarting the 6 year period again. Thanks Clive
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Once a debt is statute barred, you can never restart the clock, it will always be statute barred.
It may be wise to assume the claims company will ask for their percentage, so perhaps put that to one side and don’t spend it?
Clive Gammon says
Thanks for the reply very helpful. But how do I know if the loan has been state barred. I’m worried that if I sign the form from the bank i will start getting threatened by the bank again. Regards Clive
Sara (Debt Camel) says
The article above says that it’s hard to know if a debt is statute barred. But your debt isn’t just old, it’s ancient! I don’t think you will have any problems with this one – if you would like to be sure, phone National Debtline on 0808 808 4000 and talk to them about this.
Michael s o'hare says
Hi, I had a car finance in 1999. The car was repossessed about 3 weeks after purchase. Last month I had an email from PRA Group. I contacted them as I couldn’t sign into the website. I thought they were another debt firm I was paying at 10 month for a different debt. They said they had the wrong DOB, so I rang them and found out it was this old debt. I’m sure I had a ccj back in the early 2000’s. I told her on the phone I was not agreeing to the debt, and Also sent an email with a template from the national debt agency stating the debt was statute barred and I was not liable. I never have made any payments towards this debt . Just wonder what will they do next. Can you get a second ccj for the same debt. They said they bought the debt in 2001.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Can you get a second ccj for the same debt.
No!
If there wasn’t a CCJ, then the old dad must be statute barred by now.
If there was a CCJ, then it never becomes statute barred but the creditor will find it very hard to enforce the CCJ after 6 years as they have to go back to court for permission which is very rarely given.
If they get back in touch with you, I suggest you talk to National Debtline on 0808 808 4000 about your options.
Sam says
I have old debts going back to 2008 I had a DMP plan but stopped paying it in 2013. I was redundant on benefits, I could not afford to and also because we moved out of the country.
I returned last year. I am on state pension. My debts were sold on to Robinson Way, Cabot and Rutheridge. I believe they are part of the same group.
I know my debts are Statute Barred as I have never been in touch with the debt collections agencies in any form or made any payments. and its well past the 6 yr time.
However, recently I started getting letters asking for payment with offers of 10% for settlement.
I do not want to pay as I cant afford to. I contacted National Debtline and they advised to send these companies a standard letter to say that the debts are statute barred and that they should stop contacting me. I have the template.
I am happy to do that however my question is that if I send this letter, will it open up lines of communications and will it make the companies become more aggressive.
2nd Question, what if I continue to ignore them and not bother replying? what will happen?
Thank you for your time.
Sam
Sara (Debt Camel) says
if I send this letter, will it open up lines of communications and will it make the companies become more aggressive.
If you hadn’t heard from them since 2013 and you were just worried they may reappear, there is a case for saying let sleeping creditors lie.
But they have contacted you and they know where you live.
what if I continue to ignore them and not bother replying? what will happen?
I can’t say for definite, but it is possible they will take you to court for a CCJ. You could defend the court case on the grounds the debts are statute barred, but it seems simpler to write to them now as National Debtline has suggested.
sam says
Thank you for your reply Sara.
I do not have any CCJ’s. As I said, I was on a DMP plan.
However, if I understand correctly, so there’s no harm in sending each of these companies a letter (based on the Template from National Debtline) about the debts being Statute Barred? and they cannot enforce any action or open the cases again?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I don’t know what National Debtline said to you or what the creditor may say when they get the letter. They may deny it is statute barred because you paid them £100 in January 2018 (…I just invented that!)
What I am saying is that ignoring letters from a creditor is often unwise and National Debtline has suggested the debts are statute barred so you should send that letter. If you are uncomfortable about this, go back and talk again to National Debtline?
Sam says
Thank you for this. You right.
Will write to them and see what happens
Sam says
Hi Sara,
Just to update you, I send off the Statute Barred letter, I’ve received a reply regarding 2 of the debts.
On one of the debts, they have closed the account in their system and have returned the file to their Client Cabot Financial, at their request, so that they can deal with the matter I have raised. Any ideas what this means and should I also send Cabot a Statute Barred letter or just wait for any further correspondence?
While on the 2nd, with the same debt collection agency, a simple statement stating that the account is closed and they have returned the fileay that their client Cabot Financial, the legal owners of this debt. Again, do I need to do anything further?
I am still waiting on the 3rd Debt which is with Robinson Way.
Thank you for your advise, thus far.
Kind regards,
Sam
Sara (Debt Camel) says
You just need to wait and see what Cabot say.
Sam says
Thank you Sara,
I will let you know what happens.
Most grateful for your good advice.
Kind regards,
Saleem
SAM says
Hi Sara,
I sent the Statute Barred Letter to one of the company’s that contacted me about an old debt. They have written back with this reply:
“Please be aware that County Court Judgement (CCJ) has been secured against this debt; therefore your liability has been established for the debt. As a result, we are not obliged to provide you with documentation you referred to and the rules governing the statute of limitation do not apply. The CCJ was secured on 1st May 2014 with Case NoXXXX. If you would like to dispute this debt, then you can contact the court on Tel NoXXXX). Alternatively, if you do not wish to contact the court to dispute liability, then please provide us with your proposal for payment by completing and returning the attached financial statement”…
They said they will place the account on 30 day hold but if they do not hear from me, normal collection activity will resume.
Can you please help and advice what I can do and if they can still follow through with the enforcement of this CCJ. What are my options.
Thank you and kind regards
SAM
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest you talk to National Debtline again about whether this CCJ can be enforced as it is more than 6 years old.
SAM says
I called National Debtline,
It was a very strange conversation.
The Advisor wasn’t very clear about it. Honestly, I am no more wiser about it now than when before I called him. (I think there’s more information on your site than what I learnt from the Advisor. perhaps he wasn’t so experienced as he kept asking to be put on hold while he asked).
One thing, the advisor suggested I write to Hoist Finance and ask them to provide me with full information, and also write to the courts for copy of the information regarding this.
He also mentioned about getting legal advice which was most worrying.
I may have to call them again and get more clarification.
Any advice please? It’s most worrying!
Thanks and regards,
Sam
Sara (Debt Camel) says
well that is good advice from National Debtline – if you didn’t know there was a CCJ, go back to the court and ask for the full information.
But ultimately if there is a CCJ and National Debtline say it is enforceable, you are on a state pension and renting (are you?) so you just offer then £5 a month. It would have been nice to get rid of it, but a low monthly payments isn’t a bad option is it?
Martin says
I also found that the National Debtline advisor I spoke to didn’t make things clear.
I wanted to just ask a simple question and ended up being on the phone for over an hour going through their questions and setting up an account with them!
Chris says
Hi Sara,
My wife purchased her council house under right to buy provisions in Jan 1989 in joint names with her then partner. The house was repossessed in Feb 1991 at around the time I met her. I remember regular letters to her asking to increase repayments of 1/3 of the £19,600 discount for a period of time while we lived in another council house. I don’t believe she was paying anything back and we always assumed it was her partner who was paying. Then we bought our own property in 1999 and I can’t remember hearing anything about it since then. My wife died this month and I am now concerned that this debt could be pursued. I have placed a deceased estates notice in the Gazette and paid extra for a notice in local newspaper which I assume will be sufficient to prevent any claim from the council after 2 months, 1 day. But I was wondering about the likelihood of them pursuing such an old debt after hearing nothing from them for 20 years.
Thanks for any advice,
Chris
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I don’t know if this debt is so old it is statute barred. Obviously it is incredibly old, but I don’t know if the rules around statute barring apply to this sort of debt. And if they do, It may matter when her ex last made a payments.
Of course her ex may have repaid the discount in full so there no longer is a debt.
I think you need some advice on this – talk to National Debtline on 0808 808 4000.
If the debt is not statute barred, then it is possible that you have a duty as the executor to notify the creditor. I don’t know that placing an advert is sufficient when you know there is a creditor and you have not informed them. You may need to take legal advice on this.
DJ says
hi
Can anyone please help me. I had secured loan on my property but could not afford both property and loan installment. They reposssed my house in 2007.I was under the impression that secured loan company must have covered there money from the house. After about 14years I have received a letter form the secured loan company today that i have to pay them their money back. I changed the address after the repossion of my property twice. I am living on my current address for last eight years and never received any letter or anything from them .I have checked my credit report no CCJ nothing is there. Could you please tell my what should i do, should i contact them saying its Statute barred debt?
Thanks in advance
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest you talk to National Debtline on 0808 808 4000 about whether this old debt is statute barred.
MM says
Hi sara,
I remember opening an account with Barclays in 2007/2008 had an overdraft of £200. I didn’t pay it nor did they write to me. Will the bank still be able to see the debt. Thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Possibly. Why, do you want to apply to them for a mortgage or something?
Lukas says
Hi Sarah,
I had two accounts from Scottish Power opened in 2015, I left from this address in 2016 and never paid for this bills. I can see from my credit report that they defaulted this account back to 2018.
