The Consumer Credit Act (CCA) gives you the right to be sent a copy of your credit agreement and a statement of your account for most loans, credit cards, catalogues, store cards and Hire Purchase agreements.
CCA agreements are important! If a creditor can’t find it then:
- you can’t get a CCJ for the debt; and
- you may decide to stop paying the debt.
But the right to ask for the CCA agreement doesn’t apply to:
- debts where there already is a CCJ;
- overdrafts,
- many household bills or tax debts;
- pre 2008 loans for more than £25,000;
- mortgages.
Sometimes asking for a CCA agreement is a good idea, but not always.
It shouldn’t normally be your first thought if you are having trouble paying a debt to the lender.
Asking for the CCA normally only works if your debt has been sold to a debt purchaser – unless the debt is very old.
Contents
How to ask for your CCA agreement
There is a template letter to ask for your credit agreement in this National Debtline factsheet. That factsheet also has a lot of information about CCA agreements and if you have any problems with one, talk to National Debtline.
This is not the same as templates asking for a copy of your personal information or making a Subject Access Request. If you want to find out if the debt is enforceable, use the specific CCA agreement wording.
Some points to be careful about:
- ask the current creditor for the CCA agreement, not the original creditor;
- you have to send a cheque or a postal order for £1;
- send the letter recorded delivery, keep a copy of it and the postage receipt.
Also read the rest of this article first! You need to know what you will do if the lender sends you the agreement and what if the lender doesn’t.
What happens if they don’t send the CCA agreement?
If you don’t get a copy of your CCA agreement within 12 working days of asking, the creditor can’t enforce the debt in court until they do send it to you.
If the creditor can’t easily find the CCA agreement they may send you an acknowledgement of your request. Something like the following is typical:
we acknowledge the 12 day time limit to provide this information but as we have to request the details from the original lender we anticipate that we will not be able to provide this within 12 days but hope that within 40 days we will have retrieved the information to comply with your request.
A 40 day period is often mentioned but doesn’t have any legal standing.
It’s very common for it to take more than 12 days to find the CCA. Don’t get excited because the 12 days has passed, it means nothing in practice.
I suggest waiting two or three months before you decide they can’t find the agreement and decide to stop paying them.
“Legal but not enforceable”
The letter from the creditor saying they haven’t found it yet should be clear that the debt is no longer enforceable but it still legally exists.
The creditor can ask you to pay the debt but, if you don’t, the creditor can’t do anything. They can’t hassle you to pay it. A polite letter every 6 months or a year is fine – frequent letters, texts or phone calls aren’t. This isn’t usually a problem in practice.
When a debt is unenforceable, that should be mentioned in any letters asking for payment. Here is what I suggested to a reader who was getting letters that left off this important fact: “Debt collector can’t prove it’s my debt but wants payment”
Here are some more implications of the debt being legal but not enforceable:
- if you claim a PPI refund, this may be set off against the balance you still owe.
- the debt can still be sold to another debt collector. Make sure you keep all the CCA agreement letters or emails so you can just tell the new creditor you asked for the CCA agreement on dd/mm/yy and you won’t be paying anything to the debt until it is produced.
- you may be able to leave the debt out of an application for a Debt Relief Order so it won’t count towards the maximum debt limit. Talk to your DRO adviser about this.
- See below for the effect on your credit record.
“So I can just stop paying?”
If your reason for asking for the CCA was hoping that you could stop paying the debt, then you could stop after 12 working days.
But in practice many CCA agreements are produced in the next few weeks. So, unless you can’t afford the monthly payments, I usually suggest not stopping it immediately. Leave it a couple of months.
If the debt is in a DMP you will have to tell the DMP firm to stop paying it. Dent them the letter from the creditor saying they can’t locate the agreement.
You may find the idea of not paying scary. If you do, talk to National Debtline about this debt and the rest of your financial situation. It does help, being able to talk to a friendly expert!
I would allow the debt collector two or three months before deciding that they aren’t going to be able to find it.
There is a small chance that the CCA agreement could be found later. This seems to be rare – if the debt collector hasn’t found it in the first few months the chances of it turning up later are very low.
“The creditor hasn’t said it is unenforceable”
Occasionally a creditor will tell you they cant produce it but you are still legally liable for the debt which is true, but irrelevant – if they cannot produce the CCA agreement the debt is unenforceable in court.
Sometimes the creditor goes into a lot of detail about how you have been paying so the debt isn’t statute barred. Also true but again irrelevant. You weren’t suggesting the debt was statute barred.
In this sort of situation, tell the creditor that you are not disputing whether you are liable for the debt or whether it is statute barred, but you would like the creditor to confirm that the debt is currently unenforceable as they have produced the CCA.
If the creditor persists with this, make a complaint and then send the complaint to the Financial Ombudsman. Here is the story of a case involving an old HSBC debt, where HSBC had to pay compensation for not admitting the debt was unenforceable.
“What about my credit record?”
Is this debt still showing on your credit record? Check all three credit reference agencies to make sure.
If it isn’t on there, then it will never reappear, whether you pay it in full, in part or just stop paying.
A debt marked as defaulted will drop off 6 years after the default date:
- it will not drop off sooner because the CCA cannot be found;
- the balance will not normally be set to zero because the CCA cannot be found.
When the debt does not have a default date, if you stop paying now, a default will be added and it will then drop off in 6 years. Not good news! Read What should the default date be? and ask the original creditor to add a default date back years ago.
A default will NOT be deleted if the CCA can’t be found. And you shouldn’t want that to happen – it would mean the record would stay on your file for even if you stop paying.
The whole debt will NOT be deleted if the CCA can’t be found. The debt still legally exists, even though it is unenforceable in court, and the creditor is entitled to report your credit history accurately for it.
“Should I offer a low settlement amount?”
Some people decide to offer a low settlement amount. I don’t think this is a good idea. You don’t need to do this! Not paying them anything is a perfectly good response in most cases! It is VERY VERY rare for a debt to turn up later.
A lot of creditors simply reject the low offer, even though you think it is sensible. They know that if they refuse you may decide to give them more. You cannot make a debt collector accept this low offer or complain they are being unfair if they don’t.
If you really want to make a settlement offer, stop paying them for a few months and then make the offer. That shows they can choose between your low offer and nothing.
The only time when you should try to get the debt settled is if it will still be showing on your credit record in a year or two when you want to apply for a mortgage. Then getting the debt marked as satisfied will help your mortgage chance a lot. But if the debt is no longer on your credit record or is dropping off soon, there is no need to do this.
What if they do send the CCA agreement?
How can you tell if it is right?
You have to be sent a “true copy” of the agreement – this doesn’t have to be a photocopy of the original agreement. It must be legible and it must include:
- your name and address when the account was opened;
- the creditor’s name and address when the account was opened;
- the terms and conditions of the account at that time, including the cost of credit (the Annual Percentage Rate), when you have to make payments and your cancellation rights; and
- any other documents that were mentioned in the Terms and Conditions.
It doesn’t have to have your signature on it. Indeed if you opened the account online you may well have signed it “digitally” and there is no document with your physical signature – this is perfectly legal.
If you aren’t sure what you have been sent is correct, you can ask National Debtline about it or you could post about it on the Legal Beagles forum.
This may sound complicated but usually either the creditor admits they can’t find it or what they send you is fine.
What should you do when the CCA agreement is found?
This depends on why you were asking for the CCA agreement.
If the creditor has started a court case (you have been sent a Claim Form) then you may have hoped that the CCA agreement could not be found. But now you have it, that is not a possible defence so you need to think if you have another defence. Talk to National Debtline about your options.
If you were planning on making settlement offers to some debts and were hoping the lack of a CCA agreement could get this one settled very cheaply, that has been ruled out and you need to proceed with a more substantial offer.
If you are fed up with having to pay this old debt for many more years, look at your alternatives. If you just stop paying, you may get taken to court – especially as the creditor now has the CCA agreement ready to hand! If you have more luck with some other debts turning out to be unenforceable, can you now pay more to this one? Or is it time to look at insolvency or other options?
When should you ask for the CCA agreement – and when shouldn’t you?
A lot depends on your exact debts, who the original creditor was, who the debt collector is, and what your other options are for tackling them. So there isn’t a simple checklist here.
How old is the account and has it been sold?
The older an account is, the less likely it is that a CCA agreement will be found. It’s the age of the account that matters, not how old the debt problem is. You may have only defaulted on a catalogue account a couple of years old, but if it was opened in 2010 that’s well worth a try!
For a debt that is still with the original creditor, I wouldn’t bother asking for the CCA agreement unless the debt was VERY old or you are getting letters from solicitors about court action.
If a debt has been sold once it is less likely the current creditor can produce the CCA agreement. And this gets harder the more times the debt is sold on.
Court action and CCJs
If the creditor is seriously threatening court action, always ask for the CCA agreement. It is worth a try!
But when you already have a CCJ for a debt, it is too late to ask for the CCA agreement as the creditor doesn’t have to send it. If you have just found out about the CCJ you need to look at your options for “setting it aside“, not send a request for the CCA agreement.
Contacts about a very old debt you have heard nothing about for years?
If you haven’t been paying a debt for years and you aren’t being hassled by a creditor, you need a good reason to ask for the CCA agreement. It may be better to wait and see if you are contacted and then ask for the CCA.
But when you are contacted about a very old debt, asking for the CCA agreement is a very good idea. you should think first if the debt is statute barred, Talk to National Debtline on 0808 808 4000. They have a template you can send the creditor saying the debt is statute barred. This is simpler than asking for the CCA agreement.
