If you have an old debt, you may wonder if you still have to pay it? Can your creditors really take you to court after this long?
English law says a creditor only has a limited amount of time – typically six years – to take you to court. The term for a debt that is so old that it can’t be enforced in court is “statute barred”.
(You may have heard the phrase being time-barred, that means the same thing. Sometimes it is called status barred because the term statute-barred has been misheard.)
This article answers the most common questions people have about statute-barred debt, including when the six-year period begins.
If you are making payments the debt will never become statute barred no matter how old it gets. For you this article isn’t relevant, instead read Can I stop paying this old debt?
Contents
New rules for some debts – January 2019
In January 2019 there was a decision in the Court of Appeal (Doyle v PRA) that has changed the point at which the six-year period starts for some debts including credit cards and loans.
I have updated this article to reflect this.
This may lead to a lot of confusion for a while, with articles and comments on the internet describing the old position. If you are not sure what to believe or whether this affects you, talk to National Debtline on 0808 808 4000.
What is “statute barred” – an overview
Creditors have to take legal action about debts within certain times which are set out in the Limitations Act 1980. For most sorts of debts and bills in England and Wales this time is six years.
If the creditor doesn’t start court action within this time, the debt is not enforceable because it is “statute-barred”. When a debt is statute-barred it still exists legally, but because you cannot be taken to court for it, you do not have to make any payments to it.
This six-year period begins when the creditor has a cause of action – this is the point at which the creditor could go to court for the debt.
If you are making the normal monthly payments to a debt, you can’t be taken to court for it. It is only when you have missed payments and the creditor can go to court that the 6-year period starts.
Think of a timer that runs for 6 years – which can be reset
A good way to think of statute barring is that there is a 6 year timer. This is set running when the creditor has a cause of action. The sand takes 6 years to drain slowly through… at the end, your debt is statute barred.
But if you make a payment to the debt or acknowledge it in writing during the six years, the clock is reset back to start at 6 years again. So if you are making monthly payments, even tiny ones, a debt will never become statute barred as the clock resets back to 6 years every month.
What is a cause of action?
I try to avoid using legal jargon, but this point is so important that I have to talk about it.
Someone can’t sue you for a debt unless they have a good reason to – this is their cause of action. What that good reason is depends on the type of debt, how it is regulated and, sometimes, what the contract for the debt says.
This has always be complicated for some debts such as overdrafts which don’t have regular payments. You may have stopped using your overdraft 8 years ago, but your bank may not have realised this for a long while – so when would they have the right to sue you?
The January 2019 court judgment decided that a creditor’s cause of action does not start for some credit debts (including some loans and credit cards) until the creditor has sent you a Default Notice. The problem here is that you may not remember when you got that or if one was ever sent. Also the creditor can just delay sending you this so your debt may never become statute barred.
How can I tell if my debt is statute-barred?
Unsecured debts, including most loans, credit cards, catalogues and overdrafts will normally be statute-barred in England and Wales if you can say YES to all the following four points:
- it had been more than six years since you last made a payment; and
- the creditor has a cause of action more than six years ago; and
- you haven’t acknowledged the debt in writing during this time; and
- the creditor hasn’t already gone to court for a CCJ.
With a joint loan, it matters if either of you makes a payment. If you have split-up, you may think a debt is statute-barred but it isn’t because your ex has made a payment to it in the last 6 years.
Acknowledging the debt has to be in writing. If you haven’t done this, it doesn’t matter if the creditor has written to you, or you have discussed the debt on the phone – this won’t stop the debt being statute barred. If you have reclaimed PPI, this is likely to have acknowledged the debt.
The cause of action is the most difficult point to determine here. See this National Debtline factsheet which has a section on When Does the Limitation Period Start Running?
If you can say Yes to points (1), (3) and (4) but are unsure about point (2) on the cause of action, I suggest you call National Debtline on 0808 808 4000 and talk through your situation with them.
Sometimes the exact date a debt becomes statute barred matters:
- if you write saying that a debt is statute-barred and you are wrong because the debt isn’t, then your letter is likely to have “reset the clock” by acknowledging the debt;
- if you have received a court form about a debt, you need to know whether you can defend the case on the grounds the debt is statute barred.
Questions about different sorts of debt
Statute barring for secured debt – mortgage shortfalls
If your debt is still secured – you are still living in the house there is a mortgage or a secured loan on – then statute barring isn’t relevant. What matters is if you get too far into arrears the lender can go to court to repossess your house.
But what about when the house has been sold so the security no longer exists but you still owe money on the debts?
For a debt resulting from a mortgage shortfall, the time allowed in the Limitations Act is twelve years. But many lenders follow the old Council for Mortgage Lenders code, now part of the MCOB Rules (Mortgage Conduct of Business), that says:
anyone whose property was taken into possession and sold more than six years ago, and who has not been contacted by their lender for recovery of the outstanding debt, will not now be asked to pay the shortfall.
See National Debtline’s Factsheet on Mortgage Shortfalls for more details, such as what does “contact” mean? And phone National Debtline if you are contacted about a mortgage shortfall debt which is between 6 and 12 years old.
Do tax debts or benefit overpayments become statute barred?
Tax debts such as Income tax and VAT do not become statute barred. If you are wondering if your debt is a “tax debt”, HMRC has a list of “not tax debts”, which do become statute barred.
The situation regarding benefit overpayments is more complicated – although they can become statute-barred, there are other ways the debt could still be recovered. You should take advice about these sorts of debts – contact National Debtline or your local Citizens Advice are very good with benefit issues.
What about old council tax arrears?
A council should not go to court and ask for a liability order for council tax arrears more than six years after the council tax became due. But if the council already has a Liability Order, this will never become time-barred.
If you get a letter out of the blue about a Liability Order for council tax arrears from ten years ago, this may feel very unreasonable. One of the main reasons time limits exist is that people don’t keep paperwork forever, so you may have no way of proving that you paid the debt at the time. This is one of the rare occasions when it may be worth asking the creditor to Write-off the Debt. It may also be worth getting a local councillor involved for council tax arrears.
What about utilities?
Gas, electricity and water bills become statute barred 6 years after the date on the bill. There are also rules regulating when a supplier can “back bill” – send a new bill for charges more than 12 months old. If you think you have a problem with back billing, go to your local Citizens Advice and ask for their help.
Getting letters and court forms about a debt you think is statute barred
Can I ignore a letter about a statute barred debt?
Are you 100% sure that it is statute barred? If you aren’t certain talk to National Debtline.
If you are do not recognise the debt you should probably write a “Prove It” letter to your creditor. This is worded so that it doesn’t acknowledge the debt.
If you do recognise the debt but you are certain it is statute-barred, you could ignore a letter. But it might be less stressful to reply pointing out that it is statute-barred rather than get more letters and possibly court forms. National Debtline has a template letter you can use here.
Can I ignore a Letter Before Action/Claim about a statute barred debt?
This is a bad idea. It is much easier to challenge a creditor by saying the debt is statute barred using the Reply Form than it is to defend a court case.
See How to reply to a Letter before Action which looks at what you should do when you think the debt is statute barred.
I have been sent a Claim Form for a statute barred debt – what should I do?
Do NOT ignore the Claim Form. If you do, a judgment will be made against you in default because you haven’t replied, even if your debt is statute barred.
So if the creditor takes you to court, you must defend the claim on the grounds that it is statute-barred. And also look at whether you have any other defences eg can the creditor produce the CCA agreement.
If you are unsure what to write on the defence form, phone National Debtline and talk to them.
Other FAQs about statute barred debt
I live in Scotland
This article isn’t relevant if you live in Scotland where the laws and time limits are very different. I suggest you phone National Debtline who have Scottish experts.
My debt is statute barred, do I still owe the money?
Yes. Your debt still exists, it hasn’t been written off, it can still get sold on and you may still receive letters about it.
The Financial Conduct Authority’s rules about statute-barred consumer credit debt (loans, credit cards etc) are here. They say that if you state you will not pay a statute barred debt, the creditor cannot continue to ask you to pay it.