I spoke today with them , and they said that account never went to dept agency, instead they try make contact with me between 2015-2018 , and they decided close this account , and as punishment they put date 27/07/2018
I offered to pay for this dept with them today , and they said that accounts are closed and paid from them ,
What I can do to sort my credit report as is showing every month default , do I have to wait until 2024 for this to go from my file?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Are you saying the bills are wrong or just the default date?
When did they stop billing you?
Have you sent them a complaint about this?
Lukas says
Hi , I stop paying on the end of 2015.. and they put default date 2018 – as they said they were trying to contact with me.
Now accounts are closed, but my defaults are still in Credit reports. They are marking every month default on my report, even when accounts are closed from there said.
I even ask them if I can pay in full so they can mark partly satisfy- but accounts are not existing anymore … and I have still default..
They are billing for the last few months in 2015 and first 6 months in 2015 , the bills were for gas and electricity 113 pounds and 325 pounds , what I don’t understand how is possible that the default this accounts almost 3 years after I stop paying …
not sure if make sense that for you …
Lukas says
No I spoke on the phone today. I asked them what’s the reason to default my account after such a long time. They said that they couldn’t located or contact me and they have rights to decided when to default accounts that in areas.
So I’m confused as I said to them since 2018 this accounts are on my file as defaulted, debt is no longer debt as they cleared their books and closed my accounts , so in reality this debt is not existing as been aged ? So why is still showing default if they no longer kept my accounts ?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest you read https://debtcamel.co.uk/debt-default-date/ which explains when a default date should be added. That says when an account is 3-6 months in arrears. So this would be 3-6 months from the last bill they produced – it sounds as though this should be in late 2016?
So send Scottish Power a complaint to dataprotection@scottishpower.com and say your credit record is not a true record of your account as a default should have been added when you were 3-6 months in arrears as https://secureservercdn.net/160.153.137.210/mb9.87b.myftpupload.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/08/Principles-for-the-Reporting-of-Arrears-Arrangements-and-Defaults-at-Credit-Reference-Agencies-vesrion-2a-final.pdf explains. Ask Scottish Power to correct this. If they don’t, send a complaint to the ICO.
Lukas says
Hi Sarah.As you advice I contact my gas/electric provider,and I will show their respond below.
I need your help as I still strongly believe that timing to get this defaults was wrong, please see below respond from them and help
—————————————————-
The reason for the credit defaults being applied against your name was due to the final outstanding balance of gas and electricity account for your former address not being paid, not due to arrears building up on the accounts. The electricity account was finalised to 27/09/2017 and had an outstanding balance of £331.08
The gas account was finalised to14/12/2017 and had an outstanding balance of £115.17.
I can see that no new contact details were given to us therefore we were unable to contact you in regard to your outstanding balances and this was the reason for the credit defaults being filed against your name.
I can see from the account you did not contact us until the 05/09/2020 when you queried about the credit defaults and you asked for a copy of the invoices for the accounts in question at which point you provided forwarding address.
Scottish Power remove off any outstanding debt balances on the accounts after a period of time if no trace of the person responsible can be found.
The outstanding balance for your electricity account was removed on the 14/06/2019 and the gas account was done on the 12/03/2020. This is why our customer service agents could not take payment for the accounts as the balances no longer shown on the accounts anymore.
However by Scottish Power removing the final balances from the accounts does not mean that the credit default is no longer applicable as the debt was not satisfied and not paid by you.
If you wish to pay these balances I would need to ask out customer services department to assist and investigate whether they can rebill the accounts to show the outstanding balances again as we do not have the access or skill set to do this in the Data Protection team.
———————————————–
Can you advice what should I do as I believe that took so long for defaults to take place and also finalising account that I haven’t pay for very long time …
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest you talk to your local Citizens Advice.
I can’t tell from what SP say if they have been billing you after you moved out? Or if you ignored their bills while you were still living there? or if they have billed you very late for money you do owe? These are three very different situations and I think you need some help to dientangle this.
David says
I recently won a small refund from a bank due to a successful unfair bank charges claim.
In the banks response, they have provided some detail to me which suggests the amount of credit by way of loans and refinancing said loan after a short period of time etc, could have been irresponsible due to my circumstances at the time. The loan amount was more than my annual salary at the time.
The final balance I owed on that line of credit became SB in 2010.
If I was to make an unaffordability complaint, would that reset the clock on the debt please?
I’ve already won a PPI complaint in relation to those loans in question.
Many thanks.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
When was the loan taken out? How much did you borrow and how much did you repay?
Was it sold to a debt collector?
What happened with the PPI claim?
David says
Original loan was 12.5k for home improvements. Within 6 months I’d refinanced and in total with further refinancing up to 2004 it totalled 20k. i paid 11k off but then they stopped chasing. It was passed to a debt collector yes, but they too stopped chasing in 2010. I’ve not heard from them about it since. Just before the deadline I claimed PPi and won, they paid some off the account and returned the rest to me. The value of the PPi refund wasn’t enough to pay off the full balance so I’m unsure why I got some returned to me. I’m sure there’s still a balance of at least a few £k. Again no further chasing has occurred.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
To answer your question, yes making an affordability complaint will restart the clock on statute barring (as does making a PPI claim) BUT this doesn’t happen if the debt is already statute barred.
HOWEVER
you have repaid less than you borrowed. An affordability claim asks for a refund of interest – so far you haven’t paid any.
AND
you would have trouble with an affordability complaint about a loan before 2007, when the law changed and FOS started being able to look at these complaints. I haven’t seen one won from earlier. You can try but as you haven’t paid any interest, there doesn’t seem much point.
David says
It is already SB but that is a good point, didn’t think about it in terms of the payments made.
Thanks for helping so promptly.
Darren says
Hi
My ex wife is no longer living in this country but i was getting bills and demands from debtors being forwarded to my address by her landlord from when she was still in the UK
I haven’t opened any as i don’t want to be liable for any
I have had a bailiff visit but as i don’t know where she is apart from Cyprus i couldn’t be any help
That was over 6 years ago will those debts still be active
Thanks
Darren
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Unless you know the details of the debts and why a bailiff is coming round it is impossible to guess. If there has been a CCJ for example the debt will never be statute barred.
Replying to any callers that you haven’t seen her for years and you think she may be in Cyprus but you do not have an address seems a suitable approach for you. A hassle but not something for you to worry about – assuming that you were not jointly liable for any of the debts now being chased.
Stephen says
Hello over 20 year’s ago the bank took a house i owned back selling it , there was a short fall of about 11.000, at that time i was written off work with depression, young and foulish back then, i would now like to buy another house, would there be any records of this debt, ? would i be able to start as a first time buyer again,
Many thanks for any imformation
Sara (Debt Camel) says
You will need to make sure you do not apply to the same bank you originally had the mortgage from.
Also you need to answer questions honestly on the application – you are not a first time buyer.
Stephen says
Thankyou Sara, i would have replied earlier but this ended up in my jumk mail box, now one thing i don’t know is the Bank i took the mortgage out with as it was so long ago, any idea’s how i would find this imformation out ?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
If you have no records, I have no idea.
Stephen says
ok Many thanks again , have a great day
Mandy says
Hi Sarah. You have helped me before please can you help. A quick recap old Mbna account brought by Arrow global and now capquest chasing. In 2016 asked for a cca from Arrow global was not received Sent the request to capquest, as they started chasing, the statement of account wasnt right and I asked for a proper one which said I last paid in April 2015. I wrote and said it was statue barred, they sent another statement of a count with last payment date of june 2015 so they said it is not statue barred. I had sent a complaint too as they threatened to send someone round when they had not provided a correct statement of account. Anyway complaint not upheld, and the details in the letter is in correct. So, if I wait to reply on 3rd of june can I tell them it is now statue barred. I am currently waiting for additional tests for secondary cancer and I am going to contact the f o as they failed to correctly deal with the complaint. But please could you let me know if I can reply to them and say it is now statue barred Thank you
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Have you been sent the CCA agreement? or just the statement of account?
The problem is if you have been asking for a CCA then this is very likely to acknowledged the debt so statute barring is not relevant.
Mandy says
I have been sent the CCA in January. I asked Arrow Global for them to send it to me in 2016 but they didnt. Then Cap quest began chasing and miraculously provided it with no t’CS so they sent me those. The statement of account was not the same as Aroow Global had sent me in 2015. This is th reason I questioned them before as they said I had missed payments when I hadn’t. The one that capquest sent didnt have those missing payments but I didnt tell them that and it came from Idem. Which i never paid to them
Turns out Idem are part of Paragon which is why they have that. I have never admitted it, I just asked them to prove it. 6 years since I last paid is June 2nd. CAB couldnt look at the CCA. On Tuesday I should find out if the diagnose is terminal so wont be able to pay it anyway but I want to reply and try saying it is Statue barred. Just dont know where to go from here
Sara (Debt Camel) says
A loan does not automatically become statute barred 6 years after the last payment as the article above explains.
because of your health problems I suggest you contact Capquest, ask to speak to their vulnerable custoomers team, explain your health and ask them to write off the debt.