But if the creditor comes back with a reason why it isn’t statute barred, then your next step should be to ask for the CCA agreement.
Hoping to settle debts with a windfall
If you have a windfall – an inheritance say – and you have a lot of debt in a DMP for several years so most of it is with debt collectors, asking for CCA agreements before you make offers is sensible. You don’t need to pay them anything if they cant produce the CCA.
Thinking about bankruptcy, a DRO or an IVA
Where insolvency (DRO, IVA or bankruptcy) looks necessary, it can be a waste of time asking for CCA agreements, unless not paying those debts would make the rest manageable.
Contacted about a debt which not yours
If a debt collector says you owe money but you don’t recognise the debt, you should send them a Prove It! letter saying you dispute the debt. Here the CCA is only part of the picture. You may get sent a copy of the CCA in answer to this – if the name and address on the agreement are yours and you did live at that property at that point, it is good evidence.
But keep focussed on the fact that what matters is proving who the borrower is.
Here is a case “Debt collector can’t prove it’s my debt but wants payment” where a debt collector admitted the debt was unenforceable as the CCA couldn’t be found but wrongly still asked for payment.
Summary
In summary, asking for the CCA agreement is an uncertain process that can take months. If you have a lot of debts, make sure you are looking at the bigger picture, as well as thinking about the individual debts.
Can you really offer just £1 to a debt?
Could a Debt Relief order help you?
When to ask for a debt write off
Gary says
Hello Sara
I’ve got an unenforceable debt and many advise me to ignore it, but yet I see conflicting advice that I may be taken to court.
The debt does not appear on my credit score a defaulted 2009.
Thanks in advance.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Why do you think it’s unenforceable and when did you last make a payment to it?
Gary says
Thanks Sara
I asked them for a CCA nearly 3 months ago and they now say they haven’t got one. I last made a payment about a month ago, before I found out they didn’t have a CCA..
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Ok so you have an email or letter from the debt collector saying the debt is unenforceable then?
Gary says
Sara
Cabot say.
“we have been unable to get the information requested from lender. If this information ever becomes available to us we will complete your request, but until we are able to supply this your account is unenforceable.
” This means we are not permitted to obtain a CCJ or warrant for diligence against you in court, but we can still request that you pay”
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I’m sorry, I didn’t see your reply.
Cabot have been very clear saying they can’t take you to court. The chance of them ever finding this old CCA agreement is about zero.
Keep their letter safe, but I think you can ignore stuff you may have read on the internet about being taken to court.
Hugh says
Hello again Sara
I made a CCA request to one company at the beginning of August. On the 28th of August I received “sorry about the delay, we will be in touch soon, issuing a response within the next 28 days. As I’ve not heard anything from them is it fair to think they’ve not got one.? Should I chase it up or leave it?
Hugh
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest you chase, and if you don’t get a clear response you should consider stopping paying them anything. If you do this, tell them in writing that you won’t be paying them until they produce the CCA.
Michael says
Hi Sara
Thank you so much for all of the information you provide on here. I would be extremely grateful if you could provide some guidance for me. I am currently in a DMP with Stepchange for over 2 years and slowly paying off my debts. If I ask for a cca, and the creditor (now a collection agency) do actually have the cca, does that leave me in a situation where I have to follow through with a F+F payment. Basically, a few of my accounts were originally opened in 2011 and defaulted in 2018. If they can’t provide a cca, then the idea of a very low F&F would go a long way to cutting my total debt. If they do have the cca, can I just carry on as I have been doing for the past 2 years, or will they try to strong arm me into paying a higher F&F or god forbid a CCJ.
I hope that makes sense and perhaps I am just too paranoid, but genuinely afraid to rock the boat incase they (for want of a better word) “punish” me for asking in the first place.
Thanks so much in advance
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I’m sorry but there aren’t any “rules” about what happens if a creditor finds a CCA.
These are pretty recent defaults. Even if they can’t find the CCA, they may refuse to accept a low F&F.
How large are your remaining debts? how much are you paying per month? what sort of debts are they?
Jane says
Hi Sara,
I’ve been sending my CCA requests in stages so I can keep track. I sent first one at beginning of August and after two letters saying trying to get info, I’ve had a third to say it cant be located but if they can in future they’ll be in touch. This is Cabot for an ex mint credit card, balance 4k. So I’m considering stopping my payments but I am scared after reading other stories that Cabot will hound me, phone my work (even though they dont know where I work, they may find out) and also sending debt collectors to the house. In your experience, what is the reality? what can I expect? I am prepared to offer a f&f to get them off my back of up to 20% but is this more likely to be accepted if I stop paying for a while first?
Thanks for your help
siva says
I sent the letters 2 creditors , June 10 request CCA request , but they not send , what can I do, more the 4 months , I paid by DMP.
please give me advice.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Have they replied at all? Or have they sent they cannot find them?
Kate says
Requested CCA from HSBC for a loan over 13 years old, they can’t find it – it’s taken 8 months to get back to me. They say in their opinion it’s still enforceable as due to data protection they couldn’t keep the details. Sounds like nonsense- what should I do? They’ve refused my 15% f&f offer.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
That’s a new argument to me! It doesn’t seem a very good one, data protection laws mean any firm can keep information for as long as it is necessary for their business, which would include obviously the details relating to outstanding credit.
Would you mind copying out EXACTLY what they said about enforceability?
Kate says
Just wondering if you had any thoughts on this? HSBC also asked for a budget which we gave them, then they turned down our offer. They said this about it being enforceable:
“After reviewing your account, I can confirm that HSBC are only obliged to retain records for 6 years in line with Data Protection requirements. Therefore, I can’t agree that this debt is unenforceable”
I’m pretty sure that under FCA rules it means if there’s no CCA it’s not enforceable and they are required to acknowledge that in every correspondence aren’t they?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest you go back to them and say that:
a) GDPR says that “contract” and “legal requirement” are two lawful bases for a firm to retain data (see https://ico.org.uk/for-organisations/guide-to-data-protection/guide-to-the-general-data-protection-regulation-gdpr/lawful-basis-for-processing/)
b) sections 77, 78 and 79 of the Consumer Credit Act say that a borrower is entitled to be sent a true copy of the CCA agreement relating to a debt
and
c) the FCA’s rules say:
CONC 13.1.6G
(1) Failure to comply with the provisions [of sections 77, 78 and 79 of the Consumer Credit Act] means that the agreement becomes unenforceable while the failure to comply persists, and the courts have no discretion to allow enforcement.
(2) In such cases, a firm should in no way, either by act or omission, mislead a customer as to the enforceability of the agreement.
(3) In particular, a firm should not in such cases either threaten court action or other enforcement of the debt or imply that the debt is enforceable when it is not.
Ask HSBC to confirm that the debt is not enforceable as they are unable to send you a true copy of the agreement. Say you will be taking the case to the Financial ombudsman if they do not go this.
Jane says
Hello Sara
We have had advice from you previously which really helped so thank you so much.
We are now self managing having been on a DMP with Stepchange from 2008 – I asked for CCAs – most came back unenforceable so we are now going to just pay the enforceables. Two of our debts were with Barclaycard, then sold to Link back in 2012. Barclaycard have confirmed the debts are deleted now, never actually defaulted but are adamant that they cannot be defaulted and at my request, the Escalations team have emailed Link to say so, which I have copies of. These two debts are currently on our credit files and listed as OK with Link but they are still saying that if we stop paying them (they never bothered to reply to my CCA requests back in May) after 3 months we will have a default. My question is are Barclaycard or Link right and should there even be an entry on our credit files from Link, albeit positive? I was literally going to stop paying unenforceables like Link from tomorrow so want to be sure.
The other thing is one unenforceable came back saying to accept our very low offer (I sent 5% ff offers out at the beginning of September to the unenforceables), they want to see a budget – are they in a position to ask for this? I was expecting this from the enforceables if we try and settle with them at some point? Many thanks in advance
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Link are just reflecting what Barclaycard are doing. You need to get Barclaycard to add a default. Read https://debtcamel.co.uk/debt-default-date/ and send Barclaycard a formal written complaint and say you will escalate it to the Financial Ombudsman if they do not add a default date as you are being treated unfairly.
they want to see a budget – are they in a position to ask for this?
They can ask what your favourite colour is if they want… but you don’t have to answer! I suggest you reply that you are offering the low settlement offer in order to come to a speedy agreement, if they don’t want to accept it that is their choice but you will not be paying them anything in future until they produce a valid CCA agreement for the debt.
Jane says
Thank you Sara. Ok I will definitely do this with Barclaycard. Their argument was that our initial payments towards these debts were acceptable as a payment plan when we first joined Stepchange which is why they never defaulted. But they say because this would have impacted our credit records, they still cannot be defaulted. Do you agree with this? As I was literally about to stop paying Link tomorrow, and a couple of other debts we have with them have definitely defaulted, should I just carry on paying those in question for one more month or pay all the Link ones whether defaulted or not? So glad I contacted you.
Jane B says
Sorry to butt in but I had the same issue with Barclaycard and PRA. I got passed from pillar to post but once I complained (on the phone) Some one called me back and said they would action the backdating of the defaults. The result was that they have now completely gone from my credit file. I’m just waiting for a response to my CCA requests. had 3 accounts with them.
Jane says
Thank you for letting me know. I appreciate that. I’m going to get on to them again tomorrow.
