Have you had big overdraft problems for a long period?
You can make an affordability complaint and ask for a refund of overdraft charges if:
- your overdraft limit was increased to a level you are unable to clear; or
- your overdraft usage showed you were in long-term financial distress. For example, being in the overdraft all the time, or using an unauthorised overdraft a lot.
This article shows how to make an affordability complaint to your bank, with a free template letter to use.
These complaints do not hurt your credit record.
Contents
Overdraft affordability complaints
Overdrafts are supposed to be for short term borrowing
Overdrafts are intended to be used for short-term problems, not as long-term borrowing. A bank should review a customer’s repayment record and overdraft limit and if there are signs of financial difficulty, offer help.
One sign of financial difficulty is hardcore borrowing for a long period. The Lending Code defined hardcore borrowings as “the position where a customer’s current account overdraft remains persistently overdrawn for more than a month without returning to credit during that period”.
Some Ombudsman decisions
All cases are very individual. But these examples give you an indication of what the Ombudsman thinks is important.
In this 2020 NatWest decision, the Ombudsman decided:
NatWest did have an obligation to monitor Miss K’s use of her overdraft facility.
Any fair and reasonable monitoring of Miss K’s overdraft facility would have resulted in NatWest being aware Miss K was in financial difficulty … by October 2014 at the absolute latest. So NatWest ought to have exercised forbearance from this point onwards.
In this 2021 Santander case, the bank didn’t notice hardcore borrowing:
By this point, Miss C was hardcore borrowing. In other, words she hadn’t seen or maintained a credit balance for an extended period of time. Santander’s own literature suggests that overdrafts are for unforeseen emergency borrowing not prolonged day-to-day expenditure. So I think that Miss C’s overdraft usage should have prompted Santander to have realised that Miss C wasn’t using her overdraft as intended and shouldn’t have continued offering it on the same terms.
A similar decision was reached in this 2021 Lloyds case:
Mr and Mrs C’s statements leading up to the renewal shows they hadn’t really had a credit balance on their account for a prolonged period. Indeed, they’d had regular returned payments and had also exceeded their limit. In these circumstances, it ought to have been apparent Mr and Mrs C were unlikely to be able to repay what they owed within a reasonable period with overdraft interest, fees and associated charges continuously being added.
Decide which reasons apply to your overdraft complaint
Read through these and think about which apply to your case.
The bank set your limit too high
This may have been from the start when you were first given an overdraft. Or the initial low limit may have been fine, then the bank increased it to a level which it was impossible for you to repay.
If the bank saw signs of financial difficulty, it should not have increased your credit limit, even if you asked for it. And it should have considered offering your help (the regulator’s word is forbearance) for example by stopping adding charges.
How high is too high?
There is no set figure, it depends on your income and expenses. An overdraft of £2,000 for someone whose income is £1,800 a month is a lot – but if you earn £5,000 a month, then a £2,000 overdraft may be reasonable.
The bank should have seen you were in difficulty
Overdrafts are meant to be used when you have a problem. Using the overdraft a lot for a few months is fine. Or for a few days at the end of a month before you are paid.
Banks should review your overdraft annually. This is in most overdraft tgerms and conditions. And even if it isn’t the Ombudsman says this is good industry practice.
So at one of these reviews, your bank should have seen if you were in financial distress. For example if you are in the overdraft for all (or almost all) of the month for a prolonged period. Or if you were exceeding your arranged overdraft limit regularly for a significant amount.
I would say over a year is prolonged.
Other points that help your complaint
You don’t win an affordability complaint by saying the charges were too high.
Instead, you say the bank should have known they were unaffordable for you because of all the financial problems it could see on your statements and your credit record.
Here is a checklist, work out if any of these apply to you:
- often having direct debits or standing orders not being paid;
- a lot of gambling showing on your statements;
- significantly increasing other debts with the same bank;
- being recently rejected for a loan or a credit card by the bank;
- significantly increasing debts with other lenders showing on your credit record;
- a worsening credit record – maxed out credit cards, new missed payments, defaults etc;
- using payday loans;
- increasing mortgage arrears;
- making payment arrangements with other creditors;
- a reduction in the income going into your account.
Any of these suggests you are reliant on the overdraft to pay everyday bills and you will find it hard or impossible to repay the overdraft and not use it the next month.
If you can think of another reason your bank should have known you were in trouble.
Making your complaint
What you need at the start
You don’t need to know the exact dates your limit was increased before complaining.
If you have paper statements or you can download them from the app that may be useful for you. But you don’t need to send these statements to the bank with your complaint – the bank already has them!
You can’t go back and see exactly what your credit score was in say 2018 when the bank increased your limit. But your current credit record shows what was happening in 2017 and 2018. So download your credit report now and keep it. The sooner you get the report, the further back it goes. I suggest you get your free TransUnion statutory credit report.
Send a complaint in the app or by email
I don’t recommend phoning to start off a complaint. It’s too complicated and you will be talking to someone that doesn’t specialise in these complaints.
When the account is still open, you can send your complaint by secure message in the app or on the bank’s website. Take a copy of what you put in the message – you could email it to yourself so it won’t get lost and the date is recorded.
Most banks now have an email address that you can use if you prefer or if the account is closed so you can’t use the app. But banks don’t make these easy to find, so here is my list of bank email addresses for complaints.
A template you can adapt
The section above looked at the reasons to complain and the other good points that apply to your case – you are now going to turn those into a complaint.
In the template below, I’ve invented some examples and dates so you can see how a complaint email could read. The bits in italics should be changed or deleted to tell your story.
The bit about other points is important – what should your bank have noticed that showed you were in difficulty?
I am making an affordability complaint about the overdraft on my current account number 98765432.
Your identity details (these are needed if you complain by email, not if you use secure message):
My name is xxxxx xxxxxxxx. My date of birth is dd/mm/yy. The email address I use/used for this account was myaddress@whatever.com.
START BY SAYING they should have noticed when your overdraft usage got worse
Overdrafts are meant for short-term borrowing but that was not what I was using the account for. The fees and charges you were adding were making my position worse.
I am complaining that every year since [20xx] you have failed to notice my difficulty during the annual reviews of my overdraft. You should have offered forbearance eg by stopping interest and charges being added.
By 2014 I had been in my overdraft constantly for many months, not getting back into the black even when I was paid. This “hardcore borrowing” is a clear sign of financial difficulty. My income was only £1,850 a month – after I had paid bills, there was no way I could hope to clear an overdraft of £3500 in a reasonable length of time.
OR
By 2017 I had a large unauthorised overdraft for many days each month.
some other points that you can include if relavent- see the list above – these are just a few examples
You should knew I was in financial difficulty because you had rejected my loan application in 2016.
You should have noticed that the income going into my account decreased from 2018.
From 2018-20 there was a lot of gambling showing on my account.
In 2017 you should have seen from my credit record that I had made payment arrangements with other debts.
ALSO Was the limit to high when it was set?
(It may have been ok then and things only got difficult later – in that case miss this out.)
You should never have given me an account with such a large overdraft. When I applied in 2015, you should have checked my credit record and you would have seen I had recently missed payments to a credit card and had taken several payday loans.
OR
You should not have increased my overdraft limit in about 2014. When you increased the limit, you should have seen that my debts to other lenders on my credit record had increased a lot.
I do not know the exact months of these overdraft limit increases. In your reply to this complaint, please tell me when the increases were and how much the limit went up on each occasion.
END BY asking for a refund of charges and interest:
I would like you to refund all the interest and charges that were added to my account from 2016 when you increased my overdraft limit.
OR
I would like you to refund all the interest and charges that were added to my account from 2018 when you should have realised that my finances had got worse to the point that I was no longer able to clear the overdraft.
The Financial Ombudsman says that 8% simple interest should be added to any cash refund paid to me.
I would also like any late payment and default markers to be removed from my credit records.
Points to note
Personal accounts, not business accounts
The complaints covered here relate to personal accounts. For business accounts, talk to Business Debtline about your options.
You can complain if the account is still being used or if it is closed
These complaints can be made in a lot of different situations. For example:
- you are still using the account or you have stopped using it and are paying it off;
- the account has been closed;
- the bank defaulted it and sold it to a debt collector (here you still complain to the bank, not the debt collector). If the debt collector has gone to court and got a CCJ, add to your complaint that you want the CCJ removed as part of the settlement of your complaint.
But if you have had an IVA or bankruptcy after these problems, or if you are still in a DRO, then you shouldn’t complain – ask in the comments below for details.
Old accounts
Banks may say FOS won’t look at an old complaint, but this isn’t right. FOS will often look at a complaint if you have only just found out you can complain.
Open and recently closed accounts aren’t a problem – the bank will still have your statements.
If your complaint is about an account that was closed more than 6 years ago, it’s harder to win. The bank may no longer have much information about the old account. If you still have copies of your old bank statements for these old closed accounts this is worth a try.
If you feel you have a good older case take it to the Financial Ombudsman and let them decide!
Packaged bank accounts
These affordability complaints are nothing to do with packaged bank accounts. MSE has a good page about how to complain about packaged bank account charges. I suggest you don’t try to combine this with an affordability complaint – make two separate complaints to the bank and leave a gap of at least a month between them.
Student overdrafts
You are unlikely to win a complaint about a student overdraft saying you were a student and it was unaffordable – they are at 0% interest and nothing is charged until you are in work. So you need to argue it was unaffordable at the later date when they started to charge interest.
The Bank replies
They want to talk to me on the phone!
People are often scared if they get this message. But it may be good news!
You can just ignore it or say you would like a reply in writing.
If you decide to take the call, it helps to be prepared. Have a pen and paper handy so you can write down anything. If they say they are partially upholding the complaint, ask them the date they are refunding the fees from and how much. Also say you would like to see this in writing before you decide whether to accept it.
If they want to ask you questions that sound complicated or worrying (this is unusual), ask them to put the questions in writing as you find the phone difficult.
Rejection or a poor offer – go to the Ombudsman
The bank should reply in 8 weeks. You can’t go straight to the Ombudsman, you have to wait for the bank to reply.
Banks reject many good complaints, hoping you will give up. So don’t! You know if the overdraft has caused you a lot of problems.
And the bank may offer to refund fees for the last 15 months say, even though your problems have been large for many years. Think twice about accepting a low offer – you won’t put this offer at risk by going to the Ombudsman. If you aren’t sure, post in the comments below.
In particular, if the bank says you could have declined the increase to your overdraft limit or you never let the bank know you were in difficulty, FOS may not think that is a good reason. And ignore any statements by the bank that FOS will not look into things that happened more than 6 years ago.
Santander has been rejecting some cases then giving a full refund only a few weeks later if the case is sent to the Ombudsman – before the Ombudsman has even looked at it! Santander obviously knows it has been sending out misleading rejection letters.
The easy way to complain to FOS is by completing this online form:
- you can use what you put in your complaint to the bank;
- if the bank rejected your complaint or made a low offer, say why you think this is unfair;
- use normal English, not legal terms.
If your credit record shows that you had other debt problems send it to FOS. You don’t need to send your bank statements – the bank will send those to FOS. And you don’t need the policy documents for your bank account the lender will supply those to FOS if they are needed.
Do these complaints work?
Yes! In 2024, some banks are making more offers directly.
A Guardian article featured a case where someone used the template letter here. Barclays denied it has done anything but made an £8,000 “good will” payment to the customer.
And if yours doesn’t, people are winning cases at the ombudsman. FOS is a friendly service although it isn’t speedy. It isn’t any faster if you use a solicitor or a claims firm,
The comments below this article are from other people who have made this sort of complaint. That is a good place to ask for help if you aren’t sure what to do.
If you have priority debts such as utility bills, rent, council tax and benefit overpayments, these can’t wait until your overdraft complaint is settled. Start the overdraft complaint now, but you need debt help as well. So phone National Debtline on 0808 808 4000, tell them you have made an affordability complaint but you would like to know what your debt options are.
Is your credit card limit too high?
Get a refunds from large loans
Unaffordable car finance – your options
Catherine says
Any knowledge of Santander complaints?Responses??
I tried to raise my overdraft complaint on chat but no one responding so decided to send it off to a few email addresses and got a reply back from executive communications team saying-
Good afternoon
Thank you for your email. We will arrange for a Senior Complaints Manager in the Executive Communications Team to review your concerns and they will contact you in due course.
Any one else had this??
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Can you say which email address you used that got this response?
Catherine says
I found a CEO email so gave that a go as chat still not responded yet.
Catherine says
Hi Sara So finally the complaints team responded to my complaint on chat but I informed them my complaint was also sent to the executive communications team,after a quick call to the team the agent responded to say the executive team had agreed to review my complaint and this was confirmed via email directly from a senior complaints manager.
Quite shocked that I even had a response from the CEOs team never mind having someone senior agree to review it.
I’m hoping this will mean a direct resolution without FOS involvement as surely the senior team will be aware if complaints are likely to be upheld by FOS and I hope due to my situation they don’t reject it to delay it.
I’ll keep you updated.
Sasha Paton says
Hi I started my complaint today and got the same response from the executive team, I have been living at my maximum overdraft for 20 years, always going into unarranged overdraft, direct debits rejected, constant gambling transactions as well as payday loans.
I don’t believe my account has ever been reviewed and questioned as to my financial situation. I wondered how this ended up and how long it took with the executive team?
Catherine says
Hi They took the full 8 weeks to respond but upheld it and refunded back to 2018 when I first added overdraft and increased it multiple times in a short space.(one day I made 4 increases)
Refunded all bar the first 3 months of me having it.