Mandy says
Ok thank you
Sam says
Hi, I have an old debt with Lowell from an old phone contract back in 2016, it says on my credit file the date of default was 17 August 2015. I haven’t received any letters regarding this not for a long time, I recently moved and have avoided registering on the electoral roll just for a few more months so I’m ‘off the map’ as such. I’ve worked hard past few years to sort my credit file out, CCJ and old debts etc. I’ve had no contact with them regarding this but I don’t want them issuing a CCJ with just two months left before the debt is statue barred, how would I know without contracting them acknowledging I know? Lowell Solicitors (they act as a different company then Lowell) contacted me a couple of months before a different previous debt was due to become state barred, again if it wasn’t already, but I paid that as their letters threatened a CCJ. I’ve moved from that address since so I wouldn’t know if they have contacted me their or not. Just some advice please, I’d hate for a CCJ to be slapped on my credit file literally a month before this debt is due to be state barred.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
how would I know without contacting them acknowledging I know?
If you aren’t getting your post redirected, you can’t do this. That is the problem with trying to stay “off the map”.
Andrew says
Hi I have an old loan over 10 years old that I failed to repay. I took this out at my parents address whilst living there. I haven’t made any payments for over 6 years. I have just found out my mother has been making token payments towards this debt for years because the letters were going to her house. How do I stand with this been statute barred as payments are been made not by me and without my knowledge. I dare not contact them as I understand this could reset the clock. Any help please
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Presumably the loan is no longer on your credit record? Has it been sold to a debt collector?
Andrew says
I can’t see it on my record. It’s currently with Cabot
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest you talk to National Debtline on 0808 808 4000 about this.
If it turns out the debt is not statute barred – and that is not something I am going to guess at – than there is another possibility that could help, which is that Cabot may be unable to produce the CCA agreement for the debt, see https://debtcamel.co.uk/ask-cca-agreement-for-debt/.
Andrew says
OK thanks I will phone debtline on Monday
James says
Hi Sara,
Hope you are well, I am still having issues with provident(satsuma) it is sitting with Financial Ombudsman since October last year, my credit file is still showing at 6 months late, I raised a query with Experian who advised provident have said it is accurate but it should have went to default in 2017/2018. My understanding this will never drop off as it is showing 6 months late payment?
I don’t know what else to do as not getting anywhere with Financial Ombudsman or Provident.
Gloria says
My ex loaned my mother money in 2004. The agreement was that she paid him back when she sold the house( she did have it on the market for 3 years)
My ex and I split up in 2005 and after a few years I moved to my mums with my young son due to her failing health.
Again she tried selling the property with no luck and because she still had a interest only mortgage that was nearing its term we remortgaged in both our names.
A few months ago my ex texted me about the owed money saying because he’s lost his job he’s now able to get legal aid and he’s going to go after my mother to pay it back. No payments have been made and no written agreement was drawn up. Whilst I know it’s morally wrong not to pay him back, my mum doesn’t have any money and can’t pay him. Can he pursue this?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
You can’t usually get legal aid to help you get a debt repaid.
If you haven’t heard anything for a few months, he may just have been trying it on… also it sounds as though the debt may be statute barred. If he gets in touch again, talk to National Debtline on 0808 808 4000 and ask them what you should do.
AJ says
Hello,
I went bankrupt in August 2016 and listed my argos card as one of my debts to be written off. However it is still showing as defaulted and the balance owed of around £300. Why is this when it was included within the bankruptcy? Also the default date they have is for December 2016 am I right in thinking it should be the date of my bankruptcy order which is August of that year and that the account should have been closed like all the others that were included.
Many thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Yes, they haven’t updated it correctly. See https://debtcamel.co.uk/credit-file-after-bankruptcy/ for what to do.
Pablo says
Hi. I am being chased for a catalogue debt on an account taken out by my ex without my knowledge. The account defaulted in Feb 2017. I asked for a cca which doesn’t show date or signature and is unreadable other than my name. I have sent electoral roll details and they are now asking for council tax bills. Should I make a full and final offer of a small amount or contest it?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
was the person you think took out the account living with you ate the time? Specifically if items were delivered, would they have been to a different address or your address?
Who is asking for council tax bills and why?
Pablo says
The person who took out the debt was neither on the electoral roll or council tax bill. I was about to move in the property where she opened the debt but wasn’t at that time due to renovations. I will be able to provide council tax bills for the place I was living if local authority keep records. She did have a different address, but she opened the catalogue (Next) in my name.
The debt agency is asking for council tax bills as proof of address
Sara (Debt Camel) says
if you can get the council tax bills then that may resolve it?
Pablo says
I thought that might be it. They want to start fraud action against my ex too, that is an avenue I really don’t want to go down, can they force me that way or can I say the consequences would be too severe??
Sara (Debt Camel) says
You can point out that you are only guessing it may have been your ex and you have no evidence that it was (assuming that is correct obviously).
Catalogue companies would not generally pursue a prosecution for fraud… and if there is no evidence…
You can report it as fraud to Action Fraud and say you don’t know who did it.
Pablo says
Yeah I’ll try that. Thanks for your help, I’ll let you know how I get on.
Pablo says
Update. I eventually received confirmation from local authority re Council Tax. Debt Managers are now referring to Next and awaiting further information before looking into this for me. How helpful are they lol. They still ask for fraud but I’ve ignored that step so far. I’m hoping this will soon be over
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Most people find it difficult to get something accepted as Identity Theft if they are not prepared to report it as fraud.
Pablo says
Further update. After providing all details requested they kept pestering. I said this was beginning to feel like harassment and they started an internal investigating. The result being no harassment but accepted the account was fraudulently opened and closed, removing from my credit file.
Thanks for your assistance
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Good!
Aaron says
Dear Debt Camel
I have received a letter from a creditor, that has not been able to comply fully with my CCA Request. 2 years after sending them a proposed settlement offer, which they never replied to, they are writing to PROPOSE, a Reconnection VISIT. The debt is for £100, been sold to several Collection Agencies. I cant pay them and told them this, how can i keep them from VISITING me at home???
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Did they say 2 years ago that they cannot produce the CCA agreement or did they basically ignore it?
SAM says
Hi Sara,
Thank you for your advice. Yes, I suppose its good advice from Debtline thinking about it.
Can Hoist apply to the court again to enforce this CCJ? Is this common?
Meanwhile, I will write to the Court about it. Do you have a template I can use for this please?
A few questions and comments if you can bear with me so that I know the best way to deal with this in the right way?
1. should I also write and ask Hoist Finance, even though have refused to provide any information about it? Is there a template for this too?
2. It would have been nice to get rid of it. I can propose £5 pounds or a token payment based on my situation. Would it work, as they are claiming £9,821.70? or I was thinking of offering a small amount, say £500, which is manageable, in full and final settlement
3. And, at what point do make the offer and How should I write to them – (is there a template I can use?)
Thank you for your patience.
Kind regards
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Sorry no template. It may be easier to phone the court, although you may have to hang on for a while. Just give the facts you know, say you would like a copy of the judgment.
I would do that first, then take everything from there. National Debtline can then advise on whether this is enforceable and whether you should “vary” the judgement so you can pay an affordable amount each month.
SAM says
Thank you so much.
Meanwhile, any suggestions what I should say to Hoist as they have given 30 days to respond.
I’ve been looking at my income and expenses, Looks like I will have around 25.00 per month available to pay them. In your experience how is this go down? What’s your thoughts on that?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Well it should take you less time than that to find out the CCJ details so I suggest you ignore them until you have and you have got a plan. One step at a time….
SAM says
Thanks you Sara.
Will get on to it on Monday. Meanwhile, can I just ask what do Hoist mean by this in their reply:
“Please be aware that County Court Judgement (CCJ) has been secured against this debt; therefore your liability has been established for the debt.”
Is because of the CCJ or because I’ve written to them and it may have reset the clock?
Thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
If there is a CCJ then the debt never becomes statute-barred. if the CCJ is more than 6 years ago however it may be harder or impossible to enforce the CCJ.
SAM says
Hi Sara,
I called the County court. They couldn’t find the case on their register with the case number I’ve been given. They do not keep records of cases more than 6 years old.
And on the question of enforcement, like you said above, it would be very hard if not impossible for them to enforce the order as its over 6 years old, however, should take legal/professional advice for my own peace of mind.
National Debtline also said the same ting that it would be very hard for them to enforce this.
So, any advice on how should I proceed from hereon in? And how I should respond to Hoist about this, or can I just ignore it.
Thanks for all your time, you’ve been a great help.
Regards
Sara (Debt Camel) says
So there are several things you could do:
– ignore Hoise and see what they do
– tell Hoist you don’t have any details of the CCJ and can they send you a copy of the claim and the judgment
– tell Hoist it is over 6 years so they will have to go back to court to enforce the CCJ and you will challenge that
– offer hoist a £1 a month and send then an Income & expenditure statement showing this is all you can afford.
I can’t advise which you should do. National Debtline can talk through the pros and cons – tell them you cannot afford legal advice. they can also help draw up an income & expenditure form if you want to make an offer of monthly payments.
Kelly says
Hi
I’m not sure if the above applies to me as my debts are over 9 years old and I still pay £1 token payment on them. I’ve had default letters from day dot?
