Have you had a catalogue, credit card or store card where your credit limit was too high? So high that the monthly repayments were hard to manage and you got into more debt?
Many people were originally given an OK limit, but the lender kept increasing them.
You may have a good complaint that the lender was irresponsible in allowing you to borrow so much that the debt was unaffordable.
This article explains how to complain and ask for a refund of the interest you paid
Contents
What is “affordability”?
The following is my summary of the regulator’s rules:
- a lender must check if credit is affordable when you apply for it. A mortgage lender will ask for bank statements, but a catalogue offering a £200 credit limit doesn’t have to go into so much detail;
- a lender should also make new checks when deciding to increase a credit limit;
- credit isn’t affordable if paying it leaves you short of money for your bills,everyday expenses, and your other debts;
- if you have to borrow more most months, this would not be affordable. This could be borrowing on the same account – making a credit card repayment but then using the credit card to pay for food so the balance never drops is “borrowing more”;
- you have to be able to repay the balance within a reasonable period of time. Paying the minimum amount is OK for a short while, but not for a prolonged period.
How to complain
Good reasons to complain
If the lender could see any of these on your credit record, they should probably have declined your original application:
- recent credit record problems: defaults, missed payments, or arrangements to pay, mortgage arrears, payday loans;
- you already had a different credit card with the same lender where you were only making minimum payments and were using it for essentials like food and petrol. If you were given two credit or catalogue accounts by the same lender, often the second one should never have been given.
- other credit cards where you were near your limit and persistent overdraft usage. Here is an Ombudsman decision saying Zopa should not have given quite a low initial limit in this situation;
- a level of borrowing that looks too high in relation to your income.
Your credit limit should not later have been increased unless you could afford it. In addition to the points above, the following should have also warned the lender you were in difficulty already:
- making minimum payments for a long while;
- using a lot of your limit for a long period;
- a lot of gambling showing on the account statement;
- recent missed payments or an arrangement to pay on this account;
- your overall level of debt on your credit record has gone up a lot.
You don’t need all the details to complain
When your lender increased your credit limit, you don’t need the exact date. If all you can say is “you increased my credit limit several times” that is fine. You don’t need to ask for copies of all your statements – you would get a ton of paper!
But getting your credit record can help. You can’t go back and see exactly what your credit score was in say 2018, but take a copy of your current credit record as soon as you complain (get your free TransUnion statutory credit report). That will show what the pre-2018 problems were that the lender should have spotted.
Template to complain & the email address to use
The best way to complain is by email. It’s free, instant and you have a record of what you sent and when. Here is a list of credit card and catalogue email addresses to use.
In the suggestions below, I’ve invented some examples for the bits in italics in brackets. Change/delete these to tell your story.
I want to complain about irresponsible lending by you for my Barclaycard account number 987654/444. My date of birth is dd/mm/yy. The email address I used for this account was myaddress@whatever.com.
Then say they should never have given you the account:
You should never have allowed me to open an account with such a large credit limit. When I applied in 2015, you should have checked my credit record and you would have seen I had recent missed payments to a credit card and a default only two months before on a loan.
Or say that they should not have increased your credit limit:
You should never have increased my credit limit in 2015. At that time I had only made minimum payments on this credit card for a long while and/or I was using a very high level of my credit limit.
If you had properly checked my credit record before increasing my limit, you would have seen that in the two years since my account with you was opened, I had got additional late payment markers and defaults and/or taken out a lot of other credit. This should have warned you I was struggling with my finances and it was not responsible to lend me more. By increasing my credit limit you made my financial position worse. Instead you should have offered me forbearance by freezing the interest on the card.
I do not know the exact months of these credit limit increases. In your reply to this complaint, please tell me the dates and amounts.
If the lender should already have known you had problems with your account, mention these
You should also have realised that I was having difficulty because:
of the late payment charges you added to my account
of the gambling transactions showing on my card statement
I had missed two payments to you the year before in 2017
I had already asked you on the phone if it was possible to stop adding interest for a while.
End with asking for a refund:
I would like you to refund me all the interest I paid and any late payment charges from the point the account was opened
OR
I would like you to refund me all the interest I paid and any late payment charges after you increased my credit limit in 2018.
I would also like any late payment and default markers to be removed from credit records after this point.
I understand that if I take this complaint to the Financial Ombudsman, 8% simple interest is usually added to a cash refund.
Points to think about
Timing
These complaints can be made if your account is still open, or if it is closed and settled, or if it is with a debt collector (NB the complaint goes to the original lender, not the debt collector.)
You can complain if you already have a CCJ for the debt. Add a sentence to the template saying you want the CCJ removed as part of the settlement of your complaint.
If you have had an IVA or bankruptcy after these problems, or if you are still in a DRO, then ask in the comments below, as this can be complicated.
Old accounts
The Financial Ombudsman (FOS) can only go back to April 2007, when the law changed to allow these complaints.
Many lenders will reject complaints about something that was more than 6 years ago and say the ombudsman won’t look at them. But FOS will often look at old problems if you have only found out in the last three years that you can make the complaint.
If your account was opened in 2015 but the lender increased your limit in 2018 and 2019, then the two limit increases are within the last 6 years and can definitely be looked at.
However, complaints about things that happened more than 6 years ago may be hard for you to produce much evidence for. But if you feel you have a strong older case and you have some evidence, then take it to the Ombudsman and let them decide!
An alternative approach for old accounts
If your account was opened a long while ago and you defaulted and still owe a balance, perhaps in a DMP, think about asking the debt collector to produce the Consumer Credit Act agreement for the account.
If the current creditor can’t produce a proper copy of the agreement, the debt cannot be enforced in court and you can simply stop paying anything to it. This applies to all credit cards, store cards and catalogues.
It may be that the balance on the account is larger than any refund you might get. In which case if the CCA agreement cannot be produced, you would be better off.
Is a refund what you really need?
This depends how large your current financial problems are.
Complaining about newish debt will often only get the interest removed – you still have to repay what you borrowed. Don’t spend months arguing with lenders and going to the ombudsman if you will still be in a mess even if you win.
So phone National Debtline on 0808 808 4000, tell them you are thinking about affordability complaints but you would like to know what your other debt options are.
Poor reasons to complain
You can’t complain just because the interest rate was high or because you have paid them a fortune over the years.
A poor credit score on its own isn’t a reason why you shouldn’t have been given an account. But if your credit score was poor because you were having a lot of problems with your existing debt, the account should have been refused.
You won’t win an affordability complaint if something unexpected went wrong later in your life. If you had been managing a credit card fine for years but then you lost your job or separated from your partner and you defaulted, this isn’t the lender’s fault.
Don’t be put off by a rejection or a poor offer
Lenders often reject good cases
If a lender rejects your complaint or offers a low “goodwill” gesture, don’t be fobbed off – they want you to give up.
In particular, if the lender says you had made all the payments to them on time so they had no reason to think you had problems, you can ignore this. Or if the lender dismisses your complaint as the account was opened over 6 years ago.
When you have a Final Response from the lender – or after 8 weeks if you haven’t had a Final Response – send your complaint to the Financial Ombudsman Service (FOS). Don’t delay doing this!
Is a “partial uphold” good enough?
If the lender says they should not have increased your credit limit in June 2018 when your limit was increased and they will give you a refund of interest for balances over the previous limit, that may sound good. It is sometimes called a partial uphold or a partial refund or proportionate interest.
But often the amount of money refunded in this situation is a lot less than you might expect. So tell the lender you want to consider their offer but need to know how large the refund will be.
Often you were already in a difficult financial situation at that point, with cards close to maxed out, being used for everyday essentials and only paying the minimums. At that point the lender should have stepped in and offered to help you by freezing all interest. That is why a partial refund is often not good enough, you should have all the interest refunded from that point.
How to send a case to FOS
Send FOS a complaint using their online form. You can use bits of what you put in your complaint to the lender. If the lender has rejected your complaint or given a poor offer, say why you think this wrong.
The FOS form at the end asks you to add supporting documents. Don’t worry if you don’t have A copy of your credit or finance agreement – lots of people don’t and the lender will supply a copy to FOS if FOS asks for it. Don’t delay sending a complaint to FOS while you try to get this from the lender.
If your credit record shows that you had other debt problems, send FOS a copy of it. If you have kept some, send the oldest one you have, otherwise send the current one. Also get your bank statements if they will support your complaint and send those to FOS too.
FOS is a friendly service but not fast. Just use normal English, not legal terms. Using a claims company or a solicitor doesn’t help or speed this up.
Ask questions below!
There are hundreds of comments from readers who are using this template. It’s a good place to see how these complaints often go and to ask any questions.
FAQs about Affordability claims
Can you get an overdraft refund?
Could a Debt Relief order help you?
Thomas says
Hi Sara,
I have been making various affordability complaints over the last 6 months and although getting rejected by most lenders, I have won various with the Ombudsman.
I made one to Capital One in March and never heard anything back other than an auto acknowledgment email.
I stupidly forgot about it and chased in October and again other than auto acknowledgment email nothing.
I then finally managed to get hold of someone yesterday after trying various different numbers and the lady said they have responded on 11.05.23 by email but I never received this. She said they also sent it in October when I emailed chasing but they didn’t.
I asked for a copy of this letter again and it came straight through to my inbox.
This is now past the 6 months and it makes me think if it was a tactic from them but anyway, I was just wondering if there is any point sending to to the FOS or they will just throw it out? I know 100% I had never got this FRL until yesterday.
Thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I am very sorry to hear this. It is a pity you didn’t either follow it up much earlier or send the complaint to the Ombudsman. You can send it now to FOS but I doubt they will accept it.
Rob says
Hi Sara
I am wondering if you can help. I have a claim with Santander that is being upheld, but they are not refunding the interest on any quasi cash transactions. While I am currently happy with the offer which is £8100 plus £1500 in interest. There is an outstanding amount of Circa £2000 excluding interest due to these transactions. This complaint is already with the Ombudsman who is looking into it. My argument is that if Santander never gave me the credit which they have agreed they shouldn’t have, then I wouldn’t have made these Quasi cash transactions. Am I correct in my thinking?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
yes, I think so
Steve says
Hi Sara I’m after some advice. I’m looking into an irresponsible lending claim against Tesco. Back in 2016 I took out a unsecure loan over 10 years. The loan was for £30k with an APR of 8.9%. At the time I had an annual salary of £29k. I also had a mortgage with all that goes with it. I also had additional debts.
Needless to say I defaulted on the £30k loan. Is there any legal wording or advice you can give to help support a case?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Use the template over here: https://debtcamel.co.uk/refunds-large-high-cost-loans/
Expect Tesco to reject this because it was over 6 years ago so this will have to go to the Ombudsman. The Ombudsman makes erratic decisions on when it can go back more than 6 years, let us know if you get asked questions about this.
It will also help a lot of you can get your bank statements from 2015.
Steve says
Thanks Sara
Natasha says
Hi I finally have had a decision on my Barclaycard complaint. FOS have ruled in my favour that no credit limit should have taken place in April 2011! Which was from £960 to £2880. (There we’re other increases later) They have said Barclaycard should Rework the account removing all interest, fees, charges and insurances (not already refunded) that have been applied to balances above £960 after 11 April 2011. If the rework results in a credit balance, this should be refunded.
The one thing I am unsure of is how they work this out when the £960 would have been paid off or if they don’t. Looking at the information I have my interest charges if I ignore the proportion of interest that would have been for the £960 then the rest of the interest would have cleared the £960 by October 2013. So do i get all interest and fees after that or is it all measured as a proportion and then the £960 is paid off? I am a little curious whether barclaycard will try to dispute this by claiming they don’t have the records prior to 2014.