If you want to get rid of the debt completely and you are absolutely sure a debt is statute-barred, you could consider making a very low Full and Final Settlement offer, perhaps under 10% – see Full & Final Settlements for more details. Your letter should point out that the debt is statute barred and hence unenforceable.
A debt has dropped off my credit record – is it statute barred?
Possibly not! Obviously your debt is old but it may not be statute barred.
The six-year period for the Statute of Limitations is NOT the same as the six-year period that a debt stays on your credit file after a default. If a debt isn’t showing on your credit file it may be statute barred but it may not be.
A debt will stop showing on your credit record six years after any default was recorded. But if you have made some payments to it in the last 6 years, perhaps just a token £1 a month, then it isn’t going to be statute barred.
My debt has been sold, does this effect becoming statute barred?
No, it doesn’t matter if your debt is sold. The six-year period still runs from the date of your last payment or written acknowledgement of the debt.
The sale doesn’t “reset the clock”. If it was already statute-barred at the time it was sold, it remains statute barred.
When does a CCJ become statute barred?
It never does. But if the creditor hasn’t taken any enforcement action in six years, they will need to apply to the court for permission if they want to enforce the debt by using bailiffs. This is unusual but if it happens to you, contact National Debtline.
My debt is statute-barred – if I reclaim PPI will this re-open the debt?
Once a debt is statute barred this is permanent, it can never become “unbarred” so applying for a PPI reclaim won’t change this. So it’s safe to reclaim PPI on a statute barred debt.
But if the reclaim is successful, the lender will sometimes not send you the money but set it off against the remaining debt – even though it is statute barred the debt still exists. In this situation don’t use a claims company, or you could end up owing them money.
Any other questions?
I can’t give you advice on whether your debt is likely to be statute barred, so if you are concerned about a specific debt, then phone National Debtline on 0808 808 4000. Or you could use their good web chat.
But if you have a general question about statute barred debt, ask it in the comments below.
Updated 2019 for the new court judgment
why pay a debt that isn’t on your credit record
What to do if you receive a court form
Is this default date for a debt wrong?
Jo says
It was a wonga loan and it hasn’t been sold to a debt collector. I’ve been offered a settlement fee of £210 from £800
Sara (Debt Camel) says
ah ok, this is an offer from the Wonga administrators then? That’s rather different. See https://debtcamel.co.uk/wonga-settlement-offer/
Linda says
Hi Sara,
Is there an upper limit for a loan amount for it not to be able to classified as statute barred? I’m being chased for an old student loan from 2001 that is now around 70k with interest and fees and got a court letter for the first time
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Hi Linda, I suggest you talk to National Debtline on 0808 808 4000 about this loan and the court claim. You need to decide whether to defend it or make an affordable repayment offer.
Jackie says
Hi Sara
I have a payday loan debt with Quick Quid (who I understand are no longer trading in the UK) which has not been paid or acknowledged for more than five years. As I live in Scotland, I assumed this debt would be extinguished after five years and I have deliberately ommitted it from recent unaffordability claims with other payday companies.
Yesterday I received an email from Lantern chasing the debt and on checking my credit file, noticed it is not recorded. I have no idea whether I ever received a default notice and can’t check default date on my credit file. My question is what happens to debts that have never been defaulted ? Will they never become statute barred/extinguished ?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I will get a Scottish adviser to comment on this.
but can you say:
– did you have previous loans from QQ before this one that was repaid?
– was this problem debt a simple payday loan, with the full amount plus interest repayable the next month?
Jackie says
It wasnn’t a one off loan, from memory it was a revolving credit type loan where I could make withdrawals up to a credit limit. I have had some success obtaining refunds from other payday loan companies by following your advice but didnt include QQ as I hoped the debt would be extinguished now. I have checked on Credit Karma and its definitely not showing up.
Mr Alan McIntosh says
Hi Jackie
It has been decided by the courts in Scotland that until a debt has been defaulted on a Notice of Default has been served, prescription does not start running.
That is not to say the Debt has not been defaulted on. They may have not reported the Default to the Credit Reference Agency or it may have been removed from your Credit File if it was over 6 years ago.
All I can suggest is you could write to the firm and make a Subject Access Request to the Firm under the Data Protection Act 2018 for all information they hold about you in relation to the Debt. That may reveal if a Default Notice has been served.
Jackie says
Thank you Alan.
Linda Montgomery says
I had debts in scotland over 5 years ago but now live in england and being chased for debt just before 6 years statute barred. As the debt was taken out in Scotland can I argue the 5 years instead of 6?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
No I don’t think so. They will sue you in an English court.
Wayne Mather says
If I have a statute barred loan with Cahoot, taken over by Santander, and a ppi reclaim calculates an amount payable. Does it still stand that the ppi claim will pay off the debt before any monies would be payable to me? Moreover, would it be the full amount of aged debt or calculated lower as if a settlement figure was made ?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Does it still stand that the ppi claim will pay off the debt before any monies would be payable to me?
That is likely to happen.
would it be the full amount of aged debt or calculated lower as if a settlement figure was made ?
It would be the full amount.
NB there is no point in trying to settle the debt at a low amount now, the set off would still be used against the part of the loan that had been written off…
I hope you didn’t use a reclaim company or you will owe them their fee even though the refund has just reduced a loan you did not have to pay as it was statute barred.
Wayne Mather says
Cahoot sent an offer of £4413 based on ppi reclaim of £11.7k of which £6.3k was the statute barred amount, so still due to make me a payment. This was due on the 5th.
Spoke to them today and they would tell me nothing other than that it was with the reclaimed m team as they were further reviewing it.
Basically took £6k loan in 2001 and the repayment was supposed to be 5years…however the payment amount changed at some point. And by my last payment made in 2009, the debt appears to still be the same amount. I never requested that they changed the repayments. They did that. So even after 8 years, the loan value was still the same amount.
viva says
hi
I got barclays overdraft from 2010 , still I pay by DMP , I request full and final settlement, they reject 20%, I call again 30% not answer ??
my life is treating , I want to stop to pay, they are unfair treating me because I had house in mortgage, my credit file very poor for 10 years
I lost money from creditors, unhappy life , some time I think finish my life, gov. take more tax get from us , not countrol creditors please get my life back, i paid to much interest and taxes.
thanks
viva
Sara (Debt Camel) says
what other debts are in your DMP? how much do they all add up to?
VIVA says
hi
£18,000
I got 13 debts I partley satitial now only 3 left , 2 not give CCA still finding the agrement from 10th June.
overdraft they play with me, not give me any offer. what can I do. ?? ,
THANKS
VIVA
Sara (Debt Camel) says
So 18,000 is the total of the three remaining debts?
And 2 of them are loans or credit cards and can’t produce a CCA ? If that’s right you can just stop paying them. You don’t have to make a settlement offer.
And the third debt is this overdraft? How large is it?
viva says
thanks Sara , for your replay,
I am only working , my wife is sick, not possible to work , I look after her and my son expenses .
I had overdraft 3200 pounds , I tay to pay off this debt, because my friend will help. because this creditors disturb my family life.
I am not sleep well, I try 2 years before one of IVA that is rejected, then I used that money for this partly settles, I hoe you can
do some think, 10 years my earning loss, mortgage not possible to move less interest, they know I had mortgage, if I stop the payment any
problems ?? DMP ask me for IVA , I reject because 10 years this DMP companys missold , not give good advice or not find the solution.
viva says
thanks Sara , for your replay,
I am only working , my wife is sick, not possible to work , I look after her and my son expenses .
I had overdraft 3200 pounds , I tay to pay off this debt, because my friend will help. because this creditors disturb my family life.
I am not sleep well, I try 2 years before one of IVA that is rejected, then I used that money for this partly settles, I hoe you can
do some think, 10 years my earning loss, mortgage not possible to move less interest, they know I had mortgage, if I stop the payment any
problems ?? DMP ask me for IVA , I reject because 10 years this DMP companys missold , not give good advice or not find the solution.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
so is this £3200 is your only remining debt apart from the debts where a CCA hasn’t been produced – is that right?
you have two creditors who havent produced CCAs? Were these credit cards debts? Who are the creditors? Are you worried about not paying them?