Also, sleeping debtors lie. I got divorced and changed my name. All linked on my credit filed, I’ve not informed them, just not got round to it even passport is in old name. Should I risk waking them up? I’ve also moved but have post divert set up and again not got round to informing everyone.
Im terrified of getting CCJs as I could loose my job. I disclosed all defaults to my job even though not in credit file anymore. Would my debtors have to ask court for permission?
I would like to stick to £1 payments as well as I don’t include my partners money as no debts are his or in his name therefore his money is his not mine and almost all bills are in my name, and still works out as token payments affordable only. Having had my ex husband up and leave I’ll never put myself in that position again. My home my money my responsibility.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
If you are making payments to a debt it will never become statute barred unless it was already statute barred back when you started making these £1 token payments – it doesn’t sound as though that is relevant to you.)
Should I risk waking them up?
To say what? You can’t say the debts are statute barred because they aren’t.
It is however possible that some debts are not enforceable because the creditor cannot produce the CCA agreement. This only applies to loans, credit cards, catalogues – not overdrafts, mobiles, utility debts etc. See https://debtcamel.co.uk/ask-cca-agreement-for-debt/ for more about this.
I’ve also moved but have post divert set up and again not got round to informing everyone.
It is expensive to get mail diverted for long periods – it might be better to tell the creditors and use the money to repay to the debts.
Im terrified of getting CCJs as I could loose my job.
What is your job?
Would my debtors have to ask court for permission?
Permission to submit a claim to the court? No.
You will need to defend a case if one is started. It isn’t clear on what basis you can defend the case – possibly lask of a CCA agreement for some debts but it won’t apply to all and it is MUCH simpler to ask for the CCA agreement before the creditor starts a court case than to defend one.
The big problem for you is if a claim is submitted and you don’t get the court papers because they did not go to your address – then there will be a judgement “in default” if you do not submit a defence. The timescales for doing this are very tight.
I would like to stick to £1 payments as well as I don’t include my partners money as no debts are his or in his name therefore his money is his not mine and almost all bills are in my name, and still works out as token payments affordable only
Is your partner not contributing his fair share of the bills? A creditor would not think that was fair, nor would a court.
Kelly says
Hi thanks for the quick response. They are debts from my previous marriage and I can barely get maintenance from him let alone have him support debts he hasn’t got his name on. I do not think it’s right my current partner pay towards my debts just as I wouldn’t pay anything for what he built up with his ex wife.
But yes he does pay for bills but I’m the main earner. My job involves having clearance checks etc. SC level.
Is a defence to a CCJ that you have been making agreed payments? Just curious.
I did think they were not going to barred I was just confused about the default notice bit.
Is it worth asking for CCAs? Won’t that frustrate them? I will go and look at that link thank you
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Is a defence to a CCJ that you have been making agreed payments?
No.
Is it worth asking for CCAs?
At the moment that is a diffifcult decision as you have no problem with carrying on making the £1 payments, so letting sleeping creditors lie you may feel is best.
But if a creditor wakes up, I suggest asking for a CCA agreement should be one of the first things you think of – do not let this get to the court claim situation.
Doing this, the only risk is that you don’t get the court papers and get a CCJ “in default” as you did not make a claim. If that is a huge problem for you it may be better to tell the creditors where you live… because you think a new Income and Expenditure form will still show you can only afford £1 a month.
Kelly says
Thank you. I just went through them and three of the seven I have are with Cabot and I’ve already given them my address and a recent finance sheet so I think I’m all good there.
Just another three (two with one!), two of the companies I haven’t heard from in years! Crazy! But I still make my standing order payments to them. So I’ll send them my address and deed poll name of change over the next few weeks. My postal direct runs out in October.
Sam says
Hi, so I have a debt on my credit file that is in default and the default date is 02/08/2015 – so it is due for being statute barred I believe? I haven’t made any payments and had no contact at all with the creditor. The account was for a phone contract and I know it was opened a year before that date. I received a letter in the post yesterday from Moriarity Law saying ‘we have been attempting to contact you, and have been giving this address as where your residing, we would like to discuss a personal and private matter, if this is you please could you contact us etc’. Very much worded so I call and catch my self out?
What should I do? I don’t want to just leave it and get slapped with a CCJ in the last two/three weeks of this debt being enforceable, do I contact them and ask for proof of this debt? Any help would be great.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest you talk to National Debtline on 0808 808 4000 about whether this is statute barred and your options.
Jay says
Hi, after a little advice, i have been receiving letters from HMRC stating i owe £6474.09 but what with Corona and limited staff have not been able to speak to anyone regarding this so i sent the standard template statute barred letter thinking they would enlighten me on why i owe this money? This is the reply i received….
Dear Mr Jackson
About the£6474.09 owed
Regarding your enquiry about the limitation act 1980
The act provides a timescale in which a debt can be pursued through civil proceedings in England and Wales. The act prevents civil proceedings being taken against the debtor after six years or more have passed since the latest of the following:
*The date the debt arose
*The date the debtor last acknowledged the debt
*The date the last voluntary payment was made
This act does not affect our ability to recover the debt by deductions from benefit or the state pension. We are empowered to do this under the social security administration act 1992, c2 part 111 “overpayments and adjustments of benefit”
If you require details about the payments made by inland revenue and universal credit and any written contact from yourself you will need to contact them directly, The number to phone HMRC IS 03453003900 and for universal credit is 0800328544
What happens next
If benefit or a state pension is in payment, deductions will be taken until the debt is paid back.
If no deductions from benefit or state pensions can be set we will write periodically as a reminder of the debt. The law allows us to do this, we will also initiate other means of recovery available to us, such as instructing an employer to set up a direct earnings attachment.
We may also ask a private debt collection agencies to recover the debt on our behalf.
To make arrangements to pay back the amount owe please contact us.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Tax debts should be treated as a priority debt.
If you do not know why you owe this money, you need to ask them which tax year it relates to. It you don’t think you did owe any money for that year, you should talk to your accountant if you have one.
Read https://debtcamel.co.uk/10-things-you-should-know-if-you-cant-pay-a-tax-bill/. And if you are self emplyed or have a small limited company, talk to Business debtline about your situation.
Jay says
Hi Sara, thanks for the reply , its not from HMRC its from the DWP, lol , no idea where that came from!
Gayna dean says
Could it be a tax credits overpayment?
Jay says
Hi Gayna, we don’t claim tax credits, myself and my wife are both self employed and just scrape by so never end up paying tax so ive no idea where this supposed debt has come from?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I think you need to ask the DWP what sort of debt it is. Until you know that, you don’t know what your options are. Talk to your local Citizens Advice if you need help.
Natasha says
Hi there. Thanks for such a helpful site. Want to ask if contacting creditors to inform of a change of address resets the clock? Thanks. I’ll probably have more questions. :)
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Yes.
Natasha says
Can I please clarify if this includes just a phone call to them? My understanding from your article is that it’s written correspondence from my side only that resets that clock. Thanks!
Sara (Debt Camel) says
what do you expect to say in a phone call?
Natasha says
Literally just my new address details and resist being pulled into discussing the debt, although obviously I’ll need to provide my account number to do so. But your article does seem very clear that acknowledgement of the debt only counts when it’s in writing (same at the National Debtline link) so I’m a bit confused; the implication is we *could* acknowledge the debt over the phone, but that this won’t count. Regardless, all I’m looking to do is change my address. Thanks for your help!
Sara (Debt Camel) says
how close do you think the debt is to being statute barred?
RS says
Hi Sara.
I’ve got 2 debts in default originally from 2 loan companies. I missed payment 2/2016 and 7/2015.
They have been bought by lowell debt company 2/2018 and 8/2018 and reads as ‘updated’ on credit score. To my understanding the debts should become statute barred from original missed payment or 3-6 months roughly.
So when it comes to February 2022 is it worth me contacting/ringing them and telling them it’s unforcable and asking to remove off my credit score? I understand I don’t want to agree to payments and I don’t want to admit they are mine formally. I’m looking at getting a mortgage next year and hoping the defaults will be gone as I originally missed payments 6 years ago.
Thankyou for your help.
RS
Sara (Debt Camel) says
So you haven’t made any payments since 2/16 and 7/15?
What is the default date showing on your credit records for the debts?
Were you sent a Default Notice by the original lenders, if so, when?
RS says
Thanks for getting back to me so quickly. I’ve made no payments or contact with them since 2/16 and 7/15 at all. There is no default date showing on the credit score, but it shows when the account was ‘opened’ and updated. It doesn’t show missed payment on the report because I’ve never even had contact with lowell let alone paid them anything. To be honest I have no idea if I was sent a letter about defaults years ago. But all it reads on my credit score is how much owed, lowell and updated in 2018 but I know 100% I didn’t pay the debts at all. I haven’t contacted lowell and won’t till past Feb 2022 anyway, because that’s the statute barred timing. Thanks again
Sara (Debt Camel) says
So the bad news is statute-barred debt is not as simple as counting from when you missed a payment. Read the article above. You CANNOT assume the loans will be statute barred from then – phone National Debtline to discuss this.