So very very relieved to have this off my back either way the money will clear the remaining balance on the card. Thank you so much for your website and the help and advice you give. You are truly life changing.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
if I ignore the proportion of interest that would have been for the £960 then the rest of the interest would have cleared the £960 by October 2013.
I think that would be right if you hadnt used the card at all. But as you presumably have, you have to allow for interest being charged at any point afterwards where you want back into a balance owing.
Let us know what number Barclays come up with!
Natasha says
Well I think this may well continue to drag on. The investigator says she issued her findings to barclaycard three weeks ago. However when I phoned them up today they said they could tell me nothing as it was still with the fos and I would need to go through them to get an update. In her email the investigator said barclaycard had accepted it but maybe they have changed their mind and appealed?
From the time of my complaint to now it has been going on for 15 months already. I can’t actually afford to make the next minimum payment on the card so I’m sure that will add to the fun. They closed the account roughly three years ago but I am still making payments each month so I definitely paid the 960 off around a year ago. But the calculation is definitely going to be complicated my best guess is that the offer should be around 8 thousand if it ever appears.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
if you cant pay, then stopping paying is best – don’t borrow more elsewhere or get behind with bills to pay this.
tell your adjudicator what has happened.
Thomas says
Hi,
I have recently had two complaints upheld by the ombudsman for 118 & Vanquis and they have both agreed with the ombudsman.
Firstly, how long can I expect to wait to hear from these companies?
And secondly should I continue to pay my monthly direct debits to them while I’m waiting?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
They should settle the complaint within 28 days.
Do you expect this will clear the remaining balance?
Thomas says
Vanqiuis left a balance of £400 but they have written to me today to say they are writing that off and closing the account in 5-7 working days.
118 I may have a small balance on the credit card remaining but I’m waiting a decision on the 3 loans I have had with them over the years as well.
If I won the complaint for the credit card with 118 and I have taken two loans out with 118 since opening the cc, then do you think there is a good chance the loans will be won as well?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I would hope so.
Debtfreejourney says
HI, I’m wondering if anyone can help with some guidance. I have an affordability complaint going through with Barclaycard. In short, after a couple of years of badly managing my account because I was so stretched in making the payments I cleared the card with some proceeds of sale after my divorce. Within 12 months they increased by credit limit from £4,000 to £12,000 and then again 12 months later to £16,000. At this time I was a single parent and started to use the credit available to me. I have ever since been maxed out on this card save for times where I have paid it off with a debt consolidation loan and then maxed it out again. I feel like the availability of this credit has been the route of my problems.
Barclaycard denied any fault so I have referred to the ombudsman and they have asked for the following:
What prompted you to raise your concerns about irresponsible lending when you did?
What stopped you from raising these concerns sooner?
Who did you think was to blame when you first realised you were having difficulty making repayments to the credit card?
At what point did you realise the lender had done something wrong?
Were there any exceptional circumstances that prevented you from bringing the complaint earlier? If so, what were they and how did it prevent you from complaining?
Is there anything I need to particularly emphasise here? I don’t want to play it down and miss the point.
Thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Here are some notes based on what you have written. Change them so they are really right for you.
What prompted you to raise your concerns about irresponsible lending when you did?
Just say how and when you found put about affordability complaints (social media? friend told you? saw an article about them? whatever, there are no wrong answers). And that made you realise that Barclaycard had been at fault by giving you a limit that was unmanageably high so you complained.
What stopped you from raising these concerns sooner?
Before this, I just thought it was my fault that my balance got too big as I had used the card too much. It never occurred to me to complain about what Barclaycard had done as I thought my difficulties were of my own making.
Who did you think was to blame when you first realised you were having difficulty making repayments to the credit card?
I knew I was in difficulty in [year] and I thought it was because I had been managing my account badly. Then I cleared it with money I got from my divorce. When Barclaycard increased my limit a lot, I again spent too much and maxed out the card. I reduced it with a debt consolidation loan [loans?] but the cost of the loan meant I again used the Barclaycard again. I thought I wasn’t managing things well and needed to do better.
At what point did you realise the lender had done something wrong?
This year when I found out that Barclaycard should have made checks that a credit limit would be manageable for me. Barclaycard had increased my credit limit to 12,000 then to 16,000 when I was a single parent – they can’t have made checks that that was affordable for me. Now I feel like this high amount of credit was the root of all my problems, but that wasn’t what it felt like at the time.
Were there any exceptional circumstances that prevented you from bringing the complaint earlier? If so, what were they and how did it prevent you from complaining?
This is things like very serious illness or being in prison. Most people say No.
Debtfreejourney says
Thank you.
I have responded. I have had responses to my complaints for Barclaycard, MBNA, Very, M&S CC, Sainsburys CC, Virgin CC and Betterborrow. I am getting these to the ombudsman slowly. Barclaycard complaint was lodged with the Ombudsman in October but the others just last Friday and today with M&S and Sinsburys to follow over the next day or so.
I am waiting to hear from Lendable and Novuna. Lendable have said that they need more information and have asked for copy bank statements 3 months prior to the loan and 3 months after which I have provided.
I am feeling confident about some of my claims because detailing the credit I had at the time v my income means the repayments would be unaffordable and out of reach especially where there may have been a change in circumstances which hand’t been factored in with any stress testing which may have been applied when the borrowing was applied for.
Shauna says
Hope you can help I put in a claim for unaffordable lending from jd Williams. I had 2 accounts with them. They replied today and I would like help on what to do?
Marisota – 10/08/19 when increasing the credit limit from £1000 to £1500
– Simply Be – 27/09/19 when increasing the credit limit from £1000 to £1250
Im happy to refund the interest and administration charges from the above dates on balances utilising this limit. £166.55
Total 8% interest for credit balances £0.00
Total Tax on 8% interest (20%) -£0.00
Total £166.55
Total refund for any unfair interest charged plus any unfair late payment charges (if applicable) applied to balances over £1000
Total refund for unfair interest and charges £143.63
Total 8% interest for credit balances £0.00
Total Tax on 8% interest (20%) £0.00
Total £143.63
Outcome of your complaint:
In view of this investigation, I am upholding the complaint
Sara (Debt Camel) says
So the refunds amounts are so low because they are only giving you a “partial refund” of the onterest charged on the portion of your balance that was over £1000, not all the interest.
when were the accounts opened – which was first and which was second?
when the second account was opened, were you onlt making minimum payments on the first?
Dis they give you £1000 limits at the start on both?
Shauna says
Hi they were opened within a month of eachother . Marisota 12/06/18 and then simply be 08/07/18. They started with a £125 and £150 starting limit
Sara (Debt Camel) says
So they made earlier credit limit increases = were these when you were only making minimum payments? If so I think you should send this case to the Ombudmsn now – the article above says how to do this. Tell the Ombudsman that they should not have given you the earlier increases.
Shauna says
Yes they kept giving increases on minimum payments. Thank you I think I will send it on. I had another one and sent it to the Ombudsman but that came back that the case worker agreed with shop direct and that the increases were okay and not considered unaffordable so a bit apprehensive about sending a second complaint.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
did you agree with that decision? If not you have asked for it to go to be looked at by an Ombudsman.
Shauna says
Hi Sara
No I didn’t agree I asked for it to be looked at again and tried to find some evidence to back it up
Shauna says
Hi Sarah just a bit of an update. After sending credit reports and bank statements the case worker looked at my complaint again and agreed it was unaffordable so definitely worth going back to them
Nats says
Hiya, can anyone that’s had a complaint with capital one help please? Do they acknowledge complaints? I complained about a week or so ago now and they haven’t replied to say they’ve received it or time frames or anything. Thanks in advance
Nats says
Hello, an adjudicator has requested bank statements to help investigate my complaint which I have provided. Does anyone know how bonus payments from work and payments from family (to help with the purchase of a house) will be viewed. Occasionally these type payments will have made my ingoing vs outgoings look a lot healthier but they were sporadic/unanticipated and for a house as I’ve mentioned so were not something I could incorporate into my usual spending ie bills. I hope this makes sense. Any insight would be useful. Thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
So did you have savings for a house deposit at this time?
Nats says
yes I had savings in lifetime help to buy ISA.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
In that case the credit wasn’t really unaffordable was it? You were choosing to prioritise saving over clearing the balance.
Nats says
I’m not sure really. I didn’t have the savings when I took out the card or when the majority of increases were applied. I was then fortunate enough to receive work bonus and family inheritance further down the line and yes I could have prioritized the debt at that point but I wouldn’t have incurred the debt in the first place had they not lent irresponsibly is my argument. I guess we’ll find out.
Natasha says
Hi just curious if anyone has any idea if being successful with the ombudsman for one claim is likely to impact your other complaints with them? I had a decision that increasing the limit on a card to me was irresponsible. I have a complaint about two other cards that were opened less than six months later (my situation had not improved I actually opened a third card around the same time but I missed the six year cut off to complain), these complaints are still waiting for a case handler to be assigned. So I’m just wondering if opening the cards will mean it is treated differently from a credit increase or if the decision will likely be the same? One card was a balance transfer so I’m guessing that one I might lose anyway.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
it depends on the details of each case. Having one the earlier case, you know that your position was very difficult, so that is what you need to argue for the subsequent case. Having won the case isn’t directly relevant.
Re the balance transfer, you should argue that it should have been clear you would be unable to clear the balance in the 0% term and that the increased minimum payments when it ended would be unaffordable – so you should not have been given the transfer offer.
Thom says
Hi Sara,
I am currently under a DAS – Debt Payment Programme (Scotland). I have been since last year after going to StepChange with increasing amounts of debt I was drowning in. Although I had alway ensured the minimum payments were made on all debts I could not afford the increasing interest which meant I would never pay it off. Most of the debt I have is credit cards with Virgin, MBNA, Barclaycard and an overdraft with Halifax which combined totals around £35k.
I believe that I was lent money that I could not afford by all of these companies. They had all offered me a second credit card on top of debt I was paying the minimum repayment on. My bank had also increased my overdraft facility on multiple occasions despite the fact I also often had to resort to pay day loans.
I have just used your information and template to create complaints of irresponsible lending to all of these companies.
Before I go ahead and send them off I have a question regarding my DAS. Would this be impacted at all? I am currently paying back an amount I can afford and was a huge relief when it was accepted. I don’t want to do anything that will jeopardise that.
Thanks for all your help!
Best wishes, Thom
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I am not a Scottish debt adviser.
So far as I know, making an affordability complaint and getting a refund in a DA would be fine, exactly the same as getting a PPI refund, see https://www.scotlanddebt.co.uk/articles/das/can-i-keep-ppi-compensation-if-im-in-a-debt-arrangement-scheme. If you want. you can check this with StepChange.
Caitlin says
Hoping you have had advice on this already.. as a Scottish Money Adviser yes you can still pursue these complaints even though in a DAS. Disappointing that Stepchange don’t help much with these types of things (affordability complaints as options at the start..). Having to enter the DAS should support your complaints that these accounts were unaffordable.
If any complaints are successful then the creditor should apply a variation to your DAS to fix the balance i.e. reduce the balance if interest etc is refunded,or they will apply to remove the debt as it is no longer owing. If they do not do this, StepChange should.They will have to supply proof to the DAS team that the account is cleared.This would then reduce the length that your DAS is to run for, payments would remain the same as based on your current affordability.
Usually money refunded would go to the account you owe to reduce the balance, and anything over and above this to yourself. You do not have to use any money refunded to you to pay your DAS (but likewise if you wanted to then contact StepChange and make sure any lump sum payments are made directly to them.. they will then distribute funds fairly between all remaining creditors in the DAS). You shouldn’t really do this if you are complaining about all creditors in the DAS as it would complicate matters.
Hope this helps in some way if you didn’t get answers already.