Vicky says
Hi Sara
I have got 8 defaults from 2015 which i have been paying at £1 a month. They are all with DCAs but from reading here I’m not 100% sure if they are all sold to the debt collector, or whether they are just collecting? (how do you tell the difference?) I have recently made a full and final settlement offer of 10% to each one, and so far one has accepted at 12%, one has asked for 33%, one for 27%, and the biggest (£14,860 with Barclaycard) which is managed by Link, have asked me for 70%. All the biggest debts, which are all credit card, date from 2000, 2004 and 2006 and I’m now reading about the CCA information for the first time. As I’ve already made the settlement offers is it now too late to contact them again to request the CCA? Are the debts definitely unenforceable if they date before 2007? Not sure what to do now, as I’m in the middle negotiating with each one? Many thank
Rich says
I’ve already made offers, am I Stirling up a hornets nest if I start asking for cca’s?
Stephanie says
Hi Sara,
I have a defaulted credit card with a balance of £2237.73. The account defaulted in August 2014, so is due to drop of my credit report next year.
Over the past couple of weeks I’ve received communication from both Cabot and Robinson way/hoist regarding this.
My question is who do I send a CCA request to? Obviously both can’t collect for the same debt can they?
Also I have yet to make contact with either of them, although I do have an online account with Cabot which I opened and accessed out of interest to see who the original debt was from….. Do this count as me accepting liability for the debt?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
What do the communications say?
Look out for a Letter before Action/Claim – it is letter with several attachments including a Reply Form, see https://debtcamel.co.uk/letter-before-claim-ccj/. If you ignore one of these, the next letter will probably be a Caliam Form from the court for a CCJ. It is MUCH easier to dispute a debt at the letter before claim stage than fight a court case.
Who is the creditor on your credit record?
Looking at an online account does NOT count as acknowledging the debt. But the chance of this debt going statute barred is pretty slim. Asking for a CCA is a more promising approach…
Jane says
Hi Sara, I’ve had a response from PRA regarding a barclaycard (formerly EGG) that I requested the CCA. They have sent some terms and conditions but have said the debt is unenforceable as they can’t provide the revised T&C’s. They say if they become available they will send them straight away. I’m thinking of stopping the payment via my DMP, are they likely to find the revised T&C’s? they’ve sent a recon of the original so seems strange they can’t recon the revised. This account was opened in November 2008.
Thank you
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Well it’s not impossible, but it sounds pretty unlikely… how large is the remaining balance?
Jane says
Hi Sara, Its around 4k
Thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
So tell your DMP firm the creditor can’t produce the CCA agreement and you want them removed from your DMP.
Gemma says
Hi there,
I am hoping that someone will be able to provide me with some advice on the following please….
I have a total debt amounting to £30,400.00 which is spread amongst 6 creditors. I was previously under and IVA which failed September 2015 due to a change in health and work circumstances. Consequently, the last payment made to my creditors was in October 2015 and no payments have been made since this date.
I have not received any communication from any of my creditors chasing the debts apart from one debt which was transferred from MBNA to PRA Group for a credit card debt. PRA Group have remained in contact since buying the debt but have until now been placing my account on hold every 3 months due to my financial circumstances. I have now received a letter from PRA Group advising that my account is now being referred to their investigations and litigation department to look at my outstanding debt for possible litigation recovery. I sent them a CCA request yesterday as per National Debtline advice and I am now waiting upon a response.
Continued on next message……..
Gemma says
I would like to know how to proceed if PRA Group advise that they cannot provide me with a copy of the initial agreement please? Obviously, if they are able to supply the requested information I feel I have no alternative than to declare myself Bankrupt as I am not in a position to pay back the debt currently.
I have detailed below a list of my creditors and current status, do you think it would be possible for me to settle the accounts for 5% of the outstanding balances with the help from a family member? I would ideally like to avoid Bankruptcy if at all possible since the defaults have now disappeared from my credit report and I now have a good credit rating.
Original Creditor Last Known Creditor Date Opened Default Date Balance
MBNA Platinum Credit Card PRA Group 31-07-03 31-08-12 £3,700
Barclaycard Credit Card Watch Portfolio Management 18-10-02 17-08-13 £500
Barclaycard Credit Card Watch Portfolio Management 19-10-03 23-07-13 £8,000
Halifax Overdraft HBOS at The Insolvency Exchange 01-09-99 16-07-13 £700
Halifax Credit Card HBOS at The Insolvency Exchange 07-01-06 18-05-12 £3,500
Northern Rock Loan IVA Watch 05-06-06 30-07-13 £14,000
Many thanks in advance
Gemma
Sara (Debt Camel) says
“how to proceed if PRA Group advise that they cannot provide me with a copy of the initial agreement please”
tell them you won’t be paying them anything until they locate the CCA agreement.
without the CCA, the debt is not enforceable so they can’t take you to court or do anything apart from writing the odd letter saying “Even though your debt is currently unenforceable you still owe it so we would like you to make a payments arrangement.” You can file these letters or put them in the bin.
Obviously read all letters, don’t bin without reading!
Of those debts, the credit card debts are VERY old and all pre 2007. There is a very good chance that CCA can’t be found for any of them.
A CCA doesn’t apply for the overdraft, which is only £700, so tackle that one if it ever appears.
A CCA does apply for the NR loan – that is obviously the biggest problem if it does pop up and they can find the CCA. But if you can avoid paying anything to the others, help from a family member may stretch to 10% offer to that one?
viva says
hi
Sara
I get 1 creditor sent to me a letter ,thank you for your recent communication regarding the above account having contacted client they have advice that due ti the age of the account the agreement is unavailable. CCA I request on 10th jun 2019 , what can I do ??
1 creditors no sent letters, only one letter sent , still not get ,
I am every day life is very hard, mentaly I am mad. realy my earning all lost , this creditors, I want barrow more more money …..
please advice me , because your side is very support to I’m clear 10 creditors f & f settlement , I am loose my Life , creditors indirectey killing slowly slowly.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I said before that I thought you should call National Debtline on 0808 808 4000.
I really think it would help you to talk through all of your debts. National Debtline are very friendly and they know all about CCA agreements – it is their “template letter” that I suggest people use.
Jane says
Hello Sara
I’ve been in touch with you a few times and you’ve been a great help, thank you. We are now self managing having left our DMP with Stepchange that we have been on since 2008. All our debts have fallen off our credit records, I’ve requested CCAs and we are paying the creditors that can produce them. This is our first month off the DMP and we’ve just had a call from Link asking if we’re going to pay next month. My husband was caught unawares and said yes although we’re not. I know this doesn’t really mean anything but it made me wonder what sort of stock answer we could give creditors when they call and put us on the spot. They know we don’t have to pay – they have confirmed the debts are unenforceable in writing. Could you advise what we sort of response we should give? We want to keep it civil rather than just hang up. I’ve worked so hard to get to this point but feel a bit unsettled having had our first call chasing us up. Many thanks in advance
DebH says
Hi,
My husband and I were in a DMP with Stepchange but due to a change in circumstances we decided to go it alone and make some proper headway with our debts. I have written to all our creditors and asked for CCAs. I had 2 barclaycards that have now been passed to PRA Group. They responded to both the CCA requests on 6.6.19 stating that they ‘considered this debt as unenforceable which means we are not able to take court or further enforcement action against you to recover the debt’. However they seem to be focusing on one of the accounts and I have just received a Letter before claim which I have to respond to by 2.1.20. They say they sent an assignment letter on 17.8.15 but I have no recollection of this as this was a bad year for us due to redundancy etc. They have also said I have to reply to invitation to refer this matter to ADR by 2.1.20. The debt is £4.627. Should I reply asking for further info or accept invite to ADR? Many thanks for in advance for any advice.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Does the letter from them dated 6.6.19 make it clear which debt they consider is unenforceable? Or did it read as though it was both of them?
DebH says
They answered separately to each of the accounts clearly stating on each response that they considered the debt unenforceable as per the quote above. This was included in each response letter.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
The assignment letter is irrelevant at the moment. It could later matter in a court case but if the debt is unenforcable a court case should never be started.
I suggest you do two things:
1) send them a formal Complaint by emailing them at complaints@pragroup.co.uk
Say that they confimred on dd/mm/yy that your two debts were both unenforceable. the email or a photo of that letter. Say that you have now received a Letter Before Claim for one of the debts – attach a photo of it.
Say that this is in breach of CONC 13.1.6 which says that “In particular, a firm should not in such cases either threaten court action or other enforcement of the debt or imply that the debt is enforceable when it is not”. Ask them to confirm that this was an error, that they did not mean to imply the debt was enforceable and that they will not be proceeding to a court case. Say you do not wish to participate in any ADR process unless the CCA agreement is produced and the debt becaomes enforceable.
2) then complete the Reply Form – which may be going to PRA or their solicitors, it should say. See https://debtcamel.co.uk/letter-before-claim-ccj/ . That says go for box C if you are unsure. But if* you have a letter from them saying the debt is unenforceable, you are sure so you can tick box D – you dispute the debt. Then complete box H in section 4, explaining that you received a letter on dd/mm/yy saying that the debt is unenforceable. If you aren’t sure what to write, talk to National Debtline https://www.nationaldebtline.org/ om 0808 808 4000/.
Don’t be tempted to just do (1) or (2). Do both.
(* I said “if” because there seems a small chance that the Letter Before Claim is referring to a different debt, not one of the 2 they said was unenforceable.)
