In March 2017, the Court of Appeal decision in the Green v Wright case was published: Mr Wright’s IVA firm was allowed to collect PPI after his IVA ended, even though he hadn’t consented to this before his completion certificate was issued.
As questions about this continue to arrive, I thought it would be useful to summarise the current situation: what is clear and what is less clear.
The Court of Appeal decision
The full decision is here: Green v Wright verdict. Here are some articles on the decision by some of the lawyers that have been involved:
- Paul French’s blog: PPI claims survive completion of IVA for creditors (he was the barrister for the IVA firm in the Appeal);
- Kathryn Maclennan’s blog: Green -v- Wright: complete does not necessarily mean complete (she was the solicitor for the debtor in the original court case);
- Coffin Mew’s blog: Green v Wright (they were the solicitors for the IVA firm in the Appeal).
Before you read on:
I am not a lawyer and I can’t give you advice on what you should do. When I say things like “I cannot see” or “This seems very unlikely”, I could be wrong. I am giving a layman’s opinion, hoping it will help you to consider your own situation.
If there is a large amount of PPI, you may want professional advice. You can go to your local Citizens Advice or a Law Centre – that would be free – or you may prefer a solicitor with experience in personal insolvency. If you decide to go to court over this, you have to consider that if you lose you may have to pay not just your own legal costs but the other side’s as well.
Common misunderstandings
Here are some points that keep cropping up which are worth emphasising:
“My PPI was for a debt that wasn’t included in my IVA as it had been repaid”
This doesn’t make a difference. You had the right to reclaim PPI at the point your IVA started and it is this right which is an “asset” of your IVA even if you didn’t realise it.
“My IVA says that it includes windfall assets received whilst IVA is open, but it is now closed”
This is a standard clause in most IVAs but it isn’t relevant to the PPI issue. PPI is not being claimed as a windfall. PPI is being claimed for your creditors because the right to make a claim was an asset you owned at the start of your IVA, this has nothing to do with the windfall clause.
“They will try to get any money I inherit – this is never going to end!”
This isn’t going to happen. An inheritance (or lottery win, or taking money from your pension etc) is treated as windfall if it happens during your IVA. But after your IVA ends the money is yours if one of these events happens. The court case doesn’t relate to windfalls at all.
“I would have been better off going bankrupt”
That may be correct. But PPI isn’t relevant to this – if you had gone bankrupt all the PPI would have gone to the Official Receiver.
“It’s not fair because this wasn’t explained to me at the start”
When your IVA started no-one had any idea that this court case would happen. You can’t blame your IVA firm for not telling you something they weren’t aware of.
The simplest cases
“My IVA hasn’t finished yet”
If your IVA is still in progress then your IVA firm has the right to collect this PPI. If you refuse to co-operate with the claims company they appoint, you could be in breach of your IVA terms by refusing a reasonable request and your IVA may be failed.
“I have made my last payment but they won’t give me my completion certificate unless I agree to them collecting the PPI afterwards”
If you don’t sign they will keep your IVA open until they are happy they have collected all the PPI, which could be years. It’s your choice, but I can’t see any options which will let you get the PPI money.
“I had to sign documents authorising them to collect PPI before I got my completion certificate”
Many people in the last few years have been asked to sign a deed of assignment saying that any PPI paid after their IVA completed should go to their IVA firm. The Court of Appeal case doesn’t change this.
In any of the above situations, the PPI is going to your IVA firm, I can’t see anything sensible you can do to stop this and there isn’t much point in you reading the rest of this article.
Mr Wright’s IVA used R3 standard terms and conditions
The Appeal Court decision was that Mr Wright’s IVA created a trust which did not end with the completion of the IVA unless there was specific wording to state it ended. This wording wasn’t in Mr Wright’s completion certificate.
The Appeal Court decision was based on the specific terms and conditions of Mr Wright’s IVA, which in his case had used the R3 standard terms.
If you aren’t sure if your IVA used these terms, ask your IVA firm or dig out your IVA documents. If you see Produced by the Association of Business Recovery Professionals this is an R3 IVA. Anything that says Consumer IVA Protocol is not an R3 IVA.
Let’s look first at the situation if you have an R3 IVA, then at how this may change if you don’t.
For people with an R3 IVA
If your IVA used the R3 terms, you should assume the Appeal court decision applies to you. It is highly unlikely that your completion certificate would have had any wording to bring the IVA trust to an end. The same argument – that specific wording is needed to end the trust – is likely to apply even if your IVA completed with a full and final settlement or failed.