Darren says
Hi Sara
I would like to say thank you I have just heard back from vanquis today, I had to so though the ombudsman but vanquis have upheld all my complaint dating back from April 2013 and just over 12k settlement. Thanks for your help this site helped me so much
Darren says
Hi Sara
I was just asking advice regarding the tax I paid in the letter the 12k I got refunded included £1600 in tax it say in my letter maybe able to reclaim this back is this right I am a basic tax payer
Sara (Debt Camel) says
so the refund would have included some which said something like 8% statutory interest?
and tax deducted from that?
are you a basic rate tax payer?
Darren says
HM Revenue & Customs (HMRC) has also issued guidelines which clarify that any additional redress or compensatory interest is subject to an obligation to withhold income tax at the basic rate. We have therefore deducted income tax at the basic rate from the ‘Notional Interest’ refund shown above i.e £2,006.06. Therefore, the refund of £12,310.39 includes the net amount of £1,604.85.
That was copied from letter yes I am a basic tax payer
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Ok so your gross 8% interest was 2006. And net of tax it was 1604. So the tax deducted was £402.
Read https://debtcamel.co.uk/ppi-payday-refund-get-back-tax/ which explains how to claim back £200 of the tax deducted
Kelly says
I searched online today to look for loans / credit cards.. I have a very poor credit history however I ended up being approved for a credit card for £200. It was available to spend straight away.
I have spent the funds within an hour online gambling and I’ve just checked their regulations and says that they do not allow the card to be used for gambling. I understand completely that this is my doing but shall I do anything? I also told some fibs about working and my income however I am on benefits and unemployed. It seems they took my word rather than actually checking.
Thanks Sara. It’s unlikely that I can get anything back but I want to stop these people because it can also get others in a mess.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
No you are not likely to win a complaint.
I Suggest you forget this and try to get help with your gambling.
Nats says
I’ve just had an adjudicator agree with my complaint. We still need to wait to see if NewDay agree but I’m trying to work out the amount I could expect before they come back as I’ve seen on here they are not always accurate with their calculations. How do I work out the 8% on the interest charged? For reference this is how it was phrased – “if the rework results in a credit balance this should be refunded along with 8% simple interest per year calculated from the date of each over payment to the date of settlement”
Thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
What was the rest of the decision – refund all interest from a certain point? or refund the interest over a credit limit of Xk which was ok?
and how large is the balance at the moment?
Nats says
Hi Sara,
It was Rework the account removing all interest, fees, charges and insurances (not already refunded) that have been applied to balances above £300 after 14 February 2020.
The balance is currently £1200
Thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Ok do you know how much you have paid in interest and fees since that time?
Nats says
From the statements I have it’s £1700 in interest (July 22- to now) but I’m missing 28 months of statements from the February 2020 that the adjudicator has stated the redress should be from…. Not sure how to get these.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
i suggest you wait and see what Newday calculations are. It sounds as though the refund may well clear the balance. But unless you are getting a significant cash refund the 8% added is likely to be small. there is no easy way to calculate it.
Claire says
My complaint to Vanquis for unaffordable lending was rejected and basically it says I’m out of time to complain
This is how they responded
Sept 2016 Initial borrowing £500.00 Not Investigated
Feb 2017 Credit Limit Increase 1 £1,000.00 Out Of Jurisdiction
July 2017 Credit Limit Increase 2 £1,750.00 Out Of Jurisdiction
Dec 2017 Credit Limit Increase 3 £2,250.00 Not Upheld
Will the financial Ombudsman look it to my complaint or is it too late to complain and take it further?
Many thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
So the last limit increase was within the last 6 years when you complained. You can send this to the Ombudsman. It is there choice about whether they can go back further than 6 years if you have only found out in the last 3 years that Vanquis was at fault for not checking the limit increase was affordable for you.
Andrew says
Hi Sara – I made a complaint to Vanquis about unaffordable lending of a credit card and I have raised the matter with the FoS as Vanquis never upheld my complaint. FoS have agreed with Vanquis.
The credit check didn’t show if you had any CCJ’s registered at the time, however it did show you had a default registered 28 months prior to the lending decision. A historic default doesn’t mean it’s a reflection of a consumer’s circumstances at the of an application. Although it showed you’d previously struggled, there was nothing to indicate from the check that you were in immediate financial difficulty and Vanquis shouldn’t have lent to you.
I’ve also thought about the credit limit provided to you. Vanquis gave you a credit limit of £500. The proportion lent was low in proportion to your declared an income of £31,500, there were no signs from your credit file you were likely to struggle with this limit. When I take this into account along with the outstanding debt of £4,808 I don’t think that this indicated the lending was unaffordable. They therefore didn’t act unfairly by providing you with this limit.
Is there anything I can go back to FoS with?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
is there a reason why you think Vanquis should have realised that £500 was too high a limit at the start?
Did they later increase this limit?
Andrew says
Hi Sara – I feel that although £500 is a low limit, the fact that I had multiple forms of credit (multiple other credit cards – each with balances) and 2 overdrafts (each in use), plus a history of defaults, it was irresponsible of Vanquis to provide me with a further line of credit to exacerbate my debt situation.
My limit never increased with Vanquis.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
It’s hard to see what you can argue to FOS
Andrew says
No worries – thanks for you advice thus far.
I have also made a complaint to RBS re overdraft fees following advice from here. Initially the claim was not being investigated because it was out with the 6 year rule and FOS agreed with this. However, you suggested that I ask the bank to review the annual overdraft reviews for the last 6 years – I made a new complaint to do this. RBS have come back to advise they do not carry out annual reviews, so therefore the complaint can’t be upheld. They have noted in my complaint that they contacted me regarding my overdraft as I was consistently within it and set up a management plan (fees were halted during this) however I broke the agreement. I gained a loan from Amigo and paid off all debts with this.
Do you have any suggestions on how I am best to progress this matter with FOS?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
say to FOS that you understand from https://www.financial-ombudsman.org.uk/decision/DRN5869499.pdf that it is good industry practice to review overdraft limits annually.
Andrew says
Brilliant Sara – thank you so much for this support.
Andrew
Anon says
Hi Sara,
You asked me to post back here when my final claim was settled. I wasn’t sure if I owed or was owed some money re tax!
Last year
118 – 8% was £880.79 – They specifically told me no tax was deducted
Very – 8% was £151.46 after tax deducted
Simply Be – 8% was £349.21 after tax deducted
Current year
Newday – I got settlement payments of £906.75, £452.46 & £277.71 – I don’t have a breakdown of the 8% but tax was deducted
Next – Settlement payment of £744.39 – Again I don’t have the breakdown but tax was deducted
Halifax – 8% was £476.05 after tax deducted
I am a basic rate tax payer
Thanks so much
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Last year – your 8% income was just over the 1000 savings allowance. so you should have paid some tax.. But some tax was deducted, so was it enough?
I make your total 8% income in that tax year 880 (from 118) + 188 (grossing up the very after tax number) + 436 (grossing up the Simply Be after tax number = 1505
You should have paid tax on 505 of that – which would have been about 100
But you actually paid tax of 125. So in theory the tax man owes you 25. Up to you if you think it’s worth trying to reclaim that amount!
This year – as all your lenders deducted tax, there will be tax to reclaim. But you can’t work this out until you know what the 8% numbers and tax deducted are… Ask Newday and Next for the numbers. They have to tell you these.
Anon says
Hi Sara,
I have the figures!
Last year
118 – 8% was £880.79 – They specifically told me no tax was deducted
Very – 8% was £151.46 after tax deducted
Simply Be – 8% was £349.21 after tax deducted
Current year
Newday – I got settlement payments of £906.75, £452.46 & £277.71 and they replied with the following..
£906.75 – tax £6.95
£452.46 – tax £12.98
£277.71 – tax £9.77
Next said this..
I wanted to let you know that Next didn’t make a deduction for tax from the interest redress we paid to you. This was because the redress wasn’t used to reduce an outstanding balance, it was paid directly to you.
Just as a reminder, We sent a total amount of £744.39, this was £689.25 to refund debit interest on your NextPay account and an extra 8% on this sum which was £55.14 to award you simple credit interest on £689.25 inline with what the courts would award.
I am a basic rate tax payer
Thanks so much
Sara (Debt Camel) says
For each refund you now need to work out 3 numbers to be able to complete the form.
The amount of 8% interest before tax was taken off (“gross”)
The tax taken off (may be zero)
The amount if 8% interest you were paid after tax (“net”)
That next statement doesn’t help – just ignore it
Elle says
Hi Sara,
I complained to RBS for a Mint Credit card I’d had in 2006. After further checking I’d actually had it since 2003 as RBS Advanta (same card number, different name).
Anyway, they disagreed, but the FOS adjudicator has agreed with me and states that they should refund from the very start of card…from 2003, which is great for me.
However,.. RBS say they have very little data now,..so it’s going to the Ombudsman.
The adjudicator has now asked me for as many of my Mint statements that I can provide (he already has bank statements and some Mint ones) because if the Ombudsman agrees with him,..RBS have no records to calculate any redress.
I have Mint statements from 2003 – mid 2008. RBS Mint unprompted, then opted to change my statements to paperless from mid 2008 – 2009 so all I have are records of my monthly payments to Mint via my bank statements for that time but no info in regards to interest applied.
So my query is about wording please.
How do I request that RBS work with what I’ve provided to calculate a suitable redress figure?
And is that even do-able?
Thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
what do the paper statements from 2003 -08 show? did you only make minimum payments at that time?
And from the statements you do have – of the minimum payments roughly how much was interest?
Elle says
Yes,.. through all of those years, 2003-2008 with Mint statements proving this part,… and I only paid the minimum amounts for the latter years that the Mint statements aren’t available for but the debt was by then a lot higher,..it went from around £2000 – £3500 in that last year or so, I was paying around £75 per month and have bank statements showing this.
Early on in 2004 (debt was £1590 – £1900 and the min payments were around £43 of which £27 was interest, …later on 2008 – 2009 when the debt was between £2000 – £3500 the min payment’s were around £65 – £75 with interest of around £55.
Some debt was purchases, paying other debts but some was money transfers to my bank hence the high interest amounts at times.
I’d always hoped that RBS would have data from 2007 at least so I hadn’t expected to have to find all this info at this late stage.. If the Ombudsman agrees with the adjudicator do RBS have to offer a token gesture payment (however that might be calculated) or do I get nothing refunded at all?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest you say that were there are no statements but you know what the payments were from your bank statements, you suggest that it should be assumed that 2/3 of the payments were interest, which should be refunded. Attach some of the statements as evidence that this is a reasonable suggestion.
Elle says
Thank you Sara, that’s exactly what I needed to know/hear. I will suggest this. :)
You’re a star!
Much obliged ~
Stacy says
Hi Sara,
I just wanted to say thank you for this useful guide.
I wrote to all four of my creditors using your template earlier this year and have had positive results from each one. I’m waiting to get the final calculations from two of them but it seems likely that I’m going to completely clear my DMP once these last refunds are processed, which is more than two years earlier than expected. It’s literally been life changing.
Thank you so much!
Jo says
Hi I just need some advice about irresponsible lending on catalogs is it similar process to credit cards or loans??I had a very account since 2016 I defaulted many times due to low income and they put me in payment plans(this left me short for other bills)then once I paid them off each time they let me make more orders I then stopped making orders and paid of the balance and they then with out warning closed my account(in 2021) this makes me feel they knew there was problem why would they close the account??I could only ever pay minimum payments and on lots of occasions had late fees applied it was all very stressful do I have a case??they also increased my balance but can’t remember when they did that and I can’t view the account anymore
Sara (Debt Camel) says
yes, use the template letter in the article above to complain about this.