Back to when your DMP started – was the overdraft in your DMP? Did Barclays still add charges and interest when it was in the DMP?
viva says
thanks Sara
yes, I request F & F setlement request but they refused , I will go to complain procedure, because the unfaire treat me.
2 debts CCA hasn’t been produced, 2 credit card debts. Wescot , Cap quest [ARROW GLOBAL] still paying DMP from 2010.
overdraft pay by DMP. No charges.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Well you should probably stop paying the 2 credit cards. Tell them you will restart paying if they produce the CCA. This was the reason you asked for a CCA, so you could stop paying.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
if you aren’t sure about this, Talk to National Debtline on 0808 808 4000.
A.S. says
Hi viva
Dont pay anymore on your dmp just go straight into an iva its a shame this was not done some years ago as all your debts would have been settled. Your credit file is poor anyway so you have nothing to lose and everything to gain this action will also protect your house from charge orders unlike the dmp.
Kind regards
A.S.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
You don’t know enough about her situation to say that. You don’t know yet how large her debts are or what she can pay each month or how regular her income is etc. It sounds as though she may only have one enforceable debt left, this overdraft. And her credit record nah be fine soon if many if the debts were defaulted years ago.
An IVA may have been better at the start, but not where she is now. Charging orders aren’t that common in an DMP.
viva says
Thanks Sara
I will do.
Ali says
Hi,Thanks for the good work you’ve been doing.I have defaulted in paying my credit card from one of the high street banks in 2010.In January this year Robinson debt collectors contacted me.They sent me a link to register for payment.Which I did and made a one off payment of 20 pound.I haven’t made any payment since.Yesterday another email came through asking me to contact them about the 1000 pound debt without mentioning the 20 pounds payment.Can this debt be classified as statute barred although it’s not with the original debtors anymore.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest you talk to National Debtline on 0808 808 4000 about whether the debt is likely to be “statute barred” and whether it is worth asking the debt collector to produce the CCA agreement for the debt.
Nava says
hi
Sara
I got 1 debt 10 years, I my husband pay by DMP , I am sick , my credit score is good , I can possible to write off this debt. I have no income.
I want to clear this debt , how is possible?? this is the lone £ 16000.
nava
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Hi Nava – sorry some questions:
– was this just one debt? what sort of debt was it?
– Has it been sold to a debt collector?
– How much do you still owe?
– are you renting or do you own a house?
NAVA says
One debt, loan, PRA GRO.
£ 15999.00
I am living my husband.
I sent request to write-off the debt , I send my medical certificate and bank statement. still they do,
I have no income , my husband look after me, now I request CCA request last month. I stop payment.
my husband stop his DMP.
THANKS
Ian says
I am being chased for a credit card debt of £500 in the UK. I have lived in Australia for nearly five years and completely forgot about it. I cannot remember when I made the last payment. How do I find out without admitting liability?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Chased in Australia? Or have you been told letters have arrived in the UK? Who is the debt collector? Have you been told there is a CCJ?
Ian says
I have been told they have been trying to contact me in the UK. I have lived in Australia nearly 5 years. I don’t know when the last payment was and how did they get my email address. They have told me they will ‘pester me’ until the debt is paid😡
Sara (Debt Camel) says
So they know you are in Australia? Did they use the word “pester”?
Is this the credit card company or a debt collector?
Are you likely to return to England?
Could you pay it it? Do you have other debts in England or Australia?
Ian Armstrong says
Hi Sara, the ‘Credit Management Group’ (Cabot) said they would continue contacting me regarding this £500 debt. I have not asked when the last payment was made, although they have had my details recorded on credit files. They have ‘apparently’ written to me in the UK but no written contact here as I’ve not given my address here in Australia. How would they get my email, after 5 years and will this affect my residence in Australia.(I am a permanent resident). Thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
You may have used that email on a debt? If not, it’s hard to guess how they know it but I don’t think it’s a very interesting question.
It sounds as though you have no intention of returning to the UK. The chance of a UK debt collector trying hard to enfiorce a £500 debt in Australia seems small. It’s not non existent, if this worries you perhaps you could save up £500 and leave it in a special account so it’s there if any action in Australia starts?
You would have to ask on an ex-pat forum in Australia if the debt in england could have any affect on your Austrailian residence – I would be surprised, but I have no knowledge of Australian visas.
Ian Armstrong says
Sara I forgot to mention, I have no debts in the UK or Australia. Should I mention anything to them about anything?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
It’s not clear you have to respond to these emails. National Debtline has a factsheet on debt options if you live abroad: https://www.nationaldebtline.org/EW/information/abroad/Pages/living-outside-the-uk.aspx. They also have a telephone number you can use from outside the UK: 0044 121 410 6200.
Ian Armstrong says
I have only asked how they got my email and voiced my dismay at there ‘continued’ contact with me. I have not had any paper mail or notice of CCJ’s etc
Mel M says
I recently applied for PPI on some Credit cards and personal loans which I had defaulted on. They were statute barred 10 years ago. I have now had a letter from a debt collector chasing one of these debts, is this permitted?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
OK then you could reply that the debts are statute barred. If they persist, ask them to send you the CCA agreements for each debt, as the debts are unenforceable in court if they can’t produce them. See https://debtcamel.co.uk/ask-cca-agreement-for-debt/ which explains about CCA agreements and has a link to the letter you should use.
Mel M says
Thanks, this is a first vague letter so I will wait and see if they send any more before I start getting involved.
But if they can produce CCAs, which would be from a very long time ago, does that mean they can still enforce the debt after around 15 years?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
if the debt was statute barred, it remains statute barred even after your PPI claim.
My reason for suggesting you ask for the CCA is it’s very likely it can’t be found and that is often a simpler way forward as it can be hard to prove that a debt is statute barred.
Steve says
Hi
Might be an obvious answer but one that I can’t get my head around
Question..
Joint HMRC overpayment child tax credit debt.
Value is £9500
I am currently in an IVA ( since Janaury 19)..
After 5 years debt written off apart from what I have paid in through the IVA.
Is my wife liable for the full amount £9500 now
Even though I am paying into IVa?
Or will her liability be reduced now or in 5 years when IVA fails?
Hope that makes sense?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
She will be liable for the amount minus what your IVA pays to it.
Fred says
Had a credit card which i did not remember having from 2009. I relocated abroad to go live in US, of which I’ve racked debts also, so hard to stay debt free anyways. Back in the UK now. MBNA sold the debt to ..Global in 2012,they then sought a CCJ in Aug 2013. Fast forward to now, I have been receiving letters Statement of Earnings from them asking that I fill that in or get in touch with the Bailiff to settle payment.
They are threatening me with Prison, of which I really don’t want to give a toss about really(im not scared because I will claim I had not lived in the country for so long that I cant remember a CCJ was actioned against my person), all I want now is if I could get the solicitors to arrange a payment plan, of which they said they are not willing to enter into a payment plan until form is sent back to the courts.
What do you think my options are?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
when did you return to the UK? when did you first hear from the debt collector about this CCJ?
Fred says
I returned about 3 weeks ago, but I’ve kept a UK address of which I share with a friend. I won’t rule out a return to the US if they continue to frustrate me, which I think I won’t since I have a job here now. Just a few days ago when I called the solicitor about why they kept bothering me.
Should I return the “Notice of Application for Attachment of Earnings” form?, because I am still liable for those debts abroad in the US too. I will add all the debts. I have a mortgage to pay as well as a family to run. I will be completely up-straight, I end home with nothing,really!
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest you contact National Debtline as soon as possible on 0808 808 4000.
See their factsheet on Attachment of Earnings Orders https://www.nationaldebtline.org/EW/factsheets/Pages/countycourtattachmentofearningsorders/attachmentofearningsorders.aspx – ignoring these forms is one of the very few ways you can get sent to prison for a credit card debt …
Adding up your US debts is a good idea as ND will want to get the full picture.