Claims which haven’t yet been paid out
If a PPI complaint is upheld, it is very likely that your bank will ask the IVA firm if they should have the money, the IVA firm will say Yes (because of the Court of Appeal decision) and the bank will pay it to them. If this happens there is very unlikely to be anything you can do to challenge this.
Thinking about some possible exceptions:
- if your IVA is so old that your IVA firm can’t be located, I think the bank will eventually send you the money. See A PPI claim after an old failed IVA for details.
- If your IVA is so old the firm no longer has enough records for it to be able to distribute IVA to your creditors, it may be happy for the money to come to you. If you have an old R3 IVA you could enquire about this.
- If your creditors have been paid in full, the money should come to you. You are entitled to ask your IVA firm for an account which shows how much money has been distributed. If you are thinking you may be near the full payment point because a lot of PPI has already been reclaimed, don’t forget that a large proportion will have been taken by the claims firm and not gone to your creditors.
Will your IVA firm be trying to reopen old cases to reclaim the PPI? That is likely to depend on the firm. I have heard that some firms don’t intend to reopen these cases, but if you start the complaint, they will claim the PPI.
If your IVA firm wants to reopen your old case and asks you to sign something to allow them to reclaim the IVA, it isn’t clear that they have any sanctions against you if you refuse. If they mention the Green v Wright decision, you could ask them what will happen if you don’t sign.
You could also propose a solution in which you split any PPI reclaimed – half to you and half to the IVA firm. If your IVA firm agrees to this, you need to get it very clearly in writing. Also you do not want their claims firm making the complaint and taking a huge cut first – offer to make the complaint yourself.
PPI has already been paid to your IVA firm
There is nothing you can do about this.
PPI has already been paid to you
If you have spent the money, this is a very worrying situation. It seems unlikely that an IVA will be aggressive in this situation – who should it pursue, you or the bank who sent you the money? And if you don’t have any assets, it’s hard to see how pursuing you could produce any gain for the creditors. Don’t let yourself be pressured into doing anything silly like trying to borrow this money to hand to the IVA firm – just explain your situation.
For people with non R3 IVAs
There is no legal clarity for non-R3 IVAs. There hasn’t been a court decision on any of these cases and they can have very different terms. Some could be close to an R3 IVA in the areas that matter, but some may not be similar.
It seems unlikely this is going to change. It is hard to imagine a debtor is going to want to go to court, given the costs that Mr Wright has ended up with after losing his case.
In most respects similar points apply to those on the R3 case above, except the IVA firm itself is on less solid legal ground. You may decide that they are largely bluffing… but this still isn’t a very comfortable position for you to be in. If you feel you are being pressured unreasonably, put in a formal complaint to the firm and then to the IVA Complaints Gateway.
IVA firms may take different views.
- Some may choose not to try to reclaim PPI after a completion certificate has been issued if no deed of assignment has been signed.
- Some may try to reclaim, but it isn’t clear what possible sanctions they have if you refuse to co-operate.
- If you try to reclaim PPI, it seems pretty likely that the bank may pay it to your IVA firm.
- Some firms may agree if you offer to split the PPI.
- If PPI has been paid to the debtor and spent, again it seems unlikely that the IVA firm will pursue this aggressively.
Comments
You are welcome to comment below but I cannot guess what your IVA firm will choose to do and I am not going to speculate.
This article replaces the one originally published in 2015, which was largely obsolete after the Appeal Court verdict in March 2017.
Mike says
I have an iva, been hassle them to use that against my iva, now 10 weeks away from completion, i have been told I have to apply for PPI, but I finish my iva in Sept 17, just paying off the over earnings, surely this shut go towards the money I owe
Sara (Debt Camel) says
You need to co-operate with PPI being reclaimed and it any will be paid into your IVA. If you don’t, your IVA will not be completed.
mick byrne says
Hi I had av iva which started back in 2010 and after selling up I agreed with the iva a settlement figure hick I did and the iva was then closed in 2011. I (November 2017) recently made a ppi claim and received a letter from capital one saying they owe me £1,800 pound but they are keeping it and paying it to the iva. I can’t find documents too whom I had the iva with and I was advised also that the iva doesn’t appear on my credit records. Are they allowed to pay it to the iva firm and is there a way of me finding out who the iva firm is that I used. Thank you Mick
Sara (Debt Camel) says
a) the refund probably should go to your IVA company in theory, but this long after they may not have your records any longer.