Natasha says
Hi Sara just wanted to let you know fantastic news. I’m still waiting for a letter or communication from Barclaycard but on checking my account I have been paid £11,697.21 (standard int cs) and £4,064.12 (simple int cs) with £812.82 tax deducted. so £15,761.33 before the tax and £14,948.51 after tax! I think they must have used a much earlier date for me paying off the £960 limit as my calculations came in at around 10k. I am astonished, this will pay off the remaining balance and puts me less than £2,000 shy of being debt free. I had been going to use the money for things I need in the house (like a carpet) and then use the rest to try and negotiate a deal with my creditors.
I honestly thought I was going to have to go bankrupt now I can get most of this off my back and then save up. I can now afford Christmas dinner!
I still have two more complaints awaiting a fos decision so maybe there’s a bit of hope the rest will get paid off that way as well. With this and the refund I got from my two overdrafts you helped me complain about I have now had nearly £20,000 in total refunds. Words cannot express how grateful I am to you and your website, I truly hope that the holiday season and new year brings blessings for you and your family.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Wow. Very good news for you. I hope you have a lovely Christmas 🎄 🦃 🍷 and get those essentials for the house.
Don’t try to negotiate a deal where there is still a FOS complaint in progress.
But after that, making settlement offers sounds like.a very good idea.
Natasha says
I am feeling a little like the rug has been pulled out from under me. I have just had a letter from Barclaycard saying I owe them £3251.30.
The letter says that I accepted their “full and final offer of £8097.17 interest, £348 charges, 8% simple interest £4064.12 less tax @20% 812.82. Total refund £11,697.21. Whilst the settlement was being processed an automated credit balance refund was made however now we have completed the settlement your barclaycard has an out Balance of £3251.30. We have suspended the interest until 28th December to allow you time to clear the balance.”
I didnt accept an offer, the judgement of the fos was that they had to pay all interest from 2011 for balances above £960. They paid into my Barclaycard £11,697.21 and £4064.12 and then deducted £812.82. There was outstanding balance of -£2376 so I was left with a balance of £12,572.18 which I requested to be transferred. When the transfer went through they deducted £3251.30 leaving me with that now outstanding. I can see this is the interest amount (minus tax) I don’t see how they can claim that I owe them this. An automated credit balance refund would have been 2376. Should I go back to the adjudicator with this and ask for her to clarify with Barclays what has gone on? Do I have to go back to Barclays and get the breakdown of how they worked this out? Doesnt £4,000 interest on £8,000 seem wrong? I never had a letter from Barclays with the breakdown they just sent the money.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Tell your adjudicator at FOS what has happened.
I think you should ask Barclaycard to explain the numbers. They should give you a clear statement, including saying what the 8% added interest is and how much tax was deducted.
£4000 8% statutory interest seems perfectly possible over 12 years.
Fraser says
THE QUESTION(S) IS:
1) Would your view be the same? Or differ?
2) Are there any anomalies to be considered regarding irresponsible lending, i.e. how lenders sent (unqualified) Balance Transfer Cheques without any apparent checks?
Based On:
A 10K Mint C/C Debt considered Statute Barred due to – last payment 2014, no issue of legal proceedings, no communication by me since early 2016 – I do get monthly statements.
– The card was opened in 1997 as RBS Advanta.
– In Dec 03 – a credit limit of £10K – a balance of £0 – The Card re-branded to Mint, celebrating this lifetime 5.9% APR on balance transfers was offered and immediately I moved £10k from other credit card debts.
– Until 07, majoritively minimum-only payments made, plus missed payments & over-credit limit charges incurred – further Mint Balance Transfer Cheques or Transfer & Save Letters received & used.
NOTE: from 99 – 07 in a financial mess, robbing Peter to pay Paul. (07) got a Debt Management Company (DMC) involved to help via full final (F&F) of £40k+ credit card debt.
– Mid 07 Mint Card defaulted (11k) – (only one to refuse F&F citing policy)
– Apr 18 Card re-branded as RBS.
– Card transactions from Jan 2004 to 2007 show 17k worth of balance transfers, 1.5k purchases, and 2.5k charges and interest incurred.
My thinking is to do nothing as a successful claim would only realise 2.5k of charges/interest incurred plus any 8% statuary interest against the 10K debt
Sara (Debt Camel) says
A successful claim would only reduce what you owed.
I assume this debt hasn’t shown on your credit record for many years?
If you talk to National Debtline on 0808 808 4000 about whether this debts is statute barred, they have a template you could send RBS saying this.
Fraser says
Thanks for getting back to me.
Yes, your assumption is right, debt hasn’t shown for years.
It’s on a 2012 credit report but isn’t from 2014 onwards.
I’ll speak with National Debtline as you suggest.
Thanks Again
thomas says
Hi,
Does anyone know the timescales for 118 when they owe you a refund?
The refund they have agreed to with the ombudsman will make me debt free and it would be great to have it done by xmas but I haven’t heard from them as of yet..
Any information would be great..
Sara (Debt Camel) says
When was it agreed? How much will you be getting back? Is this from a loan or credit card?
thomas says
It was agreed a couple of weeks ago, just wasn’t sure if they was proactive with this.
It was for both but the credit card refund wiped away my balance then the loan refund from my understanding is around £2,300 owed to me.
thanks
Jason says
Hi Sara,
I made an affordability complaint with Barclaycard card credit card which they have not upheld. They spoke to me over the phone and told me their decision but the terminology they used confused me and when I explained my circumstances at the time they didn’t really have answers for it. The sole reason they could give me was that my history of repayments with them was ‘fantastic’. Despite just making min payments each month. I offered them bank statements to show that I was almost in the red every single month but they didn’t want to know. The details of card are:
Jan 2017 – £1,000 limit.
June 2017 – £2,000 limit increase
Oct 2017 – £4,000 limit increase
Feb 2018 – £7,000 limit increase
My income was between £900 and £1,100 depending on overtime and I already had other loans, payday loans and in the £7,000 increase, had two other credit cards to add to that. I had a big gambling problem and was relying on gambling wins to help pay, which wasn’t every month so was in the red alot of the time.
They told me that because over 6 years ago they could not look into any of it until the £4k-£7k increase. But even they said it was affordable purely because my history of payments was fine? I explained to them I recently made a complaint with Virgin which was made recently for only £2,700 which was upheld by FOS, but this didn’t faze them.
Have they got a point or does this seem a bit mad?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Mad.
Send it to the Ombudsman. FOS will make a decision about whether it can look at the older limit increases, but the last one is clearly in time.
Jason says
Yes I will do as soon as they send through the final response letter which I can then pass on.
I just found the whole thing quite surreal as they asked if I had anything to add so I then went into detail after detail about my finances etc at the time, that I had about £100 left after all outgoings and then I would gamble to try and make more. Also how it’s affected me and how they actually seeked me out to take this credit card – they had been sending me ‘pre-approved’ forms through the post every other month for over a year previously until I gave in and thought I’ll have easy access to money. I had never held a credit card previously, just loans and payday loans and this I think set off the snowball of applying for further cards.
They also asked me why I thought I’d be entitled to interest refunded plus 8% simple…. I thought this was very strange so I just replied with ‘That’s what I was told I would be entitled to if upheld’. There then was a bit of a grunt and that was it.
All very strange but thanks and I’ll take this straight to FOS
Rachel says
I made a complaint to NewDay back in July 2023. This was regarding having my Aqua Limit increased 3 times in 2022. I had gone from a 2 income household to a 1 income household after my marriage breakdown and was responsible for 2 children completely on my own. Each limit increase was done without credit checks or affordability checks being done.
NewDay communications were ok to start with and then nothing. However this week I noticed on the account that I had been refunded £2,205 as the complaint was upheld and the account has now been closed.
I used the refund template from this website and adjusted it to reflect my case, it made the process a lot easier!
Safe to say I’m happy with this and thought I would share the outcome with people who were looking at doing the same or are already going through the process!
Helen says
I’ve just had the exact same thing happen to me with Aqua.
I put in my complaint in Aug, using Sara’s template…and like you, had a few responses from them . Then nothing at all!
But, just this week I noticed loads of credits/adjustments to my account which came to about £2000, and a message to say the account was now closed.
Still no letter explaining what they have done, but it’s definitely a win!
Mr Jones says
Hi Sara,
it wouldn’t let me reply to the previous comment so started this one.
Do you have bank statements going back to 2015? I do not contacted the Bank and they can’t help me with them either.
There were two MBNA cards? There are 3 MBNA cards
Card 1 was opened September 2015 (£2,000)
Card 2 was opened February 2016 (£4,000)
Card 3 was opened June 2016 (initially £2,600 but rose to in December 2016 to £3,900)
I was making minimum payments on all cards and even at one point had a persistent debt letter for one of the cards. Having this amount of cards has lead to my problems because I continually balance transferred with the aim of getting them paid off but unfortunately had to spend more and more on the cards and created the hole I am now in aswell as the overdraft ( which I have also now complained about)
Thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Without evidence about what your situation was like when you were given the cards, these cases can be hard to win.
However you can argue that without the evidence, FOS should take a decision “on the balance of probabilities” – and the fact that you had only made minimum payments to the first card when they gave your the second, to the first two cards when they gave you the third, and to all three cards when they increased the limit on the third card suggests that the debts were not sustainable for you and the later cards should not have been given.
Mr Jones says
Hi Sara,
The saga still rumbles on with the Ombudsman they are unwilling to uphold the complaint and keep arguing there is nothing to show at the time of lending these cards were unaffordable because I hadn’t missed payments etc and they haven’t taken into account the time the credit limit was increased instead only focusing on the times the cards were given. I haven’t argued the ” balance of probabilities” because I’m unsure how to do that? Is an affordability complaint only looked at from what the situation was like when the cards were given? I really do believe the cards and amount of lending given to me at the time have led to the situation I am in now because I had access to so much credit.
Thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
what were the dates the limits were increased?
Mr Jones says
The credit increase was December 2016 from £2600 to £3900.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
“Is an affordability complaint only looked at from what the situation was like when the cards were given?”
Yes for the opening limit. If the limit was later increased then affordability should be reassessed at that time
But you don’t have bank statements for the time the credit limit was increased.
Arguing your bank statements from 2018 (or whenever) show you were in difficulty does not prove that you were in difficulty earlier when the accounts were opened.
All I can say is what I said before:
“Without evidence about what your situation was like when you were given the cards, these cases can be hard to win.
However you can argue that without the evidence, FOS should take a decision “on the balance of probabilities” – and the fact that you had only made minimum payments to the first card when they gave your the second, to the first two cards when they gave you the third, and to all three cards when they increased the limit on the third card suggests that the debts were not sustainable for you and the later cards should not have been given.”
Just go back to FOS and argue that. I can’t see what else you can do.
Nats says
Hi Sara,
NewDay have agreed with the adjudicator for my complaint. I have a balance on the card of £1200. And they have said the following:
‘The proportion of interest charged on balances over £300.00 after the first limit increase on 14 February 2020: £3737.97.
Cash fees: £6.00
Total: £3743.97
The refund leaves a credit balance of £2,513.15 (an overpayment). Therefore, we will pay 8% simple interest for loss of cash on this amount.
Plus, Gross simple interest: £41.49.
Minus Tax: £8.30
= A net payment: £33.19
Does that simple interest sound right to you? I can’t get my head around if it’s correct.
Thanks in advance
Sara (Debt Camel) says
its really hard to say if the simple interest is right. Has yout balance on the card been a lot higher than the current 1200, if so, when was that?
Nats says
Yes it was a lot higher before I did a balance transfer earlier in the year. It was around £4500 in January.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
so the 8% interest only starts from the point where you account would have been in credit if the interest being refunded hadn’t been charged. It sounds as though that wouldnt have been until several months at least into this year. Then your credit balance builds up every month to the 2531 now.
The 8% looks low to me. I would have expected several hundred pounds. You could ask newDay to explain how they have calculated it. And tell your adjudicator that it doesn’t look right
Nats says
Thanks Sara. I’ll do that. Thanks for all of your help.