It sounds as though the debt collector is trying to enforce a CCJ that is over 6 years old. CCJs don’t become statute barred, but the creditor has to get permission from the court to enforce them over 6 years. ND can explain this and how to find out if the creditors has obtained this permission.
Fred says
Thank you. I will do as advised
juli says
i got a loan in april 2007 well i signed for 15000 but only recieceved 13800 they said i had to have ppi in july 2007 i had a car crash in jammica tryed to claim told it didnt happend in uk in sep 2007 the company i worked for went bust told i couldnt claim as family buisness brothers told them i havent recieved full amount of loan they said they would redo it i stoped paying injan 2008 they have never contacted me but i found out its secured on my home which i didnt as the lady said the form was just to check with land registry that i owned my house ant advice would be helpful please
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Hi Juli, that sounds very complicated, can I suggest you go to your local Citizens Advice with any letters or paperwork about the loan that you have and they will have a look at it?
Mel M says
They have written again. They say that the debt is no longer enforceable through the courts and they will not be issuing proceedings, but they’ll give me a 75% discount if I settle it. Is it safe to ignore them, since they’ve admitted it’s statute barred? Will they get bored after a while, it’s Intrum?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
You can reply saying the debt is statute barred and you will not be paying it. point out that CONC 7.15.8 says “A firm must not continue to demand payment from a customer after the customer has stated that he will not be paying the debt because it is statute barred.”
NB for anyone else reading this, this only works when the firm agrees it is statute barred! If the firm doesn’t agree you have to convince them of this or it is likely to end up in court.
PF says
Hi Sara,
I received a CCJ in December 2012, in September 2019 the Bailiffs from the same court tried to enforce the CCJ, so I wrote to the courts challenging the enforcement and the court ordered that ‘no permission is granted to enforce, the judgment is older than six years’.
Now I have been contacted by solicitors acting for Arrow Global (the creditor) who have been instructed to consider further recovery action. What further recovery action can they consider if the courts have ordered that they don’t have permission to enforce the CCJ?
Thank you. PF
Sara (Debt Camel) says
The creditor can ask the court for permission. I am not sure if that is possible when the court has already said No. I suggest you talk to National Debtline 0808 808 4000 about your situation.
PF says
Thanks Sara,
I will do.
Darren says
Hi Sara,
I had a loan and overdraft that defaulted some years ago. The bank agreed to my offer of a monthly token payment of a few pounds to each debt. I paid this to them through Worldpay as they requested and some time after making regular payments, the payments were cancelled, I believe because of a technical problem between Worldpay and the bank. I received a letter from Worldpay explaining what had happened and they said I would need to set up the payments again and should contact the bank to do this. In my infinite wisdom I decided to wait for the bank to contact me which fire since reason they never did. It’s now been 6 years and 1 month since my last payment so am I correct in thinking the debts are now statute barred?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Read the article above – it isn’t as simple as not paying for 6 years unless you remember being issued with a Default Notice.
If you have never been contacted by the bank and not by a debt collector, then anything you do now risks contact restarting. The longer you leave it, the better your situation is. How is this debt showing on your credit record?
Darren says
Hi Sara, thanks fo the response, the loan debt recently disappeared from my credit record exactly six years and 1 month after I made the last payment (it showed 6 years of monthly defaulted payments from when my token payments stopped). The overdraft disappeared a couple of years ago. I have only checked my credit record using Credit Karma (formerly Noddle).
I knew I wouldn’t be able to afford the repayments after my circumstances changed so I opened a new bank account elsewhere and then stopped paying the loan and overdraft and waited for them to contact me. I replied with my offer of a monthly token payment and requested that they don’t charge me any more interest or late payment charges. They suspended/closed the current account and agreed to the token payments towards the overdraft and loan. As far as I can recall I was issued with a default notice for the loan and the overdraft. I was also chased by various (7 in total iirc) debt collectors for some years trying to ‘persuade’ me to arrange a payment plan with them. They eventually they gave up because I refused to change the payments I had already set up with the bank.
When the token payments stopped, I received no further correspondence regarding the debts.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Unless you know the date of the Default Notice – this is NOT the same as a default being added to your credit record, you can’t be absolutely sure a debt is statute barred.
If the debts are not on your credit record and you are not being contacted by debt collectors, I suggest you sit back and do nothing.
But if you are contacted by debt collectors, do not ignore letters, reply saying the debt is statute barred. And – for the loan, not the overdraft – also ask them to produce the CCA agreement for the loan (see https://debtcamel.co.uk/ask-cca-agreement-for-debt/)
Darren says
Hi Sara, thank you for the info. I have had a root around and found an original default notice sent to me for the loan. I also have found a letter regarding the overdraft where they reference a default notice sent to me in regards to not paying the overdraft and closed the account, so I may have that too, but hopefully that letter may be enough should I ever need it.
Thanks again Sarah. I will just sit tight now and hope I don’t hear any more from them.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
So the default notice and the letter are both over 6 years old? AND you last made a payment over 6 years ago? In that case you should be safe – the debts are statute barred.
Maura Flynn says
Dear Sara, My housemate has just received a letter out of the blue from a debt collector that is very vague. I’m encouraging him to deal with it because it won’t just go away. It states that they have been notified by returned correspondence or from a third party that he no longer lives at this address. Then it states that they have reviewed credit report data that confirms he does live at this address. It then states the importance of him contacting them as soon as possible (online or by email) so that they can help him. They do not mention a sum of money anywhere in their letter. He believes it may refer to a debt Credit Card debt (as they refer to the company in Due to) from nearly 10 years ago when he moved abroad. He can’t be certain that there hasn’t been a CCJ issued 6-10 years ago. What do you advise he says in his first communication with them and should he correspond by letter only?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest he emails or writes to them saying that he is unaware of owing any money to that company and he hasn’t heard from them for 10 years. Ask them to send proof of the alleged debt, an account showing the balance and when the last payment was made as if there is a balance owing it must be statute barred.
See what they come back with.
If they say there us a CCJ he should ask for the date and the courts a CCJ over 6 years old doesn’t become statute barred but isn’t enforceable without permission from the court which us rarely given.
If they don’t say there is a CCJ he should repeat the alleged debt is statute barred.
Maura says
Thanks Sara. I will encourage him to do as you advise and update.
viva says
HI
I am pay my Barclays overdraft full and finial settlement offer £ 952 .00 , I paid, still Barclays say they kept record
still £ 2223.72 on my balance, when they say before when I spoke that time they not tel anytink write-off the debt, but they kept records show my account £ 2223.72. but I don’t understand. what is full and final settlement.
why they not tel before take money ? still not sent my letter ? one month take only Barclays sent letter. my house in uk , not in frost ??
please advice me, 30/12/2019 I sent my driving licence renewal , I recived 04/01/2020 I received.
thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I think you should go to your local Citizens Advice where they can look at this and help you with it.
Stu says
Hi Sara
Quick question…. I have an old MBNA credit card debt totalling £7K from 2008, the debt was sold to Arrow in 2012 after I defaulted on payments, due to illness and being unable to work. Prior to being sold I was making token payments of £1 direct to MBNA. After the debt was sold I have not had any direct contact with Arrow, I have not entered in to a debt management plan nor have I made any payments directly to them. In Dec 2019, I received a letter before court action. included in this was a statement that said they had been receiving £1 payments. Having checked through bank records, it appears my joint account still has a standing order set up to pay MBNA £1 each month. As MBNA aren’t the owner of the debt anymore, would this make the debt statute barred? Or would these misdirected token payments have the effect of re-setting the clock?
I can’t find an answer to this anywhere – Thanks in advance
Sara (Debt Camel) says
The payments have reset the clock, this is not statute barred.
BUT on the Letter Before Action you need to ask them to supply a copy of the CCA agreement. See The creditor doesn’t have the written agreement in https://debtcamel.co.uk/letter-before-claim-ccj/. For an old MBNA claim Arrow may have difficulty producing this.
Stu says
Thank you – I had a sneaky feeling that would be the case but I will certainly enquire re the CCA agreement 👍
Sara (Debt Camel) says
get the form back within the time period!