I had a 2nd part to my complaint which they didn’t uphold and that was picked up by a investigator last week.
Catherine says
If you haven’t already asked then subject a subject access request for whatever you think will support your complaint.
I didn’t request everything I asked for specific things.
Like overdraft increases and decreases,when,how much,behavioural history,decision history,chat history as I’d asked for help with overdraft several times and didn’t receive any.
My overdraft was £4500 constantly at max,I had 100s of gambling transactions.
The data I got regarding overdraft actually proved it was unaffordable as in the decision going back to 2020 it said my max overdraft should be £500 but yet they didn’t do anything or ask me to try reduce it.
It proved very valuable data which I added to complaint when a executive manager started to look at it and I had a direct email.
Sasha Paton says
Thanks for the information, I was contacted by the executive communications complaint manager who said the ceo has asked him to look at the complaint personally, he said they have 56 days to look but he hopes to have concluded his review by the end of this week, can I ask did they give you an offer immediately? Was it full refund? Hoping the fact that I’ve been at a maximum 1400 overdraft for 20 years is a good case lol
Sara (Debt Camel) says
it is very rare for a bank to offer a refund of more than 6 years. If you want to go back further you will almost certainly have to go to the Ombudsman.
Catherine says
Hey It’s highly likely that it will be a straight reject if they are getting back to you so soon.They took the full 8 weeks with me.
I increased mine from £600 to £4500 in only a few days,then reduced it back to £1000 a few days later,then increased 5 times in the same day back to £4500.
I’d also asked for help with overdraft several times and wasn’t helped,I was utilising the full overdraft every month for 4 years and had multiple other loans at the time.
Totally depends on your case and why you think it was unaffordable/irresponsible and what evidence you have to support that.
If you had other loans etc,if you increased it several times,if you asked for support with the overdraft,if you were regularly at the maximum limit etc etc
Have a look at some of the ombudsman decisions on the website for Santander cases to see if any cases similar to your situation,but remember all cases are individual.
Greg says
Part 1………
Hi Sara.
Thank you for highlighting the unfair treatment many of us have received at the hands of UK banks.
I originally opened a santander (formerly Abbey national) student account in 1997 with a modest overdraft. I’m not sure the amount of overdraft or how my account was managed up until the statements I have from 2014. Between 2014 and today, my overdraft has been at £2500 and for the wast majority of the time, overdrawn by around £2000. Sometimes 1700 or 2400 but rarely or never anywhere close to being out from the overdraft in almost 9 years. Littered throughout that time is payday loans from Wonga and sunny. There are also instances of heavy gambling, however this is masked by using PayPal as the vehicle to get an advance betting deposit when my account was empty and then the PayPal DD would debit a few days later. I eventually defaulted and they closed that PayPal account. I have letters from the DCA. One day I lost about a grand and thankfully I walked away from it. Chasing the dream rarely materialises
Greg says
On the other side, my self employed and employed yearly totals were between 5k and 10k. Maybe one p60 for probably 2016/17 might show a higher annual income.
I also highlighted the masses of interest I have paid each month with living on the edge of the overdraft. I’ve documented exceeding the overdraft, bounced direct debits and a rejected santander loan application for a minimal amount in 2015.
All of this has been in front of santander eyes, yet they have done nothing. Historically, they’ve even refused to refund bank charges eventhough they could see the state of my account.
I even took it upon myself to change my account type to limit interest to £20 instead of the 50 to 60 I was paying most months. This incurs a £10 month fee that I still pay to this day. Not once has santander look at my account and offered a shred of help. Instead they’ve been happy to prize around £4k of interest from me since 2014 (not sure about before then). 4k interest on a 2.5k short term debt that’s lasted 25 years.
I’ve sent santander the information I’ve gathered and asked them to refund all the interest I’ve paid, plus 8% interest. Refund the charges and fees I’ve paid and to wipe any adverse credit.
I expect a push back but I’ll sit it out for the 8 weeks until I escalate to the ombudsman as santander have a shocking record of responding and taking care if their obligations.
Chloe says
I got a very prompt no from them Greg. I’ve sent my complaint to FOS now. Hoping for better luck! Can you believe they even said in their response “we’re not financial advisors”. Basically put the blame on me and said “you didn’t ask for help”.
Catherine says
As in how prompt??Was your complaint detailed,I’ve sent mine and it’s 6 A4 pages with dates,figures,the times I’ve contacted asking help with overdraft,gambling etc over the years.
I sent mine to the CEO email and have a senior complaints manager from that team agree to review it.
Chloe says
I sent a message through the online chat in my banking app. They responded within a few hours with straight up no. But I didn’t send a very detailed message. It was short but to the point using a template I found on here. But I think their argument that I didn’t ask for help is very week and poor on their behalf. Like Greg says, it’s just easy money made for them and they had no intention on stepping in to help.
Perhaps Catherine, I should of sent an email to the CEO instead. However, I’m more than happy to wait for the FOS
Greg says
The emphasis is on them not to exploit vulnerable and people trapped in spiraling debt. If they turn around and said….. you’ve had you overdraft for 5 years and we need to clear it. We will freeze the card, add no more interest and you still need to make the minimum payment which will reduce the balance each month! Great!
But no. They just sit there rubbing their hands at the £600 annual income they got sometimes. £600 on an average overdraft of £2k must be around 30% return. Then they pay savers 1%.
Look at the case studies at the top of the page. They aren’t worse scenarios than us. Most of them got kicked back to the customer and the fos rules in their favour. That should be a president they’ll follow. Remain optimistic.
BECKS MASH says
Finally after Barclays having my complaint for 3 months and not even bothering to look into it (despite constant reassurances it was progressing) then another 3 months with the FSO it has been allocated to a case handler! 🤞🤞
Mike says
What date you raise your case to the FoS?
I’ve had mine waiting to be assigned since the 15th of March with nothing back from them yet
Sara (Debt Camel) says
This is an overdraft complaint? I suggest you phone them up and ask why this is taking so long.
Mike says
It’s an overdraft and loan complaint combined. I made them separately but NatWest addressed them both together in one letter.
Would it being attached to a loan delay it?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Some people have had combined cases split up, but I think that has been where the lender replied to each complaint separately. Tell FOS you don’t mind if they are split up so long as each complaint takes account of the other one.
Ammi says
Hello sarah i put in a complaint with halifax regarding my overdraft i had a message after 3 week that i will get a call from them is this normal or has anyone else had a call from there bank regarding a complaint
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Some banks phone some people. It isn’t clear to me why they choose those people. So I have no idea if this is good news, bad news or they just want to ask some questions.
If they make you an offer on the phone, unless that is a refund of all your fees for the whole period, ask them to put this in writing as you need time to consider it.
If they want to go through your income & expenses now, that may mean they want to offer help going forward but it should not affect the decision about whether you should get a refund of previous charges.
If you aren’t sure why they are calling or are uncomfortable replying to any questions on the phione, ask them to oput it in an email as you find it difficult to think about numbers on the phone.
Catherine says
I have a complaint with Halifax and they said a manager would call once it had completed a initial review to understand the complaint and see if they need to ask for any more information or questions before making a decision.
Adam says
Hi Sara,
First of all thank you so much for this website. Such a wonderful resource.
I’ve only just found out I can get overdraft fees refunded. I’ve complained to NatWest because from 2010-2020 I was almost constantly in my overdraft, usually near the max amount, which was 2K. I had a nervous breakdown in 2010 and the next decade was a struggle, I rarely had enough money for life/bills/myself. On benefits a few points, other times doing off jobs here and there and I was constantly having to top up my account just to be able to pay off the interest charge and avoid being charged for going over the limit. I spent nearly 10 years paying various fees and charges including interest. I did not gamble, nor did I get any pay day loans. I was also homeless at one point. I was pretty much living in my overdraft for those 10 years, except for a few months here and there where I’d manage to make some money working but would then be in the red very quickly. It was a nightmare. I remember there were months where I had £200 and I’d have to pay 30-50 of that towards interest charges.
In 2019 things got really bad for me and I had two credit cards, I struggled to keep up the minimum balances and had a poor credit rating. Yet I was still paying NatWest. I finally managed to clear the debt in DEC 2021 and have now been debt free since then.
I am wondering is there any chance that they will refund me from 2010-2021 etc? I managed to get all my statements from them and realised I’ve paid a fortune throughout the years.
Thank you so much for all the help you’ve given all the people above. I’ve found it really useful.
Or do you think this is a case of having to go to the Ombudsman? Also, what kind of evidence is it best to use for the Ombudsman?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
You have to start by going to NatWest.
I will be very surprised if they refund you back to 2010. But see what they offer. If it’s a refund going back 6 years (which is all a bank seems to offer), consider how much that is and whether you should accept it.
If you go to the Ombudsman, FOS may decide it can go much further back, but if you got into problems in 2010, then a refund would be from some later point where the Ombudsman decides the bank should have realised – after all an overdraft is there for an emergency. But when you have been in it all the time for a couple of years, the bank should have realised you were in difficulty.
Adam says
Hi Sara – Natwest replied to me.
I was sorry to learn from your email that you had suffered a period of ill health which affected your time as a student up to the present.
I have looked at your account history in respect of the overdraft increases on your account, ending ****, however I’m unable to investigate them for you. The reason for this is because it falls outside the time limits set by the Financial Conduct Authority for us to review complaints. These being if what you’re complaining about happened more than six years ago, and if you’re complaining more than three years after you realised, (or should have realised); that there was a problem. I have checked our records and can see that the last recorded successful overdraft increase agreed
on your account, ending ****, was done in February 2011 – this was over 11 years ago. I can see from my records that you were incurring debit interest and charges as a result of using this overdraft in 2012-2019 so you would have received a monthly interest andcharges notification – so you were aware of its existence and could have raised your concerns within a reasonable timescale i.e., within 3 years.
What can I do next? I was deeply unwell during those years and the last thing I was able to do was manage things like bank charges. They are saying I was aware of it but all I knew was that I was getting money taken out I had no idea that this could have been stopped.
“If you feel that you are struggling financially now or in the future, we want to do all that we can to
support you so I wanted to let you know we have a team who may be able to help. You can call our
Financial Difficulties Team on 0800 068 9816 and the team will be able to discuss things with you and
do what that can to help
If you’re unhappy with my decision you have the right to refer your complaint to the Financial
Ombudsman Service, free of charge. The Ombudsman might not be able to consider your complaint
if:
• the issues you’re complaining about happened more than six years ago, and
• you’re complaining more than three years after you realised (or should have realised) that
there was a problem
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Send this straight to the Ombudsman.
With overdrafts, you can almost always go back 6 years so that would be to 2016 even the “cause” of the problem was a lot longer ago as the bank should have reviewed your overdraft.
And the Ombudsman may accept your argument that you should have a refund going much further back as you were unaware that the bank should have checked the overdraft was unaffordable, you thought the bank had done nothing wrong and it was your own fault.
Adam says
Thank you for the advice, Sara. Really appreciate it.
So you think it’s just easier to refer it straight to the Ombudsman and not call NatWest to discuss it?
Also, what kind of evidence do you think would be useful to send to the ombudsman to back up my claim and make my case stronger?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I would be astonished if NatWest change their mind. So I wouldn’t waste time on this.
Natwest will supply the Ombudsman with bank statements.
Adam says
Hi Sara – I received a reply but they don’t want to look at anything before DEC 2017 – this is the period where I paid the BULK of my charges and where i really struggled. What can I do/say/provide to the case adjudicator to convince him otherwise and strengthen my claim. I thought my original letter would have been enough.
———————————————-
Our rules usually only allow us look at complaints where they were made within six-years of what’s been complained about. This is unless three-years from when the consumer was aware (or they ought reasonably to have been aware) they had a reason to complain provides them with longer to complain.
xxxx applied for her overdrafts more than six years ago and therefore rules do not allow us to look into the approvals of the overdrafts in 2001 and 2011.
xxxx complained more than six years after the charges applied to her overdraft between 2001 and 2016. As these charges would’ve been notified to you around the time they were being applied, I think that you knew enough to decide whether you thought they were excessive or keeping you in debt. As this is the case, I don’t think that three years from when you were aware (or you ought reasonably to have become aware) you had reason to complain provides you with longer and I think you complained about the charges applied to your overdraft before September 2016 too late.
We can look at a late complaint if exceptional circumstances were responsible for this. So if there’s anything that might’ve stopped xxxx complaining in time, then xxxx can let me know.
Findings
Having considered everything provided, I think NatWest acted unfairly when it continued charging overdraft fees from December 2017.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
You can ask the adjudicator to look at this again and say you would like an Ombudsman decision if they do not change their mind.
Some thoughts about what to say
“As these charges would’ve been notified to you around the time they were being applied, I think that you knew enough to decide whether you thought they were excessive or keeping you in debt. “
You could reply that you knew the charges were high and keeping you in debt but that does not mean that you thought the bank had done anything wrong, you thought this was normal and had no idea banks should have assessed affordability each year. So you had no reason to make a complaint as you thought it was your fault not the banks fault.
Also when did you send the complaint to the Ombudsman?
Adam says
Thank you for your advice. I will try that. I sent my complaint in early September and the adjudicator just got back to me 2 days ago.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
In that case you can also ask why the adjudicator has made the decsion that there should be a refund from Dec 2017, not 2016.
Adam says
Adjudicator got back to me and says that:
“You told us “I knew I was being charged and that those charges were extortionate, keeping me in a vicious cycle of poverty and debt which took me a decade to come out of” – based on this, I think it’s fair to suggest you knew you had a cause to complain during that time. ”
They only quoted one part of my reply to them. I wrote a long explanation of how there was no way I was supposed to have known that the bank was acting unfairly. Thinking that it was my fault and that I did not know that banks should have assessed affordability. Pretty much what you said above.