b) Ask Capital One who they are paying it to?
andy miles says
My IVA failed in Jan 2013 and I have just been awarded £3k in PPI refund does this need to go to Aperture or does the money come to me? I have asked Aperture a copy of my terms and conditions but awaiting for them
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Probably to Aperture I am afraid. But what has happened to the debts in your IVA?
andy miles says
As far as I know everything has been written off. Nothing appears on my credit file IVA commenced 07 Jan 2009 and the Completion date was 31 March 2014 a final report was issued detailing fees etc
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Ok, sorry you said your IVA had failed, but actually it completed.
Andy Miles says
They have issued a failure report which states a completion date. Confusing I agree but surely in light of this Aperture should not get the money especially after they have confirmed the case is closed
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Ok. PPI can still be collected by the IVA firm after an IVA has failed. The reason I asked what had happened to the debts is because you may have paid them off… in which case the PPI would come to you… but this hasn’t happened.
Your debts haven’t been written off, the fact they don’t appear any more on your credit record is because the default date was more than 6 years ago. Legally they will not be statute barred until 6 years after your IVA failed.
Andy Miles says
But what about the recent ruling? Surely after it terminated the iva is dead and buried and cannot be reopened 4 yrs after it closed
Sara (Debt Camel) says
What recent ruling – the Green v Wright case? That says there is a trust set up with an IVA which continues until it is expressly terminated (I am summarising here) and the language to terminate the trust will not have been included when your IVA failed, so the trust continues and IVA can be collected for your creditors.
Steve prince says
I am interested to know what has happened to a recent plevin ruling award from barclaycard awarded to myself.i had a letter from bc informing of amount it then went on to state that they had tried to contact the supervisor of my now ceased iva(ended in feb2015)at that time it was debt free direct but all their clients are now under aperture,despite serveral attempts to contact aperture to no avail bc then went on to state that as a result of no confirmation of aperture requiring said award it would be sending the cheque directly to myself.i rang bc yesterday to enquire as to cheques whereabouts to be told it has been sent to my supervisor at aperture,I then questioned the statement within their award letter sent to myself stateing they could not gain confirmation from aperture and was indeed sending it to myself,the reply I got was that the paragraph had been left in by mistake as they use a template letter for all such contact….. I am now annoyed that this award has apparently gone into an iva that was completed and closed via certification with a different company and thus it appears aperture are acting upon my behalf to lay their claim to award.i have not instructed them to do this in any way and I cannot reason how they can do as my contract was with dfd not themselves(and indeed it is now closed).
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Its good in complicated situations to work out where your most likely line of complaint is.
The fact the IVA is closed is irrelevant – read the article above.
The fact your closed IVA has been passed to Aperture is irrelevant.
Who put in the PPI complaint to BC? Was it you recently? Or was this done by DFD and BC are now coming back because of of Plevin payouts? Or was it done by Aperture without your knowledge?
Steve prince says
I had a personal letter from bc advising that due to the recent plevin ruling there could be monies due to be returned.it invited myself to apply under these conditions,that I did and I received a letter dated 14th Feb advising of the plevin related award.
I find it very ignorant and unprofessional of them to make a statement within the letter the provided to myself then quote and inform of a completely different action.
The original complaint for ppi was placed by dfd through a claims management company.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
ok, then Aperture haven’t submitted a PPI claim without your authorisation – that would be very wrong – they have just been told by BC and claimed it.
If Aperture have the details of your IVA (and I don’t know what cases were included in the group that Aperture bought) then I am afraid you can’t complain about this. BC made an admin error but that isn’t going to help you.
I suggest you put in formal written complaint to Aperture saying you have tried to get in contact with them several times but they haven’t replied. Ask if they have the details of your IVA with DFD which completed on dd/mm/yy. See what they reply to that.
Steve prince says
Sorry I forgot to ask,what level of detail do you suggest i contact them with? ie just my name and address or this along with my debt free direct reference number?
Also if they cannot confirm any knowledge of myself or indeed my case,or in the other case,i have no reply,what course of action do you suggest i then take please?
Thank you again
Sara (Debt Camel) says
name, address, email address, date of birth, DFD reference number and enclose a copy of your DFD completion certificate.