Kate says
Hi There,
I have old store cards unpaid and I have lived out of the UK for 11 years.
How do I check if they are still on my credit score?
And what happens to your credit rating here, is it negative or do you need to start from scratch? Thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Are you planning on returning to the UK?
Kate Hausey says
Yes, in the next 2-3 years
Sara (Debt Camel) says
So after 13-14 years your credit record may well be clear. The debts themselves should have gone and so any CCJs that were later taken out on them pay also have dropped off after 6 years.
Kate Hausey says
Ok thank you!
One more question, is there any way at all to check my profile? Credit score?
Your help is much appreciated
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Not really unless you still have an address in the UK.
nishan says
Hi,
I have old unpaid overdraft and I am out of the UK for 6 years and planning to return.
How do I check if they are still on my credit score? And how do i know its statute barred? Thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
It can be hard to access credit records when you are out of the UK. If you have just not used the accounts for 6 years they are likely to still be there and they are very unlikely to be statute barred as the article above says.
Nishan says
Hi
Do you have any suggestion for me what to do when i return to UK, That would be very helpful.
Thank You
John says
Hi,
I’ve been approached by Lowell who claim I owe a debt to British Gas from an old address I lived at a little over 6 years ago. When I checked my credit file there is an account in my name with British Gas for the address in question in the “Settled Accounts” section, showing that it was settled and was never in default (settled date Feb 2014). I provided Lowell with this information and a screenshot of that part of my credit file but they say the account number doesn’t match the one they have. I’ve written back to them and suggested they contact British Gas as there should be no reason for a duplicate account to exist with the same details, for the same reason and covering the same dates, but they continue to pursue me. There is no other British Gas account on my credit file. They have sent me a photocopy of a bill from British Gas (that I’ve never seen before) dated 4th July 2014.
Any advice on what I should do? Is the burden of proof on Lowell to prove that this alleged debt even exists as I’ve provided them with proof from my credit file that an account with British Gas was settled years ago? As the date on the bill they sent me is 4th July 2014 does that mean it would be time statute barred this year? I’ve made sure to put in writing that I do not acknowledge any debt being owed by me to British Gas.
Thanks in advance.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest you talk to British Gas about the two account numbers mystery.
As the date on the bill they sent me is 4th July 2014 does that mean it would be time statute barred this year?
yes, but you may find they start a court case before July…
John says
Wouldn’t the burden of proof be on Lowell to prove the debt exists, not me to prove it doesn’t (as I’ve already provided them proof that an account in my name for the details they claim was settled years ago)?
If an account had fallen into default, would this definitely show on my credit file?
Have you ever encountered a situation like this where there is a settled account on a credit file, but nothing else to do with that company (in this case British Gas) on the credit file? I’m really confused as to how my credit file can show a settled account but then be approached about what appears to be a duplicate account out of the blue over 5 years later…
Thanks again
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Well you can send Lowell a formal complaint saying you have disputed the debt and produced evidence that your bills with BG from that time were paid and ask them to stop pursuing you for the alleged debt. But ultimately they may disagree and say they have enough proof – that bill – and go to court. So if you can get any useful evidence about the account number from BG that may help.
John says
Thanks for your response, it’s much appreciated. Yes, that is what I’m concerned about.
In your experience, shouldn’t a defaulted debt be marked on my credit file? It seems strange that there’s no trace of this alleged debt on my credit file.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I wouldn’t describe BG’s credit reporting as reliable.
Samantha says
Hi,
I received a call today from a housing association that I rented a house from 7 years ago to tell me that I had an outstanding rent balance of £301.66.
This lady proceeded to tell me that they have tried to contact both myself & my partner from 2014-2015 via telephone and letters which I told her must have been wrong as I ahd not heard anything from them until today. She told me that on her records it says that I spoke to them in 2015 and agreed to pay the money back, still I know this is not the case.
I haven’t agree to any payment method and requested a copy of the payment schedule to show me what this debt was for as I wasn’t going to agree to pay money for something I am just being made aware of 7 years on. I know they were given notice in October 2013 that I would be moving out at the end of November 2013. I received the payment schedule for my time in the house and it shows I owe money for the month of January 2014, by this time I hadn’t lived there for 2 months.
The lady went on to say that I need to speak to my partner and sort out what we would be willing to pay weekly/monthly so that no further action is taken.
Ive never had this issue before and have no idea what to do or what my rights are. Can she tell me that further action will be taken if I don’t make a payment ASAP? Still no letters have been received up to date at the forwarding address.
Thanks in advance.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I think you need to ask why you are being charged for anything after you left in November. Hard to say much more until you know what they reply to that. Your local Citizens Advice can be good at helping with this sort of thing.
viva says
hi
I request CCA 2 creditors still not get answer, from 10 June 2019 still not send CCA document.
if they can reuse the credit file??. this problem start 2010. they try to kept me hardship.
thanks
viva
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Hi viva, I am sorry but you are asking a lot of questions about this on a lot of different pages. I know English isn’t your first language and I think you should go to your local citizens Advice and they can help you look at the full picture .
Clair says
Hi. A debt collecter started court action with a letter of claim in March 2019 for a debt that will be statute barred at 6 years in Dec 2020. I filled out the PAP form (if I remember the correct term) requesting every document under the sun as this was a provident home loan, and some of the figures I do not recall. I did not acknowledge the loan. Lowell solicitors wrote back to me and said that the client, Lowell has not been able to provide a full response and ask that they return the case back to them have asked back to them. Does this mean court action was placed on hold or they’ll need to start again? Thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I don’t know if you have received a Letter Before Claim from the solictors, sometimes known as a PAP letter, which has a Reply Form where you can request documents? See https://debtcamel.co.uk/letter-before-claim-ccj/ for what this looks like.
Or an actual N1 Claim Form from the court? See https://debtcamel.co.uk/court-claim-form/ for what one looks like.
Clair says
Hi.. It was a letter of claim and PAP form. It wasn’t the N1 claim form. And the letter from lowell solicitors to say it was passed back was in July 2019
Sara (Debt Camel) says
ok, so court action has not be started, so it isn’t “placed on hold” because it never began.
Can I ask if you borrowed a lot from Provident before this loan?
Clair says
Yes, I just realised this too. Sorry. I can’t recall the exact amount without going back on paperwork, they came out to the house on 3 separate occasions. I do remember the interest was approx double. I was on a low as I was going through separation and financially struggling.
When lowell pursed this I did ask for all the paperwork from provident (so I do have all that filed online) so I could check it corresponded with what lowell had, but I’ve not had any breakdown from lowell
Sara (Debt Camel) says
OK, some people got trapped, borrowing from provident for years – if this has happened to you, you may be able to get a refund. But you wouldn’t just for ome loan.
Clair says
Meant to say the figure being asked for is £2008
Sara (Debt Camel) says
ouch! That would be an unusually large loan from Provident.
Clair says
They have it as £1341 – £475 – £190..something like that, split into 3 payments.
However, the amount borrowed was less as this includes the interest.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
ok, well if they come back again, you should be asking for a copy of the CCA agreement for the debt and a statement of account showing all your payments.
Clair says
Hi, yes I asked for all that last time. These are the documents they apparently were unable to produce in the time frame so they asked their solicitor to refer the case back to them.
Janine says
Hi.
I had an old virgin media debt, opened way back in 2011 9 years ago that I stopped paying as they tricked me into another contract. I know it has definitely been way over 6 years now since I made last payment, but they are still reporting to my credit file every month! It’s the only damaging thing on there and I don’t know what to do! I have tried contacting the credit file companies but they just tell me it will fall off after I defaulted but this date has now passed.
Also they also mark payments as late instead of missed on clear score. Does this mean they have kept my account as open? They didn’t start recording late payments until Feb 2016! At least 3 years since I actually defaulted.
Any help on next step so I can purchase a mortgage would be great as I’m really at a loss with how to sort it. Thank you.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
The problem here is that Virgin never added a default to your credit record back 2013. You can ask them to add one now: https://debtcamel.co.uk/debt-default-date/.