Even if they are statute barred, that is not a reason why a lender should have to remove them from your credit record. So if you want a mortgage next year, lenders will see these unsettled debts.
If you want defaults added to your credit records so the debts drop off, you have to ask the original lender to do this. Then Lowell will add the same default. This will count as acknowledging the debt so restart the 6 year clock.
There is no clear way forward that will definitely get you a mortgage next year. But getting defaults added is a good start. Then you need to
EITHER settle the debts (partially or in full) 12 months before a mortgage application if they still show on your credit record
OR settle the debts 6 months before if the loans no longer show on your credit record as they have dropped off
OR ask Lowell to produce the CCA agreements for the debts (see https://debtcamel.co.uk/ask-cca-agreement-for-debt/ – this also acknowledges the debt) – if they can they are unenforceable and you don’t have to pay, if they can you need to settle the debts.
RS says
Hi thanks for the reply. Really helpful. I’ve been doing loads of research today and looking into my defaults and found the actual default dates, which are different. 05/2016 and 07/2016. Using another credit score agency.
So assuming they don’t contact me for payments, it will be 6 years 05/2022 & 07/2022. I understand they won’t be enforceable after this date. Do they just come off the credit report as ‘settled’ after this date or would I have to contact lowell to ask them to take off? I’m unsure what happens after 6 years after defaulting on payment because I’ve never had the issue before. Thanks again
Sara (Debt Camel) says
it will be 6 years 05/2022 & 07/2022.
At that point the debts will drop off your credit record automatically.
But this does NOT mean at that point they are statute barred. Read the article above and talk to National Debtline. Statute barring has NOTHING to do with wh=ther they are on your credit record.
If they are statute barred they are not enforceable.
But they may not be on your credit record and they can still be enforceable.
And before that point you are likely to be contacted by Lowell and asked to settle the debts or make a payment arrangement. See https://debtcamel.co.uk/no-calls-or-letters-about-debt/
RS says
Ahh I see what you are saying. Thankyou so much for the help and advice. I’ll probably update the comment next year if my original comment still on here. Thanks again.
RS
SAM says
H Sara,
Continuing on from my last comments regarding the letter from Hoist claiming they had a CCJ, I rewrote to the Courts asking for details who have written back to say that they are unable to help further as they cannot trace the case with the details (number) i provided, given to me by Hoist Finance. That “the case is not recognised”. They they have suggested that I write to the debt collection agency asking for more details where they obtained the number from and if they hold further information on it.
I have spoken to National Debtline about it and explained. On their advise, I have written to Hoist Finance asking them “for more information as I don’t know anything about this”. I also told them that I was getting advice from National Debtline That was last week, I am still waiting for them to reply.
Is there anything else I should do? Its most worrying.
Thank you and kind regards
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I think just sit and wait. How stressful.
SAM says
On another related matter: to do with Statute Barred debts sold to DCA’s:
I’ve received 2 emails in the space of a week or so from Capquest asking me to log on to their website to review some document they have sent me. These are fr 2 separate accounts.
I am suspicious as the emails have come on the back of the Hoist Finance issue and some past correspondence from other DCA which you will know were closed by the DCA as they were Statute Barred.
Can you advice if I should I log in and check the information or ignore them because I feel that they might be on phishing exercise because if not they would have sent me a letter about this.
I am afraid in case I trigger anything.
Thank you again for your advice about this.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I always suggest people log in and check the info. Shutting your eyes and hoping they go away is rarely a good option.
Mr S says
Good day, I just received a letter from hoist finance asking me to confirm my address, that they were just about to contact me on an old address, I have no idea what this is about, I know I owed some money but had a failed marriage and child custody issue and lost my job around 2012, last payment I made for any debt was in 2013, my credit record shows no court judgements against me, all the defaults on my credit report are gone since 2 years back, are my debts status barred ? What should I do about hoist finance
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest you contact them and ask them what the alleged debt is as you have no idea.
The article above looks at when a debt is statute barred, yours sound pretty old, but you need to find out the information on this one.
Mr S says
Thank you very much for your advice, since its most likely whatever debt it maybe will be SB, I think I may ignore the first letter, if another letter shows up then I will follow up on it by reaching out to them, am only starting to get my life together after many years out of work, don’t need the extra stress from them
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I do not recommend this. Just because a debt may well be statute barred doesn’t mean you can assume it is. What if they decide this isn’t the right address for you as you didn’t respond, and send court papers to the previous address?
If you aren’t sure about what to do, I suggest you talk to National Debtline on 0808 808 4000.
Mr S says
Thank you very much once again for your advice. I decided to call them and it was about a lloyds over draft of £344.17, they said it defaulted in Nov 2012 and they bought it over in September 2015, I honestly don’t remember this debt at all, I don’t even remember Lloyd’s giving me an overdraft. I did not acknowledge the debt and instead said I would try and reach my ex wife to find out if she knows anything about it and call them back before the end of the week, please can you advice what I should do next
Sara (Debt Camel) says
statute barring for overdrafts can be complicated – talk to National Debtline about this.
Steve says
Hi. I had a bad credit loan taken out in September 2015, no payments have been made at all, I emailed them in November 2015 to inform I had lost my job. No payments have been made at all and no contact since November 2015. Missed payments are noted on the credit file from November 2015. A default was not added to the account until March 2017. Should a default have been added earlier and when does it become statute barred?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
who was the lender?
Steve says
Likely loans.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
would the loan have been affordable if you had not lost your job? A loan is only affordable if you could afford to repay it and still be able to pay all your other debts , bills and living expenses, without getting further into debt?
Steve says
Yes. It became affordable once a new job was found. I don’t intend to question the affordability. The question is really about the long time for default to be added and the statue. Thanks.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Yes a default should have been added earlier.
The article above looks at whether a debt may be statute barred – you can call National Debtline and talk through your case in detail with them.
Mohammed says
5 years and 11 months before debt becomes statue barred and pra group keep ringing, no pre action letter yet or aggressive letters just polite ones, chance of them whacking me with a ccj in the next 28days?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
what sort of debt is this? What happened 5 years and 11 months ago?
Mohammed akbar says
2 credit card debts they have purchased both around 5grand each, last payment was 5 years 11 months ago , not sure how long ago they have purchased the debt , but had no one chasing me for some reason, I didn’t pay over 36000 in cards and loans and not one ccj or bailiff nothing lol thought I was home free but for some reason they are pushing hard with the phone calls the last month, possibly cos it will be statute barred soon? I’m so paranoid as my credit rating is now excellent ( I was in an i.v.a but that failed, rang them to confirm and they say the last payment did go out mid October 2015
Sara (Debt Camel) says
rang them to confirm and they say the last payment did go out mid October 2015
rang who, the IVA firm or PRA?
how old are the accounts?
Mohammed akbar says
Sorry see where the confusion may be , it has been 5years 11 months since I made any payment or acknowledge any debt lol
I rang the Iva firm to confirm when the last payment was made to any creditors on my behalf, they said the 12th October 2015, the original accounts were opened around 2010 then I think I started struggling around 8 years ago, got an Iva and then that failed 2015. Just surprised none of the creditors pestered me when the I.v.a failed, as I said 36000 pound in various credit cards and loans and hardly any letters asking for payment, just unsure how fast pra group can get an Iva in place, I know they don’t HAVE to give me a pre action letter if they want to issue a ccj without covering their costs, never moved house never changed phone numbers
Sara (Debt Camel) says
so 5 year 11 month was the last payment by your IVA firm to your creditors. What was the date on the termination letter of your IVA?
PRA should send a pre action letter.
Mohamed Akbar says
I understand that they don’t have to send a pre action letter if they are willing to forgo the court costs of taking out a ccj against me ? I’ll ring my old Iva firm up tommoro and ask what date my Iva was terminated, possibly they sent a letter to my creditors informing them of Iva termination? Could they use the termination letter date of the i.va as last contact?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I understand that they don’t have to send a pre action letter if they are willing to forgo the court costs of taking out a ccj against me ?
where did you hear that?
Until your IVA is terminated, your creditors can’t start court action against you.
Mohammed says
My Iva is terminated. I’ll just ride it out and worry myself silly for the next month
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Yes I understand that. What I don’t know is whether you are working the 6 years statute barred from the right date. If you don’t know the terminal date, as k your IVA firm now what it was as you may need this and you do not want to have a delay finding this out later.
You can also talk to National Debtline on 0808 808 4000 about your situation and statute barring.
If they send you a Letter Before Action, do not ignore this. And at that point you also want to ask them to produce the CCA agreements for the cards, as well as possibly saying they are statute barred. Again National Debtline can advise on this.
Mohammed says
Yeah ur spot on with ur advice thank u very much
Jess says
Hi Sara
I had a loan with five lamps from March 2014 , I made payments until October 2015 , I then lost my job . It shows as settled on my credit file . It was sold but just receive a statement once a year . Will this loan become status barred this October .
Thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Were you ever sent a Default Notice? What default date shows on your credit record?
Jess says
Hi Sara
No default notice was sent but , each year I get a letter saying I am arrears and how much the balance is .