Catherine says
I have had my complaint against NewDay upheld by the Ombudsman.
They are to pay me £700 directly back to myself and have my bank details from the Ombudsman. How long does it normally take to receive the money back?
Stacy says
I had a Newday refund recently. I had to ring them up with my bank details and they told me it would take up to 10 working days. But I actually got it through in about 3 working days 😊
Catherine says
Thank you! I just called them and they said hopefully 7-10 days. Did they let you know it was being refunded or did they just do it and you saw in your bank?
Stacy says
They said to me that it’s up to 10 working days at maximum but that it’s normally a lot quicker. Still, 10 days isn’t bad either.
I’d had my final response letter saying what they owed me and to call up with my bank details. After that, they didn’t confirm to me once it was done, I just saw it in my bank account 😊
I hope you’re not waiting too long anyway!
JJ says
Good Morning !
I had 2 credit cards with MBNA with outstanding balances of £ 11,500.00 altogether. One account was opened August 2008 the other September 2009. The debts were sold to PRA, I asked PRA to supply me with a signed CCA, they cannot and have written and admitted the debt is unenforceable. They have sent me an offer to settle at 20 per cent so £ 1150 per card, I am yet to counter offer.
Alongside this I wrote to MBNA with an affordability complaints for both cards; both were declined and I have since referred these both to the Financial Ombudsman on 09 December, 2023.
My reason for writing is if I agree a settlement with MBNA and the accounts are then closed, what will happen if the Financial Ombudsman upholds my claim(s), will any monies come to me, and what happens if I am awarded amounts which are considerably more than I have settled with PRA for, Thank you in anticipation.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
How long ago did these cards default?
Did MBNA increase your credit limits?
Do you have, or can you get, your bank statements going back to when the accounts were opened and when the limits increased?
Lea says
Hi Sara
I had a quick query regarding Vanquis . I opened an account with them on Feb 2020 so beginning of Covid £500 limit, I was then put on furlough march 2020-dec 2020 so earning less. I was maxed out at my £500 limit from April 2020 -Feb 2021 when I got some inheritance which I used to pay of some debt not all as not enough. Then Vanquis upped my limit from £500 to £1500 as soon as I paid that £500 back I’d been stuck in for the previous year. Since then so March 2021 I have been maxed out at £1500 or over my limit due to missed payments as unaffordable to me with my other debts (overdraft, few other credit cards maxed out – swapping jobs few times post Covid) Also march 2021-sept 2021 I was having some mental health issues. They have just passed my debt to Lowell. Would I have a case for any refund of interest at or not? Thanks Lea
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Possibly. It depends whether Vanquis should have seen the 1500 would be unaffordable. I think this is worth a try. If you are in your overdraft all or almost all of the month and this had been going on for well over a year, yo7 may also have a complaint about that.
But with a lot of problem debt that you have defaulted on, I think you should also look at a debt management plan with StepChange, see https://www.stepchange.org/how-we-help/debt-management-plan.aspx.
A DMP lets you make one affordable payment to your debts and interest is stopped. A DMP is also completely flexible, so you can reduce or increase you4 payments and winning any affordability complaints against Vanquis or other lenders will really speed a DMP up. StepChange are open today, they are nice to talk to and not at all pushy, so find out what you would pay in a DMP.
A says
Hi Sara
I have been in a spiral of debt for the last 2 years nearly.
Although I am keeping up the payments the financial stress and burden has become alot on me and at the moment I have a barclaycard with money owed and also 2 Newday credit cards with money owed on them aswell
I also have 3 loans in my name with the following companies:
RATESETTER
ADMIRAL LOANS
UPDRAFT
Furthermore with the credit cards I made purchases of crypto aswell when they shluld not have been allowed it still went through and I have lost all that aswell but have not missed payments I have also stated this to the card providers aswell within your template do you think they will reject my case?
And also what can I do regarding the 3 unsecured loans these are all still very new basically within the last year. My income is 55k is year but I have had to do Overtime to be able to pay off the required payments and abit more however I do not have anymore overtime and my standard monthly will not suffice.
Any help is appreciated..
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Some credit cards block crypto transactions but they don’t have to.
Card lenders reject many good complaints so don’t surprised if they do – send the complaint to the Ombudsman if they gave you too Large a limit or increased a limit too high to be manageable.
You can also make complaints about loans, see https://debtcamel.co.uk/refunds-large-high-cost-loans/ for a template to use for loans.
But these complaints are not fast and if you are already struggling you cannot assume they will sort your difficulty with in month or two.
So I suggest you talk to StepChange about a Debt Management Plan, see https://www.stepchange.org/how-we-help/debt-management-plan.aspx. A DMP lets you make one affordable payment to your debts and new interest is stopped. A DMP is also completely flexible, so you can reduce or increase you4 payments and winning any affordability complaints will really speed a DMP up. StepChange are open today, they are nice to talk to and not at all pushy, so find out what yo7 would pay in a DMP.
A says
Quick update I have managed to secure a substantial amount to clear 1 of the loans which was £11000 and a few other things such as BNPLs via family and friends but still have to pay them back. Regarding a DMP i will be doing this first thing tomorrow.
Will a DMP effect my credit score in a bad way? That is the last thing I want, would you recommend sticking to the payments on the 2 loans and 3 credit cards so that my credit score will not be effected?
I have emailed the credit card companies with your template will be doing the same for the loans as well.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
How fast do the family and friends loans have to be repaid?
Yes a DMP harms your credit score. Paying interest in cards to protect your credit score here is usually a very bad decision. A DMP for everything and not owing friends and family would have been a much better option.
M says
Hi Sara, please can you advise.
I had Newday Card, balance £4430, defaulted in Sept 2022.
I complained to Newday re affordability in Jan 2023, they partially upheld and refunded £1458, balance reduced to £2972.
I wasn’t happy with Newday’s response as they didn’t address all aspects of my complaint so sent it to FOS. FOS agreed with me and Newday went back to account opening and awarded £140 compensation paid to me and reduced the balance by a further £1081 so that left a balance of £1891.
I sent in medical evidence from my GP to ask Newday to consider writing off the balance in view that I was unable to work for health reasons and the chances of me clearing the balance were slim to zero in a reasonable time. Newday agreed they would not pursue me to contribute anything further to the balance, however, they refuse to wipe the balance and all 3 of my Credit Reports show a balance outstanding of £1891.
Should I be concerned a balance is still showing, considering the default will drop off my file in Sept 2028 anyway?
Thank you, M
Sara (Debt Camel) says
As you say, the debts will eventually drop off your credit record. Whether this bothers you depends on whether you want to borrow any more…
Whether FOS would say newday out to write off the debts will depend on the medical evidence – it has to be pretty strong for FOS to over-rule a lender in this sort of situation.
M says
Thank you Sara
I have no intention of borrowing anything at all for the foreseeable future, I’m glad tbh that my credit report is littered with defaults (all others are zero balances), it stops me borrowing and has taught me how to be responsible and budget properly.
I am emerging the other end of a debt crisis situation that nearly made me bankrupt it was so bad… 69k to be exact. Yes 69k. I’m in a good financial place now and will be debt free in 2024, made possible in the large part to your advice and everyone else who has posted on Debt Camel. Thank you. It’s taken me 2 years to get where I am now and I am enjoying the peace that returns to your life when you kick the debt anxiety out.
If the Newday default balance proves to be a hindrance in the future, then I shouldn’t really be thinking about borrowing anything unless I was in a position to clear it first is a good way of thinking about it.
Once again, thank you. Sara, you are a shining light to me and so many others.
Paul says
Hi Sara, I’m very appreciative of the advice you have provided on this website. I currently have a complaint into a credit card being investigated by the FOS. Their investigators initial findings are that the company involved were fine to issue me with the card but should not have raised the limit at a later date. I’m just looking for some advice on this, the information I provided at the time to the company RE my income was inflated (I earned £1.5k per month but stated I was earning £2k), I obviously did this to try and ensure I would receive the card at the time as I had gambling problems. But is there any way for me to justify this and show this was unaffordable? As in their decision the investigator is using this inflated figure I put on my initial application, which would have meant I had £500 disposable income that I didn’t actually have at the time. Or do I just have to accept the company made the decision based on the income I told them? I had 5 loans and 2 other credit cards at the time.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
how long ago was the card issued? what was the initial limit?
I had 5 loans and 2 other credit cards at the time. how many of them had been taken out recently? did you also have an overdraft?
Paul says
The intial limit was £600 in January 2018, and they raised the limit to £800 six months after the account was open.
The investigator came to this decision: “Rework the account removing all interest, fees, charges and insurances (not already refunded) that have been applied to balances above £600.00. If the rework results in a credit balance, this should be refunded to Mr ## along with 8% simple interest per year* calculated from the date of each overpayment to the date of settlement.”
For context the 5 loans and 2 other credit cards were recent and being repaid at the time and were upto a value of £20k or around £750 per month. I believe the card was unaffordable from the outset but don’t know whether I have and comeback on this if the amount I stated for my income was wrong or was the gross amount I was paid rather than the net.
I should add I also had an overdraft of £2k which was maxed out each month.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
So at the point the limit was increased, had you only made minimum payments to the balance? And had your other debts increased?
Paul says
Yes, I had only made the minimum payments prior to the increase. And yes my debts did increase, as I raised the limit of one of my other credit cards during this time also.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest you go back and argue that:
First you do not beleive the original credit limit of £500 was affordable. The card lender should have seen the recent credit you had taken out and taken steps to verify your income and expenses, because of that, which would have shown that £500 was too high to be manageable.
Second, even if it is decided that an initial limit of £500 was reasonable, by the time they increased this to £600, they should have seen (a) that you were only making mininum payments (b) that you had taken out even more credit lsewhere and (c) that gambling transactions were showing on the card [IF THEY WERE?]. Because of this, the lender should not have increased your limit and should have seen that you were in difficulty, and offered forebearance. So from this point on the refund should be all interest charged, not just a partial refund of the interest over the previous limit of £500.
Paul says
Thank you for your response I will follow your advice!
Are you able to give any advice on the point I raised about my income? Me stating on the appli application it was £2k but I was actually on £1.5k per month (I cannot remember whether I did this to ensure I was issued the card or whether I misinterpreted the application and put the gross fee). But it seems the investigator is using my disposable income to determine whether the original limit was affordable, despite me actually earning £500 less per month. Or am I going to have to stay with the £2k figure as this was on the application form?
Thanks again, your help and the information on here is invaluable!
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest you say you don’t remember what you put on the application but it may have been your gross income by mistake, and the lender should have attempted to verify this.
Paul says
Thank you for your time and the responses you have given. I replied to the investigator with the points you made and he stated the creditor “carried out proportionate checks, therefore they would not have seen your bank statements and would have taken information from the application and verified it through CRA or internal checking systems.”
They stated I had never missed a payment for any of my credit in the 12 months preceding this which shows I was not in financial distress. However I believe I was only able to make these payments as I took out further credit to keep on top of these existing payments.
They have also stated it is their standard practice when only upholding part of the complaint to only repay interest over the limit increase.
I will be escalating this to the Ombudsman following this response but if you have any further advice before I do so I would appreciate it!
Sara (Debt Camel) says
“They stated I had never missed a payment for any of my credit in the 12 months preceding this which shows I was not in financial distress. However I believe I was only able to make these payments as I took out further credit to keep on top of these existing payments.”
You can argue that a creditor has to take into account information they should reasonably have been aware of, and in your case the large escalation in your debts suggests that you were in difficulty so they shoould have attempted to verify the figures.
“They have also stated it is their standard practice when only upholding part of the complaint to only repay interest over the limit increase.”