Should I tell him to pass it to ombudsman?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
yes. Go back and say that he has taken what you said out of context and your full reply said you thought it was your fault as you did not know the bank should assess affordability. Say you would like this point passed to the Ombudsman.
Adam says
I got a reply from ombudsman:
I sent you the final decision made by the ombudsman in relation to the date from when we can look into your complaint.
Therefore, my assessment sent to you earlier remains unchanged. National Westminster Bank Plc have agreed with my assessment and they have agreed to refund all interest and charges you paid from December 2017 onwards as per my recommendations.
Please let me know by 27 March 2023 if you agree with this offer as full and final settlement of your complaint or if you still disagree with my assessment and you would like a final decision to be made on this part of your complaint.
————————————————————————————————————————————————
What options do I have now?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Apart from the start date, do you have any reason to disagree with the decision?
Adam says
I disagree with the start date because that’s not the full 6 years. I was extremely unwell during this period and have sent in relevant evidence for this.
The ombudsman disagreed with having my complaint go back to 2010, unfortunately. Even though I supplied plenty of evidence, it seems like they dismissed it. And I can’t appeal this.
I still think this was unfair but it seems like if i refer this to the ombudsman they’ll only look at whether I should get the full 6 year period and not just from DEC 2017.
Catherine says
Hi Sara,
In shock,submitted Halifax complaint on 2nd of September.Received a call today upholding my complaint.
A refund of £2900,£2500 will pay the overdraft off,£400 refund plus £125 added 8% and will be paid today.
One less debt and resolved so much quicker than expected.
Advice is to include as many facts and figures in your complaint as possible,ie number of gambling transactions within a period,other debts,times you have contacted bank to ask for help etc etc
Thanks for this site once again
Mike says
Hey Sara,
Just received this from Paul Whiteing | Lead Ombudsman and Director of Casework
Assuming it’s a generic email sent to others?
Still waiting after 5 months to be assigned a case handler
Dear XXX
Your complaint about National Westminster Bank Plc
I’m getting in touch to say that I’m sorry we’ve not started to investigate your complaint yet.
We’re currently very busy, with lots of customers needing our help at the moment. That means it could still be some time before one of our case handlers gets in touch with you. I’m very sorry for this delay, but can assure you your complaint hasn’t been forgotten.
Sarah says
Hopefully this is helpful for those complaining to Barclays and cannot find an email address.
I made my complaint my using resolver end of august.
Barclays sent me a letter about a week later saying they received my complaint and would respond by the 20th of sept
Yesterday I received a text message from a Barclays complaint adviser ‘Hi. We are sorry that you have had cause to complain to Barclays. We would like to talk to you about your complaint. When is a convenient time for us to call you to discuss this? Please can you reply with a date & time that is convenient for you. If you would prefer a written response from us, reply YES to this message. Kind Regards, Barclays.’
I replied Yes as I wanted everything in writing.
They responded straight away ‘No problem. I will write out your letter this evening and it will be sent via first class post tomorrow. Kind regards – Barclays.’
I’m expecting I should receive the letter during next week. Even if they don’t accept my complaint, I can escalate to FOS.
I’ll update on here when I receive the letter.
Sarah says
Hi Sara,
Thank you for your help and this wonderful site.
I received my letter in the post from Barclays offering me 4089.16 as a good will gesture from 2015 even though I told them I made a mistake on my letter and I sent straight away I wanted it looked at from 2012.
I’ve actually had this overdraft since 2004 whist at uni but Barclays the started charging some years later possibly 2009/10.
I’m not sure what exactly I was charged from 2012 or 2015
but do I accept the offer if charges are correct + interest from 2015 or send to financial ombudsman to look at from 2012, thanks.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
is the 4089 a full refund of all interest and charges since 2015?
do you know how much you paid in charges from 2012-2015?
did something specific happen in 2012 which is why you think you should get a refund from them?
Sarah says
Thanks for the reply.
I thought you could claim from before 6 years and during that 2012 period onwards the charges were coming in regularly as I was always in my overdraft and every month getting out a payday loan.
I don’t think 4089 is correct because they do not accept they did anything wrong, the money is a good will gesture. They didn’t break down in the letter how they came to that amount.
Furthermore, I was being charged about £90.00+ a month until when the law changed on overdraft charges.
I will call Barclays and ask for a list of my charges from 2015 to be sure.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
you can claim for older than 6 years at the ombudsman. But it’s a bit random what decision the Ombudsman makes! if they have refunded ALL charges for 6 years, you may decide that is fair enough.
Do ask how much you paid in charges for 2012-3-4 too – that gives you the facts to make a decision.
Sarah says
Hi Sara,
Forgot to mention in my letter they quoted they have only been able to review the charges and statements for 6 years because that’s all they are legally required to hold.
So they have refunded me all the charges applied from sept 2016 to present.
I don’t know if that also includes the interest.
Hp2020 says
Hi could i ask how longer from the letter did u recieve your refund if dont mind answering
i still bank with barclays just waiting on my letter looking at the txt you got its simallar to mine so crossing fingers goes my way here tmz they was sending it wednesday by first class :)
Becks Mash says
Can I ask what grounds you complained on. My Barclays complaint wasn’t even looked at and is now at the FOS
Sarah says
I complained using the template on here, I deleted what I thought didn’t apply. My complaint was that I should have never been given a large overdraft and for the fact my credit was poor and I was constantly relying on other forms of credit including payday loans they should have noticed this.
I emphasised I was never able to get out of my overdraft which was considered ‘hard core borrowing’ and this put me in a worse financial position.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
you have asked several people about this.
There isn’t much point… your complaint is unusual and very large – what has happened to anyone else isn’t relevant.
Becks Mash says
I didnt think mine (£2520 overdraft) was that much bigger than most seem to have on the complaints on this site?!?. The reason I ask is because a lot of people seem to be in the same boat as me and if the FOS come back with a rejection it is good to have a perspective on how others have faired with the same kind of complaint before I responded.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
it’s the fact you have had nothing paid into the account for more than 10 years that makes this one different.
AQ says
Hello, I made an affordability complaint to Lloyds for £2400 OD about a month ago. Just received a call from them upholding it. BUT they said they can only go back 6 years and last time my overdraft was renewed in July 2017 so they are willing to give back charges from that time. I told them send me a letter and I’ll think about it. He was very persuasive in me accepting the offer. When I mentioned FOS he went bonkers in telling me they will never take your complaint. Just need some help here , should I accept this offer or try ombudsman to look into it as had OD since September 2008 and always used upto the limit.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
How much are they offering to refund?
AQ says
Just checked my account , they already have put £4076 and second transfer of £152 which I think is interest
Sara (Debt Camel) says
do you know how much you paid in overdraft interest and charges for the years before 2017?
If you go to FOS, you may get more if the Ombudsman dwecides they can go back further. I think they should decide that but FOS decision on this are rather erratic at the moment so I can’t say you will definitely get it.
But you aren’t putting at risk the offer from Lloyds if you go to FOS – Lloyds have already agreed to refund you that.
Ammi says
Hi Sarah had a letter come thru the post yesterday bank paying me 7.297 in 14 days for my 3000 overdraft i had since 2016 do i need to call them to confirm or would this automatically go in my account
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I think this will happen automatically.
Are you happy with this as a resolution of your complaint?
Ammi says
I’m happy it will clear my overdraft that I couldn’t clear thankyou soo much for ur help without you this wouldn’t of happened so i wait until it come thru too my bank it did say on 28th it will stop al my interest rate on my overdraft will stop soo maybe rest arrive soon too as letter was dated from the 15th of this month
BECKS MASH says
Hi Sara
Just to let you know after Barclays ignoring my complaint for 3 months then myself passing it to the FOS in July. I have finally received a response from the FOS. They believe Barclays should refund fees and interest since March 2017. Barclays have 2 weeks to agree or disagree with the FOS.
Do you know how likely Barclays are to dispute the FOS findings or whether they seem to give in at that point?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Barclays don’t seem to take most cases to the ombudsman levwel – fingers crossed they accept yours!
BECKS MASH says
How do they work out the interest on a refund. For example if you were receiving a £5k refund for a time period from March 2017 and were receiving the whole amount as there was no overdraft balance remaining now. Is it just 8% of the £5k (£400) or is it worked out differently?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
When was the overdraft cleared?
BECKS MASH says
Hopefully this week but using a loan fro. Parents not the actual redress
Sara (Debt Camel) says
ah. If it had been cleared 2 years ago, you would have got 2 x 8 = 16% interest.
Would the refund clear the overdraft?
BECKS MASH says
The refund would clear the overdraft with an extra £2500 left owed to me. I will be clearing the overdraft this week though so it will be a
£5100 refund to me
Sara (Debt Camel) says
ok so what the bank needs to do is work out when your overdraft would have been clear if it had not added these charges… that isn’t easy for you to do. From that point on, fuether refund 9which will total the 2500 you will get in cash) you will get 8% interest on. But these payments have been made over a period of time, so if you think of getting interest for that period times 8% times £1250, it will give you a rough calculation.
You won’t be gaining any extra 8% interest because the overdraft is cleared now. In fact it will complicate the calculations if the bank has already done them. So if that is the reason it is happening, there is no point.
BECKS MASH says
The financial ombudsman contacted Barclays and said they should uphold my complaint from march 2017. Barclays had until Oct 17th to respond other the ombudsman would
make final decision. I heard nothing so this week I contacted my case manager who then said Barclays had just contacted her and will respond by Oct 31st. I dont understand why Barclays have now had 6 months since I first sent the complaint and still are giving us the run around. In the 12 weeks they had my complaint they didn’t even look at it despite assuring me they were. I feel they are now doing the same with the FOS. What happens if Barclays just ignore the FOS decision and refuse to respond?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
is this an adjudicator decision or a second level Ombudsman decision?
J says
Good evening, I’ve been reading through the comments. It’s encouraging to read many success stories.
I wanted to ask if anyone has had any success with RBS. Did you write to them through a claims portal or via email? From start to finish how long did your complaint take from submission to a decision from RBS or the ombudsman.
Many thanks for your help
Sara (Debt Camel) says
it doesn’t matter how you send a claim in, the result is the same. I suggest email.
Decision times are pretty random unless you are complaining about something over 6 years old, in which case you may get a rejection quickly and need to send it to the Ombudsman who can look at older complaints.
You cannot rely on getting a good decision quickly – many strong complaints are rejected and have to go to the Ombudsman.
J says
Thanks Sara. I will email them about an overdraft i had in 2015
So in this instance can go back further than 6 years? As between December 2003 and early 2009 i pretty much stayed in an overdraft between £1500-2000. i took out a loan to repay this. Or is there no chance in making a claim dating back 20 years.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I think there is virtually no chance of a claim between 2003-9.
J says
I thought as much. I just wanted to be sure.
Thanks again.
J
mark says
RBS rejected my complaint, standard template reply….I sent it to FOS, allocated to case handler after many months….A week later the case handler has written to RBS finding in my favour and asking RBS to refund all charges from December 2016. I
I did get out of my financial mess in September 2017, but i was getting charged up to £50 per month for the overdraft
was in overdraft from 2006, but sadly FOS would only look at my case from 2016 onwards.
mark says
i complained to RBS online…..they rejected in under a week……probably didnt even look into my individual circumstances., sending out a templated letter…
On day of rejection , i sent to FOS, took about 6 months to be allocated. 2 weeks later FOS wrote to RBS finding in my favour from 2016 onwards.
Ben says
RBS rejected me also after a few weeks wait but they gave a good will gesture of £230…the equivalent to one months charges.
FOS ruled in my favour recently almost four months later and I was refunded £4450.
Stick with it!!
Best of luck.
Mara says
Dear Sara,
I hope you are well.
I would like to get your advice on something. I have used the email that you have mentioned for my Barclays overdraft complaint, and today I got the response from Barclays complaint handler. She has tried to call my number and alternatively wants to write a letter to my UK address. She mentioned that she doesn’t want to use email as it is not a save way for communication. The problem is that I don’t live in UK for 2 years now, moved to EU due to family circumstances. Is it reasonable for me to give my European number or better give my EU address for a letter? Will it affect my complaint in any way?
Thank you in advance
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Being abroad won’t affect your complaint.
I suggest you tell her the problem and give her your contact details abroad. But you could say that you are perfectly happy to carry on by email.
Tom says
Hi
I was wondering if anyone could help me please.
I made an affordability complaint to Halifax for my overdraft. I took out an overdraft but I was constantly in my overdraft when I was offered a higher amount.
I took out a higher amount and had that for approximately 2 years. I complained that they give me a second overdraft, I also complained that my credit score wasn’t good I didn’t have any creditors it just wasn’t good and also that I took out the loan even though I wasn’t fully aware of what I was doing because of my mental health and I provided medical evidence for this. The overdraft was £1000, they cleared £600 in interest but told me that needed to go towards paying off the overdraft so I’m left with having to pay them £400, so my balance will show minus £400 from tomorrow and my overdraft has been stopped. They also told me I could have the remainder £400 wiped off if i provided further medical evidence because the evidence i provided wouldn’t be suitable, im assuming because it was from two years ago when i first took out the overdraft. I also told them i thought a contract was void by law if a person had mental health and didn’t understand the contract but they told me no because they didn’t know about my mental health. Doe’s this all sound right? Any help/advice would be appreciated thank you.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
What is your current financial position like – what other debts do you have? do you have any arrears on bills?