DebH says
Hi Sara,
Thank you very much for this helpful information. I have been going through documentation to check everything before I sent a reply. On 6.6.19 PRA sent a letter saying they ‘deemed this debt as unenforeceable which means we are not able to take court or further action against you to recover the debt’
On 30.7.19 they sent a letter re – request for informtaion Section 77-79 Consumer Credit Act 1974. It just states they have ‘enclosed copy documents as requested’ and asked me to contact them. The documents are computer printouts of statements from 6.12.11 – 6.9.12 – April and June are missing and they are obviously just from their records not on headed paper from Barclays. They have still not sent a CCA agreement copy. I then received the letter before action on 28.11.19.
Am I still ok to use the response you gave me above?
Many thanks for your help
Deborah
Sara (Debt Camel) says
If you dodn’t feel comfortable about this, please do talk to National Debtline. They can talk through your situation in detail.
Deborah says
Dear Sara
Just want to say a huge thank you for your help. I sent off the email complaint following your guidelines and including all the relevant correspondence, The great news is that they have responded by letter and have apologised for their mistake and have confirmed that this debt is indeed unenforceable and that all action will now cease. They do still want me to arrange a settlement with them but in this case I think I am in a much better bargaining position to reach an affordable amount.
Many thanks again for your help, I feel much better informed on my rights and more in control.
DebH
lisa says
Hi Sara. I haven’t asked for my CCA agreements yet as only defaulted a year ago. However the actual credit card I took out 20 years ago. I have just received an email. Please see below. Do you think I should ask for the CC A now as they are giving me a new one it would appear.
Dear Lisa
The latest statement for your Tesco Bank Credit Card ending 4461 is now available online. You can view this by logging on to our Mobile App or Online Banking.
***IMPORTANT CHANGES TO YOUR CREDIT CARD AGREEMENT***
From 15th January 2020, we’re updating your Tesco Bank Credit Card Agreement. You don’t need to do anything, we’re just writing to let you know. To help you understand what’s changed we’ve created a quick summary below, or you can read the full copy of the changes at http://www.tescobank.com/CC-NoV
1. We’re making changes for customers in persistent debt
We want to do all we can to help customers get out of persistent debt. So, we’ve updated your Credit Agreement to reflect some changes we are making to support this.
– What’s persistent debt?
If you’ve been paying more in interest, fees and charges than you have towards reducing your card balance for 18 months or more, you’ll be considered to be in persistent debt. You can read more information on this at http://www.tescobank.com/persistent-debt.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Are you making payments to the card to Tescos? Are they still adding interest?
Lisa says
I am paying £5 a month to Allied International. I don’t believe I am paying interest. The debt is for around £4500. Thanks. I was going to leave it a bit longer before I asked for a CCA. I took the credit card out in 2001 I think.
Eman says
Hi Sara,
Who can I speak to about informing me if a CCA agreement sent to be is in fact correct and enforceable or if the DCA is just trying their luck?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
See the How can you tell if it is right? section in the article above.
Hasitha says
Hi All, Thanks you so much for the all usefull infomations on this site. I have recently sent a letter requesting CCA agreement from desbt collecting company which is harassing me since few months now. Then they have sent me a acknolagement letter with attached of copy of utility bill in connection to the debt. I have opened this account on May 2013. Can you please let me know if copy of a utility bill can be accepeted as CCA agreement/ is it vaid and can they still go agains me? Please help
Thanks so much in advance
Sara (Debt Camel) says
CCAs only apply for credit card, store card, loan and HP debts. They aren’t relevant at all for utilities. If you are being chased for a utility bill that is nit your, wrong or very old, I suggest you go to your local Citizens Advice for help.
Lisa says
Hi Sara,
Just wondering what your take is on CCA requests for overdrafts in light of this:
“MFS Portfolio Ltd v Phelan & West – Appeal – Overdrafts
4 April 2019, 10:41
The claim against our clients in this case was for monies owing under a personal Current Account Overdraft. We lost at first instance before a District Judge in Peterborough County Court and appealed the decision before HHJ Walden-Smith sitting at Cambridge County Court.
The Appeal was successful yesterday. This is an important case because it confirms that consumers using the unenforceability provisions of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 can successfully defend claims for personal Current Account Overdrafts in court. In this instant case the Appeal court found the personal Current Account Overdraft agreement to be unenforceable pursuant to the Consumer Credit Act because of lack of evidence of compliance with the requirements of the OFT determination.
It was also accepted that Creditors must comply with S 78 Consumer Credit Act 1974 requests relating to personal Current Account Overdrafts, not just credit cards and loans. “
Does this mean a CCA for overdraft debt can now be requested? I’m a little confused.
Many thanks.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I will read the judgment.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
The judgment is not on Bailli (so I haven’t read it) and it is not a case that is legally binding as a precedent.
If you are taken to court by a debt collector for an overdraft and the amount owed is over 10k, you may want to talk to a xonsumer credit act specialist solicitor to see if they would take your case on.
Jay says
Hi I received a F&F settlement offer for a outstanding debt of circa £4.5k from a debt collection agency who bought the debt some years ago, the offer was circa 45%. The debt is due the fall off my credit report has it’s coming up to the six years point.
I submitted a F&F offer of 20% which they rejected. I requested my CCA and they have now said the debt is not enforceable.
Would you advise sending another letter for the same F&F offer i.e. 20% making reference the fact that the debt is not enforceable now.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
You made a reasonable offer and they rejected it hoping you would have no idea what your rights are. They got it wrong.
So why would you offer 20% to an unenforceable debt? The debt will be off your credit report whatever happens. You can simply stop paying.
If you would prefer it settled, offer them 5%.
Jay says
Do you by any chance have a template letter for post CCA F&F settlement offer?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
No, just take the standard one here https://debtcamel.co.uk/debt-options/less-common/full-final/ and start by saying that they agreed on dd/mm/yy that the debt is currently unenforceable until the CCA agreement can be produced, but you are prepared to make this settlement offer to get the debt closed. Add that if they do not agree to this you will not be making any further payments to the debt.
It’s probably best to have stopped paying them before you send this so they know they can’t ignore your offer and get paid for a few more months.
Jay says
Thank you that’s most helpful
Gav says
Hi debt Camel,
I sent off 3 CCA requests 2 to Cabot one for £2.5k the other 11k and one to intrum for 1.5k this was 4 weeks ago and they all got sent together.
I got a response from Intrum suspending my account for 7 weeks while they try to get the information.
Cabot sent me a letter for the £2.5k debt and told me it was unenforceable. as I said it’s been 4 weeks now and I haven’t heard anything regarding the 11k debt from Cabot.
Telephone calls and letters have stopped but what do I do at the moment just leave it or contact them again asking where the response is?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest waiting another month.
Hugh says
Hi Sara
Thanks for all your advice in the past.
I now have two unenforceable creditors that don’t have CCA. I shall be writing to them this week to say that I’m going to stop paying unless they produce a CCA.
I had one enforceable creditor that settled a F&F at 40% of total debt
The second enforceable refused a 40% offer and demanded 85% of total debt. They’re going to have to wait.
Thank you for all your help in the past. I couldn’t have done this without your advice.
Merry Christmas
H
Dan says
Hi Sara quick question is it worth making a complaint to link financial as they sent me a letter in January letting me know they can not provide the cca for the debt they have and the debt is not enforceable but is still collectable. I stopped making payments to them from this date.
I have had conversations with them about the situation and I have just come across to them with the stance provide legal evidence with a consumer credit agreement but still nothing.
I know they think the debt is collectable but my stance is the debt is legally unenforceable and until a cca is provided I dont recognise the debt and no payments will be made.
I have stopped communicating with them now as it’s a pointless exercise going round in circles but is a complaint about the chasing me every month justfied?
Thanks
Dan
Sara (Debt Camel) says
So they are sending a letter once a month? And the letter says somthing like – the debt is unenforceable but we think you should make a payment arrangement?
Dan says
Hi phone calls and automated texts. No letters
Sara (Debt Camel) says
But the calls and letter say the debt is unenforceable? This is important.
Dan says
Yes I have a letter from them saying the debt is unenforceable
They dont send letters any more its calls and automated texts trying to get me to set up a payment arrangement
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Sorry, I meant to ask if the calls and texts start by telling you the debt is unenfoceable… i know you had a letter saying this, i am asking about the communications you have received after that point.
The regulator’s rules say:
CONC 13.1.6 “The firm should, in any request for payment or communication relating to a payment (other than a statement issued in accordance with the CCA or regulations made under it which does not constitute or contain a request for payment) in such cases, make clear to the customer that although the debt remains outstanding it is unenforceable.”
So do these texts comply with this? And the phone calls?
Dan says
I see, no they just want a payment arrangement set up nothing is ever mentioned about the cca and the debt being unenforceable until I bring it up with them, and then the call handler doesn’t really have a clue and it’s me educating them over my rights, it’s quite embarrassing for them I feel. (The student educating the master !)
So if they aren’t following the fca guidelines i should issue a complaint?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Yes :)
Your complaint is that you are being asked to repay a debt but they are not explaining that the debt is unenforceable each time by phone or by text and that this is in breach of the FCA rule I quoted. Add that you will take the case to the financial ombudsman and ask for compensation if they persist in this.
You could also say that you accept they may wish to write you letters from time too time but you do not wish to receive any further communications by phone or text message. Ask them to confirm this.
Let me know what happens!
Tony says
This article was a huge help, thanks Sara! I made three requests because an inheritance means I will soon be able to make some settlement offers and hoped it could put me in a better bargaining position.
I had a very fast response from Moorcroft saying that they needed me to sign the request (I read advice somewhere not to), I sent this signed copy back a month ago but have not heard anything from them since. Then I received replies from Link & Cabot saying they can’t provide them.