You do need to be aware that when you ask them to do this they may start asking you to pay the debt. If you end up arguing with them about whether it is statute barred, talk to National Debtline on 0808 808 4000. Don’t ignore letters saying they will be starting court action. Hopefully this won’t prove a problem in practice.
Janine says
Thank you for your reply. I haven’t even received correspondence from them at all in I don’t know how many years. I don’t even think I have any paper work from when I opened the account it’s been that many years. So if they have never registered the default, does that mean it will never leave my credit file? I have read on other forums that Virgin are quite renowned for incorrect credit reporting and people have a hard time getting it removed and having mortgage offers rejected because they do not remove debts. Would national debt helpline be able to point me in right direction for having it removed quicker if virgin do not co operate? Thank you.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
So if they have never registered the default, does that mean it will never leave my credit file?
yes
Would national debt helpline be able to point me in right direction for having it removed quicker if virgin do not co operate?
You can ask them if virgin say No. My advice is to send the complaint to the Financial Ombudsman if virgin reject it.
Danielle says
Hi Sara
I have a credit card debt from Barclaycard for £3000 my partner rang them up a year ago saying I was unwell and that he would be paying the debt for me but since then we haven’t had any communication from them the last payment I made was in 2017. When does the 6 years start from my last payment or our last communication with the company??
Thanks in advance
Sara (Debt Camel) says
so has he been paying anything?
do you have other problem debts as well? have they stopped adding interest?
Josephine Ejlersen says
Hi,
Does statute barred apply to a non-institution e.g between an ex wife and ex husband? Ex wife claimed for money owe to her by ex husband 15 years after divorce. Ex wife produced a Without Prejudice letter signed by the ex husband that he will repay her when his circumstances are better. Thanks for your kind attention and assistance.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I think you need to talk to a divorce expert.
James says
Dear Sara – In late 2014, I received correspondence from a DCA acting on behalf of Barclays, pursuing a student overdraft of around £1k from 2003. I hadn’t used this account in many years, well over six, and it is my belief that it was closed a couple of years later in around 2004/2005/2006 (and it wasn’t on my credit file in 2014), and the overdraft transferred to RBS. I certainly don’t recall using it after 2004, and it was quite common then to transfer student accounts/overdrafts between banks. I emailed the DCA, stating that I didn’t acknowledge the debt, that it would be statute-barred in any case, and requested an original credit agreement. After some back and forth, I invited them to issue proceedings if they felt they had an enforceable credit agreement. They did not respond. I am currently looking at applying for a mortgage, and have noticed that whilst this account doesn’t appear on Equifax or Experian, it is on my TransUnion file, showing as set up in 2003 and defaulted in 2015.I want this off my credit file, even if the account wasn’t closed in 2004. A further point is that whilst it is Barclays, the account was opened at a branch in Scotland (where I lived/studied), where I believe that the Limitation period is five years, so, even if it transpired that the default was legitimately in 2015, would the matter now be statute barred anyway? Or would it be six years given that I now live in England?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest you talk to National Debtline on 0808 808 4000 about all this – statute barring, default dates and the Scottish angle.
Ryan says
If you request Experian to change the default date to an earlier date, does this in itself restart the date for statute barring the debt? Does referring to the debt as “the alleged debt” help?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Experian won’t change the date unless they are told to by the creditor.
Ryan says
Thank you for replying Sara, I think I should clarify my enquiry:
As the prescriptive period under the Prescriptions and Limitations (Scotland) Act 1973 starts from the first instance that the Creditor realises they have incurred a loss pursuant to the interpretation of the 1973 Act by the Supreme Court in David T Morrison & Co Ltd v ICL Plastics, the only time this resets would be in Section 6(1)(b) where the debtor or his agent “relevantly acknowledged” the debt.
So would a request to Experian be considered to have acknowledged the debt, say, in the instance that Experian then contact the Creditor for comment on the request to change dates?
I’ve been searching Sheriff Court and Court of Session judgements all night and haven’t found any further expansion or clarification on what would constitute “relevantly acknowledging” the debt other than instances where the debtor outright acknowledges it, in writing, themselves.
Sorry about the long question but I’m struggling to find an answer. I really appreciate hearing your thoughts on the subject.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Is there a default date on there at the moment? What are your reasons for wanting it moved to be earlier?
Do you consider you are currently within the 5 year period or over it? When did yiu last make a payment to this?
I know I’m not answering yiur question but I think it’s important to look at the bigger picture.
Ryan says
There is a default date but the file list the default dates as almost a full year after the default, my idea was that if I got the defaults rolled back to the ICOs 3 month recommendation (or at least 6 months upper limit in their recommendation). Then that would mean the debt falls off my record almost 6 months earlier.
Both debts owed to same lender. My primary concern is them dropping off my Credit File, I would rather the 5 year prescription is not restarted by contacting Experian about the dates but I’m equally comfortable fighting the Debt Collection Agency in the Sheriff Court, they’ve already tried to get me twice and lost both times. I don’t think they will try again though as I will be asking for a Decree of Absolvitor and accusing them of being vexatious. They might not want to run the risk of that given that I’ve turned them over before and they still owe me over £400 in party litigant costs. If I can get them up to £750 I’ll go for the winding up order.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I have to say this sounds to me like a massive amount of hassle to get the default date brought earlier by 6 months.
But I’ll ask a Scottish adviser to comment further.
Ryan says
Thanks Sara, after sending the message to Experian I immeasurably contacted them through e-mail requesting they abandon my support ticket but I don’t know if it was too late.
I really appreciate the work you do through here and support you give people struggling with financial difficulties.
If your Scottish Expert could answer if contacting Experian about the debt would constitute “relevantly acknowledging” the debt.
Again thank you for your time and consideration!
Alan McIntosh says
Hi
If your are seeking a definitive answer I won”t be able to assist you. Relevantly acknowledging a debt usually means acknowledging in writing the existence of a debt.
Experian are not your creditor, but s6 does not say it has to be only the creditor. I do think personally asking a default date to be changed to an earlier point is an acknowledgement that a debt exists, even if there is a dispute over the amount, as otherwise you would be asking for the default to be removed.
Ultimately it’s a Sheriff, as a question of fact rather than one of law who will decide whether the wording of a letter would constitute a relevant acknowledgement, so scouring case law probably wont be much use to you.
Also as to when prescription begins running, you may want to look at PRA Group v Macpherson (https://www.advicescotland.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/01/Scottish.pdf).
In that recent case, and there is a similar case from the Court of Appeal on English Law the court found prescription begins when the creditor makes a demand for the payment in full or on default.
Alan McIntosh says
I would suggest maybe leaving it and seeing if they take further action and dealing with it at that time, as they could even argue that its English Law that applies and the correct period is 6 years. There has even been a Govan Law Centre case again involving the PRA Group, where they argued that for a Scottish Consumer case, the English Limitation Act could apply and the Sheriff agreed. (See here https://www.scotcourts.gov.uk/docs/default-source/cos-general-docs/pdf-docs-for-opinions/2018scedin59.pdf?sfvrsn=0).
Unfortunately, I cannot give you a more definitive answer, but the Law of Prescription is a notoriously complex and will depend as much on the facts, as it will on the law, and there is no way of knowing how the Sheriff will apply the law to the facts of your case, or how he will even decide what the facts are.
You say you have been taken to court twice and they have failed to succeed. That may have put them off. The danger in continue to fret about this and taking action now is you may stir them into action or even inadvertently relevantly acknowledge the debt. I would, therefore, suggest doing nothing and see what happens next, if anything.
Gwolst77 says
I have an account that was SB in November if you adhere to the updated 2019 SB advice, the account was a Santander overdraft sold to Cabot. Original default was 4th November 2013, so it dropped of 4th November 2019. I have never made payments or acknowledge the debt in writing to Cabot.