Tom says
Hi Sara
Thank you for your reply!
My current situation is I’m unemployed and claiming sickness benefits, I have no other debts and no arrears on any bills. I’m not being greedy I just thought based on everything mentioned in my previous message that they would have cleared the overdraft of £1000 and paid the interest back on top of that. Thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I asked about other debts, if you had a lot of them tackling them one by one may not be the best option.
I am not suggesting you are greedy, just trying to get the full picture.
If they have removed the interest they charged – that is what the Ombudsman says they should do in 95% or or more of cases.
What evidence about your mental did did you provide and what have they now asked you for?
Whether a contract is void because of mental capacity does depend on the facts of the case. It is usually simpler to give them more evidence if they are asking for that rather than argue the legal point…
Whilst this is going forward, I suggest you get a new account with a different bank and switch to that – worst case then is the overdraft isnt cleared but you just pay a £1 a month to it and ask them to freeze interest.
Tom says
Hi Sara
Thanks for the reply.
Great advice thank you!
The medical evidence I provided was from my GP report on my medical file and also some evidence from the psychiatrist.
They haven’t asked for anything specific just that if they were to wipe the remaining debt they would require further medical evidence because what i provided wouldn’t be any good. I will look into opening a new account, thank you for the advice
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest you go back and ask what sort of evidence they would require.
Ceri Thomas says
I had been in conversation with Lloyds about aa unfordable overdraft given to me in late 2008.
I explained no affordability checks were made and I was on and remain on Disability Benefits.
Lloyds at one point removed my benefits for payment of my overdraft.
In 2010 I was went into a Debt Management Programme, By this time Lloyds had sold my debt to a third party..
Speaking to Lloyds they say the account is closed, I have not closed it and payments for my shares with Lloyds go into this account, so I asked where is that money, I received no reply.
I have taken my complaint to FOS, the lady I am dealing with is not really helpful.
The most recent reply state, ‘ she cannot comment as they haven’t investigated my complaint issue!.
They will only consider to investigate if there were exceptional circumstances, she says from what I have told her there is none!
Is she asking me to tell the FOS why the delay, I explained the debt was sold etc.
Is she asking was there something in y private life that caused the delay?
Such as a death etc?
She said I can disagree and have my complaint read by an Ombudsman.
I really didn’t think I had to put personal issues in my complaint, I will if needed.
I think I will ask for my complaint to be read by an Ombudsman.
Any comments/ advice would be great.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Most banks will reject complaints about things that happened more than 6 years ago so these have to go to the Ombudsman. Send your complaint to FOS now.
When a debt is sold, the account is closed.
If you own Lloyds shares where the dividends should have been paid into that account, you should ask them to explain where the dividends have gone – it may be they have passed them on to the debt purcaher, but you are entitled to an explanation about this and a statement of account that shows what has happened.
Ceri Thomas says
Thank you for your reply.
I replied as advised to the FOS and laid my life out.
Telling her that my mum had passed away, I had lost a sister in law through medical negligence negligence , taken on a Trust and won.
Also that I had been in hospital myself and continue to have treatment for a skeletal injury.
plus that my brother passed away and two very close friends, resulting in me attending counselling.
I really didn’t want to put this to writing but I did, her reply received today, 27th October was, no there re no exceptional circumstances in my case.
Should I wish to refer the case to the Ombudsmens he will forward it on.
Needless to say, yesI do want it forwarded on.
My life was upside down emotionally and continues to be, what does this person who is ‘helping’ me class as exceptional circumstances?
Kind regards
Ceri Thomas
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I hope the Ombudsman looks at this with a fresh pair of eyes.
Ceri Thomas says
Hi Sarah
Just received a reply from the Ombudsman, which surprised me how quick the repl came through.
Ombudsman’s decision is that I left it too late even though he sympathises and acknowledges why it was left so late.
But because I had spoken to Lloyds in 2015 I could of addressed my issues with them then.
I can’t remember talking to Lloyds in 2015, I do wonder how anyone was made ware of this because the FOS said they had not read any paperwork from Lloyds during my case.
So is that the end of my complaint now, can I do no more?
Kind regards
Ceri Thomas
Sara (Debt Camel) says
did you tell FOS you have no recollection of speaking to Lloyds in 2015? And asked what evidence there is about that call?
Ceri Thomas says
Hi Sarah,
Thank you for all your help with this matter.
Sorry for the delay I have been ‘digging’ through my Lloyds paperwork.
In reply to your comment on 18th.Nov.
I have found evidence of why I contacted Lloyds Bank on the dates they say.
I was asked by the Ombudsmen to contact my Local branch about a PPI letter.
Also I had received a letter saying my debt was paid in FULL. My Debt Management Company asked me to contact Lloyds to clerify before they responded.
This was 2015, my debt was not paid off until 2018!
On all occasions no one from lloyds would speak to me about my account because the account was ‘archieved’!
Do I follow up and pass this information onto the Ombudsman?
Kind regards
Ceri Thomas
Sara (Debt Camel) says
yes, do this straight away.
Ceri Thomas says
Hi Sara
On your instructions 21st Nov.2022 I sent all the information that showed the evidence why I had contacted Lloyds on the dates they say.
The FOS has just responded to me, (1/12/2022) stating the ombudsman”s mans decision is final and cannot be changed unless there was an error.
The information I supplied does not provide the error. The Ombudsmen decision stands.
Is that me done?
Thanks for all your help and support
Kind regards
Ceri
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I am sorry it is. There isn’t anything more that can be done here.
Ceri Thomas says
Hi
As you are aware I am searching to find where my Share dividends where being paid into as Lloyds said my account had been closed.
WhenI eventually got put through the correct department, the lady I spoke to informed me that any money paid into a closed account would ‘bounce’ back to Lloyds.
The lady I spoke to was adamant that I have an account with Lloyds, ending in 1350 the same sort code as my account inquestion.
If this is the case why did the FOS and the Ombudsman say my accounts were closed so they could not get the evidence they needed.
I struggled with this lady explaining my accounts were closed, so where was my dividends, small that they may be.
The result being, I was told to go into my local branch and enquire!!!
I explained my local branch, which I have tried, told me to contact the Share Dividend Team,
She then says if you have no luck ring us back and put the phone down.
Do I ask why the FOS didn’t get told about this account that is ‘open’?
I feel like the FOS let me down a bit I told them there has to be an account with a small amount of money in for them to see into my account.
Any advice will really appreciated
Kind regards
Ceri
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I am sorry but you need to go back to FOS and explain what you have been told.
mark says
thats the FOS got back to me….
RBS have contacted them and agreed to repay me interest and charges from March 2016 to September 2017……I cleared my overdraft at that point as i received a hefty lump sum when i took voluntary early retirement…
I will get back 700 plus 8 per cent on top of that……Really is worth sending to the FOS when banks issue their template rejection letter…
C says
My overdraft with Lloyds was taken to over £3000, when at the time I wasn’t even working. I was on the phone to them one day about another issue and I was asking for help, and I made a throwaway comment ‘you should never have given me the overdraft in the first place’. They then took this as an official complaint, investigated it and declined my complaint based on the fact that I’d had to request the overdraft increases. It had started at £500 and worked its way up over about a year.
As I didn’t realise that they’d taken it as a complaint, (I didn’t even realise I could complain about this) and therefore investigated it as such, and I didn’t know about the 6 months to send it to the ombudsman, so I didn’t.
When I mentioned this in a comment before you said that I could raise another complaint but with different wording. Their letter states that they investigated my comment that they should have never given me the overdraft in the first place. But in their write up they have referred to the increases that were made. Can I now complain and say that they should never have increased my overdraft limit after the initial £500? Because they’ve mentioned this, although they’ve stated that they investigated giving it to me in the first place.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
As I said before, you can’t make the same complaint twice. So it really matters what the first one was about.
From what you said at first it sounded as though you only complained about being given an overdraft in the first place.
But you then said their response said “Their complaint letter states that my complaint was that I was unhappy that they gave me an overdraft with no means to repay it, and the £3000 is now more than (and always has been) three times more than my monthly wage. They said that I feel the bank did not act responsibly by providing me an overdraft.”
Which suggests that they treated this as a complaint about the original overdraft and the increases.
So I said you had to go back to the ombudsman, not complain again to the bank. I think if you complain againt to the bank about the limit increases they will just say they have already responded.
If you cant get FOS to agree to look at this it isnt clear there is anything else that can be done.
C says
Thank you for finding that, I just couldn’t find it.
Their first paragraph of their complaint response stated that they were investigating, ‘you should never have given me the overdraft in the first place’.
I was hoping I could complain that they kept on increasing the overdraft, as I didn’t ask them to look into that on my initial complaint. Well I didn’t ask them to look into anything, but they did.
But in their response they referred to me opening the £500 overdraft, then said that each time they increased I clicked the button and filled in their mini form saying I understood what I was getting into. I couldn’t ever afford it, I wasn’t working when they gave it to me and increased it, my only income was universal credit and child benefit. And when I went back to work it was part time due to childcare and my wages were less than a third of the overdraft. Lloyds bank was my only bank.
So really I was wondering if I can ask them to look into the increases because even they haven’t claimed that I asked them to, even though they have mentioned them within their response. I can’t take that to the ombudsman as it’s been too long, and when I did find out that I could have done that, it was at about 9 months, I phoned the ombudsman and they said they wouldn’t accept it.
Also, if I can’t complain again, and I get taken to court for it, can I bring up irresponsible lending as a defence? The balance remaining is almost all, if not fully, just their charges now
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Have you actually sent this complaint to the Ombudsman or just talked to them on the phone and they said they would not take it?
Two optuions are:
1) to try to get FOS to take the complaint on the grounds that you never made an affordability complaint about the increases (I don’t know how likely this is to work)
2) to send Lloyds a new complaint saying that they have not treated you fairly since the 2019 complaint as it should have been clear in the annual reviews of your overdraft that it was unaffordable so you would like a refund of charges from that point. Do you know how much you have paid in charges since then?
I think realistically you would struggle to argue this as a defence in court. What is your current financail situation?
Dawny says
Hi Sara
good news, I went to the ombudsman in June 2022 and never expected to hear back until sometime in November as they have a backlog. I had an email back today to say that Santander have offered me all the interest back from 2016- March 2021. The overdraft was paid off by me in Jan 2021 but they still put charges on until March 2021. this amounts to £1532.26 and they are paying 8% on top of that which brings the total repayment to £1654. I am amazed and so thrilled I took your advice. I really appreciate your help. thanks so much :)
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Another comment saying Santander make a good offer when its sent to FOS after first rejecting it.
I am now aware of similar 5 cases since October.
BECKS MASH says
Hi how long after the decision did you receive the refund? I am currently waiting for a redress?
Catherine says
Hi All,
Any one had a recent decision from Santander about unaffordable overdraft lending.
Not seen many about Santander.
8weeks up on 1st of November for my complaint.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Here is one https://debtcamel.co.uk/get-refund-overdraft/comment-page-4/#comment-496428 where Santander turned down the complaint (or offered £50 goodwill payments) and so he went to the Ombudsman. Then Santander came back after a few months and offered him a full refund… so persevere if they reject yours!
Greg says
Few week back, got a letter from Santander washing their hands of the matter. I had already sent it to the Ombudsman as the 8 weeks was already well past. Got a few emails from the FOS telling me it was months of work outstanding so expect a delay. Expected movement early 2023.
Yesterday I got an email from the FOS telling me I have 7 days to accept or refuse all interest and fees plus 8% from 2016. Must be close to 4k when I tot it up.
Keep at them. Provide as much evidence to show constant overdraft usage, unaffordable interest etc.
Thanks Sarah… your a star 🌟
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I am now aware of several cases since October where Santander make a good offer before the Ombudsman even looks at the case
BECKS MASH says
For those where the Ombudsman came back and said Santander had agreed to refund fees, how long after this did Santander make payment? I’ve been told 4 weeks until I should contact FOS again but just wondering whether they take the whole 4 weeks or not normally?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
The only one I know the answer to was about 15 days.
Saz says
Hi,
I don’t know if anyone can help me? my complaint has been with FOS since early May which has been 6 months and is still waiting of a case holder? looking at comments people have sent in after me and already had a response and case handler given. do you think there is a reason for this? is this not good sign?
Thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
A lot of overdraft complaints are being picked up pretty quickly at the moment. Are you complaining about anything else as well?
Saz says
No just overdraft. I ended up ringing and they said it’s just waiting for case handler said it should be any day due to being on there since may. and they have all the information they need from Halifax. Only thing I can think of is that it’s because it’s complicated case?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I don’t think so. That suggests someone has looked at and thought about your case and put it in the “complicated” pile (which so far as I know doesn’t exist). I don’t think that happens before your case is allocated to an adjudicator.
Catherine says
I sent my case to FOS against Santander a few days ago and they said it could be a few weeks to set case up and 4 months to investigate.
Although my complaint was addressed in 2 parts and they upheld the unaffordable overdraft part and have refunded charges bar 3 months from when I first added overdraft but I had a lot of other issues that I don’t think have been resolved fairly in regards to support and account management and gambling related harm that they have not upheld or offered comp for the poor support.
I had asked for card and account to be blocked multiple times since 2021and they didn’t do anything.
My father passed away I had no support among other things.
There final response was that it’s not their fault that their blocking features don’t work very well it’s Mastercards fault.
My point is they failed to act when they were fully aware of my issues and this resulted in harm.
Don’t know what the FOS take on it will be but I’ve read lots of case studies about gambling related harm that were upheld and those were customers that hadn’t told the bank of their issues but I did,and multiple times too,so hoping FOS say they should of done more.