If they say they have no record, then you want the cheque from BC to be sent to you or back to BC.
clive bessent says
hi ive been discharged 6 months from my IVA got my certificate and letter saying i had completed it, during the IVA i had several claims of ppi which obviously got swallowed by IVA firm ,however ive just been successful with further claims and the bank sent the money straight to IVA company who are keeping it does anyone know how long they can keep taking money from me, i thought it was finished? ok after reading all the comments on here i will no longer pursue ppi win win for banks how corrupt!
Sara (Debt Camel) says
There is no time limit.
Lucy says
Hi
I received a letter from Yorkshire bank to say that they had looked again into my missold ppi and had decided it had been missold I was awarded £3500.00 they kept £1200.00 of it to pay a loan I had with them and sent the rest to the company I have my iva with but I have just received a phone call from the company who have said under the terms and conditions of my ppi I am entitled to keep the full £2300.00 and it will be refunded to me incantation find my original paper work does anybody know why this would be thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
How long ago was your IVA finished? Who was the IVA firm? Do you remember if your IVA listed specific assets?
Lucy says
It doesn’t finish until October this year and it is with freeman Jones I don’t think it lists any specific assets only really mentions my car
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Then I can’t guess! Hope you get the money soon!
David Turver says
Hi we had an iva which finished back in 2011. We have received payment from varions Ppi claims but nat west are arguing with us regarding our past iva. We have contacted aperture and they say there is no problem with us and they require nothing more from us. Nat west are claiming that the debt was offset and the Ppi which payment was agreed by them before Christmas is to be used to pay any offset debt. Again apature say they want nothing. Any help?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
You should put in a complaint to NatWest. Say your debt to them was extinguished at the end of the IVA, so there is no debt to be offset against. If they don’t agree you should take the complaint to the Financial Ombudsman. NB I am saying you have a good argument here, but I’m not aware if any previous cases so I’m not saying you are going to win.
David Turver says
Thanks for that.
Lisa says
Hi there, just thought I would say that I have had the same with Natwest over the last year. My IVA was with Accuma, who themselves dissolved, details were apparently passed to aperture but they have no details and no interest. My iva finished completed in 2008. Natwest originally said they were going to pay out and gave me amount and date and then subsequntly, since june last year, decided that their solicitors have everything on hold, because of the cases mentioned here. I had to do lots of ringing to find this information and put a complaint in to them. Anyway since then, I have rang them monthly and they still say the same, its with their legal department. They are waiting for direction. On my file it says from all departments in Natwest they aren’t interested and to pay me,however they won’t. I finally sent everything to the financial ombudsman last month and they have said it can take a minimum of 6 months to a year to sort it out. So here I wait some more. :-/
Lyn Kelly says
We were with DFD and we dont seem to get any response from any phone numbers we have tried to sort this out has it been taken over if so by whom so we know who to contact regarding this as we were told once finished they would not need any more money from us and there still wanting more its not on
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Taken over by Aperture, see https://apertureiva.com/dfd/
Rick Borman says
I have been totally ignored by aperture so far! No answer on phone lines and no response to 3 emails apart from auto responses saying they will get back to me “in due course”….. Its 3 weeks now!!!!!
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest putting in a formal complaint after a month.
Lyn Kelly says
We are having problems with aperture too not answering calls or emails how do we have to make a complaint and who too
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Initially to Aperture, to ivacustomerservices@aperture.uk.com with COMPLAINT as the title. Also see https://debtcamel.co.uk/complaint-iva/
Rick Borman says
UPDATE 08th June….my email sent as recommended has been returned to me as “no server available” after 7 days. I have double checked correct address. I also sent another email via their website and this time have not even had a an automated response! Phone lines remain busy! What is happening? Anyone else actually achieved contact with Aperture???
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Their complaints page has a different email – try that one. https://apertureiva.com/terms/complaints/
If that bounces back, send them a letter recorded delivery.
Lyn Kelly says
I have sent a complaint email to them can you advise how long i should wait and what the next procedure would be please
Rick Borman says
I have now sent another complaint email too. I have spent well over 2 hours sat on hold on their phone line over several occasions. No response to emails either. I am genuinely suspicious!!
Rick Borman says
My email bounced due to a “temporary problem with the receiving server”!!! I am watching to check that it does get through.