According to Check My File the Cabot account is still present, on November 7th 2019 and account status of ‘Query’ was updated at Equifax for September history and for October the status is showing as NR, nothing more has been reported since then. My understanding is that if the default expired on November 4th 2019 I should have no record of this debt on my credit history at all. It is only being reported via Equifax and does not show up on the other credit agencies.
Original default entry for Santander dropped off November 2019, but a Cabot account for the same sum is still there albeit not negatively impacting my score.
What are your views on this and what do I need to do to get rid of this query marker? Also do other lenders see this account query when making lending assessments?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
If there was a default on the Santander credit record of 4 November 2013, then the same default date should have been used on the Cabot record. Was it?
Gwolst77 says
Yes, up until the November both accounts were showing the same details (default date, balance etc) and now the Santander account has gone. But there is still an account with Cabot for the same amount that looks like it was created in September/October (no previous history before that). I’ve never paid any money to them or acknowledge the debt so I am wondering why they are reporting it.
The SB part is complicated as they believe that the debt is not SB until May this year but they can’t prove it and they have still not provided any documentation that would be required if we go down the PAP route. My assumption is they are just going of the last recorded activity on the account. I have the SAR for that account and can prove that the activity they are quoting was not me and the payment made was in error, recalled and refunded by the bank.
It may be the case that they trying to get me to write in but I will happily wait till after May just to be 100%
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Indeed, waiting until after May sounds sensible. You may want to talk to National Debtline on 0808 808 4000 about the SB issue, I can’t make a comment on it.
Ian Kitson says
I had an unpaid dept of £1068 on my Nationwaide credit card in 2010. I have not been pursued for that debt since 2012, and in any event did not respond to any attempt to recover it.
I have applied and been accepted for a new Nationwide flex a/c and a credit card.
My question is this:-
Though I realise that the debt now enjoys a Statute barred status, if I place £1,500 in my new a/c can the Nationwide withhold my money to ofset the old statute barred dept ?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Legally I think they can do that. Though statute barred a debt still legally exists. It’s a long while ago so they may not even realise the old debt is connected with you. But do you want to take this risk?
Ian Kitson says
Thank you Sarah . . . If they long ago sold my debt on to a collection agency, do they still retain their right to claim the debt as still existing ?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
No. In that case you would be safe.
Ian Kitson says
Thank you Sarah :)
warren says
I have some debts from 2005. I left the country in 2006 after my divorce and returned in 2014. I have worked in construction since 2014 and get paid in cash (tax and insurance is deducted. I have nothing in my name not even a bank account everything is in my partners name. I pay council tax and we rent a flat in my partners name. We are looking to move and are about to be checked via rent4sure. Will my debts from 2005 show up? I have had no contact with my creditors since 2005. Do I have a credit score and what will rent4sure think about my non credit history for nearly 15 years?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
It seems very unlikely any of the old debts, or CCJs from them, will show up but the only way is to check your credit records. I have no idea what a tenants reference agency will think of you having no credit record.
For the future, I suggest you should emerge from hiding and get yourself a bank account! Any old debts are very likely to be statute barred.
Iwan R says
Hi, ongoing saga with southern water and UK search limited. Few questions to ask for clarification if possible?
1.on a default CCJ how important,legally, is the wording of the judgement? ie “no response to claim ” or “claim acknowledged but no defence submitted”
2.whilst I’m aware that utility providers don’t have to default an account before court action I’ve repeatedly been told my account was defaulted but has passed the six year mark so dropped off.
I asked for the default notice which they could never provide and then their litigation department informed it never has been defaulted.
3.if an account has been transferred to debt collection agency does that account then close or does it still continue to accrue charges?
4. As far as I can work out the last cause of action was (payment to account) was over 6years and court action was taken after that. Where do I stand with that as I’ve got correspondence to show they haven’t followed their own code of conduct, officially recognised guidance from industry regulators or even their own policy with dealing with vunerable customers.
Sorry it’s a long post
TIA
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I’m not quite clear what you are hoping to find, but I suggest you talk to National Debtline on 0808 808 4000 about this CCJ and whether you have a good option to get it set aside.
Rob says
Hi,
I left the UK to live in Germany. I had some debts with 3 creditors, all in all ammounting to just over 5k. All 3 know where I live and I hsve been getting yearly statements from 2 and from one of them I got a letter now and then from a debt collector.
So my question is this…if those debts are passen on to debt collectors and in the meantime they get sold to a collector say here in germany, Can I still claim them as being statute barred?
I have also noticed that my credit file or better my rating has changes to real good and no debts are showing on it, which makes me worry a little.
look forwars to your reply.
kind regards
Rob
Sara (Debt Camel) says
how old are these debts? what sort of debts are they?
Rob says
2 of the debts will be 6 years old in March, the other has a few years left… 2 are credit cards one with Lloyds the other santander and one is leftovers from a loan from Tesco bank all in all around 5k.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
It’s rare for anyone abroad to be chased for effectively for small debts, I suggest you phone National Debtline as you are worried – you can call them from abroad, see https://www.nationaldebtline.org/EW/information/abroad/Pages/living-outside-the-uk.aspx
rob says
Thanks for the reply Sara, what would happen though should I eventually return to the uk. The debt being statute barred means as long as no ccj is there I cannot be taken to court, but the debt itself still remains…
Sara (Debt Camel) says
If you can’t be taken to court, why do you care if the debt still exists?
Sorry but either you have to make payment arrangements to start repaying, or opt for some form of insolvency, or you have to live with some uncertainty and just sort out problems as they arise.
David says
What happens if legal action was started but was struck out? 10 years ago a debt collector started sent me a claim which I disputed, they failed to send the directions questionaire to the court and the claim failed. Now, all these years later, they are claiming that it can’t be statute barred. Surely, at the very minimum they would need the court’s permission to start chasing it?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Are they saying the claim was only stayed so there is still a live case?
What sort of debt is this?
David says
They avoid saying anything other than “legal action”. After I received the claim in 2010, I responded that I believed the claim to be statute barred. They then wrote directly to me saying that it wasn’t but not providing any evidence to the contrary, they also asked me to sign a Tomlin order that would have doubled the outstanding balance and more. The debt was £4800 and they were claiming £10500 by adding a high interest rate.
The debt was a car loan taken out in 2002.
I didn’t respond to them and a few weeks later was informed by the court that the claimant had failed to return the directions questionnaire and the claim was struck out
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest you post on the Legal Beagles board: https://legalbeagles.info/forums/forum/legal-forums/court-claims-and-issues.
on the LB board, I suggest you say what had happened and aslo say if you have asked them for a copy of the CCA agreement for the debt? And whether you have been sent you a letter before Action/Claim? It would have a form labelled Reply Form attached.
Robert says
I gave a loan in Germany for some amount and got unstamped receipts in 2007, but I am in England, and want to sue here. What Law and remedies can i have. considering the time and unstamped receipts admissibility?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Where does the person you would be suing live?
Robert says
living in England
Sara (Debt Camel) says
and where are you living?
jay says
i had a credit card debt that was defaulted in 2010 , when the debt was sold and they started chasing me for a value addition of over 25% Capquest) i contested their letters they couldn’t provide a CCA i didn’t acknowledge the debt as mine and stopped responding and i moved away, this fell off my credit file in 2016, having failed to get a CC i checked my credit file they have added another default for the same debt on the old address copy of my old credit file shows same account numbers and amount. they have adjusted the start and default date to 2017-2018 .and also have shown a payment history which matches the last year on the old one also it appears that they have made it look like i have made a random payment of £2 in 2018 they tried the same thing back in 2014 saying i had acknowledged it by making two payments i hadn’t i didn’t have money when asked to prove they backed down after giving various excuses as to why they didnt have to provide proof, surly this is illegal? who do i complain to ? any help welcome.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Tell them the debt used to have a default date in 2010, so you want this added to the current record. Add that they couldn’t produce the CCA agreement back in 2010 and unless they can now, the debt is unenforceable and you will not be making any payments.
jay says
thanks ,
called them yesterday they say i they have a right to keep it on the credit file, i asked why they produced a fraudulent start date when the start date is actually 2006, apparently as they own the debt and its outstanding they can put it back on my credit file, as they started chasing again in 2017, the woman was contradicting herself, she couldn’t tell me why it wasn’t statue barred eit/her kept changing the subject . i recorded the entire conversation. regardless weather they produce a CCA or not isn’t this now statue barred? dont i have enough recourse to make a complaint to both OFS &ICO? .
thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
It is simpler to keep re[peating they cannot produce the CCA agreement than to get into arguments about whether it is statute barred. Both are possible defences in a court case, but the CCA point is already agreed, so just keep saying that.