Sara (Debt Camel) says
is there a default date on your credit record? not missed payments, but an actual default date.
Jess says
Hi Sara
No default date on my credit file , just showing account was settled July 2016 . Not sure what the best thing is to do .
Thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
so who sends you a statement once a year? This is probably the debt collector this was sold to. Have you looked at your credit records with all 3 credit reference agencies – the debt to the debt collector may show on one of them.
george g says
Hi Sara, just need a bit of advice please. i had a vanquis cc and default notice is sept 2015. The debt was sold to lowell and due to my ignorance i started paying them, would this debt be statute barre as default was sept 15/
Thanks for any advice
Sara (Debt Camel) says
no, it can’t be statute barred until after you have stopped paying them for 6 years.
Was the debt large? Do you think Vanquis increased your credit limit too high?
george g says
Hi Sara, the original debt was £1800, now down to £800. i was paying £25 a month to dca but due to now being on state pension, i dropped it to £2.
Letter today from link, debt is currently unenforceable as original creditor cannot find paperwork.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
ok so you can now stop paying anything.
I assume there is a default date on your credit record in 2015 so the debt should be fdropping off this year.
george g says
Thanks Sara
Wictor says
Dear Sara
My Halifax bank account was closed in 2013 by their own decision. They never contacted me till today about the overdraft of the account. Recently, I checked my two credit file (Trans union and Equifax) who show different information. Equifax does not show anything but Trans Union still show that the Halifax bank account is open and overdraft is due. The account was closed by the Halifax and I requested to keep it open but the branch could not help me as the decision from the head office. One of the employee also advised that I can open bank account with other provider. So, I was upset and I did not bother checking back on my credit file. At the same period of time my Lloyds TSB account was also closed as they are under the same LLOYDS BANKING GROUP. There is no trace of Lloyds TSB bank account as it is closed more than 6 years ago.
However, my question is that is my overdraft debt is statute barred and if I write to them will they delete from the credit file? Overall, what will be the impact on my credit file and how can I tackle myself? I do not want to pay as it is more than 6 years ago and they did not support me during account closure. The credit file showing that the account is open as up-to-date.
Please advise me as my financial condition is not good and any impact on my credit file will affect me mentally. Last year, just one Default account had came off. Recently, I closed down few other credit accounts to improve my credit score.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
my question is that is my overdraft debt is statute barred
I can’t give a definite answer to this. But the bank closing your account suggests it may well be. I suggest you talk to National Debtline on 0808 808 4000 about this. They can also talk about the rest of your financial position.
Closing down credit accounts doesn’t usually improve your credit score.
KATHERINE says
Hi
Received letter recently from hoist chasing a debt.
I believed it to be sb. They have replied saying its not and that ‘the last payment was made on the 24th january 2017’.
Ive checked both my bank accts and nothing about any payment. Been onto banks on phone and no joy .
I do recall i set uo a dd or so but i think it failed as i remember letters but cant recall if from dca or bank.
My question is, if they never actually got a payment (payment rejected or whatever) does that count as acknowledgement or not?
Hoist gave me 30 days to respond. Other advice so far was to send cca request and perhaps a sar?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
If you authorised a creditor in writing to set up a DD then that probably counts as acknowledging the debt.
What sort of debt was this originally?
KATHERINE says
Hi
It was for a loan. Originally 8k but obvs charges etc added on
Sara (Debt Camel) says
when did you take the loan out and when did you default on it?
Is the current balance over 10k?
Do you think the loan was affordable at the time it was given? A debt is only affordable if you can repay it and pay your other debts, bills and living exp-enses without being so short of money you have to borrow more each month.
The loan may have been affordable at the start, but then you later ran into problems eg if your income dropped.
KATHERINE says
The loan amount is now £13k. Loan agreed in 2008. Default i think 2010 (dropped off file already)
There was a dmp through payplan that i ended up stopping. Then i set up another myself using online company(cant mind name) but again i stopped paying it. There was a gap from that to this payment they claim i made, could be enough of a gap to mean it is sb but im unsure when last payment was via payment plan.
Hence the advice to request cca. Unfortunately i didnt realise i should have sent a prove it letter first.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
a Prove It letter is pointless – you know this is your debt.
Yes you can ask for a CCA. Ask using the correct wording and send £1 – see https://debtcamel.co.uk/ask-cca-agreement-for-debt/ for a link to the template to use.
As the debt is over 10k, you may find a solictor to take on your defence if they produce a CCA and were to sue you.
Beryl says
I have recently returned to the country after 11 years abroad. A couple of weeks ago I received a letter claiming that I owed money on a credit card. I have no recollection of this debt so sent a statute barred letter. This debt was sold on to another company so I also sent them a statute barred letter.
I have now received a letter stating that my debt would be reduced if I made a payment. Should I ignore this offer or send another statute barred letter?
Thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
A couple of weeks ago I received a letter claiming that I owed money on a credit card. I have no recollection of this debt so sent a statute barred letter. This debt was sold on to another company so I also sent them a statute barred letter.
Who was the letter from? who is the other company you sent a statute barred letter too?
Beryl says
Hi Sara
The first letter was from Cabot Financial and the second one from LCS. The offer of a reduced debt also came from LCS
The letter from LCS states that their client is Cabot Financial
Thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest you reply saying you are waiting for a response to your letter dated dd/mm/yy saying that the debt is statute barred.
Beryl says
Hi Sara,
Thanks for the advice. I will do that and update you when I receive a response.
Jay says
Hello,
How does the 6 year statute of limitation period apply in practice to gas, electricity and water bills becoming statute barred 6 years after the date on the bill? Service providers don’t usually leave bills for six years without asking for payment or without meanwhile receiving a payment on account. Does such a payment on account have the effect of “resetting” the 6 year period for the older bills?
I ask as an electricity account customer who has difficulty paying on time or in full, and where I am usually in a continuous debt situation with the provider and never really up to date. Of course I am attracted by the idea that bills more than 6 years old may have become irrecoverable with the passing of time but wonder if the 6 year period is reset by making a payment towards several outstanding bills ? For example, a budget account where an amount is paid monthly by direct debit for current usage and towards arrears. Put another way, can the service provider apportion a payment towards older bills first, with the effect of resetting the 6 year period ?
Jay
Sara (Debt Camel) says
yes it’s pretty normal to use arrears payments towards the oldest debt.
Have you got arrears for several years separately itemised? Or just a single large arrears amount?
Do you have other debt problems as well as these energy debts?
claire says
Received a letter from mortimer clarke sols saying that I owed in excess of £8k. I think this may be from a LTSB loan I took out in 2009 which I stopped paying when I fell pregnant in 2010 as was in a really bad position financially back then. I stopped receiving letters pretty quickly and heard nothing until after I got married in 2018. The most recent one (sept this year) I sent them a statute barred letter which I found on your website. They then came back and said that it is not statute barred as in Sept 2016 a CCJ was served. There is no CCJ on my file for this. Turns out that they applied for a CCJ, I never received any documentation about a CCJ and so obviously could not respond to it & for whatever reason after the two week period, they never lifted the stay and never actually completed the CCJ. Although they said in the letter if I didn’t pay in full they would lift the stay and register the CCJ (5 years later). I responded with a subject access request and they are now saying they want certified copies of my ID before they will provide this information to me. Can they even do this? It has been approx 10 years since I ceased making payments for this and didnt start receiving letters until early 2019?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I don’t understand what is going on here or why there was a stay applied for by the claimant. This is not normal. I suggest you phone National Debtline on 0808 808 4000 and also post on the Legal Beagles forum https://legalbeagles.info/forums/forum/legal-forums/court-claims-and-issues.
Asking for a SAR is a good move. They are being unreasonable in asking for a certified copy – after all they are talking to you about the debt so they should know they are speaking to the correct person. You can put in a complaint about this and send it to the Financial Ombudsman. Whether you think this is worth arguing about this up to you – you could just pop round to a solicitors who will sign the copy for about £10.
Who is the claimant? I assume this debt has been sold to a debt collector so it’s not TSB. You need to send the debt collector a request for a copy of the CCA agreement. National Debtline & Legal Beagles will explain all this.
Claire says
Thank you so much! This has been really helpful. It’s been really worrying me as I have tried so hard in recent years to clear my debt and get in a better place with my credit score. I will definitely do what you have recommended. The claimant is Cabot Financial, so yes I think it must have been sold on. PS. Sorry I posted in the wrong place.
Martin says
Hi, I had a default dated October 2017 from an overdraft for £3260 when they increased my overdraft from £300 to £2850 I was compulsively gambling, my statement had multiple gambling transactions a day also taking out payday loans almost daily as I was out of control. This was clear on my statements.
I complained that they lent to me irresponsibly as they had information and shouldn’t have increased my overdraft.They refused my complaint so I went to the FOS and they agreed and told Halifax to refund all interest/charges leaving a balance of £1790.
They said as they should not have increased my overdraft in July 2015 that the default had to be backdated to that date so its over 6 years old and will drop off my credit file but the debt £1790 remains.