Is this the Ombudsman saying this or the creditor?
in either case you can say that it is not approparte to apply this sort of blanker rule when calculating redress, as the decision ought to be made on the facts on an individual case, and your strongly suggests that by the time te limit was increased, it should have been clear to the lender that the £500 limit was not manageable for you.
Paul says
Thank you for the advice.
To be clear this is the investigator from the FOS, and the next step appears to be escalating this to an Ombudsman.
Candice says
Morning Sara, I’ve had a response to my Barclaycard complaint suggesting I should have been aware and therefore made an affordability complaint when they reduced my credit limit from £16250 to £15500 in 2017 and therefore I’m time barred. This is from the case worker rather than the ombudsman and I have until 5th Jan to reply. The decrease was such a small amount and whilst I new it wasn’t affordable because I was living off the credit I thought it was my fault and didn’t think for one minute I could complain about it. Any advice on this?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
did you actually pay much attention to the decrease at the time ? that is an incredibly small one!
Candice says
I don’t recall realising at the time that they had reduced it or advising that it was their fault I had such a high limit and therefore they needed to reduce it. The decrease, as you say is only small (4.5% which is minimal). If it was considered unaffordable why didn’t they reduce it by more?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I think you should make exactly those points.
Jackie says
Hi
Can I get some advice please?
3 accounts:
Capital One £936. Default 060919
Lowell (originally Capital One) £553 Default 021118
Lowell (originally Paypal) £711 Default 250722
I havent worked in 10 years, have mortgage arrears (now on a plan) , rates arrears (now on a plan), payday loans (these are cleared) and utility bills arrears (also on plans)
So the above 3 accounts. I dont know how I got them as my credit is shocking. None of them have had payments from these default dates and possibly before that. If I were to chance my arm with unaffordability complaints would it reset the statute barred clock as I was hoping to claim SB after the 6 years is up or would it not make a difference?
Thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Can I ask how old you are? And if you have a permanent health condition?
How large are the mortgage arrears?
When will the council tax arrears be cleared?
Jackie says
Hi
Im 52. No permanent health condition. Was made redundant and at the time my free child care (parents) said they would no longer do it full time. So I decided to stay home as child care for 4 kids meant I wouldnt earn much.
Mortgage arrears are £6000. Total balance is £14200. This should have been cleared in Dec 2024 but have extended term to Dec 2026 as payments were too high.
CT arrears will take until end of 2025 to clear.
For context I do have a husband but the debts in my original post are mine.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
ok in that case you don’t have a clear reason to ask for the debts to be written off.
To answer your question –
“If I were to chance my arm with unaffordability complaints would it reset the statute barred clock”
Yes it would. It is very hard to imagine how you could complain about something while not acknowledging the debt.
Normally I suggest that it isn’t worth bothering too much about that if you think you have a good chance of winning affordability complaints because not that many debts go statute barred anyway. But the balances on those debts are pretty low. Ecen if you have all your bank statements going way back, these complaints may be hard to win. You would efectively be poking a sleeping lion and may not get anything useful from waking it up.
A possible alternative strategy would be to keep a close look out for a letter Before Claim/Action from any of the creditors (see https://debtcamel.co.uk/letter-before-claim-ccj/ that explains what this letter looks like) and if you get one respond asking for a copy of the CCA agreement and saying you are taking debt advice. Ifd they manage to produce the CCA agreement, point out you have lots of priorioty debts and offer a token £1 a month payment.
If you aren’t sure what to do know, or when you get a letter before claim, talk to National Debtline on 0808 808 4000.
Jackie says
Thank you so much Sara, greatly appreciated.
Nathan says
Hi Sara,
I have a 118118money credit card which they have agreed was unaffordable lending and so I’ve been paying back £30 a month to clear the remaining balance. I dropped this to £1 after a discussion with them during the last quarter because of a very large one off expense but I’ve noticed that on my credit file this is being recorded as a missed payment, so my question is because they’ve deemed it to be unaffordable lending am I right in saying that no negative marks can be left on this card?
Thanks,
Nathan
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I think you can reasonably complain about this.
Nathan Chan says
Thanks for the quick response Sara.
That’s good to hear and is what I thought. The card is labelled as an arrangement to pay on credit file which is fair enough but I just wanted to double check before I unfairly give their team a hard time!
Thomas says
Hi Sara, I put in a complaint to barclaycard last month and I have just missed a call from them. Should I phone them back and discuss over the phone or get them to respond by letter, or both? thank you, Thom
Sara (Debt Camel) says
you can talk to them if you want – but unless it is absolutely clear that what they offering is great, just say you would like to see their decision in writing so you can consider it. And if they are asking why you did not complaint before, again ask them to put this in writing.
Chris says
Hi.
Over the last two years I have been suffering from depression and it’s lead to an excess of borrowing. On a £68k salary they let me get a credit card, fill that up, open a new one with a 12.5k limit, Transfer the balance to that, fill both up to 15k, get a loan to clear both (another 15k) , fill up the 12.5k credit card, open a new credit card for a balance transfer, transfer that over, then fill up all three cards (9.5k + 12.5k + 3k) to a mountain of 50k debt. At some point during this the charges from the credit cards got so much that it was those that was causing us to run out of money so we had to spend even more money on the credit card to keep up.
Does this sound like it was excessive lending, (possibly the last card that took us from 40 to 50k borrowing or ?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
very possibly. But these cases take a very long while to go through and the earlier decisions may not be decided to be unaffordable as you were on a good salary. Also you only get the interest removed – I think you should be looking at a debt management plan right now for all of these debts to get yourself into a safe financial space. Read https://debtcamel.co.uk/debt-options/guide-to-dmps/ and talk to StepChange. Tell them about your depression.
Winning affordability complaints can then really speed up your DMP.
Ian says
Hi Sara
I have about 35,000 in debt , i have already defualted on my sainsburys loan for 14000 , i have a virgin card with 5000 and a marbles card with 4000 on and tesco card with 7000 on and capital one card with 3000 on it . I cant afford any of these credit cards now . But not made any late payments just kept borrowing from each card to pay diffrent amounts . So my question is can i ask the business to apply a defualt now? . It seems mad to wait six month not making any payments .Reciving load of letters and phone calls.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
sorry quite a few questions:
are you mainly concerned about getting interest frozen or getting a default added to your credit record?
If you haven’t missed a payment, why are you getting a lot of phone calls (except from the Sainsburys loan)?
Are you buying or renting?
Has something gone suddenly wrong (income drop, separation?) or has your debt been unaffordable for quite a while and you have stayed on top of payments by borrowing more?
Ian says
Hi Sara
Sorry for the late reply , i guess i would prefer a defualt to be added . I cant see any benefit from having it frozen as i have left my job due to health problem , need to take six months off due to mental health , I have been borrowing to keep up with all of my payments . I have moved back home for the moment . But will hopefully move out next year .
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I think you need to talk to StepChange about a debt management plan right now. See https://debtcamel.co.uk/debt-options/guide-to-dmps/
You can’t ask for a default to be added while you are making the current payments.
Getting your payments reduced and the interest stopped is the most important thing. When StepChange have agreed to set up a DMP you can stop paying the creditors.
Chris says
Hi, hoping you can advise me.
I’m currently a year into a debt management plan to help with debts that have built up over the last few years.
I had a £25k loan with Admiral
2x Credit cards with Virgin totalling £18k
1x Credit card with MBNA for £6
The credit cards were close to maxed out and I was only paying minimum payments on them.
Along with the household bills, nursery fees etc I ended up borrowing more and more on the cards to pay bills.
I’ve only just read about unaffordable lending but I’m adamant this was the case as detailed above.
Where am I best starting with contacting the lenders please?
Many thanks in advance
Chris
Sara (Debt Camel) says
The article above has a template you can adapt for the credit card complaints.
For the loan, see the template over here: https://debtcamel.co.uk/refunds-large-high-cost-loans/
Chris says
Hi Sara
Thank you.
I’ve typed up the letter to Admiral about my loan.
Back in November I started the 3 letter process with PRA who now own one of the credit card accounts.
2 letters in they told me that if they hadn’t sent the documents I requested, the account would be unenforceable. They also asked for more time. Should I send letter 3? I got spooked by reading stories of people ending worse off, but judging by what I’ve read on here, it’s only what I should be doing anyway?!
Should I start the 3 letter process with Intrum now who own the other 2 accounts?
Thanks
Chris
Sara (Debt Camel) says
The 3 letter process is a legal nonsense. Don’t send the 3rd letter.
It sounds to me as though PRA are treating the letters as a request for the consumer credit act agreement. That is actually a sensible thing to ask for, see https://debtcamel.co.uk/ask-cca-agreement-for-debt/. And it is helpful of PRA to have responded like this rather than laughed and ignored the letters you sent (which they could have done.)
So read my article on the CCA agreement and if you want to ask Intrum for paperwork, use the suggested I letter that I link to in there.
Chris says
Hi Sara
Thanks for that, I’ll look into the CCA pages.
With the loan, I’m just checking I’m sending this correctly. I’ve used the template, but where it says “ I am asking you to refund the interest and any charges I paid, plus statutory interest, and to delete any negative information from my credit record.”
Does it mean just the extra bits and not the loan itself?
Thanks again
Chris
Sara (Debt Camel) says
It is only interest that would be removed from the balance if you win the complaint.
How much are you currently paying to the DMP? Is it manageable or does it leave you short?
Are you buying or renting? Do you own A car?
Chris says
Hi Sara
I’m currently paying £228 per month across the 4 accounts.
I think Admiral get about £78 of that.
Is there anything else I can do? As currently the interest in frozen anyway? So does this actually make a difference?
To be honest the £228 is about right.
There’s £21k on the Admiral loan, this started at £25k.
Before the DMP I paid them £3600
Since the DMP I’ve paid them £1178
I have a mortgage.
And I own a car, the finance was paid using the Admiral loan.
Thanks
Chris
Sara (Debt Camel) says
do you know what the interest rate was on the Admiral loan?
Chris says
5.9% APR
Sara (Debt Camel) says
So the problem is that if you win the Admiral complaint you will not reduce the debt in the DMP by a large amount as it was such low interest. Where you are now, this is still worth doing as you don’t have a lot of nice options, but it isnt going to transform your situation.
The credit cards debts have only recently defaulted. The CCA agreements can likely be produced. You cannot pin hopes on that working well.
If the credit cards increased your interest rates you can also look at affordabilty complaints about them.
The car — how much is it worth? Have you looked at selling it and buying a much cheaper second hand car so you could use some of the money to clear debt?
Presumably your situation will get better when your childcare costs drop?
When does your mortgage fix end?
Chris says
Hi Sara
I’ll send them over and see what responses I get. Doesn’t hurt to try.
We have 4 years and 5 months fixed left on our mortgage.
I don’t think the car situation will help much.
I just think the fact that PRA replied saying from the 13th December the debt would be unenforceable, says they don’t have the info?
Thanks
Chris
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Many debts are sold to a debt collector with the debt collector being able to back and ask the opriginal lender for the paperwork. The fact they havent produced it so far doesnt anot mean that they wont get hold of it in the next month or two,.
Dan says
Hi Sara,
Have been following the site for some time and have had some very successful outcomes so far…thank you.
Could you advise on your opinion or an answer or reply as to when the lender or the FOS states that a credit card limit reduction from the lender should have been a trigger point for complaint?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
if it is the lender, just ignore this and send the complaint to the Ombudsman. Lenders won’t change their minds.
from the Ombudsman, well it depends on what actually happened. If the limit reduction was small you may not even have noticed it. a few more specifics would help.