BECKS MASH says
What does this actually mean and how long can Barclays just go on ignoring the FOS?
Unfortunately I still haven’t received a response from Barclays. I have therefore escalated this complaint to our operational contact team. This team will liaise with Barclays management.
I appreciate your patience and understand it can be frustrating having to wait for a response. I will continue to keep an eye on this and will be in touch again once I have further updates.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
remind me what stage your complaint is at?
BECKS MASH says
It was with Barclays April to July. After the 8 weeks and no response I sent to FOS, they came back start of Oct to say they believed Barclays should refund all charges etc from March 2017. Barclays had until 17th Oct to respond. They then have them till 31st Oct. Still nothing
Sara (Debt Camel) says
At some point the adjudicator will give up and put your case in the queue for a second level “Ombudsman” decision. In 90% of cases that is the same as the adjudicators decision.
An Ombudsman decision is legally binding and Barclays can’t ignore it.
Richard says
My Iva failed, can I still complain to my bank regarding overdraft
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Was the overdraft included in your IVA?
How long ago did the IVA fail and why? What are you doing about the debts that were in the IVA?
Richard says
Hi Sara
Yes the overdraft was included.
Iva started 2019 and I terminated it this year after being missold it. I had complained.
The other debt ive contacted them to arrange repayment and also have sent unaffordable complaints in.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Was it missold because it was unaffordable? Or because you did not need a form of insolvency?
If you win an affordability complaint when you owe a balance, the refund is first used to reduce that balance. Which is presumably your main priority.
If there is a cash refund free that it may be claimed by your IVA firm, or it may not. I don’t remember seeing a case like this recently..
Dawny says
Hi Sara thanks for your help. I received a refund from Santander with regards to an unaffordable overdraft. I received a payment of £1965.03. I thought I would get nearer to £1600 and would have been happy with £250. The letter states that they gave me 8% annual interest but deducted £108 for income tax at 20%. It states that I can claim this back if it does not exceed my personal savings allowance. does it?? I am on a low wage but pay normal income tax and have a standard tax code. I have very little in savings (£2000 this has now gone up to £3900), and receive minimal interest. so my question is how do I know if the £108 they deducted for income tax can be claimed back as I am unsure what my personal savings allowance actually is?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Yes you can claim that back. See https://debtcamel.co.uk/ppi-payday-refund-get-back-tax/
Helena says
My husband has an overdraft with Natwest for £2,400. He is constantly in it. He has been with Natwest since he was 16 (he is now 37) he cant remember when it was increased to £2,400 but it was at some point. As he has the overdraft for a long time can we still put a complaint in?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
So he is in it every day of the month?
Helena Gray says
Hi Sara,
Thank You for coming back to me so quickly. Yes, when he gets paid it does clear him by £870 however once we pay our bills he is back in it which is straight away as he will transfer to our joint account etc. Also up until last year his overdraft was always more than his monthly wage. Its only in the last year his monthly wage is more than his overdraft.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Ok so this definitely worth a complaint. He should hope to get back the last 6 years overdraft fees. If he goes to the Ombudsman he may get back more, but decisions for more than 6 years are erratic.
Stu says
Hi, Any examples of how easy TSB are to deal with regarding overdrafts/affordability complaints?
I essentially live in a £3000 overdraft, even when wage goes in it doesn’t clear it and each month I end up back at the max of overdraft. This has been the case for about 4 years now and before that the overdraft went up in 4 or 5 increments from £1000 and eventually £3000 despite my wage never ever been in excess of £2000 nevermind £3000.
I have debts and at the time of increasing overdraft was in desperate mindset and things spiralled. The past 3 years have seen me stabilise finances – repayment plans are in place elsewhere and steadily paying things off but overdraft monthly fee is £70 and I’m just stuck in it.
I haven’t been contacted by TSB ever regarding a review or if I’m having difficulties etc.
At the time it would have been very clear reviewing my account that there were financial difficulties and although no-one is knocking on my door now, I am still heavily repaying debt in many areas plus this £3000 overdraft – I am stretched to the limit.
Is there any case here to submit an affordability complaint with TSB?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Definitely. Point out in your complaint that your wage is less than the overdraft so you are not able to start to reduce it and say this “hardcore borrowing” is a sign of financial difficulty they should have noticed years ago.
If TSB reject it, or make you a Poor offer, send this to the Ombudsman.
Stu says
Thank you for your quick response. I will submit this tomorrow and update you on progress once I hear anything. What an incredible service you are offering here. I’m not counting my chickens but looking through things certainly gives me hope that I could get somewhere.
If I do it would be such a boost!
Stuart Riby says
Hi Sara. An update on this one with TSB.
After putting in the complaint at the end of November I received acknowledgment of the complaint and just before Xmas another letter stating a response would be sent within 14 days.
I have yet to receive an official response to the complaint not have I spoken to anyone from TSB but today I logged in my online banking to find the £3000 overdraft taken away and a further deposit of £570.
The transactions were listed as a series of payments all referencing ‘monthly OD usage fee’ and older charges. Plus the deposit of £570 after all the itemised fees were put in.
This is incredible and I’m over the moon, such a long time worrying about how I could ever begin to deal with it before finding this website and less than two months later I have no overdraft and a positive balance for the first time in years!
Thank you so very much, I will be spreading the word of your wonderful website.
Final question – I assume I will be receiving some communication shortly about the result of the complaint and what they have refunded me. Do you have any further advice – I haven’t formally accepted anything as I haven’t spoken to them. Once I review what they have paid back and how far they went back if I believe their refund low can I still take it further?
Sounds like I’m being greedy, more curious, I’m delighted with the outcome already.
Thanks again!
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Curious is good – wait until you get the response and then come back and say what it was and if you think it should be more.
There must be some 8% interest added in there and that will have tax deducted – you can reclaim up to £200 of tax deducted from HMRC , see https://debtcamel.co.uk/ppi-payday-refund-get-back-tax/
Stuart Riby says
Hi Sara. Still waiting for formal communication from TSB.
In the meantime, having read some of your responses on here I wanted to ask about loans.
This complaint that TSB have refunded was purely about my overdraft with them.
During the same period as the overdraft they approved two loans to me- one for £1000 and one for £6000 – both high interest for bank loans and we’re a big part of my struggles over the years. Both are paid off now but can I submit a similar complaint to TSB about the loans?
Or should I have done it alongside the overdraft complaint?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Yes you can complain about the loans. I suggest you start with the template on this page https://debtcamel.co.uk/ppi-payday-refund-get-back-tax/ and add in a paragraph saying they should have been blue to tell from your overdraft with them that the loans would not be affordable.
Neil says
Hi Stuart,
In a very similar situation to yourself (a £3000 overdraft with TSB) that I have been living in despite my wage being paid in every month. Like you also, has been the case for about 4-5 years now. I had 19 increases in total over the course of 7 months with multiple increases on the same day. I have had no contact from TSB whatsoever, I’m assuming because they’ve managed to successfully take the fees every month as it is the account I get paid into. I haven’t gone into an unarranged overdraft in 2 or 3 years however it has nonetheless still been a financial burden on me. I am currently paying back 4 unsecured loans, and ironically last month finished paying back a £500 loan from TSB. I have submitted my complaint via the app through the chat today, but have yet to receive an official acknowledgement outside of what seems to be an automated response “we’ve passed your query on to the relevant team. We’ll get you connected to an agent soon”
Just curious as to how the process went for you? Having seen your outcome, I am hoping to hear something similar back from them so I can finally see the end of this.
Stuart says
Hi Neil,
To be honest, it couldn’t have been easier or more straightforward – I couldn’t believe it
Once I had put in the initial complaint at the end of November (I used the website) I didn’t have to anything at all.
I, like you, received the immediate acknowledgement. I received something similar via letter shortly after and then towards the end of December received another letter saying I would hear about their decision/response within 14 days.
Within those 14 days all fees were paid back into my account, overdraft cleared and removed plus a bit more from the interest.
I still haven’t had any communication from them by letter, email, in-app inbox etc about the payments or how they came to the decision – just logged in one day and it was all done.
Very best of luck, I hope it goes the same way – the feeling of relief when checking my account is still with me even though it’s been a few weeks.
Neil says
Hi Stuart,
Just curious if you’ve yet to receive anything formal in the post from TSB about the refund?
I received a letter in the post dated 2 weeks ago saying they’re currently investigating but haven’t given a timeline
Tom says
Hi Neil
I sent the complaint on January 26th. I got a letter yesterday saying they are still working on my complaint. They promise that I will get a final answer within 4 weeks.
Do you have any update?
Kim says
I have recently had my claim agreed and accepted with virgin/clydesdale after going through the FOS and I am currently waiting to hear the final calculation of refund from the bank (anyone have any idea how long this will take?). All interest to be repaid for last 6 years and if once the refund clears my overdraft which is set at £2400 any extra that has to be repaid to me plus 8% – I am expecting the full refund to be around £3500. My question is – at present I am in my overdraft by around £1500 – would it be of any benefit to me to clear this overdraft prior to the calculation and refund issued or will it make no difference? I was thinking possibly I would be due more interest if there was no as much of the refund used to pay off the overdraft (if that makes sense). Any advice gratefully received!
Sara (Debt Camel) says
It will make virtually no difference as the 8% interest is per annum so if you have only cleared the account for say two weeks before the calculation you would only get an extra £5. Not worth the hassle as it may delay the calculation.
PS nice result!
Rachel says
Hi Sara,
Firstly as always many thanks for your help, I got thousands of pounds back from various payday loans with your templates, thought my days of refunds were over till I saw this about overdrafts, about two weeks ago I complained to NatWest about my £2500 overdraft using your template, which I have been in for years and years getting charged around £60/£70 a month interest, I was in a payday loan cycle from around 2015/2019 can’t remember exact dates but currently don’t have any just CCs and overdraft, NatWest have come back saying they haven’t done anything wrong but as a goodwill gesture given me £191 which equates to three months interest charges I have paid, is it worth sending this to the FOS? Thanks in advance
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Are you in the overdraft all month?
Your credit cards – does that include one from NatWest?
Rachel says
Thanks for the reply Sara yes I am in the overdraft the entire month even when my pay goes in, no but I have a loan from them? X
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Then definitely send this to FOS – being in your overdraft like that is “hardcore borrowing” and NatWest should have noticed you were in difficulty.
The loan – how large was it and what interest rate?
Rachel says
Okay thanks so much for the advise I’ll send it over , there are actually 2 one for 7k and one for 10k x
Sara (Debt Camel) says
what were the interest rates on the loans? because if the bank new you were in the overdraft all month, then perhaps they shouldn’t have given you such large loans?
Rachel says
They are 20% will that be a separate complaint?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Ouch! So your bank knew you were in difficulty or it would never have charged so much interest.
You could have started this as a single complaint originally but now it’s easier to send the OD one to FOS now and start a new complaint.
In the OD conmmplaint going to FOS, mention that NatWest also gave you two expensive loans over this period and you are making a seperate complaint about this. point out that NatWest should have seen from the OD that you couldnt afford the loans and you applications for the loans should have meant they looked at your overall situation and realised your overdraft was already unmanageable.
In the loan complaint (use the template here https://debtcamel.co.uk/refunds-large-high-cost-loans/) add in a sentence saying you have already made a complaint about your overdraft which has been sent to the Ombudsman, this is in addition to that complaint and they should have seen from your ovrdraft that you were struggling anf could not afford such large loans.
Rachel says
Thanks so much Sara, I have sent the OD one to the FOS, do you think I should wait till that’s all done and dusted before I raise the complaint on the loans? How does it work tho because I still have quite a few years left to pay on the loans I have only ever had refunds back from loans I have paid off with other loans so if you still have the loans what happens if they do agree to pay back the interest but then it won’t be enough to clear the loans do you just carry on paying the interest again till the loan is done? Hope that makes sense! X
Sara (Debt Camel) says
do you think I should wait till that’s all done and dusted before I raise the complaint on the loans?
No, get on with it now.
if you still have the loans what happens if they do agree to pay back the interest but then it won’t be enough to clear the loans do you just carry on paying the interest again
What happens is that the balance is adjusted so that in total you only have to repay what you borrowed. eg you borrow £1000, have paid £700, the balance is £550. If you win the complaint the balance is adjusted to £300 which you pay off at an affordable rate. At the end you have repaid £1000, what you borrowed, no interest.
Rachel says
Okay great thanks Sara I have sent an email to Natwest, I will let you know if I get any wins from either complaint, thanks so much for your time x
Catherine says
Hi so I had a Santander overdraft complaint upheld,the refund was used to clear some of the overdraft so still a balance left to pay and I was told to contact the financial support department to arrange a repayment plan.
I’d already stopped using the account when I put the complaint in.
They have said that either I repay the arranged overdraft left in my own time but interest and fees would continue to be added?????but it would not effect credit file.
Confused as surely if I did that I could submit another complaint that they continued to add interest on a already upheld unaffordable overdraft complaint??
Or they remove the arranged overdraft facility and put it as Unarranged and they would stop interest and account fees and I pay whatever a month to reduce it,but this would be a informal arrangement and they will record as in arrears on credit report and may default down the line??
Surely if the overdraft had been deemed irresponsible to lend I should have a affordable repayment plan with no interest on it and account should be not have negative markers on credit file??
I can’t use the account other than to add funds to be used to reduce overdraft and once paid it will be closed.
Fine with that as Santander is shocking.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
could you say what the words Santander have used are about how much they are refunding you and why.