Couple of questions:
1. I’ll contact Moorcroft again but what should I do if they just ignore me?
2. With the two who can’t locate them (and hopefully that’ll be three eventually).. Is there any benefit to me making a settlement at all (after waiting a few months to ensure they don’t show up)? I already have defaults on them that are about 4-5 years old.
Thanks!
Sara (Debt Camel) says
That’s all going well!
I would give Moorcroft another month. Then write to them and say as they haven’t replied, you assume they can’t produce the CCA agreement so you are stopping paying them until they do.
Have you stopped paying Link and Cabot?
Are you likely to apply for a mortgage before all the defaults drop off your credit record after 6 years?
Tony says
I haven’t yet, no. I currently pay all 3 through a DMP with StepChange. If I tell them to stop paying those two, won’t they just pay Moorcroft the rest of my payment as that’s still what they’ve deemed is affordable to me each month?
I have checked the drop off dates and they are May 2021/July 2021 for Link & Cabot and March 2022 for the two Moorcroft ones. Ideally I would like to have applied for a mortgage by then.
I heard something about making settlement offers on the condition that defaults are removed:
Would you say that would be only condition under which it’s worthwhile paying anything?
If Moorcroft do supply the CCA and those defaults are definitely in place until 2022, is it still worth making settlements to try to remove the other two? Like if I was to apply for a mortgage in 2020 (the inheritance might be enough for a deposit), is the difference in how they would view 2 v.s. 4 defaults, great enough that it’s worth the settlement cost (or would that be better served being added to the deposit?)
(That second question become complicated and long-winded, hope this makes sense!)
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Yes StepChange will start paying more to Moorcroft. does that matter? You are more likely to get a settlement offer accepted if you have stopped paying them.
It will be hard to get a mortgage unless the defaults have dropped off OR you have the defaults settled.
Debt collectors should not agree to remove a default as part of a settlement offer. I’m not saying it never happens, but it isn’t common.
Are the default dates right for all these debts? Read https://debtcamel.co.uk/debt-default-date/. If you can get the dates moved to be earlier, they will drop off sooner.
Tony says
No, it doesn’t really matter. The only worry I have is that, the Moorcroft one is actually the largest and won’t they be less likely to accept a settlement offer if I’ve just increased my payments to them? Obviously this would still be better than the situation I’m in now because I’d be debt free a lot sooner but I’d really rather just get them all sorted ASAP.
Ok, that’s what I assumed to be honest: make a settlement offer because at least that will look better than just an ongoing (and not decreasing) debt that has defaulted… right?
I’d never really thought about checking the dates so just had a quick read of that advice, however when I took out these debts, I was not only not responsible in the amounts, but I also didn’t keep records etc. The only point that applied to me in those examples was that I did move house and didn’t receive the warning letters, but isn’t this my own fault for being so unorganised that I didn’t even update my address?
Thanks so much for all your help, it’s greatly appreciated!
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Well then you can just wait another month and, assuming Moorcroft hasn’t produced the CCA agreement, stop paying them all at that point. Then make settlement offers to all three.
Getting a low offer accepted sounds perfect – but you can’t make the debt collectors accept a settlement offer. If they think you are too keen as it will make life easier to get a mortgage, they may refuse a low offer even if they haven’t got the CCA.
Tony says
Hi again!
I took your advice and stopped making my DMP payments as none of them could provide the CCA. The sale of the house (my inheritance) took longer than expected (although I’m sure they always do) but I should have the money to make my F&F offers this week!
There’s just been one slight development since then: Cabot have no bought the debt the Moorcroft held. I guess I just make another CCA request to Cabot for this debt?
I don’t understand why they would purchase a debt without a CCA? I guess Moorcroft don’t exactly tell them that I’ve requested it and that’s why they want to get rid!?
Final question: is it worth considering my default dates when making these offers? I noticed that some of them seemed to be unpaid for up to 6 months before a default was applied. Is there any chance I could get that date moved to any earlier as a condition of my settlement payment?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I would send Cabot the email/letter from Moorcroft confirming the CCA could not be found and say you will not be paying the debt until it is located.
Default reporting rules say a default should be added when a debt is 3-6 months in arrears. If they have complied with those, you are very unlikely to get it moved earlier let alone deleted.
As I said before “you can’t make the debt collectors accept a settlement offer. If they think you are too keen as it will make life easier to get a mortgage, they may refuse a low offer even if they haven’t got the CCA.”
Ashley says
Hello Sara
I am currently under a DMP and have been for some while now. Ive defaulted with numerous creditors and am looking at sending the a full & final settlement offer but before i do this i will ask for my CCA agreement. All my loans have been sold to other companies. I have all my original account numbers but after my debt was sold i now have new account numbers for the new creditors(found in my DMP). When sending my letter to the new creditor is it a good idea to send the original account number in the hope they cannot find it or is it irrelevant and i should just send the current?
Many thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
You don’t want them to find the CCA agreements!
Just send the CCA letter using the template given and don’t forget to include the £1 cheque or postal order with each request.
Paul says
I have two old debts , a loan to First Direct and a barclaycard debt . These two debts date back to 2008 . I have been on a DMP since 2010 trying to pay these debts off. Both have issued my a default notice .
I wrote to barclaycard and HSBC repayment services back in September 2019 . I wrote the letters using the template suggested on this forum to both companies. I asked that under the Consumer Credit Act 1974 (sections 77-79), I am entitled to receive a copy of any credit agreement and a statement of account when I request it. I enclose a payment of £1 which is the fee payable under the Consumer Credit Act 1974
I did not receive any reply from Barclaycard , despite me phoning and asking for a response to my request .
In December 2019 I received a letter from HSBC repayment services thanking me for my request . this is what they said
Section 78 Of the Consumer Credit Act does not apply to Current Accounts . the current account is not a regulated agreement because it provides no credit .
Are the HSBC repayment services right in what they say ? What should I do having had no reply from Barclaycard ? .
I would welcome some advice please .
Sara (Debt Camel) says
No CCA applies for a current account, they are correct.
Is the barclaycard account still with them? They haven’t sold it?
Paul says
Thanks for the reply , I cannot understand why HSBC are saying that the personal loan I took out is a an overdraft connected to a current account . It was a personal loan and a First Direct Visa , the amount totaling just over £20,000 which I took out in 2008 . I got into difficulties in 2011, went on a DMP and was served a default notice by First Direct bank in October 2012. I have a letter from First Direct stating that the loan account , and the Visa account had been amalgamated into my 1st Account , the loan and visa account being closed by them and an agreed payment plan was started in March 2011. So I can see that I did have the loan and a credit card , got into difficulty , agreed a payment plan and the bank closed the via account and the loan account and put the debt into something called a 1st account .
I think that the Barclaycard account is still with them .
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest you talk to National Debtline on 0808 808 4000 about this amagamation of previous debts into a single debt and the implications for asking for a CCA agreement.
You can reasonably stop paying Barclaycard and tell them you will resume payment if they priduce the CCA agreement.
Paul says
Could I also ask a further question please . having read a lot of the comments on this page I see that a lot of people mention the debt dropping off your file etc . I have signed up to the Credit club to enable me to see my Experian report for free. I’ve never seen one of these before and I am finding it difficult to see if I have my two debts on my file . Where do I look ?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
If you want someone to look at paperwork fior you, I suggest going to Citizens Advice,
Ashley says
Hi Sara
I sent my creditor (westcot) a letter asking for a copy of my cca but they have replied saying they are not the creditor and to contact a different creditor (link financial) instead. I am currently in a DMP and have contacted my DMP provider and they confirmed westcot was in fact my creditor and they have been the ones receiving payment from me. Should i stop making payment as they arent providing me with my cca or should i contact this supposed ‘other creditor’?
Many thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest you send it to Link
Michelle says
Hi Sara, I have 9 creditors. (around 28,000 in total, mostly credit cards, and an old Halifax overdraft I have been managing them now on a DMP for around 7 years, only 1 remains on my credit file. All have shown as defaulted, only 1 of the 9 is still showing on my credit file, this should drop off in June. The agreements (if they exist) will have started I think between 2004 and 2009.
I would like to request the CCA’s but I’m worried that if they find them they might proceed to CCJ route. I have payed them all regularly, not missing a payment. Can they put them back onto my credit record?
Once the last one drops off my credit file and my credit rating improves can I apply for a mortgage? Do I sill have to declare I’m paying them? Should my credit rating improve? Sorry for all the questions. I’ve been in this for what feels like a lifetime and they still make me feel sick.
I’ve prepared letters to 8 of them as I have no contact details for the last one. They haven’t been in touch at all for at least 2 years (although I do still pay them).
I would be grateful for any advice. Thanks Michelle
Sara (Debt Camel) says
between 2004 and 2009.
that’s old… no guarantees but I will be surprised if all of them can produce the CCAs
“an old Halifax overdraft”
no CCA is relevant for overdrafts, don’t bother asking for one.
I’m worried that if they find them they might proceed to CCJ
it could happen but if you look back through the comments here you will see that no-one has reported it.
Can they put them back onto my credit record?
No. Never.
Once the last one drops off my credit file and my credit rating improves can I apply for a mortgage?
yes, but you may well be turned down because of your DMP
Do I still have to declare I’m paying them?
you should always be honest in a mortgage application – but anyway the lender is going to spot the DMP payments on your bank statements :(
Should my credit rating improve?
oh yes, it will, lots. But that isn’t the only thing that matters for a mortgage application – the payments to your DMP also matter.
How much do these debts add up to?
Michelle says
Thanks Sara, that has given me more confidence with going ahead and sending the letters. I will leave out the one for the overdraft balance. I’ll deal with that one separately.