“they say i they have a right to keep it on the credit file, i asked why they produced a fraudulent start date when the start date is actually 2006, apparently as they own the debt and its outstanding they can put it back on my credit file, as they started chasing again in 2017,”
That is nonsense.
I suggest you send an email to customers@capquest.co.uk with the title “COMPLAINT and Subject Access Request”
Give your reference number, name and address so they can identify your account.
Say an old debt that had dropped off your credit record because the default was more than 6 years ago has been readded. Attach a screen shot or a file to show this.
Say you asked by phone and were told they were entitled to do this.
Say you are making a formal complaint as this is incorrect and you want the record deleted. Point out you asked for a CCA agreement in 2010 and they could not produce it so the debt is unenforceable and you will not be making any payments.
Say you also want to make a Subject Access Request for a copy of all the personal data they have about you including recordings of all phone conversations.
End by saying the complaint will go to the Financial Ombudsman if it is not resolved within 8 weeks and at that point you will be asking for compensation.
jay says
thank you sara for your advice ,
They have finally written back after i mentioned FOS
and say it is closed and the CRA will be updated so i have it in writing .they also acknowledge it is statue barred.
how ever this is stated in the last paragraph.
Statute barred debt still exists and is “Recoverable” where contact has been maintained during the limitation period.
so they acknowledge it but say they are still allowed to Recover it? are they allowed to do that “recover” it while acknowledging it is SB’d
thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
As I said before, it is simpler to keep repeating that until they produce the CCA agreement it is enforceable than get into arguments about whether it is Stateuete barred.
Have they confirmed they cannot find the CCA?
jay says
Thanks again Sara,
“Have they confirmed they cannot find the CCA?”
no they have completely ignored the CCA request and mentioned nothing regarding this , But i sent a SB letter previously before i posted this here they seem to address that but mention “issues” i have raised on my letters both plural .
and i clearly did not acknowledge any debt or thier claim and raised on the very first letter
“CONC 7.15.8
after i raised the points you mentioned in the complaint and FOS they seem to have addressed this
they clearly state that ” we Acknowledge that the above account is statue barred under so governed under the limitation act of 1980. so no longer showing on my CRA( but so far it does -may b it will drop off within the month).
but goes on to say
Statute barred debt still exists and is “Recoverable” where contact has been maintained during the limitation period.
clearly ignoring “CONC 7.15.8 which i clearly mentioned i will not be making any payments what so ever to this alleged debt unless they have absolute proof that the debt exists and they can prove it is mine ( which they haven’t provided and any way they have acknowledge its Sb’d)).
once again they completely ignored even mentioning the CCA request
Thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
(Sorry, I have reunited your comment with your previous ones and removed my reply which was meant for someone else!)
You could deciide to shrug and assume you will not be hearing any more about this debt. Or if you are still worried you send them a new request for a CCA using using the formal words and enclosing £1. See https://debtcamel.co.uk/ask-cca-agreement-for-debt/ for how to do this with a link to the template. don’t complicate that CCA request letter with anything else about the debt.
Jay says
Thanks again Sara,
They also mention in the letter that they acknowledge it’s statute barred that they will either it from their normal collections, so because it gives contradicting information I might send another CCA as you instruct and hold on to this letter to future reference .
Thanks again Sara
Claire Fitzgerald says
I have just received a letter from TSB. A bank I used to use when I was in my teens. I did leave that bank and now use another bank. I did leave the account open with an overdraft spent of £2000. This was twelve years ago. They have sold the debt to Arrow? Can I say this debt is now over the 6 year period or not? I’ve never received a letter up until today?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Statute barred can be complicated with overdrafts, but that is an extremely long time! Is it still on your credit records?
Lydia says
I remortgaged my house to pay a deposit on an investment property with another couple. The agreement was that I would receive pro-rata on the increase in equity at the point of leaving. The exact amount loaned was paid but no additional amount. This was 13 years ago & they are still refusing to pay saying I should have pursued it further at the time. I didn’t because I was emotionally smashed by their behaviour & also knew he could loose his licence as he was a financial advisor & had set the whole loan up through his colleagues. I was 2months widowed at the time. Is it too late to pursue the equity as per the agreement of the loan?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
the investment property was sold 13 years ago?
Lydia says
no.. I became aware that the terms of the private loan were not adhered to .. ie , my name not on Land Registary, and the party I loaned to had decided the loan was in fact a gift. We were both living in the property after my London home sold. When I discovered they had never intended to return the loan, and took a call to the effect that they were getting all the house locks changed, I, on advice moved out.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I am sorry but you need to talk to a solicitor about this. You should have followed up on this years ago, I have no idea whether you can do anything now.
Jason says
Hi Sara,
I’m 26 years old and defaulted on a number of agreements including loans, credit cards dating from 2016-2018. Since I have kept everything immaculate and take a Loqbox account which is helping.
Couple of questions:
1. I am doing a payment plan on a couple of the defaults and one will take me beyond the six years since defaulted date. Am I correct in thinking that it will be cleared from my file so will improve my rating and ability get credit but will NOT be statute barred because I will still be paying towards it so every month the clock is reset on that six year time? If that is the case, I assume I will have no issues if I keep up with the payment plan. The repercussions of suddenly stopping paying the repayment plan after the six years since default, would be they could apply for a CCJ which will go on my file as a brand new black mark?
2. If I receive letters demanding payment, or even threatening but not yet issuing a CCJ weeks before the six years since default and also six years since any contact whatsoever from me acknowledging the debt, if I ignore those letters and nothing has happened at the point the six years surpasses, I can deem the debt officially statute barred?
Thank you very much for any help and guidance in advance!
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Am I correct in thinking that it will be cleared from my file so will improve my rating and ability get credit but will NOT be statute barred because I will still be paying towards it so every month the clock is reset on that six year time?
Yes.
The repercussions of suddenly stopping paying the repayment plan after the six years since default, would be they could apply for a CCJ which will go on my file as a brand new black mark?
Yes, I think you have a good understanding of the situation.
I can deem the debt officially statute barred?
No, it’s not as easy as that. Read the article above – it all depends when the 6 years starts. Best thing is to talk to National Debtline if you ever get a letter and you think it may be coming up to the statute barred point.
David says
Was hoping you could help,
I took out a loan with cahoot in 2001 for 12000, it was a flexi loan and one where I could keep withdrawing out if it from any amount I had paid off, the last time I took money from it was in 2004. It defaulted the same year and I was chased for the money, although never by an external debt collector. The debt dropped off my credit record after 6 years and I didn’t hear anything more.
However over the past two years, every six months, I have received a letter which just states an opening balance and a balance I owe. The date of the opening balance is always the six months previously. So this letter states opening balance 26-09-19.
I know I received a letter saying I had defaulted on the payments, so should I just ignore these letters or write to them saying that the loan is now statute barred. The letter specifically says that ‘this letter is for information only and I do not need to take any action or contact us in response to this statement’.
Thanks for any help you can provide.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest you ignore it but keep an eye open for any further letters.
David says
Thank you for your response. Do you mean further letters asking for the money rather than just saying it is for information?
Also, are they stating an opening balance every 6 months to keep it within the 6 years timeframe? As surely they can’t keep reopening the balance once its defaulted.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I am generally inclined to ignore “for information” letters unless it is clearly in your interest to do something and now, with coronavirus taking up everyone’s attention seems a very bad time to try to get someone to look at this.
I wouldn’t worry about statute barred – this debt is ancient history – if they ever ask you to pay something, talk to them then.
David says
Thank you for your time and help.