Catherine says
Following our review, we have made the decision to refund all charges related to your usage of your arranged overdraft facility since 1 July 2018, these refunds have already begun to be processed and this action we hope to be fully completed within the next 7-10 working days. Once this has been completed, we will then arrange for the overdraft facility to be reduced by this amount and ask our Financial Support Team to contact you to discuss the next steps for setting up an arrangement for repaying the overdraft amount.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
And how large is the remaining balance?
Catherine says
£1856 left to pay
Sara (Debt Camel) says
That’s quite a lot. I was going to say if it was a couple of hundred it may be simpler to pay it off over the next few months.
I suggest you go back to Santander and say unless they allow you to pay this off without further interest being added and without this harming your credit record, you will be sending the complaint to the Ombudsman.
Catherine says
I said I would seek some advice about whether if I enter plan with interest stopped if they are even allowed to record negative markers given it was unaffordable to lend in the first place.
Like I said they said if I didn’t want it to harm my credit file then they wouldn’t put a plan in place I would just pay it down on my own but they would start to add interest and fees again.
I said that wasn’t an option as I wouldn’t be able to pay anything off it if they added interest again.
He then confirmed again if they freeze interest on remaining balance they would record negative markers and possibly add a default.
I’m not sure why it’s an informal arrangement when as part of the resolution they said to contact financial support and put a plan in place. I have,so is that not a formal agreement?
Want to make sure I’m understanding what they should/shouldn’t be doing so I know whether to make another complaint.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I think this is all part of your current complaint, so you don’t need to start a new one. It isn’t reasonable to refund over several years and still leave you with an overdraft you will struggle to pay off if they carry on adding interest.
Tell them unless they agree to let you pay this off with no more interest being added and with no impact on your credit record, you will be sending the complaint to the Ombudsman.
The distinction here between formal and informal isn’t really relevant, I suggest not getting bogged down with it.
Catherine says
This was one of messages from financial support-
I need to be open and honest with you.
No formal arrangement has been agreed today and so your credit file will not show an arrangement flag.
***But I’ve filled in a budget planner and agreed to pay a set amount each month to pay balance
As your account will soon move into an arrears position, the arrears will show on your credit file too.
**** why would it be in arrears??
If you do not want your credit file to be impacted then there is an option not to do anything further and for you to manage the balance and any interest and account fees on your own.
***surely as the overdraft was deemed irresponsible lending then adding interest wouldn’t help
Sara (Debt Camel) says
***But I’ve filled in a budget planner and agreed to pay a set amount each month to pay balance
An agreement to pay is not a formal legal contract. There is no point in arguing with them about this.
**** why would it be in arrears??
Because you are not paying the standard charges associated with your type of account.
***surely as the overdraft was deemed irresponsible lending then adding interest wouldn’t help
Exactly. This is an unreasonable position for Santander to take after they have agreed your overdraft is unaffordable. Tell them this and say it goes to the Ombudsman if they won’t change their mind.
BECKS MASH says
Hi all. Any one have any experience with Barclays? The FOS have upheld my claim and said Barclays need to refund interest and fees from March 2017. Barclays have now agreed and the FOS have given them to Dec 5th to pay the redress. What I am asking is how likely is Barclays to meet that deadline. They have failed to meet every other deadline from initial complaint to FOS deadlines.
Ernest says
Good evening Sara .pls l need your advice for a friend about Halifax overdraft complain…£2350.
Halifax didn’t treat Ms D fairly and reasonably. I don’t think that Halifax did treat Ms D unfairly or unreasonably here though. I say this because having looked at Ms D’s statements I can’t see anything to suggest that Halifax ought to have realised she might have been experiencing financial difficulty prior to it being notified of this.
Ms D may argue her regular use of her overdraft was in itself an indication that she was struggling. But while I’m not seeking to make retrospective value judgements over Ms D expenditure, nonetheless there are significant amounts of non-committed, non-contractual and discretionary transactions – in particular regular spending on high end retail shops.
There were regular credits and cash transfers into the account and Ms D was able to bring the overdraft down and sometimes pay it off before once again going on to use her overdraft to make debit card transactions, further money transfers and cash withdrawals. I accept this doesn’t necessarily mean that Mrs I wasn’t experiencing financial difficulty. But there isn’t anything in these transactions in themselves which ought to have alerted Halifax to any potential financial difficulty. And although there were periods of time where Ms D didn’t see a credit balance Ms D kept within her limit and was often at the lower end of it.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
It sounds like a normal decision to me. Unless you disagree with any of the facts?
Ernest says
So taking everything into consideration I don’t think Halifax treated Ms D unfairly or unreasonably which means that I’m currently not minded to uphold this complaint.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
That s disagreeing with the conclsion – I am asking if you disagree with any of the facts listed that the conclusion was based on.
Ernest says
NO l was thinking did not accept the complain … maybe they reject it that is what am thinking they saying on the letter
Sara (Debt Camel) says
rejecting this complaint sounds like the normal decision if the facts are what the FOS investigator has stated.
” there are significant amounts of non-committed, non-contractual and discretionary transactions – in particular regular spending on high end retail shops. There were regular credits and cash transfers into the account and Ms D was able to bring the overdraft down and sometimes pay it off before once again going on to use her overdraft to make debit card transactions, further money transfers and cash withdrawals.”
Unless any of this is wrong, then this doesn’t sound like a good complaint.
BECKS MASH says
8 months and Barclays have finally paid up £7750 in returned fees/charges!!! Happy dance right now
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Well done!
cyrilv says
Sent my complaint against Halifax end of July, they received it early August. Since then nothing except a pro-forma reply when I asked them about my claim in November. No case assessor appointed yet, nothing. Is this normal, even allowing for the fact that FOS are sure to be busy? What kind of time scales are people here getting in between sending off their complaints and the cases being picked up by the handlers?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
the comment above said 8 months from start to being paid.
cyrilv says
Thank you. So I’ll expect the result, be it positive or negative, around April?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
you just asked what others’ experiences are. I’m not saying most are around 8 months!
Max says
Hi Sara,
Good news! It appears I’ve won my case against Halifax (detailed previously on this thread) at long, long last as Ombudsman has partially upheld my complaint in a provisional ruling after an adjudicator threw it out completely back in the summer.
I wanted them to go back to even before the 2012 OD increase from £900 to £1,600, but ruling is only the early 2013 hike to £2,000 was unaffordable.
That said, Ombudsman said at that point financial distress should have been obvious and forbearance initiated, hence decision is a refund of ALL interest, fees and charges from February 2013.
Am happy with that as worth over £4,000 plus a good few hundred pounds in simple interest. Process has been a long one given another Ombudsman first had to rule they could go back that far under the three-year rule.
Best of luck to everyone else with similar complaints.
Max
Sara (Debt Camel) says
That is good news.
Max says
Hi Sara,
Final update: Halifax accepted the Ombudsman’s provisional decision and the final decision (same as provisional) was taken a week ago.
Today, slightly more than £5,000 has hit my account via two payments and the overdraft facility withdrawn, as per the Ombudsman’s instructions.
I’ll lose some of the £1,000 simple interest to the taxman, but c’est la vie.
Whole process took about 20 months and I sent as evidence to support my case a whole load of docs, including that from a SAR to Halifax.
Between 2012 and 2021, I utilised my OD around 93% of the time (nearly 3,400 days) and often went heavily back into it just a few days after my salary was paid in, meaning there was a clear pattern.
The Ombudsman noted I ended up turning to payday loans and high-cost credit and that “the fact that Halifax continued to allow him to use his overdraft in the same way notwithstanding the annual reviews which took place and what was happening on his account, is further reason why I’m satisfied that Halifax failed to act fairly and reasonably.”
Cheers,
Max
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Excellent.
Read https://debtcamel.co.uk/ppi-payday-refund-get-back-tax/ as you may be able to reclaim up to £200 of the tax deducted from HMRC.
Max says
Yes, thanks for the link, Sara.
Actually, due to my successes against various companies over the past 18 months or so, it looks like I owe HMRC some money (for tax year 2021-2022, anyway), but trying to speak to someone is proving impossible and a part of me feels I should better utilise my time elsewhere, as they’ll be in touch in once their dated systems flag it.
You’d think they’d be a way of messaging/paying them via my online HMRC account, but seems not; though having had several dealings with HMRC over the years it really doesn’t surprise me one bit…
Thanks again for your superb work, you really do show people in dark circumstances the light.
Max
AQ says
Hello, Lloyds upheld my complaint partially 2 months ago and paid back interest citing 6 year rule. Should I go to ombudsman and ask to go even before 2017. Thank you
Sara (Debt Camel) says
so Lloyds paid you back 6 years of interest and charges? Did they ask you to accept the offer or did they just pay it without you accepting it?
AQ says
They just paid it , I told him over the phone I don’t accept this offer and he went so you don’t want me transfer money then and the money was in my account within half an hour ,I told him I’ll go to ombudsman to which he replied I can tell you categorically ombudsman will never take up your case as they can’t go back prior the 6 years. But in the letter he did mention you can take your complaint to ombudsman.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
“I told him over the phone I don’t accept this offer and he went so you don’t want me transfer money then and the money was in my account within half an hour”
so did you say you did accept the offer? or that you wanted the money? or did he just do it?
How much did you get paid? (write off and cash refund)
when did you overdraft problems start? what date do you think you should be refunded from and do you know how much extra that would be?
AQ says
I never accepted the offer that’s why I kept on saying to him I’ll go to ombudsman but when I searched online it said it has to be only 6 years so I didn’t go to ombudsman but today when I saw the above thread I realised probably that’s not the case. But I may have said I do need/want the money.
Total refund was £4229. They deducted £2400 and remaining transferred to my account.
I think problem with overdraft starting around 2012/13 so refund should be from that date. So if they agree from 2012 onwards it maybe over £4k
Sara (Debt Camel) says
do you know what interest / charges you paid per year from 2012 – the date they have refunded from?
I am not trying to put you off doing this.
AQ says
I have no idea but I remember it used to be £45+ as they used to charge monthly rather than daily at that time
they have refunded from 7th of July 2017
Sara (Debt Camel) says
So that may be 5 years at about £550 a year = £2750
Often the Ombudsman may say you would only get a refund after a year or two years of problems as the bank would not have realised at the start that your difficulties were persistent.
It’s up to you if you want to go to the ombudsman. If you do, emphasise you did not accept their offer and they tried to put you off going to the Ombudsman. explain you have only recently found out about these cases, say when and how you found out a bank should have checked affordability.
Louise says
Hi Sara
I put in a complaint to Barclays and got a response today… They didn’t agree with me and felt they acted fairly but agreed to refund me £1970 as a gesture of goodwill……do you think its worth accepting or do you think I would be entitled to more if I challenged their decision? I dont want to lose what they have already offered!
Thank you so much for all your help thus far!
Louise
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Can you say a bit about your case – is the £1970 a refund for certain years? are these the main years you had problems for?
BECKS MASH says
Hi Sara
In relation to my Barclays Overdraft charges refund they have taken £411 tax. Is this something I can claim back after April?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
yes probably, see https://debtcamel.co.uk/ppi-payday-refund-get-back-tax/
Lloyd says
Hi Sara – I wrote nationwide about 10 days ago with an affordability complaint and used the address you have listed for them which is tina.jones@nationwide.co.uk. I’ve had no acknowledgment at all. Can see she is head of complaints at Nationwide, is this the correct email to use still or are you aware of another?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
They now have a new one on the FCA register: karlene.white@nationwide.co.uk. I suggest you forward your email to Tina Jones to that address and say you have not yet had an acknowledgment or a reply.
Can you let me know what the result is?
Lloyd says
Hello – I’ve had an email back from member services team within a day to apologise and say it’s been picked up by a senior member of their team. Will keep you posted on any update. Thanks 🙏
Ed Moody says
Hi all, reading some decent success stories, wondered what my chances are on this,
In 2011/12 I managed to up my overdraft on my Lloyd’s current account online, to £5000.
I had no stable income at the time,
And what was being banked monthly was probably around 1000 per month.
I’ve been sat in this overdraft for 90% even til now.
I’ve had missed mortgage payments because of it and all sorts in 2017/18.
I’m not amazing at writing emails and would if possible really benefit with some help with the templates to make sure I don’t get anything wrong.
Thanks so much
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Take the template above and add it the bits you have said – that they give you a huge overdraft limit when you had no stable income, that it has caused problems ever since, including mortgage arrears. Add that they should have seen the difficulties when they reviewed your overdraft annually and they should have offered forbearance.
If they reject this completely, send it to the Ombudsman straight away. If they make an offer that doesn’t sound great, come back here and check before accepting it!
John says
Hi I used an English cmc company I’m from Northern Ireland,and won a redress 9007pound the cmc is charging 33.6% meaning there fee is 3000 pound ,this Seems particularly high ,I’m sure I read that 28% or 2500 maximum they could charge
Also the redress would get me out of debt ,presently do cmc companies offer to take payment montly for fees ,abd as I live in Northern Ireland if I didn’t pay fees what powers have cmc got to pursue me
Sara (Debt Camel) says
it is a shame you have wasted the money on a cmc.
The caps you quote do not include VAT :(
I can’t give advice on what can happen in Northern Ireland if you don’t pay, talk to your local Citizens Advice or phone the NI Debt Helpline: 0800 028 1881
BECKS MASH says
Another person winning against Santander! They have agreed to refund all charges/fees on my 3 overdrafts from Dec 2016 onwards. This was after only being with the FOS for 2 weeks.
Ed part 1 says
Hi sara, thanks for the advice, would this be ok to send?