The overall balance is about £28,000 roughly.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
What a pity you didn’t go bankrupt instead of choosing a DMP. Your debts would be gone and you could now be getting a mortgage :(
But how much of a deposit do you have saved up? If there are just a few debts where the CCA is produced, you need to be able make F&F settlement offers on them so you can then get a mortgage.
Michelle says
I know, it is a shame. I didn’t do it because of the stigma attached to being bankrupt. Silly I know but just how I felt about it. I thought I could start paying more once I can go from P/T to Full time work. (I have a son 10 years old) I had no idea that these would drop off my credit file after 6 years of defaulting.
This week of really looking into this more has opened my eyes a bit :) I’ve always managed the process of updating creditors with my available income and setting standing orders each year (thanks to the templates and how to guides on the net).
I can get the deposit as soon as my debts are cleared., Family have offered to help with that but I don’t want to go into that until this is resolved.. There really is no rush. I will wait to see what comes back on the CCA requests. Once I know how much of this I actually need to raise to be clear of it, I can move forward..
Thanks again Sara, this website and your advice really have been an eye opener!
I will write again when I start getting responses. :)
Michelle says
Sorry Sara, just one more thing.. What do I do about the one that hasn’t sent me any correspondence for the last couple of years? I’ve been making payments but haven’t heard anything from them? No statements, no calls, no requests for information nothing..
Michelle says
And one more, sorry Sara, just so that I have understood this correctly.
If the defaults have dropped off after 6 years., can a lender still go for a CCJ and will it show up again on my credit file? I think from your response earlier that the answer is no but just checking I’ve understood this correctly.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
yes they can still go for a CCJ and then that CCJ – not the debt itself – will show on your record. But as i said before, although this is a possibility, it isn’t something that normally seems to happen. Go back through the comments here and no one has mentioned it happening to them when the debt collector found the CCJ.
You have to weigh up the risk of this against the chance of possibly being able to get a lot of old debt cleared. because unless you do, you are never going to get a mortgage.
Michelle says
Hi Sara, I hope you are well :).
I have an update, I have had 2 responses from 3 of the accounts with Cabot. the first around end of Jan acknowledging receipt of my request. The second around the first week of Feb is worded as this: We’re still processing your request. We have contacted the original lender for the relevant information. As we haven’t yet been able to provide you with the information you have requested your Credit agreement is unenforceable until we are able to reply to your request. This means that we are not permitted to obtain a County Court Judgement or a Warrant for Diligence against you in Court. Thank you for making the payments towards your account, please continue making the payments. You are making positive steps to repaying your account with can have a positive effect on your credit file if this account is showing on it.
One of the creditors hasn’t responded at all and one of the smaller ones has sent me a copy of the CCA agreement and all statements.
There is one more creditor that I cannot write to because I have no contact details for them. I haven’t received any correspondence from them in the last two years.
For those who have responded, how long should I wait before making F & F offers? And what should I be offering?
Thank you for your advice so far, its very much appreciated.
Michelle
Sara (Debt Camel) says
You could contact them and ask what your balance is?
Ash says
Hi Sara, i have been sending CCA letters to all my creditors which are coming back quite successful so thank you for that. I have an overdraft debt which has been passed on from lloyds to moorcroft. Im reading contradicting information online as to wether or not this can ever be deemed as unenforceable? I have requested a CCA from them anyway but im not sure if thats what i should be doing, or if there is anything i can be doing, thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
They will probably reply saying that no CCA is applicable.
mark says
I’ve had several debts (mainly from loans or credit cards) for best part of ten years now. It seems many of the debts have been passed to several agents or debt collectors over the years. What is the best way to identify all my debts, the current collectors for each and ascertain whether I need to pay them back or not?
Denise says
Hi, my IVA failed after 3 years in Nov 2019. I am now dealing with creditors myself and most of the debts are now with debt collectors. Can i ask them for CCA’s. The debts are approx 3 & 4 years old and some have already been sold on to other debt collectors.
Thank you
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Hi Denise,
a few questions. You say the debts are 3 & 4 years old – does that mean you took them out just before the IVA? If the accounts were opened a long while before that, that is what matters, not when you defaulted.
What sort of debts are they? Have they all been marked as defaulted on your credit record?
Are you being asked for payments? How much do they add up to in total? Are you buying or renting?
Denise Owens says
The debts started in 2014 and i entered an IVA in sept 2016 which failed in Nov 2019. My debts total £20,000 1 of which is a £3,000 overdraft. Yes they have been marked as defaulted on my credit file. Most of the debts are now with PRA group, Lowell and drydenfairfax solicitors who are acting for moorcroft. We own our home with no mortgage and at the moment no payments have been made to anyone as they want an income and expenditure from me.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
You can ask for CCA agreements but not for the overdraft & there is no point with the recent debts in asking for CCAs for any debts that have not been sold to a debt collector.
Can I ask why your IVA failed? Do you have any possible source to make a settlement offer to them, does your partner have an OK credit rating? are you over 55 with any unpaid pensions? If you are asking for CCA agreements, it is good to know what you intend to do if the agreements are found.
HQ247 says
Hi Sara, I have 4 debts, 2 with link financial, one with Wescott and one with idem. ( A loans with Halifax, 2 Credit Cards with MBNA and a Credit Card with Halifax) Total debt is approx 11k. They have all dropped off my credit file and date from around 2006/2007. I am currently paying a total of £47 per month towards the debts. I arranged this myself with the creditors as the DMP company I was with was costing me 35 a month in admin fees. Should I now ask for CCAs to see if the debt is unenforceable?
Reading the posts here chances are they won’t be able to furnish me with the relevant CCAs and , if this is the case, I intend to stop paying and offering a F& F settlement for each in the region of 10%. Or should I offer 5%?
Thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
They sound very old – well worth asking for CCAs for.
Personally if they can’t produce one, I would simply stop paying, but it’s your choice. 10% sounds way too much to me. Keep your money in case a CCA does turn up!
HQ247 says
Thanks for that info Sara. I am in the process of sorting CCA request letters currently. If the result of this is that the debts are unennforcable and I cancel my payments, how long should I wait to make a F& F settlement? I’m thinking I should just offer 5% and be done with them.
Many thanks.
AK says
Hello, could you, please, confirm if I received a copy of CCA and it doesn’t have my last name and address of the time of opening an account it’s not a correct one. I had two accounts with Barclaycard and I think debt purchaser sent me CCA for the one I repaid and closed and not defaulted one I sent a request for. What are my actions? Many Thanks, AK
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Talk to National Debtline on 0808 808 4000 about this and what you can do.
AK says
Thank you Sara. But is my understanding correct that the CCA PRA sent me is not for the debt they acquired as it has more recent address and last name?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
It does sound wrong, but please talk to National Debtline.
AK says
Thank you, I will.
Jane says
Hello Sara
I have asked for CCAs from our creditors and as a result have letters confirming the debts are unenforceable. We had a number of creditors and some have just gone very quiet and some are calling or sending letters – the latest from IDEM says they haven’t had a payment since October and want us to complete a budget form by 10th Feb to come to a mutually acceptable agreement or this will result in ‘further collections activity’. I have the earlier letter in front of me from them saying they couldn’t supply the CCA so the debit is unenforceable so assuming this latest letter is hot air.
I wanted to ask you though with the phone calls and letters we receive, is the best course of action to ignore them? Ideally I’d like to have a stock response – I wondered if I should just say we have stopped making payments until they are able to produce the CCA as is our right. Please can you advise what’s the right thing to say? Some of the phone calls from a couple of creditors are relentless. Many thanks in advance.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
“I wondered if I should just say we have stopped making payments until they are able to produce the CCA as is our right.”
That is right if they have said the debt is unenforceable. If you don’t want to receive any more phone calls o texts, say you understand the debt still legally exists and that they are entitled to ask you to pay it, but you no longer want to receive any phone calls or texts about this, just letters.
Will says
Hi.
I have received a claim form for a ccj from Mortimer Clarke on behalf of Cabot financial. This is all about a vanquis credit card from 2013. I don’t agree with the amount they are claiming. I made some payments off this debt through another debt collecting company, before it was passed on to Cabot. These payments don’t seem to have been taken off the amount and also there is no mention of the other company on the claim form. Would it be a good idea to ask for a Cca? Many thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
It would have been an excellent idea to have asked for a CCA when you were sent the Letter before Claim/Action but I guess you ignored that letter.
At this point you need advice on how to respond to this Claim not just send off a CCA requet. You can call National Debtline on 0808 808 4000 or post on Legal Beagles https://legalbeagles.info/forums/forum/legal-forums/court-claims-and-issues – or both!
You need to do the work in finding out how much you paid to the other debt collector. Get you bank statements together for this.
RW says
hi Sara;
Could i ask whether it is worth asking for CCA with three CC’s i have complaints to the FOS with for unnafordable lending? one cc has sent a letter saying they have passed/sold the debt despite it being with FOS. would it be prudent to ask for CCA on all of these now rather than later? I have been unable to pay since last spring but had been making token payments until nov ’19 when we struggled even with that.
thanks in advance :-)
Sara (Debt Camel) says
it’s not normally worth asking for CCA for recently defaulted debts. can you say something about your overall financial situation? How much do you owe on these three cards? Do you have loans and other debts? Any priority debts such as rent arrears or council tax? Are you buying or renting?