I had to retire on ill health grounds so now on a pension, income is small but above benefit level. The question is, as the default is now over 6 years ago and they never got a CCJ is the debt unenforceable and not able to show on my credit file. Or because they have just been given this instruction will they have the leeway to go for a CCJ now for the outstanding balance. I want to negotiate and pay as little as possible as I don’t have the money, am vulnerable and of course it being unenforceable would make my negotiating position much stronger so that I could maybe get the debt written off or make a token payment. anything you can say on this matter would be greatly appreciated.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
No this cannot be statute barred. It doesn’t matter how long ago the default was or if it no longer shows on your credit recors, you have been using the account in the last 6 years.
What is the rest of your debt situation like? Do you have other debts you are up to date with? Debts which you are in arrears with?
Are you buying or renting?
Have you had benefits advice? If you retired on ill-health grounds, could you be eligible for disability benefits?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Also have you looked payday loan affordability complaints? Which lenders did you use?
Drew says
Hi there,
Around 2002/2003 ish I had a car on finance. I could not afford it and so returned the car to them. The car was sold back to themselves stupidly low via auction leaving a balance owing of £6000+
I paid very little to them afterwards and it’s been at least 15 years sconce I actually made contact with them.
They wrote to me at my old address just over 4 years ago but that letter was put in the bin. I recently had an email from a debt company regarding this debt and I replied with a standard statute barred letter – they replied and want me to confirm my birthday to prove it was really me… I didn’t reply as I didn’t want to reset the counter however they’ve emailed again today saying they’ve placed the account on hold for 7 days but then they’ll begin collection proceedings against me again so do I need to confirm my date of birth – I would hate to do anything to start the clock on this 20 year old debt again!
Any advice would be brilliant thank you.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
If a debt is statute barred, nothing you can do will “unbar” it.
If you would like confirmation about this, and that your very old debt is probably statute barred, talk to National Debtline on 0808 808 4000.
Drew says
Hi, my main concern was more that speaking to the debt company would restart the timer on a debt that was statute barred. It’s definitely statute barred as it’s been over 15 years since I’ve spoken to anyone about the debt.
Are they able to ask me for my date of birth or will me answering them restart the clock?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
1) you can only acknowledge a debt in writing, not on the phone.
2) if a debt is already statute barred , it doesn’t matter what you do it can never be unbarred. You can start making payments to it and that would not change.
Please talk to National Debtline if you are unsure.
katherine says
hi again. apologies for late reply. Thanks for template. letter sent. awaiting with baited breath.
You stated in your reply that I should get a solicitor to defend my case as over 10k. I am a SAHM so I thats not an option as im not earning at the moment.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I understand that, but it would still be worth talking to a solicitor as they may sometimes take on cases over 10k on a no win, no fee basis as if they win your costs will be paid by the creditor.
KATHERINE says
They are more likely to issue a claim if they are sure they can win.
Unless sb then ive not too many options. Im going to assume they can supply cca anyway. If it isnt sb i will have to make a very low offer with a view to look at it after 12mths or so(retraining to be self employed in new year) hoping that can buy me some time to gather up enough for a lump sum offer. Id rather it didnt get to court as ive had a clean credit file for few years now.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
They are more likely to issue a claim if they are sure they can win.
No, they know most people don’t try to define a claim.
Im going to assume they can supply cca anyway.
Why would you assume this? Have you asked them to produce the CCA?
KATHERINE REID says
Im assuming they have as in im going to prepare for the worst. Just so i can think about my options.
They have alleged a payment was made on a certain date so they may well have something, but, as you know yourself they may be chancing. Soon find out anyway.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
You need to check your bank statement for a payment on a day. Often people are told this but there is no sign of a payment. And why would someone make a small random payment for one month in the middle of a many year no payments.
KATHERINE says
Ive checked both accounts i have and even phoned them and had them look. Nothing showing in either. They were only recently opened back then so not much in the way of outgoing payments.
What happens then if theres no mention of these payments in cca docs? Assuming they are able to supply them.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Have you now asked them to produce the CCA using the correct letter?
I suggest you reply to the debt collector that your bank statements show you never made a payment on that date.
KATHERINE says
I did yes . I used the template you included in your reply. Should i not have sent it? I thought i should as then there would be the statement of account which would show the payments that were made.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
yes, I was going to say Do It if you hadn’t. It is mostly useful for seeing if then can produce the CCA agreement.
Mandy says
Hi Sarah, I have a letter from LINK Financial in 2019 stating they could not find the CCA, therefore debt is unenforceable. In the last month, even though nothing has changed, they are calling every other day, texting me and now just started to email me. I thought this was not allowed. I have been given a terminal cancer diagnoses so I don’t need this harassment from them. What should I do. Thank you
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Do the texts and emails say the debt is unenforceable?
I’m sorry to hear about your diagnosis – you don’t need and shouldn’t have to put up with the extra stress of hassle from Link.
Mandy says
Thank you. No, they just say to call them. There are two different numbers they are texting me on. They are ringing and leaving voicemail and now they are emailing to say you haven’t yet been in touch regarding your account and to contact them. I went through the prove it CCA in 2019 and they could not provide it and still haven’t. The letter said it wasn’t enforceable but they could still ask for the money. Initially it was a message every 6 months but this is ridiculous
the email asks me to log onto their portal to set up a direct debit and manage my account
Mandy Bradshaw says
Hi Sarah, just wanted yo let you know that after your advice Link agreed that they had not followed the correct procedure in telling me that the debt was un enforceable. They apologised. Offered me £50 and wrote the debt off, so thank you so much
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Good!
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Go back to Link by email saying:
– you confirmed in 2019 that you could not produce a copy of the CCA agreement for this debt and that it is unenforceable.
– since [month/year] you have been receiving texts and emails saying asking you to contact them or login to you account to set up a direct debit. None of these communications mentions that the debt is unenforceable and they are therefore in breach of CONC 13. 1.6(4) which says that “The firm should, in any request for payment or communication relating to a payment (other than a statement issued in accordance with the CCA or regulations made under it which does not constitute or contain a request for payment) in such cases, make clear to the customer that although the debt remains outstanding it is unenforceable.”
– Add that you have recently received a diagnosis of [type of cancer] and you have been informed that this is terminal. If there is some letter you have that confirms this, attache a copy of it to the email
– Say you will not be making any payments towards this unenforceable debt and in view of your health you would like Link to confirm that they will stop sending you texts and emails about this. Say you do not have a problem if they send an occasional letter.
– Say if they do not agree to this you will be sending a complaint to the Financial Ombudsman and end by saying that in view of your health, you would like a response to this email from their Vulnerable Customer Team.
————— and from this point on, keep a record of the date and times of the texts you receive.
Mandy says
Thank you do much Sarah
Steve says
Hi,
I was looking for advice on an old CCJ. I was in a short term tenancy agreement (9 Months) with someone in 2014, moved out after 2-3 months. they requested I leave the premises. So I left, lost my job due to stress because of this. I asked them to sign the breakout clause of 3 months which they refused and they continued to live in the house. I stopped paying rent and bills as I was not living there any longer. I left I was sleeping on brothers and family members sofas for the remaining 6 months until I started renting a separate property in 2015.
I never receive any letters of claim or court hearing dates but find out in 2019 that the CCJ had been on my record since 2014 which was a shock for me. I call the court and am told without the reference number which would have been on the original court documents (Which i didn’t receive) That they couldn’t give me the persons email/house address etc due to GDPR. So I leave it then speak to Solicitors and they tell me to leave it alone till 6 years passes at which point it will come off my record (Nov 2020).
So I leave it, it dissapears, then this year in May time so roughly 7.5 years after the original CCJ was issued in Default I get a letter for the first time saying that I have to go to court and this person is now claiming £7,000 (interest) as opposed to the £1250 they originally claimed. they are trying to set aside the judgement and then re-issue the claim for the new amount.
Thanks! Steve
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest you talk to National Debtline on 0808 808 4000
Paul says
Hi Sara Cabot keep contacting me for a debt from 2015, I have never acknowledged this with them , they keep sending me letter any advice?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
This was your debt, not something you don’t know about?
What sort of debt was it?
When you say 2015 was the the date the account started? of the date you stopped payming? or the default date on your credit record or what?
Were you ever send a default notice?
Do the letters just ask you may an arrangement to pay or are they threatening court action?
Paul says
It was car finance taken out in 2013 , the same year I was sent to prison , the car was given back to finance company , wrote and told them the situation , but last year started getting letters from this debt collection agency asking to make arrangements to pay , no court action just to contact them to make arrangements to pay
Sara (Debt Camel) says
” the car was given back to finance company”
By you? or did they repossess it?
When you write to them, what did you ask them to do?
does this debt show on your credit record – if so what is the default date, or isn’t there one?
How large is the debt they are asking you to pay?
what is the rest of your financial situation like?
Paul says
Hi Sara ,Santander who finance was with I told them to collect the car as I will be incarcerated and would be unable to keep up with payment,
This debt does not show on my credit file, the balance the debt collection is asking for is £2990 , no default showing on file
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Has the default ever shown on your credit record? Have you checked all three credit reference agencies – Experian, Equifax, and TransUnion?