I’m not the best with writing letters so want to make sure i cover all the correct areas to rectify my life.
I was given ccj’s for a few things too through this, anyway i can right those wrongs?
I am making an affordability complaint about the overdraft on my current account number [personal details]
You should not have increased my overdraft limit around 2009 When you increased the limit, you should have seen I had low regular income and many previous returned Direct Debits and unplanned od charges.
I do not know the exact months of these overdraft limit increases. In your reply to this complaint, please tell me when the increases were and how much the limit went up on each occasion.
ed part 2 says
By 2022 I had a large unauthorised overdraft for many days each month.
I had a loan account I couldn’t keep up payments with, again through yourselves then sold to PRA group with the balance £6440.00 on April 11th 2019
I missed mortgage payments between 2017 and 2019.
I had a vehicle repossessed due to missing payments too frequently within 2018-2019
Overdrafts are meant for short-term borrowing but that was not what I was using the account for. The overdrafts fees and charges you were adding were making my position worse.
My loan application should never have been accepted with such a substantial OD facility, I’ve been in and out severe debt for more than 10 years and am struggling to this day.
I would like you to refund all the interest and charges that were added to my account from 2012 when you should have realised that my finances had got worse to the point that I was no longer able to clear the overdraft.
The Financial Ombudsman says that 8% simple interest should be added to any cash refund paid to me.
I would also like any late payment and default markers to be removed from my credit records.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
That looks like a good start.
I would change the first sentence to read:
“I am making an affordability complaint about the overdraft on my current account number xxxx and the loan account number xxxxxx” [personal details]
Do you know roughly when you took out the loan? It was just the loan that was sold to PRA? They then got a CCJ?
I would add in a sentence saying that “Despite selling the defaulted loan to PRA, you carried on adding interest and charges to my overdraft.”
I would add a sentence at the end saying that “Please arrange with PRA for the CCJ on the defaulted loan to be set aside.”
You mentioned CCJs in the plural – have you had any other CCJs from debts with this bank?
I assume the mortgage was with a different lender?
e says
I can’t remember if they went to ccj or not, they ,may just be accounts they hold now. I can’t view on my credit file who filed the ccj’s, only the case no.
Do you know roughly when you took out the loan? It was just the loan that was sold to PRA? They then got a CCJ?
11/12/16, and also a credit card with lloyds that went to PRA too.
I would add in a sentence saying that “Despite selling the defaulted loan to PRA, you carried on adding interest and charges to my overdraft.”
I would add a sentence at the end saying that “Please arrange with PRA for the CCJ on the defaulted loan to be set aside.”
You mentioned CCJs in the plural – have you had any other CCJs from debts with this bank? i have 6… 1 has been struck off and i need to find a way to take it off the register too.
I assume the mortgage was with a different lender? natwest
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Were the overdraft and loan also with lloyds?
i have 6… 1 has been struck off and i need to find a way to take it off the register too.
What do you mean by “struck off – what happened?
e says
I went to court to fight the claim, and the other party didnt even turn up, and the particulars of claim were all wrong so the judge struck it off.
it still shows on my credit report as I’m not sure how to remove it.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
so this debt you were disputing in court – are you denying it was your debt? or why were you disputing it? what is the default date on your credit record?
E says
Yeh, currently still have the overdraft.
Lloyd’s loan went to PRA
Lloyd’s Credit card went to PRA
Sara (Debt Camel) says
so you have an overdraft, credit card and a loan from lloyds. I suggest you complain about all three of them. The more your bank knows about you, the less they should give you extra credit you could not afford!
DD says
Hi Sara,
I just have a query on this, apologies if it has been answered.
So I never had an official overdraft with HSBC but would go into unauthorised overdraft, get charges and have direct debts refused and get further charges. Sometimes these charges would see go into overdraft again and get further charges.
I am still with HSBC but have managed to stay out of overdraft for over a year now.
I have two questions. I wondered if I can still claim a refund? If so, will my account be closed?
Thank you.
Sorry for anon but I can’t post under my name as it could affect my job (linked to financial advice).
Sara (Debt Camel) says
How frequently was your unauthorised overdraft used? there is a big difference between a few days a year and a couple of weeks every month.
DD says
Thanks for your reply. It would have been pretty much monthly for a couple of years at least, and for more than a week every time.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
so you could complain and say that the bank should have realised that your unauthorised overdraft usage was not very occaisional but had become a routine every month. Point out the very high charges and failed direct debit charges etc made it harder to try to resolve your prblems.
If you had ever asked for an overdraft and been rejected, say this was unfair as that would have made your problems much less, so they were just profiting from your difficulty. .
DD says
That’s brilliant, thank you. I did ask for an overdraft at the time too and they refused. So it sounds like I’m in a good place to complain.
I still bank with them, would they close my account? It’s not a problem to move banks would just want to do it before I start the process.
Thanks again
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Banks don’t normally close accounts just because a complaint has been made.
I’m not saying this is a strong complaint, that may depend how long the unauthorised overdraft usage went on for. But it’s worth a complaint and send it to the Ombudsman if it is rejected.
Matt Williams says
I put in a similar complaint with HSBC in October – unauthorised overdraft charges for at least 2-3 weeks every single month dating back to October 2016 (the charges and activity actually went on a couple of years before that too but I didn’t want my complaint to be held up by the longer than 6 year stuff). I had also applied for a formal overdraft on 2 or 3 occasions and been declined.
They rejected my complaint so it’s now with the FOS. It was a bit of a surprise to be honest – if you look at the FOS website there are several decisions against HSBC for complaints in similar circumstances so you have to wonder why they would think this one was different.
Their reasoning was almost comical, even going so far as to tell me they wouldn’t have been able to control how much I debited from my account on my card! When it gets picked up at the FOS I’ll let you know the outcome as it sounds similar to my case.
DD says
Thank you for this. It’s good to know there’s a precedent. I figured that they wouldn’t just give over any money and that it may be a struggle. I deal with many different financial issues through my work and I’m no longer surprised at the things they will try to duck responsibility.
I’ve got a couple of app based bank accounts and I’m honestly thinking of switching to one of them permanently anyway, especially now they’re established and generally more ‘ethical’.
DD says
I went back over the last 6 years of statements and saw that I was charged over £1200 in unauthorised fess and interest in just 2 of those years alone (which was almost a month’s wages at the time). One year, 2016-17, had 181 separate charges.
So I’ve put in a modified version of the letter and will keep my fingers crossed. I’m expecting that they’ll refuse but I’m happy to go to the ombudsman if that is the case.
Thanks Sara and everyone for help and advice. I will update as soon as I know anything.
DD says
So HSBC refused my claim in record time – 5 days. Their response completely ignored most of the points I raised and just told me that the charges were allowed then and that they no longer charge them in the same way. To be honest the letter was pretty patronising and very dismissive.
I have raised it with the FOS, I’m not expecting to win, but I feel that I need to be heard – especially as they ignored most of the content of my complaint, including the circumstances at the time. Once it’s sorted I’ll be switching banks too.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Let me know what the adjudicator at the Ombudsman decides.
Peter says
Good morning everyone,
I’ve been in financial struggle for like last 5-6 years. I have currently overdraft with Lloyd’s and credit card. I’ve been using other bank account for like last 2 years just because of my lloyds overdraft and have kept the balances on the account. Initially I had £1000 overdraft and £1250 on credit card. As of today, I have managed to reduce OD limit to £650 and CC to £1200. My credit score is poor but I’ve been trying to get it higher as much as I can, clearing the defaults I had with with payday loans. I also tried to get like debt consolidation loan from Lloyds to clear the OD and CC, but got rejected because of my score and financial situation. Is there any chance I could get refunded for my OD from Lloyds? Any suggestions, advice would be appreciated. Thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
The card is from Lloyds as well?
Peter says
Yes. I tried to reduce CC limit like I do with OD but it’s not possible.
Forgot to mention, on my bank account statements you can also see bounced back DD, payday loans etc.
I was using overdraft for the like 95% of the month, because when it was at £1000, my wages were between 12-17 hundred and after my payday most of it was gone in rent, utility bills etc.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
This sounds like a good complaint. You could also complain about the credit card in the same complaint as the overdraft.
PS when you said “clearing the defaults I had with with payday loans. ” do you mean you have been trying to clear payday laons that you defaulted on? or that you have been taking out payday loans in order to clear other defaults?
Peter says
When I was using Lloyd’s as my main account, I took payday loans as well but eventually it all caught up and those payday loans became defaults. I believe I had 6-8 defaults. I complained about them as well, most of them were upheld (4 or 5), for other 3 (my fault), I had to pay off balance to get it cleared from my credit file. For the last two years, I’ve been working so many extra hours to clear those 3 loans off, but, finally, I’ve just done my last payment for the final loan. Now, I would like to clear the Lloyd’s thing off but not sure where to start and is it worth it to complain.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
this definitely sounds worth a complaint to me.
Peter says
Should I just use one of the templates and try my luck? Thank you again for your help. I’m still not in really good financial place, but because of you and your website which I’ve been following last couple of years I’m on my way here.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Yes, start with the overdraft template and change the start to make it clear you are also complaining about the credit card. And add a couple of paragraphs onto the end about why the credit card was unaffordable given all your other debts and that Lloyds should have realised this so you would like a full refund of the interest paid on it.
This isn’t trying your luck. If Lloyds reject it, send it straight to the Ombudsman as banks are rejecting many good complaints.
Heather says
I have put a complaint in to NatWest about overdraft originally £3000 a long time ago I managed to pay £2000 off when I got a loan so was left with £1000 I have worked out in 6 years 2000+ days I have only been out of my overdraft 141 days I rang in 2017 and advised I was struggling financially they waved that months fees and put a overdraft control on my account so nothing came out if it went over the arranged overdraft but other than that did not offer any other help since then I have paid over £1300 in fees and charges will this complaint stand with the ombudsman if NatWest reject it
Sara (Debt Camel) says
In 2017 was that a complaint? did NatWest tell you you had the right to go to the Ombudsman?
Heather says
No it wasn’t a complaint I just rang saying I was having difficulty paying the fees
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Then you should be able to make a complaint now.
Ceri Thomas says
Hi, after speaking on here I forwarded on to theFOS that Lloyds actually had an account that was still open that belonged to me.
Forwarded all information on as advised by yourself around the 15th dec.22 yet to receive a response , is this normal?
Or should I contact the FOS.
Kind regards
Ceri Thomas
Sara (Debt Camel) says
You used the FOS online form? or sent them an email?
And you have not had any acknowledgement?
Ceri Thomas says
Hi,
I used the FOS online form that I’ve used throughout my case.
Regards
Ceri Thomas
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I would wait until the end of the week and then phone FOS if you haven’t had an acknowledgment by then.
Ceri Thomas says
Hi Sarah
Contacted FOS as advised, ,by phone , to be told that number was not in use but got put through a central reception.
The lady was amazing she informed me the lady who was working on my case was no longer employed by the FOS.
I was asked to wait on the line while she checked where about my claim was.
She told me that my case was in the Ombudsman investigation Queue and as soon as there was an update either she or my new case handler would be in touch.
She did explain that they were extremely busy, and apologised that no one had been in touch with the update of a new case handler.
Just a waiting game now, so fingers crossed. I was given more information during this call than my former case handler had given me throughout my challenge on Lloyds.
Kind regards
Ceri Thomas
Jon says
Can i still complain about an account between 2000 and 2008 with Barclays? As they say within 6 years but have only just found this out. I recently had my statements from that period sent to me by Barclays themselves?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
You can complain but expect to have to send this to the Ombudsman as Barclays are very likely to reject it. the Ombudsman will then consider if it can look at it.
Can I ask what happened in 2008?
Jon says
Hi we had a 3500 o/d limit in which we were permanently in and often going over that with our wages going in bringing us still in to the red. Many d/d were returned unpaid and charges added which compounded the problem. There was no way we were ever going to clear the overdraft and (now) thought barclays would of noticed this. I have done a complaint to them yesterday morning (using the email address you provided) had a reply yesterday afternoon acknowledging my complaint and then this morning I received a phone call from them basically saying that as it was more than 6 years ago nothing could be fone by them or the fos and quoted ‘statute of limitations’. They said that a letter would be sent to confirm this.
I originally had no statements but went onto my lost account and through that a bundle of statements arrived between Christmas and New Year (as i was looking for an old account number) dating back to 2000 up until 2008 when they just closed my account and set up a resolve loan to clear the outstanding balance. It was when i was going through the statements that i saw all the balances and after reading this thread i thiught i would give it a go!
Sara (Debt Camel) says
What was the interest on the Resolve loan?
Jonathan says
Hi the intrest rate on the resolve loan was 15.143%
And finished paying this off in October 2014
Jax says
Would you be able to share the email address you sent your complaint to please?
Jonathan heard says
Wandim.execcomplaints@barclays.com
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I think this worth a complaint as you have all the evidence in the statements. You may want to complain that the laon was also unaffordable?
Jonathan heard says
So complain about the loan and overdraft? If loan as well what shall i ask for?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
ask for a refund of the interest on the loan. See https://debtcamel.co.uk/refunds-large-high-cost-loans/ for more about loans clainsms
I suggest you start with the overdraft complaint letter and then add onto the end that you are also complaining about the resolve loan and add a couple of paragraphs about that.
make sure they reply to both parts of your complaint!