E says
Hi Sara, how long should we realistically wait for companies to send CCAS? I requested over a month ago copies of agreements for several credit card and catalogue debts that are many years old from Lowell debt collectors. I chased them and got a response back saying ‘as previously advised you will receive copies of these by post when we receive them, this could take a long time and therefore they could not give me a date of when I would get them’.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I normally suggest 2 months, but this isn’t really a science. They may still be able to find a CCA after that but the chances must (you would have thought) be dropping fast.
Kate says
I’ve receive CC claim from Lowell (old vanquis debt), submitted defence, asked for CCA and other docs. They have only sent me notice of assignment. 10 days after I submitted my defence they offered settlement which is the same amount as they claim in County court claim form. The thing is, they say because I made payments in the past to them I have already admitted liability for this debt, therefore they can proceed with court hearing.
I have submitted a standard defence for full amount that I found on this website. Would lack of CCA not going to work in this case?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I have submitted a standard defence for full amount that I found on this website.
not sure what you are looking at as I do not have a “standard defence” published on this site.
I suggest you talk to National Debtline about your defence or post on the Legal Beagles forum here https://legalbeagles.info/forums/forum/legal-forums/court-claims-and-issues
Kate says
Oh shoot, yes, my mistake, that was from legalbeagle.
I’ve tried calling ND, waited for ages, then phone died and I gave up. Will try them again tomorrow.
Anyway, maybe if I reformulated my question you could help me quicker. As I understand from the article above and comments, agreement is unenforceable if it is not provided by debt collector upon request even if they already made a county court claim?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
With a court case in progress, you have to defend the court case on the basis that the creditor has not provided the CCA. Back to Legal Beagles for help to do that!
Dean says
Hi Sara
I have been in a DMP since Feb 2013 and the last default will drop off next month. Had 46k outstanding and is now down to 5k :-) – I have just cottoned on to these CCA’s and i’m thinking that I could settle these debts for much less if they cannot find the CCA.
Are the CCA’s similar to statute barred? I have of course aknowledged my debts as ive been paying them.
Just to confirm I need to send the CCA requests to the debt collection agency i.e. Link who have taken on my Barclaycard debt?
Also I don’t have a cheque book so how do I send the £1. :-)
Thanks Dean
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Are the CCA’s similar to statute barred?
No, nothing to do with each other, except both are relevant for old debts.
Just to confirm I need to send the CCA requests to the debt collection agency i.e. Link who have taken on my Barclaycard debt?
yes
Also I don’t have a cheque book so how do I send the £1. :-)
send a postal order, see https://www.postoffice.co.uk/postal-orders
Dean says
Thanks Sara, So you think its worth a try? most of my credit agreements would have been started over 10 years ago.
This seems like a strange thing for creditors to agree to, why would they lose or dispose of CCA’s if it makes the debt unenforceable?
Thanks again Dean
Sara (Debt Camel) says
With credit card or loans over 10 years this is definitely worth doing.
It’s a legal requirement, written into the Consumer Credit Act. Creditors hate it…
Dean says
amazing – I’m excited
One more question sorry……
Say a couple of them come back with NO agreement – I think I would offer them a F&F settlement at a very low %. What if they dont accept the offer?
Do I just say take it or leave it and stop paying? Do I say “you must accept the offer as I will stop paying?”
Maybe we should talk again if I get some results :-)
This forum and your advise has been so valuable – thank you again
Cel says
Thanks so much for the advice on here. I’m in a DMP and have been paying for a few years a small amount each month. I emailed all creditors to ask for CCA and the first to come back confirmed they didn’t have it so I asked them to confirm they are not going to enforce it and they replied and said balance now Zero! I owed £5k on that one alone and they’ve wiped it just like that!!! Couldn’t believe it so thank you!
Dean says
Hi Cel, I’m just about to ask for my CCAS – great result
Can I ask who the debt was with and how old the agreement was ?? Well done
HQ247 says
Hi Cel, out of curiosity, if you emailed all of your crediorshow did you pay the £1 fee? Did they not request it?
Tia.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Some creditors don’t ask for the £1. But legally you should pay it and it’s best just to send it.
Dean says
One more question sorry……
Say a couple of the CCAs come back with NO agreement – I think I would offer them a F&F settlement at a very low %. What if they don’t accept the offer?
Do I just say take it or leave it and stop paying? Do I say “you must accept the offer as I will stop paying?”
This forum and your advise has been so valuable – thank you again
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest you stop paying when they can’t find it. Then offer a low settlement amount a couple of months later. Makes your point more clearly.
Keith says
HI wonder can anyone help with a situation that I’ve been left in.. Wife has a debit owed £1.800 to Lowell portfolio last week she got a letter saying that ResolvoCall will be sending there representative but didn’t say when. This morning I got a knock at the door it was the guy asking for my wife, I was taken back and said she wasent in and he handed me a calling card to contact his head office.
The thing is I went and looked up my wife credit file and seen the debit owed to lowell and it been in default for 5 years and 11 months is this classed as statute barred I can see on the file the date of first default but I’m thinking it actually longer than what it say. would I need to send off a for a CCA
I just don’t know what to do with ResolvoCall guy if he calls again. My wife took ill several years ago and couldn’t make it up and I don’t have anything to give
Any help would be much appreciated.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
You can’t guess if it is statute barred without knowing if your wife has made any payments or what she has said in writing to them. Asking for a CCA may be a good move.
Keith says
Hi Sarah no she hasn’t made any payments to them in over 6 years and she hasn’t made any contact with them either. She knows it’s over six years because we moved house that’s how she can recall how lon its been.. Looking at her file thr debt drops off in a month would asking for the CCA be of any benifit or do I just ply the month out until I know it has dropped off
Kind regards
Sara (Debt Camel) says
read https://debtcamel.co.uk/statute-barred-debt/ and talk to National Debtline pn 0808 808 4000 about whether this debt is statute barred, because dropping off your credit record means it’s old but that doesn’t necessarily mean it’s statute barred.
Dean says
Hi Sara just to let you know I sent 5 cca requests off today with the 1 quid postal orders – if they come back unenforceable and I stop paying I’m worried they will try to obtain a ccj regardless. Any unenforceable ones I intend offering a 5 % settlement – maybe I’m overthinking things but I have bad anxiety which has come on after I left the post office today – anyway hope you have some reassuring words as you normally do :-))))
Sara (Debt Camel) says
The reason for offering a F&F settlement if they can’t find the CCA is it rules out any chance of them finding it in future. People don’t normally get a problem with a debt collector saying they can’t find it and still going to court anyway.
You have taken the first step. O suggest you sit back and wait until there are some responses. Don’t try to over think, just see what happens.
Dean says
Thank you as always
Dean says
Hi Sara, hope you are ok if I record my cca journey on here – just to let you know 3 of my 5 ccas were signed for today – and I have cancelled my dmp with PayPlan so that I can self manage and react accordingly. Hoping to be debt free in 6 months – excited but a little scared too – been in dmp for 7 years 😮
Mike Peckover says
Hi, have had a letter from Resolve Call on behalf of Arrow Global. The letter states that my wife owes an amount of money on a Santander account. I called Resolve and they said it was for an Asda credit card which was taken out in 2008 and the last correspondence was in 2010 making it Statue Barred. The thing is my wife has never had an Ada credit card. Because this is Statue Barred should I ignore it or send them a letter from National Debtline website saying it is not my wife’s debt or should I send a letter ashing them to prove it?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest she makes all three points – reply saying that she has never had a credit card from Asda, if they think she has can they please produce the Consumer Credit Act Agreement for the debt and a Statement Of Account showing the last payment as such an old debt would be likely to be statute-barred.
Michael says
Hello everyone, I was wondering if anyone could shed some light on why my very (shopdirect) account (opened 2011) has disappeared from my credit report?
My debt with very was sold to NCO Lowell in 2018 as I have been in a DMP with stepchange since 2017. A few weeks ago I emailed very to ask why i could still log in to my very account and also why my account was showing as closed and defaulted on clearscore since 2018, but still appearing as open on credit karma…the credit karma report still showed the balance from 2018’s default date. Very replied confirming that my account was closed and the information I was seeing when logging in to my very account was historical. To note, NCO Lowell are not showing on any of my credit reports.
After hearing back from very, I sent a CCA request to NCO. I haven’t heard anything back from them yet, but have noticed that the very account has completed disappeared from my creditkarma account and my clearscore account has a message stating that the very account will be removed from my next credit report. My overall debt total on credit karma has reduced £4000 as this was how much my balance was when it defaulted.
Is this all related to me putting in the cca request? Can I now expect NCO Lowell to show up on my credit report instead.
Sorry for the lengthy post and apologies if I am posting this in the wrong section, just hoping someone can shed some light on this.
Many thanks in advance.
Maisie says
Hi Sara
I took out an overdraft in 2009 which has since defaulted and is due to drop off my credit report in September this year. I have not made any payments towards the debt and i am being hassled daily by Link Financial. Previously, i have just buried my head in the sand and ignored it which i don’t want to do anymore. i know requesting a CCA is not applicable in this case – is there another way to go around seeing if the debt in unenforceable?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest you talk to National Debtline om 0808 808 4000 about what your options are. It can be difficult to tell if an overdraft is statute barred.
lynn says
I paid off 5 of my debts which were with Link, PRA, etc. I never knew about asking for the original Credit agreement. None of them offered much of a discount and I ended up paying about 80% of the debts which was around £42K. I guess there is nothing you can do retrospectively once the debts are paid off? I only have 1 left with Link which was originally Barclaycard. I started with Stepchange in 2015. I know some people have paid only 10-20% of their debts but I was never given this option.
Many thanks for your help.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
No, nothing you can do now about the settled debts.