The question is whether this old debt is statute barred. The article above gave a link to this National Debtline factsheet which has a section on “When does the limitation period start running?” https://www.nationaldebtline.org/fact-sheet-library/statute-barred-debts-ew/.
The problem in your case is that you may not have a lot of the paperwork relating to this car finance and all the legal letter that were sent when you stopped paying. It may be hard for you to be sure about what happened and when.
You could talk to National Debtline about this now on 0808 808 4000. They may think it is a good idea for you to send a Subject Access Request to the car finance (not Cabot) asking for copies of all information they have about you. Or they may think it is a better idea to do nothing at the moment until Cabot – or their solicitors – send you a Letter Before Action which is the precursor to a court case.
See https://debtcamel.co.uk/letter-before-claim-ccj/ for what a Letter Before Action looks like – you need to know how to recognise when you are sent one. You should NOT ignore one – it is better to respond rather than to have to defend a court case.
So, assuming you haven’t had one so far, you could decide to wait until you do and talk to National Debtline at that point. As I said, I don’t know if it would be better to start asking questions now rather than wait.
Ali says
Hi guys,
I have a question about unpaid credit cards. I had a credit card back in 2015 and for some financial reason I stopped paying payments. I did suffered because of it but that unpaid credit card debit has been removed from my credit profile. Now I have received a letter from a debit collection agency saying that the credit card provider has sold this to them and they want to agree a plan with me. My question is I read after 6 year the it gets removed than why did I got the letter. And also how should I response to the letter will they take me to court for this ?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
There are two different things here and it can be easy to confuse them.
A debt drops off your credit record 6 years after a default date. It sounds as though this has happened to this debt. It should NOT reappear with thie new debt collector.
Debts may become statute barred 6 years after the creditor has a “cause for action” to take you to court as the article above explains. Just because a debt has dropped off your credit record does NOT mean it has to be statute barred.
Amy says
Hi Sarah ,
I moved to my parents house the end of 2017 and now I’m receiving letters from south west water saying I owe money , I know I had a ccj from them for an outstanding bill but that is no longer on my credit report so is over 6 years old , I’m worried as I live with my parents my ex partner Is on the letter too, he lives somewhere else now. My question is can they still collect the debt ? They are saying on the letter about a writ to control or attachments of earning or sending a collection agency to my parents home ? Can you let me know what is best to do please , I’ve never contacted them about paying the outstanding bill , I know it’s been years. Many thanks .
Sara (Debt Camel) says
A debt doesn’t become statute barred when there is a CCJ. But if it has gone 6 years without you paying and without them trying to enforce the debt, it becomes much harder for them to enforce this now. One problem may be whether your ex has made any payments to this – would you know?
I suggest you phone National Debtline on 0808 808 4000 about this, don’t ignore it. They are open on Saturday mornings.
Amy says
It is definitely over 6years as the the ccj is no longer showing on my file , my ex partner has not paid anything to them or spoke to anyone about this . Should I call them about this ?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Call National Debtline, don’t call the water company..
Amy says
Ok thank you I’ll call the today , thank you.
KATHERINE REID says
Hi Sarah
Quick update of sorts.
So i sent cca request. Letter was dated 3rd nov but didnt get posted til 5th.
I also forgot to include the £1 fee. I sent this separately on the monday, when they would have recieved cca request. As expected they returned the fee by fri of same week.
However, since then, no response to cca request so far. No letter nothing Not sure what to make of that. Do i now just sit and tight and wait it out?
Thanks
Katherine
Sara (Debt Camel) says
You can Wait another few weeks or email them now and ask them to confirm that. The debt is currently unenforceable as they have not produced the CCA agreement.
Ali says
Hi guys
I need some advise I had a credit card back in 2015 for Lloyds bank I stopped paying credit card payment in March 2015. That debt was on my credit profile until August 2021 which was removed recently. Now couple of weeks ago I have received a letter from a debt collection agency which says that they have bought the account from Lloyds and they wants to talk etc. Also I had a visit from them at my house and gave me a letter as well. I have no idea what to do as I check my credit profile again with Experian there no current debit by that name. Can anyone please advise what to do in this situation. Ps I have not made any payment since March 2015.
Thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Is the balance owed large?
You have two possible ways to challenge this. The first is to say that it is statute barred. Do you remember if you were sent a Default Notice by Lloyds? NB a Default Notice is a formal letter, it has NOTHING to do with when a default was added to you credit record. Because as the article above explains, statute barring may only start with a Default Notice.
The other way is to ask the debt collector to produce the CCA agreement for the debt. If they can’t do this, it is unenforceable in court. Read https://debtcamel.co.uk/ask-cca-agreement-for-debt/. As that says, if the debt may be statute barred it may be better to challenge it on that basis first, and fall back on asking for the CCA agreement if the debt isn’t statute barred. Phone National Debtline and talk to them about this.
Ali says
The debit is around £1800 also I don’t remember them sending me a letter. Another question can I get a CCJ for this debit ?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
yes. But you may be able to defend it on the grounds that it is statute barred. Or that they cannot produce the CCA agreement. Talk to National Debtline about your options.
Debtissues says
Hi There,
I took out a Santander loan back in approx 2008 for about £15k. I paid then fell into problems.
I haven’t paid to this debt for at LEAST 8 years nor acknowledged it I thought it was Statute Barred by now. However reading this thread and others carefully – the clock for the 6 years starts ticking at the point when the Creditor has a “Cause for action” – which is the Default Notice.
HI don’t recall them ever issuing me a Default Notice – in fact, other than sending me an annual statement I have never had anything – they have never asked for me to bring the account up to date, no demands, nothing.
What should I do? Responding to the next annual Statement with “What’s this – I don’t remember the debt, prove it” kind of thing is dangerous – it could wake them up to the situation, similarly asking for a copy of the default notice could do the same…. At the moment, the debt isn’t a problem, I’m not being hassled or paying anything – but I am middle aged, I don’t want it rearing it’s head when I get to my ’70’s!!
I could leave it well alone – Is there a timeframe at which point a court would rule the lender didn’t act properly in NOT issuing a Default Notice in “reasonable time” of the initial breach of contract?
The debt was a fixed term, fixed interest rate loan, so there was a clear “cut off” of payments, it’s not like an overdraft or a “repayment on demand” type loan.
Can you offer some advice please.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I assume this loan is not showing on your credit record? If they are still sending you an annual statement, they can’t have sold it to a debt collector.
Debtissues says
Yes it’s not on my Credit file.
I am worried they could issue a Default Notice, and then the 6 years would start from then, not from when I last acknowledged or paid anything to it…..
At the moment it’s not causing me a problem so I am tempted to let well alone – but whereas I was very relaxed about it, I am now a bit more worried.
Surely they cannot hold off issuing the Default Notice for years and years hoping to gain more time?
And yes, I am sure it’s not been sold on as the Statements come direct from them.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
This is so old I doubt you will have any problems. If someone does get in touch you can reasonably say you beleive the alleged debt is statute barred.
If they say it isn’t, then I suggest you talk to national Debtline on 0808 808 4000. If they start saying there was no Default Notice you may be able to make a complaint that it is unfair to raise this matter after such a long time as you no longer have any records relating to that time.
Debtissues says
Thank you – so for now I think I am best to simply forget all about it,
Would they have a defence that as they keep sending me Statements, I should have challenged them? Or will that not help them in relation to it being statute barred?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
you have to acknowledge the debt in writing – they cannot argue that sending you an annual statement has anything to do with this.
Debtissues says
I’ll just sit on it then.
Thank you Sara
Clive says
Hi Sara
I have an old credit card debt which will go statue barred in December of this year. Link Financial cannot produce the agreement or terms and conditions. Can I offer a full and final settlement figure by Phone. If link were to refuse the offer does this start the clock ticking again ie would I have to wait another 6 years before it goes statue barred.
Many thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
have you asked for the CCA agreement?
Clive says
Hi Sara
Yes I have asked for cca from original lender and Link Financial. I also done SAR to both and no agreement or terms were in the paperwork I received.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I think you will find that asking for the CCA agreement acknowledged the debt, so it will not become statute barred. Are you making payments to this debt?
Clive says
I have not made any payments in over 5years.
Cca was asked for in 2015
They have been asking me to call them. They have been phoning me, texting and emailing me on a regular basis over the last few weeks. I haven’t responded to them as yet.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
do all of these communications mention that the debt is unenforceable?
Clive says
Hi Sara
No none of the communications mention they are unenforceable. As I understand they should do, but I haven’t complained as I thought this would be an acknowledgment of the debt and therefore reset the clock on the statute barred angle
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest you start keeping a list of these communications which are in breach of the FCA’s CONC rules and otherwise ignore them.
Why would you want to offer to settle this? The CCA is obviously never going to turn up. They cannot enforce this in court. It makes no difference if it is statute barred or not!
Obviously if they send you a letter threatening court action, that is different. Then you can reply that the debt is unenforceable and that their communications are in breach of the FCA rules as they do not mention this.
I doubt you can make a settlement offer by phone – they would almost certainly ask you for some information in writing.