Jonathan heard says
Sarah i have already had my overdraft complaint rejected by barclays with 36hrs! Shall i also send a separate complaint re the resolve now?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Sorry, yes send a separate complaint. And send the overdraft one to FOS now. Then if you have to send the loan complaint to FOS, you can say that you have already sent in a complaint abiout the overdraft and you would like them both looked at together,
Jonathan heard says
Brilliant thank you
Jax says
Thanks for sharing the email address, much appreciated
Jonathan heard says
Well i had a call yesterday from Barclays saying that they wouldn’t look at my second complaint about the resolve loan as it was too far back.( over 6 years). I have now submitted a complaint to the fos for both overdraft and loan even though i have not had the official letter from Barclays yet. Will keep you guys updated
Lee says
Hi , I put a complaint in with Santander in May and it was rejected off the bat. Just heard from FOS and they have said santander have made an offer of goodwill. I’m not sure whether to accept or to appeal and furthermore how much the gesture actually come to (can I ask FOS to confirm).
it has agreed as a gesture of goodwill it will refund fees and interest from February 2020 to date, with 8% simple interest applied.
I think this offer is fair. This is because prior to February 2020, whilst you were utilising the overdraft facility you were able to successfully bring it in line for many years. Each increase from 2016, I can see that you were using the overdraft but had enough income to bring the account in line.
I appreciate you’ve said that Santander should’ve intervened as there were clear gambling transactions. However, until 2020 your account was in credit for significant periods of time, and I can see that there were large credits that brought your account in line even when you were using the overdraft. This often came from income and transfers from other accounts. Therefore, Santander couldn’t have known there was a problem to intervene, based on your account management.
However, I can see from 2020, you were persistently in your overdraft. I can see a loan credit of £30,000 entered your account in January 2020. After that point you were unable to clear your overdraft, which indicates financial difficulties. Therefore, I’m satisfied Santander’s offer to refund your interest and charges from February 2020 along with 8% simple interest, is fair under the circumstances.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
what you have pasted in is the FOS adjudicator’s comment I assume.
“However, until 2020 your account was in credit for significant periods of time, and I can see that there were large credits that brought your account in line even when you were using the overdraft. “
Do you feel that is a fair summary? How many increases were there from 2016 and would you say that your position got worse with each increase – were usually you in your overdraft for more days of the month and deeper into it at the end?
“Therefore, Santander couldn’t have known there was a problem to intervene, based on your account management.”
Do you agree? Did you have any other accounts with santander (loan? credit card?) that would have suggested you were in difficulty?
what would your credit record have shown – increasing debts to other creditors?
Who was this loan of £30k from?
Lee says
Hi Sara , thank you for your response . You are correct I copied it from their response to me.
I’m working on answering both your questions and will get back to you by Monday latest, from first thoughts the large payments going in were noy from other accounts, instead were both gambling wins disguised as paypal transactions and also balance transfers from credit cards i took out to clear the overdraft…..but will fully check over the weekend.
The 30k was from the company I work for who allowed me to clear all credit I had with lenders at the time at 0% borrowing.
Quick qs…. if I do appeal can Santander withdraw this initial gesture of goodwill offer?
I have until 20th January to respond to FOS
Lee says
I have gone through my statements etc and drafted below to incorporate 2019 in their goodwill gesture. Let me know if I’m missing anything you would advise to put in
Whilst I appreciate Santander’s offer and I believe we are close to a fair resolution, I would like to request that Santander extend their offer to incorporate the year 2019.
My reasons are as follows:
Consistent usage
Going through my statements I can see I spent the majority of each calendar month throughout the year of 2019 in my overdraft for everyday spending after my direct debits/bills had come out at the start of the months, only coming out of the overdraft when I was paid/partner transferred her mortgage contribution into my account towards the end of each month. This trend correlates with 2020,2021 and 2022 to which Santander has kindly offered to refund as per your email.
Lee says
Consistent Charges
I received 12 individual charges in 2019 totalling £242.00 (for each calendar month) again correlating to 2020,2021 and 2022 figures.
My credit file at the time
Santander should have also been able to see I was in financial distress through 2019, in fact, this year was the height of my borrowing on my credit file. Where I had multiple loans and credit cards with other lenders and an increasing overdraft limit agreed to by Santander all building up to over £30,000. Reviews from Santander on my credit file would have shown I was in financial difficulty.
The £30,000 loan you refer to that I received in January 2020 was from the company I work for to save me from going into bankruptcy at the time and losing my home. I was lucky enough to clear the majority of credit I had with other lenders on my file and pay my company back (still am) at a 0% interest rate.
Coupled with the consistent fee charged usage in 2019 as illustrated above, I hope you and Santander would agree to incorporate that year within the gesture of goodwill offer.
To confirm if Santander will not re-evaluate their gesture of goodwill based on the above, I would like to appeal their decision as per your deadline of the 20th of Jan 2023.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
What was 2018 like? Because if Santander reviewed your overdraft annually in february, what would it have looked like in February 2019.
Lee says
Hi Sara, 2018 was when I was considerably lucky with gambling and the account was in a surplus for long periods of time and months. I received 8 charges in 2018 compared to 12 in year 2019,2020,2021,2022. Also the average charge was only £10 a month compared to £20/£30 a month in subsequent years.
That’s why I feel ir would be fair to incorporate 2019 , but interesting to hear your thoughts before I submit my response to fos
Sara (Debt Camel) says
So I am not saying don’t try this. But if Santander only review overdraft accounts once a year, then in Feb 2019 your account may have looked ok but by Feb 2020 it wouldn’t have.
Lee says
Hi Sara , had a response from FOS, copied below. Do you think i should accept or ask for a further review by an ombudsman?
—————————-
Santander have reviewed your response and have explained that they won’t be changing their offer to include a refund of charges from 2019.
The reason being is that from a risk perspective your credit file and account management didn’t demonstrate that you were in financial difficulties. There were no missed payments, and everything appears to be up to date both internally and from external reference agencies. Santander said it cannot see any evidence of the credit card and loans elsewhere with arrears so from your credit file looked like you were keeping up with payments.
Whilst I understand that you’ve said your indebtedness increased elsewhere, due to your good management of accounts Santander couldn’t reasonably have been aware at this point that you were struggling, particularly if you didn’t inform them. I understand that you took a substantial loan to repay your debts, this intervention has enabled you to get your account back in order without causing detriment to the information presented on your credit file. So, your account management was generally in order.
I don’t think in 2019 Santander had enough information to have reasonably been aware of your financial difficulties and so, I don’t think it’s made an error having not intervened at this stage. Therefore, I think Santander’s offer to refund your interest and charges from February 2020 as this is the point at which it was evident that your overdraft was unsustainable.
Please let me know if you’d still like to accept this offer by 9 February 2023.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I think I just have to repeat my previous comment.
Lee says
So sorry Sara, I cant get my head around it , i must be having a moment! are you saying its probably a dead end as Santander wouldn’t have seen I was in financial distress in 2019? They are offering from February 2020 onwards to refund , but when they were reviewing in Feb 2020 should they not have acted as since Feb 2019 – Feb 2020 I was in financial distress?
Your last comment: So I am not saying don’t try this. But if Santander only review overdraft accounts once a year, then in Feb 2019 your account may have looked ok but by Feb 2020 it wouldn’t have.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I am trying to read between the lines here. And an ombudsman may make a different decision.
Overdrafts are meant for when you have financial problems. A refund is usually only given when it should have been clear to the bank that your problems were bad and prolonged.
Banks normally have a clause which means they review accounts once a year. If Santander are offering a refund from Feb 20, it may be that reviews were done in February.
So the question is, at the previuious review in February 2019, would your situation have looked sufficiently bad and prolonged that Santander should have acted?
2019 may have gone very badly for you – but was that obvious by February of that year?
Lee says
OK I understand where you are coming from , 2018 was actually a good year in terms of my finances and gambling meant I cleared alot of debts off that year (only to lose it all and more after ) . So in Feb 2019 they wouldn’t have been able to see I was in difficulty, but in Feb 20 I believe they should have based on feb 2019 onwards and the length of time in overdraft , coupled with credit taken out elsewhere as my habit spiralled.
However I now see the angle you explain and i think I will accept their offer of.goodwill based on your advice
L Taylor says
Hello,
I have had Barclays overdraft of £5000 and £3400 dating back to circa 2014 – I think I stated whilst I was at university – although I didn’t have student accounts.
I have been in vicious cycle of living in these, with other debts also. Salary not enough to put me in the black etc.
I’m short I have submitted a complaint requesting interest for the last six years to be refunding – totalling just over £9000. But now wondering because the overdrafts were unstated way before this will they use that as reasoning not to pay?
At this stage I would just like to get something to relieve the burden of it all, but now worrying that actually because the overdrafts are way older than six years they will use that to try and combat.
Any advice or timeframes anyone has about dealing would Barclays would be great?
I did reach out to them September and they have paused the interest charges on my accounts, to give me some breathing space, but that is up in March.
Thanks, L
Sara (Debt Camel) says
The fact that the problems date back more than 6 years is not a reason to reject your complaint.
Claire says
Just a clarification request: if I am in my overdraft for 3 of 4 weeks of the month, would it be a good idea to put a complaint in? My account is in credit for around a week after payday then all goes downwards. I’d love to get out of the overdraft, but I just don’t have the money to spare – and other, more expensive debts to pay.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
how long has this been going on for?
You have more expensive debts than this overdraft? who are the lenders?
Mark says
Hi Sarah
I have been in permanent overdraft up to my limit of £1000 for at least 8 – 10 years with Lloyds Bank. Never has this been reviewed, just continued.
On two occasions they gave me £100 when I complained about the amount of interest which averages £40+ every month. Easily several thousand pounds of interest has been paid since this overdraft. I have banked with Lloyds since 2003 and wonder if I could claim against them to cancel the overdraft and refund interest due to lack of reviews etc.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
yes you can. Read https://debtcamel.co.uk/get-refund-overdraft/ and use the template there for overdraft compalints.
Mark says
Hi Sara
Good news!!
Further to my previous post, I submitted a complaint to Lloyds Bank saying they should have reviewed my overdraft position, instead of letting it just run and run year in, year out, and therefore seen that it was unaffordable for me. Today (amazingly just 5 days after complaint) they agreed unreservedly with my complaint, apologised and refunded me all charges/interest for last 6 years, some £1600. Apparently they (banks) unable go back further than 6 years unless instructed by Financial Ombudsman (FOS). They themselves emphasised that I still have the right to take up matter with FOS.
Frankly, I am shocked at the speed they agreed and settled.
Thank you Sara for your guidance on this site.
Mark says
Hi Sara
Regarding my successful speedily resolved complaint against Lloyds in which they went back six years, do you think it would be worthwhile to refer this further to the FOS with regards to the previous period 2005 – 2016 in which I was basically same situation as the now resolved x6 years 2017 – 2023. Lloyds letter which boldly states “We Accept Your Complaint” does also mention that I have the right to refer my complaint (whole period) to FOS.
I was never out of my o/d position during the entire period save a few days here and there perhaps. During that period Lloyds gave me a personal loan of £3000 which I was unable to pay in entirety and they since sold balance on to a major debt collector company of which I am paying ridiculously low £2/month. Whole thing adds to fact I couldn’t afford overdraft as well as loan.
Many thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
did you also complain about the loan?
Mark says
Hi Sara
No I didn’t mention the loan in any complaint.
This loan was given during the time of permanent overdraft usage (to the maximum limit).
Should I now refer the unaffordability of the overdraft prior the standard last six years to FOS?
The fact Lloyds accepted and settled my original claim (complaint) within days, I would hope is a positive sign re the 2005 -2016 period during which there were regular payday loans and and debt collector payments.
Separately on the matter of loans there was also an HP agreement for a car with Black Horse, that was paid over about 4 years although extended a couple of times. Paid when in overdraft from same account referred to here.
Thanks your invaluable advice, So impressive the way you help people on this platform pro-bono.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I think it sounds worth going to the Ombudsman about the earlier years. Point out you have only just foudn out that a bank should check annually to make sure an overdraft is affoprdable, so although you have known for a long while that the overdraft is a problem, you considered it was your own fault and not lloyds. And now you have found out lloyds partly responsible you are bringing this complaint.
Then it seems worth making a complaint now about the loan. Point out ij that complaint that lloyds should have been able to tell from your overdraft that you would be unable to afford the loan. Don’t delay sending the overdraft to FOS waiting for a reply about the loan.
Kim says
Hi Sara any advice would be much appreciated. I had an overdraft with Halifax and ended up with it being at £2500 at the end. I put a complaint in using your template and recieved a letter today turning down my complaint due to the length of time it’s taken me to complain and that Iv had plenty of time to realise I could complain. But over the past 7 years I lost my mum, my marriage broke down and I suffered serious mental issues which caused me to attempt to end my life twice. Iv become much more stable over the past year and only saw I could complain from here about banks a month ago hence why I put a complaint in. Is there anything else I can do regarding the complaint now or is that it?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
When was the account closed?
Kim says
Thank you for reply. It was closed 1st aug 2017
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I asked when the account was closed as you can always go back 6 years. But as your account was closed in 2017 that will not help you.
You can also go back further if the Ombudsman decides either that you have complained within 3 years of the time you should reasonably have been aware that you had a reason to complain OR in exceptional circumstances.
In your case both of those may apply. So I suggest you should send your complaint to the Ombudsman. It may be necessary for you to produce some evidence about your mental health problems if the Ombudsman asks for it.
Good luck!
Kim says
Thank you for reply. I did reply to Halifax explaining my situation and asked them to reconsider there decision and that I’m happy for them to see my medical records. Do I still have to wait 8wks before sending to ombudsman?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest you give Halifax another couple of weeks before going to FOS