Candice says
I’m 2022 I was in £33k of debt on various credit cards. I took out a £25k loan and paid off some of it in July 2022 and then another loan in September 2022 for £10k. Both loans were high interest and my debt spiralled. I borrowed again on my credit cards and lived off credit to survive. I’m now on a debt management plan and have lodged affordability complaints. Today the FOS have rejected my claim the £10k loan was unaffordable because I still had £500 per month free after bills and I had no credit it on my cards but large limits and that showed I didn’t have financial difficulties.
They failed to see how I had a £25k loan I’d used pay the cards off and considered how irritating c and poorly managed my financial management has been over the last few years.
Do I have any chance of putting any representations forward to help with this?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
who was the 25k loan from? and who was the 10k loan from?
can I ask if you are buying or renting?
Candice says
Hi Sara
The £25k was with Lendable and £10k was with BetterBorrow.
I have a house with a mortgage jointly owned with my husband but we run our finances separately.
I think my biggest point when responding would be that I had so much credit available and my previous lending history suggested I struggled to manage financially. Quite bitter sweet yesterday because another case worker approved an affordability complaint with Virgin Credit card yesterday in my favour on the basis I was clearly bad at managing debt, I had borrowed above my means and my payments in debt was more than 50% of my income.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Do you know which credit record the Lendable loan shows on? You need to check all 3 credit reference agencies – see https://debtcamel.co.uk/best-way-to-check-credit-score/
And which does the better Borrow loan show on?
You have also made an affordability complaint about Lendable?
You said you had cleared some cards with the lendable loan and them borrowed on them again – you need to try to work out exactly what Better Borrow could see when you applied for that loan.
Candice says
Thanks.
I have a claim in against Lendable which I submitted Friday so await the outcome.
I put in a SAR against Betterborrow and see the credit intermediary was Clearscore so would that have been Experian?
I know the BB loan definitely shows on Experian.
I’ll have a look through my credit file a little closer but I sent in an Experian one with my complaint which is what they have used to gather their information. I have until 26th Jan to respond.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
don’t try to guess, I suggest you get the statutory credit reports from all three credit reference agencies.
Graham Barry says
Hi Sara,
So Sky mobile have let me take out 10 separate handset contracts, which I can’t afford. They never did any affordability checks other than a credit check. I believe that they should have checked the affordability of this at the time as more handsets were acquired, as I am unable to work due to health conditions.
I’ve recently come out of a debt relief order within the last year as well when 5 or 6 were taken. Most within a short space of time. I hit my limit of 7 on one account then created another account it was a different email address but everything else was the same information, name, address etc.
Please could you advise what you think.
Thank you.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I’ve recently come out of a debt relief order within the last year as well when 5 or 6 were taken.
These contracts were taken out during the DRO?
Graham says
No, sorry, just after and I think, I already had 2 from just before the dro was approved
Sara (Debt Camel) says
so you had two debts from them that were included in your DRO?
Graham says
No, so Sky were not included in the debt relief order as we were using the phones at the time and didn’t want to cause any problems. so I still had the two or three contracts and was paying them throughout the DRO then when it ended they allowed me to get more phones.
I hit my limit and recently ordered another 3 over the space of the last four months or so.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
SO claims against mobile firms are are rarely successful. If you had had several contracts taken out while you were in your DRO that would be clear cut. If you had had a couple of Sky contracts included in your DRO that would have been arguable. As it is I have no idea if you have a chance of winning this. There is also the possibility that Sky may decide using a different email address to get around their limit amounted to fraud.
Graham says
Ok, well thanks for the advice anyway
Leyla12 says
Hi Sara,
I’m planning to make a complaint with Very and I wonder if I have a good case.
Original limit was 400 in Jul 2018. Limit was increased to 500 in Mar
2019, despite falling behind with my payment to them once, just a few months before. By then, since the opening of the account I had taken out 3 payday loans and an unsecured loan.
Then my credit limit increased to 700 in June 2019. By then I had
taken 2 more loans.
Then my limit increased to 1200 in May 2020. By then I had taken out 4
more payday loans and 3 unsecured loans.
Then my limit increased to 2700 in May 2021 despite taking another
large loan on top of what I already had.
Then my limit was increased to 3700 in July 2022. By then I was
spiralling in debt and I had taken another 3 unsecured loans. My limit was
increased despite clearly being behind my payments for 9 months in a
row with a loan justa few months prior and this was clearly visible on my credit recird.
Then my limit was again increased to 4000 in Dec 2022. I had taken yet
another loan since, to be able to pay my debt.
This was done despite making only minimum payments and always balance
being close to limit.
What do you think? Do I need to provide much more than this?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
That looks like a strong claim to me!
The limit increases should never have been offered. And by the time it got to May 2020, it should have been clear to Very you were in a lot of difficulty and they should have offered to freeze interest to help you, not increased your limit. So from that point ALL the interest should be refunded.
Thomas O’Brien says
Hi Sara, I put in complaints to 4 credit providers. Virgin had accepted me for multiple lines credit cards despite knowing I was using the cards for essentials and paying off the minimum amounts. They have come back to me and stated that I told them my income was £36k which was correct. However they said I had put a joint household income of £100k and therefore it was affordable and if I disagree I should complain to the ombudsman. I have always lived alone so I’m confused at this. What action should I take now? Thank you
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest you go back to them and say that you have always lived alone and you are sure you would never have stated that your household income was 100k. Ask them where you were asked this and for evidence of what you replied.
Sean says
Hi Sara,
I need some advice on a couple of things.
1. Can I make a irresponsible lending complaint for a credit card I had as a student opened in 2014 and paid off and closed in 2017 ?
2. I have a credit card (credit card closed and sold to lowell) complaint with a resolution to refund some overlimit fees and and interest but they still claim I did not have any payday loans at the time of applying which I did and have proof. The refund is enough to pay off the lowell debt, but Im wondering if them saying I had no payday loans when I had change anything
Thanks
Sean
Sara (Debt Camel) says
1. yes. the Ombudsman can make a decision about whether to look at these “over 6 years ago” cases.
But unless you have bank statements or other evidence of your finances at that time you may find this difficult to win.
2. how long ago was this card opened? You have made a complaint and what exactly have they offered?
Sean says
The card was opened in Jan 2020 and was sold in march 2022.
They offered £108 overlimit fees, £216.53 interest, £84 late payment fees and they said they’ve arrange for adverse info to be removed from my report.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
do you know how much interest you paid over this period?
sean says
at the moment I don’t know how much interest I paid but have queried it with customer services and they said it may take about 30 days. What I can do on monday is to call the complaints team and ask what period that interest refund is for.
The credit limit was £300 and I was almost always near the limit since opening it
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I think finding out the facts may help.
Sean says
Spoke to an advisor who confirmed it’s for the entire time the card was opened.
David says
Hi Sara
I’ve just made Service Access Requests to two major lenders concerning credit cards opened in 1997 and 2000. One account now settled and closed by the lender following completion of a payment plan for £7000, the other fully paid off.
Over the years I had horrendous issues – both cards had at one point set credit limits well in excess of £10,000 – I recall minimum monthly payments for one card alone in around 2008 being over £500 on a £2100 monthly pay cheque – which only paid off the interest for that month! But despite everything, I never once defaulted!
I don’t know how optimistic I should be of receiving account information from each lender from that far back in time or whether any claims for issues from 15 – 20 years ago are likely to get anywhere. But if nothing else, I’d like to see the SAR data just to see how much I was sucked dry for in interest over all that time!
And one other thing – in 2022 I was diagnosed Autistic at the age of 52. Looking back, I can now see how I had no control over my spending habits which could possibly be attributed to that condition. If I pursued a claim, is this a relevant and helpful thing to mention?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
How long ago were these accounts settled and closed?
I don’t recall people getting any refunds for lending decisions that were made before 2007.
Do you have bank statements going a very long way back?
David says
Card 1 settled a couple of months ago, account closed a couple of weeks ago, card 2 is active but has had a zero balance for a couple of months.
Very few old CC statements unfortunately, although I still have a few old bank ones… I went on a shred-of-shame binge a few years ago in the days before I ever thought they could ever be useful again for potential claims.
Agree – I’d be astonished if even the Ombudsman would consider anything from 20+ years ago but even the more recent stuff is worth pursuing. But I’ll keep you posted.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
When was the last time the credit limit was increased on these accounts?
David says
Hi Sara
Card 1 was last increased to £7350 limit around September 2019 after a long history of minimum or near-minimum payments.
Card 2 has had a steady limit of £1000 for several years, at least since 2017. I know the limit was at its worst until around 2011/12 when the limit was around £15000.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
then the last limit increase on the first card is within the 6 year where claims are easier.
Further back you can try but the Ombudsman doesnt make consistent decidions on older cases and if there is little evidence you may not get anywhere
TT says
Hi Sara,
I have 2 CCs from Capital One, both with Credit of £200, one applied on July 2021 and the 2nd one on January 2022, maximizing the credit almost immediately since I received them. At both times I had significant debts, more than what is highlighted in their response below. Since then In have complaint to several other companies I had a credit line over the same time period and these have all successfully been upheld, most recently for a Zopa CC, Overdraft and several Pay Day Loans. I just received their response declining the complaint, (I have send to the FOS now), The debts they highlight are significantly higher than the monthly salary that’s coming in, seems odd that they gave the credit cards initially and now have declined the complaint so confidently, what are your thoughts, do I have a chance?
1st Card:
When you applied for the account in July 2021, Manager with an annual salary of £41,500 gross.
Other debt commitments. These included £1299 of outstanding credit card debt and £750 in other borrowing (including any outstanding overdrafts). Housing costs of £650. An estimate of other non-discretionary expenditure.
2nd card:
When you applied for the account on 22 January 2022, Manager with an annual salary of £43,500 gross
Other debt commitments. These included £2626 of outstanding credit card debt and £5691 in other borrowing (including any outstanding overdrafts). Housing costs of £650. An estimate of other non-discretionary expenditure.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
well the credit limits are both very low. Did you try to increase the limit on the first card before you took the second?
TT says
OK thanks for your reply, because of the low credit line its fine for them to provide the credit? Even though the current debts are already exceeding the amount of money coming in?
Yes, I did try to increase the limit and this was not possible.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
So it’s not automatically fine to provide you with credit but with a small amount it is very hard to win the case.
For the second one however, if you were declined for a large limit on the first and then succeeded in getting a second card, you have a good case that that second card should never have been given
TT says
Thank you for your response, and for this website
ads says
Hi Sara,
I have 2 cards via New Day that defaulted and sold to Link Financial. Marbles card was taken out in 2017 – credit limit £300 and Fluid card was take out 2021 – credit limit £900.
At end of 2017 I made a payment arrangement with Marbles of £5 pcm to bring this balance down, of which cleared the balance December 2020.
Same month they then issued me with a new card again with a limit of £300.
The next 6mths I maxed out the card and made the minimum payments. I was using 50% – 80% of my credit limit.
Aug 21, I applied for a Fluid card – granted £900 limit & I had a Cash Advance to get car repaired.
Sep 21, Oct 21 the fluid account was suspended as missed payments by 1 day & Charges applied that took the balance to over my limit.
Nov 21 I bought both the balances down by 60%;
Dec 21, Fluid increased my credit limit to £1.9k (my Marbles account balance was 85% of available credit limit)
April 22 Fluid card had a limit increase to £2.9k, and again I started to use majority of the balance.
I applied for an increase of £1k on Marbles , which was rejected – but 8 days later increased to £1.3k despite being 85% of my limit .
June Covid finally hit the company I was working for and lost my job – around Jan/Feb 23 I setup a step change.
I have in a SAR that I rang and told them about step change, and agent tried to get me to pay more than the amount step change deemed affordable.
Do you think I have an irresponsible / unaffordable lending complaint?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
So in Dec 2020 you were given the second Marbles card?
ads says
Dec 2020, I was given a replacement card as the previous one was blocked due to the payment plan.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Then I think you have a good argument that the Fluid car should never have been granted – after the previous payment problems you again had a maxed out Marbles car where you were only making minimum payments. And the increase to the Marbles limit should never have been approved given your previous payment history on the card and the more recent problems you had with Fluid.