Beth says
Hi Sarah,
I had a £4K credit card debt for 10 years with Halifax. 6 months ago I requested a copy of the 2007 CCA, which they were able to produce. The debt has recently been sold to Cabot. If I was to now request Cabot for a copy of the CCA, how likely would they be able to obtain it from Halifax?
My parents have offered to pay £800 FFS, and after 11 years I am really desperate to try and settle this, but I guessing if Cabot have a copy of the CCA they’re not going to be in a rush?
Thank you.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I’m afraid I can’t guess. Just because Halifax have it, doesn’t mean Cabot have it or that they will be able to access it.
JohnC says
Hi there,
What a fantastic website! Congratulations!
Your wisdom please. I ran into problems a while ago and got chased by several creditors that I ignored. Eventually an HSBC credit card balance, having been sold on several times, ended up with a CCJ in May 2014. All the others have fallen away. I was hoping to ignore it for 6 years, but my circumstances have recently changed and now, frustratingly, I need to try and get rid of it before it expires if I can. It has ended up with Hoist/Robinson Way and is for a little over £8,000. I did some research online and found that creditors occasionally try and enforce CCJs shortly before they are due to expire with bailiffs etc. which I really didn’t want to happen, so I thought I should try and take action. I had enough cash to pay a little money so I have just brought the balance down to £8,000.
I wrote them an F & F letter offering to pay 30% which they ignored, but referred me to their website. If I use the website to try and find out how much they will accept in settlement, it says 60% which a) I can’t afford and b) I think is too much.
I have been offered some cash from a relative to help pay it off, but not enough to cover their 60%. Please can you suggest what I do next?
Many thanks in advance.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
You could send them an income & expenditure sheet showing you can only pay a low amount each month and say if they won’t accept the 30% you had proposed you will make monthly payments as your relative cannot afford to pay any more than that.
JohnC says
Thanks a lot. If they still reject the 30% and I do end up making the monthly payments, will that ‘extend’ the 6 years though or will it drop off after 6 years, irrespective of how much I have been paying or have paid up to the 6 year date? Also, if it does get to 6 years, then it will still take a few weeks to actually disappear from the credit report won’t it?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
debts drop off 6 years after a default if they have been repaid in full, if they have been settled partially, if you are still making payments or you have ignored them and never paid a penny.
They should drop off the day after 6 years.
JohnC says
Thank you. That’s a relief!
Finally, I’ve heard that some creditors send round bailiffs right at the end of a 6 year CCJ period. Is that an urban myth or does it happen? If it does happen, is it common or rare in your experience please?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I don’t think I have seen enough cases at that exact point to be able to reply.
Tina says
Hello,
I’m so glad to see you’re still responding to comments! This page has been really useful but I’m just looking for clarification since receiving one of my CCA’s back.
I received a reconstituted CCA from PRA that seemed to be in two parts and the order was all over the place, taking me a bit of time to sort out. The first part seemed to be the one from when I applied as it had the address I was living at at the time. The second one has my current address. Both have my name and address, similar information, but different lengths and neither of them are dated. Does this matter? Does it fulfil the CCA request?
Barclaycard (Original Creditor) who assisted PRA with the request sent a cover letter which says the CCA includes Short Form Cancellation, Historic T&Cs and Varied T&Cs.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
See the “How can you tell if it is right?” section in the article above,
Jay says
Hi this may be a silly question but what stops credit card companies from simply producing a document with your information on it, they will know all the relevant information so why would they not simply add to a template and submit
Sara (Debt Camel) says
a) most companies do not have a department set up to fraudulently produce documents
b) the original lender may well have a lot of the information, but the debt collector who has bought the debt may have ,uch less information.
Jay says
A) Thanks but who actually knows what happens behind closed door, PPI was a great example.
B) Agreed
Tina says
I read the section. Does that mean that the date of the agreement is not required?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
That was a brief overview – please talk to the experts about what you have been sent as it suggests.
Melrose dreams says
hello Sara,
I hope you can help with this.
Recently both me and my partner have been chased by Cabot for several credit cards and overdrafts, one of them only being in both names.
A year and a half ago we had token payments of £1 per month setup, which at some point we stopped paying because of my nervous breakdown, I wasn’t able to look after anything. The debt belonged to another company I think, which stayed silent for a while and then passed it on to Cabot.
Cabot is now quite persistent with letter and calls. What do you think is the best thing to do, ask for the token payment again or send a CCA request at this point? My fear is that a CCA request could accelerate a county court claim being initiated in case they find the documents. Also there is a chance that our financial situation could improve at some point so buying some time at this stage would be really essential.
I don`t want to accelerate anything..
as for now, I am self employed with low earnings and my partner has been out of work for 4 years. My income is low but not enough to get JSA to which we are not eligible as a consequence. Would it be enough for them to think twice before a court action? And the CCA would it accelerate the process? Realistically we cannot offer more than a pound per month even if a CCJ was granted.
Thank you
Sara (Debt Camel) says
How large is the overdraft – a CCA isn’t relevant for an overdraft.
How large are your credit cards? And your partner’s credit cards?
Are their other debts too that aren’t with Cabot?
Are you renting? Private or council/HA?
Melrose dreams says
Cabot debt:
2 overdrafts, one in my name and one joint, each one of about 2200. Formerly with HSBC, all of them.
4 more credit cards, 1 in my name and 3 my partner`s, totalling about 20000+
Other debts:
I owe about 20.000 and my partner`s debt is about 58.000 about .
We rent from a private landlord. We have arrears with electricity and gas.
We also received a letter of claim for a CCJ from 2 other credit recovery, one each, that we are trying to sort out.
I do not understand the logic of sueing debtors without a certainty that there are assets.
Even if a CCJ is issued, I will not be able to pay more than a pound per month for maybe 40 years. I will be over a hundred years when I finish paying…
Unfortunately due to my nervous breakdown I ignored all the letters, including pre action letters.
we have considered DRO and bankruptacy, but my partner worked in finance and it would be the end for him.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Why hasn’t your partner worked for 4 years? What was his job in finance?
Melrose dreams says
I would prefer not to reveal too many details on a forum as he lost his job due to a very complex legal matter and confidentiality issues could arise. He was, say, a broker and an FCA regulated person. After that he was a sales representative for a junior type of job compared to his experience. However our car broke and he lost that job too. And confidence became an issue too together with references and gaps on the CV.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
That sounds very difficult. I think the two of you need to talk to a good debt adviser about your options. It sounds as though these are quite recent defaults and there are a lot of them. Some overdrafts where the issue of a CCA will not help. Given your mental health problems and jor partner’s long period without a job, I think you may do better to look at insolvency – DRO possibly for you if you are under the 20k limit and bankruptcy for your partner. With court cases underway, you may well soon both have CCJs.
When you said “Also there is a chance that our financial situation could improve at some point so buying some time at this stage would be really essential.” you have to be realistic. Otherwise you just waste years of your life in a stressful situation just hoping things will get better in a few years and they don’t. Sometimes a clean start is the best option.
Can I suggest you talk to National Debtline tomorrow? On 0808 808 4000. It will always be your choice what to do.
The help from a relative may be better in paying his bankruptcy fees. A creditor with a court case underway will not normally stop if t for a full & final settlement, if that is what you are hoping for.
Jenna says
Hi Sara, I pay Vanquis £1 a month via my DMP plan with Step Change along with other debts. I’ve done this since May 2018 but Vanquis still won’t Default my account.
I contacted Vanquis and was told that a Default would only be added if I stopped paying them anything.
My question is, shall I take their advice and stop paying them until they Default the account?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Can I ask how large the debts are in your DMP? Do you think you will be able to pay more than £1 a month in the next year or two?
Pat says
I have had the same situation with Cabot, 2 debts of 3k and 12k, CCA’s sent 15/1/20 and they have only replied to the lower 3k debt stating it is unenforcable. Should I wait longer to stop paying or do you think 2 months is long enough (they cashed both £1 cheques the same day).
Thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
did Cabot say the 3k debt may become enforceable again? Or have they said they won’t be able to obtain it?
Pat says
Hi Sara
Their exact wording is
We’re still dealing with your request,we have contacted the original lender for the relevant information. As we havent yet been able to provide you with the information you requested, your Credit Agreement is unenforceable until we are able to reply to your request.
Both debts are over 10 years old by the way
Thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I think you should ask why they haven’t replied to you about the 12k debt.
Pat says
Hi Sara
I contacted them yesterday evening regarding an update on the 12k CCA request. Just had a reply email stating
“I have had a response form my CCA department and it looks like update letters were sent on both accounts yesterday so they both should get to you by the middle of next week if they have not already arrived today. All information in terms of where we stand and future contact is included within the letters so it should give you further understanding you are looking for.”
Convenient they were sent out yesterday!!!
Just hoping they havent found the agreements – will find out next week I suppose.
Pat says
Hi Sara
I’ve now had the letters from both accounts, both letters are saying the same
“We havent been able to obtaininformation you have requested from the original lender. If this information becomes available to us later, we’ll complete your requestand send you the relevant information.”
“Until we can supply this, your account is unenforceable. This means we are not permitted to obtain a County Court judgement against you. Whilst we cannot pursue legal action, your balance remains outstanding.”
Would you suggest stopping payment now or making a very small offer?
Thanks for all your hard work
Sara (Debt Camel) says
That’s good!
Are the debts still on your credit record?
Pat says
Hi
The debts are over 10 years old and not on my credit file although I cant remember if they ever were but I am assuming that they must of been.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
In that case I suggest you simply stop paying them!