John Maddox says
Hi Sara,
I made an irresponsible credit card claim against Capital One. This was they should not have given me the card initially (the limit they gave me to start was £1500).
They have rejected due to me having the card in 2015 and FOS won’t review as out of 6 years and I have given them no explanation within 3 years of me becoming aware. This was the only correspondence I received from them after my initial complaint apart from we have received your complaint.
Can I still send to FOS, i have bank statements from the period of opening and should I ask capital one for a subject access request including the initial credit agreement?
Thank you
Sara (Debt Camel) says
They never increased your credit limit? is the card still open?
John Maddox says
Hi,
Never increased but was in persistent debt just making minimum payments for the past 17 years. Only just paid off the last few months. At the time of opening i already had a significant amount of debt including other cards, payday loans, gambling and a high interest personal loan.
Thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
So you can send this to FOS to make a decision on whether they can look at it. They can choose to look at complaints where someone is complaining within 3 years of having become aware they had a cause for complaint. FOS makes erratic decisions here, but some are uphled so its worth a try, espcially as you have your banks statements.
K says
JD Williams complaint went to FOS who found in my favour. JD Williams to calculate and refund plus 8%. Before JD deleted my account I went back as far as I could and noted down all interest charged. Cheque received today less than this and no explanation of calculations. Part of me wants to accept and other wants an explanation of how they reached this figure. Either way happy I won 🙌🏻 and it’s all thanks to the site
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Definitely ask for an explanation!
Sharna says
Hi Sara,
I’ve used your templates and made 3 affordability claims with MBNA, Santander and HSBC. I also used the email addresses that you provided on your page. I however, haven’t recieved an acknowledgment of the emails that have been sent. How long should I wait before calling them, or will the emails be enough?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest phoning them after 4 weeks if you havent heard anything
Heather says
Thank you, Sarah, for all your help and advice with irresponsible lending complaints, I can see from the Comments thread that you have transformed the lives of many people struggling with debt.
Using your template, I complained to Halifax in May 2023 regarding my credit card limit which was increased in steps from £3,500 to £11,200 in 2010, and I have had a very long wait for the Financial Ombudsman to consider my case.
I have previously read on your website that when it comes to the 3 year rule, FOS decisions are erratic and not consistent, but I still had hope for a good outcome as I knew I had a good case and a lot of evidence dating back years.
I have heard today that FOS have rejected my complaint as submitted too late, even though I did not know about irresponsible lending complaints until May 2023.
I am absolutely gutted as I can see that other cases HAVE been upheld where the balance increases were well over 6 years ago.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Is this rejected by an adjudicator/investigator? Or an Ombudsman?
Heather says
Rejected today by an Ombudsman. The adjudicator rejected it on 30 July 2023, saying I should have complained by May 2019 under the 3 year rule. I asked for it to be referred to an Ombudsman, and sent in lots of supporting evidence, because I did complain to Halifax in 2018 (about the v high interest rates being charged) but I didn’t have the magic words ‘Affordability complaint’ . In many conversations with Halifax, they never suggested they had done anything wrong until May 2023, when they said it was too late.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Sorry you have Lost this one. fOS decisions are very unpredictable on these older cases.
Lauren says
Hey Sara,
Just coming back here to advise my last default was removed after all your advice and my credit score has shot up to 971 on Experian and 700 on transunion which I’m so relieved about!
I just wanted your advice on this one though – despite there being no missed payments/defaults now, my Equifax score is stuck at 643 out of 1000 despite being excellent on the other two credit agencies. When I asked them, they have said it’s because there are 5 debt collector searches on my account from Perch Capital (who removed the default as part of a successful complaint win) and this is having an impact on my score. I went back to ACI who are now perch and told them that I’d like these searches removed as the outcome of my complaint was that ALL negative information was to be removed. They’ve said that the searches don’t affect my score however Equifax have said they do. Anyway ACI have raised a complaint to investigate into this as they obviously don’t believe me or Equifax that they are having an affect on my score although proof is in the pudding with the excellent score on Experian and transunion and not on Equifax? Am I being unreasonable to ask them to remove the searches as I assumed that they were to remove everything as a result of winning a claim?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
so hard searches – prior to lending – can affect your credit score. A debt collector would not normally make a hard search.
Also I doubt 5 hard searches would have such a dramatic effect…
Have you gone though every line of the Equifax report and are you happy it is all correct? Apart from missed payments / defaults, do you have any high credit card utilisation? Any links to other accounts?
Lauren says
Yeah I went through my entire report with Equifax with a toothpick and they said the only negative information on my score is the 5 searches by the debt collection company ! they also said I only have 4 open credit agreements (very low usage credit card, a mobile phone contract, and my current accounts with no overdrafts) so said I don’t have a lot of credit open to show credit worthiness but I still don’t understand the dramatic difference in scores on Experian and Equifax! Plus taking out new credit will only lower my score for a while won’t it? I know they score differently but they both have the same information on!! Anyways I have asked for the searches to be removed so if they don’t make any difference I will go back to Equifax and ask again!
Jack says
Hi Sara
After suffering with a gambling addiction , i took a lot of loans out and credit cards I have won my first case against santander but got this judgment . I have another five complaints ongoing .
Feels unfair that i have default applied , when santander admitted that they should not have given me the credit card . I will now have to find £3000 at some point to get the defualt removed . Surely this is wrong ? I been punished for santander failure .
Firstly, we only recommend that lenders remove the negative information from a person’s credit file once they’ve paid off what they borrowed, even if we think the lender shouldn’t have lent them the money in the first place. This is because removing the negative information would present an unrealistic picture of your financial situation on your credit file, of what debts you have and your repayment history. We think it’s reasonable that other lenders who might need to check your credit file (for example if you apply for a loan) are given an accurate picture of your financial circumstances so they can make lending decisions which are responsible.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Well they have a point. Do you need to borrow more?
JB says
Hi Sara,
I have had a new situation come up in a couple of complaints and wanted to get your thoughts – Essentially it looks as though the information provided by the CRA was incorrect – according to Very (the creditor in this case, but I have a similar query with a Loan from Updraft) the information they received showed that I had 19 credit accounts but a credit limit of £0. The investigator therefore cannot determine that Very should have had any concerns of offering me an initial credit account.
At the time I had overdrafts, a couple of credit cards and a paypal credit account which was maxed out, and I’ve provided evidence of this, but the investigator is making the point that her job is only to look into if Very did the necessary checks based on the information they had.
I have argued that having 19 accounts should have been a flag in itself, but aside from that, where would the responsibility lie here – would I have to look to put in a complaint about the CRA for providing incorrect information?
The CRA in this case is TransUnion, but I have had a similar thing happen with Equifax on another credit account, and Monzo have also acknowledged in their complaint response (to a different complaint) to me that they were given incorrect information in their credit checks before they offered me a loan so it sounds as though this could be quite a regular occurrence – for me at least!
Sara (Debt Camel) says
How long ago was the Very account opened?
JB says
It was opened in 2015 but credit was applied for and granted in Aug 2020
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Has updraft also mentioned this issue?
JB says
Updraft have not mentioned it as an issue, but the data they have provided on the credit checks from when my accounts were issued as part of the investigation is significantly different to what my actual situation was – some of it could be put down to being a couple of months delayed on reporting, but some of it is overdrafts, accounts etc. which had been open for years.
The FOS are saying it’s not their job to look into business practices, but only to confirm if the lender did the necessary checks based on the information they were given – sounds as though no one wants to take responsibility!
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I think you should go back and say their must either have been an error in Very’s system or in the CRAs. In either case Very had a list of 19 accounts and an implausible credit balance of 0. So they should have known something was wrong and not based their lending decision on it.
Kay says
Hi Sara,
Thanks to your forum I have had refunds and every loan that I have ever taken has been removed, my credit file now has no missed payments or defaults. Newday removed 8 missed payments on my Aqua account, however my question is that although the status code is ‘0’ on Experian, you can clearly see that I did not make a few payments as the payment is £0 and the balance stayed the same. Would a mortgage broker question this or ignore as technically there are no missed payments showing. Newday agreed to remove adverse information but to me, this seems to show that no payment was made. Thank you
Sara (Debt Camel) says
The Ombudsman is unlikely to tell Newday to delete the record. And obviously Newday could not invent and report paymenys that were never made.
How long ago are these issues? Have you talked to a mortgage broker about your application and your concern?
Kay says
Hi Sara, the ombudsman asked for Newday to remove adverse information which they did by removing the missed payment markers. What would be the point in doing this if it still looks like I have missed the payments by paying nothing those months. They spanned over 2020 and 2021. The account was settled in December 2021 then I won the affordability complaint late 2023. I haven’t missed a payment since August 2021 but technically they have been removed from my credit file. I spoke to a mortgage adviser last week but they haven’t looked at my credit file yet.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Speak to a mortgage adviser. I have not yet come across anyone who has had a problem in this situation.
Mariann says
Hi Sara,
I won the affordability claim against SafetyNet and Loans2Go previously and while I am waiting for Amigo… I made a claim against DotDot Loans and Mr Lender. Both of them approved me the same month when I had serious gambling issues. (April 2021). I have statements around that date to proof my gambling problem. (Thanksfully its in the past!) Do you think I have a good arguement for irresponsible lending?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
how large were the loans?
Mariann says
DotDot was £350 and it was the 3rd loan from them and Mr Lender £500 first loan. Paid around 400 interest on each and they both ended up in DMP.
DotDot is in administration so unsure if it was worth to claim against.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I doubt you will win either of those.
Natalie says
Hi Sara.
I wonder if you can help I took out some credit cards vanquis and aqua and catalogue accounts simply be, online home shop, freemans I can’t remember them all! I was however in a DRO order at the time and was not managing my financial situation. Will I be able to complain that it was irresponsible lending. The credit card companies didn’t raise the limit but the catalogue companies did a few times ! I’ve been in debt with them a while now and haven’t made any payments. I am awaiting a ADHD diagnosis and have recently been awarded PIP as I struggle to manage finances along with other things.
They have registered defaults on my credit report which I would like them to remove. Am I likely to win if I complain ?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
How long ago was your DRO? how long ago were the limit increases?
Natalie says
I started the DRO in 2018 I think the credit was taken out within the 6 years probably between 2019 – 2021 increases were applied during this time in the catalogue accounts.
The credit cards I was offered £1000 with vanquis and pretty much maxed it and never made a payment and £400 with aqua which I did the same.
The catalogue were pretty much at the limits the whole time and increases applied.
I can’t remember exact dates at and time. I’m planning to sit and have a good look at my credit report and bank statements and try and work out what happens and when and who I owe money to.
In the mean time do I just tell the debt collectors that are chasing me that I’ve made a complaint and they need to back off until the complaint is removed.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Can you say what the total debts are at the moment? Are you buying or renting? do you have a car, if so is it on finance?
Kirsty says
Good morning!
Bit of an odd one involving Very.
My partner racked up quite the debt with them, the debt was eventually passed to debt collectors who now say the account has been passed back to Very.
We have called to try and make a complaint but the reference the collector gave us doesn’t work and my partner isn’t showing on their system at all.
Has anybody heard of this before?
We’re getting my partner on a DRO and need to get balances as accurate as possible and complaining to the companies where there was irresponsible lending practices (some companies had pretty good practices but some should have laughed at him when he applied for credit)
Kind regards
Kirsty
Sara (Debt Camel) says
That sounds odd. Did you make a complaint about that? It is possible his account may have been sold to a debt collector but it should still show.
How large are your partners debts? Are you delaying applying for. DRO because of affordability complaints?