Lyn Kelly says
we have never been notified of this change so why should we be liable to pay aperture when our agreement was with DFD
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Because DFD have sold the book to Aperture and you have no right to object to this. NB That isn’t a statement of the actual legal process but it is a reasonable practical summary.
An equivalent situation in a different area may clarify why this isn’t quite as unreasonable as it sounds. When Egg decided to close down, all their Egg credit card accounts were sold to Barclaycard – the T&Cs on the cards remained the same – the Egg card holders had no right to say they would rather stay with Egg.
Steve prince says
I have found some interesting variations in terms and conditions that dfd issued back in 2013 that I have approached the people in Belfast with…. Needless to say my response from them is that it will be dealt with in due course.
These variations quote about any pending ppi whilst iva was running,mine ended 3years ago(recently a claim was satisfied from barclaycard that was started in Dec 17, therefore wasn’t pending during the iva)also it states if the supervisor leaves office whilst the iva is running it will be transferred to another supervisor within dfd(no mention of if they were to become insolvent).
Basically how can they lay claim to any ppi award which wasn’t pending during running(as terms state)and it states that it will be transferred to another supervisor within dfd(if need be)not once does it state that it would be transferred to another company in case of insolvency.
I have wrote a formal complaint quoting these terms and also where said cheque is…. As of yet no contact regarding my old completed iva from 2015.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
So two separate issues:
PPI – what is in the T&Cs isn’t likely to be relevant. The Green v Wight case (see article above) established that a bit of Trust law applies – this was not known about in 2013 so it couldn’t possibly be mentioned at that time – but this still applies to previous IVAs that have completed and indeed that have failed.
DFD-Aperture transfer – who is your IP ?
Lyn Kelly says
But they sold this after we had finished the IVA we finished in 2015 3 years ago as far as i can remember i dont about PPI being mentioned they tried to get me to sign something when it finished but i refused
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Read the article above. PPI can still be collected after an IVA has completed even if you did not authorise this.
Steve prince says
If terms and conditions are not relevant then why have them?if they are not relevant then surely none of the terms and cons can be upheld?
It seems as the iva trust holders want it all in their favour,and it appears from what you state that any terms are pointless
Goalposts seem to continue to move in favour of any iva providers.
When I started the iva back in 2010 I got told I would be debt free within 5/6 years,what an utter pack of lies as it appears it will follow me around with an interest in any windfall i have until i die or reach 100p in the £1.
I only wish i knew then what i know now and i would have gladly gone bankrupt as i had no assets nor savings.
ip was dfd.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
“I only wish i knew then what i know now and i would have gladly gone bankrupt as i had no assets nor savings.” Bankruptcy may have been a better option for you than an IVA, but not because of PPI. If you had gone bankrupt, the PPI in question now would be going to your Official Receiver, not to you.
Your IP is a named individual, not a firm. Look at your IVA paperwork.
Steve prince says
Richard savage
The gentleman whom has had several insolvency practitioner sanctions against him due to bad practice……
Alan says
See my IP on the sanctiom list as well from Aperture
Andy Miles says
Mark Allen from Grant Thornton / Aperture makes an appearance on sanction list 3 times and since he mishandled my IVA i shall be complaining to them about him after ive complained about them keeping ppi when uva proposal states eveything ceases when terminates
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Richard Savage is no longer an IP. I suggest you ask Aperture who your IP now is and the date on which this changed. (I could guess, but it’s better to find out the facts.)
Steve prince says
Many thanks
Jane Goodwin says
Hi
I was in an IVA Payplan which I have a completion certificate for March 2017. I made a full and finally offer to my creditors and this was agreed in December 2016.
I have now received a letter from a Claims Firm saying that an undisclosed Commission PPI claim against Mint have made an offer of £1250.29 and in terms of my IVA this will be paid to my supervisor and I need to sign the paperwork from the RBS and send it onto Equity & Finance.
My question is – I thought that as Pay Plan & my creditors accepted a full & final offer and I have a competition Certificate that was a conclusion of my IVA. Is this correct?
in the letter I received in December 2013 when my creditors agreed to the full and final offer. It reads – This sum (£1500), together with those funds already paid into the scheme by the debtor, will constitute full and final settlement of the scheme and therefore no further monies shall be due from the debtor and the arrangement shall be concluded.
Can you please advise me of my situation and the way forward
Many Thanks
Jane
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Was your F&F in 2013 or 2016?
Darren says
Hi, I completed an IVA with Payplan in December 2014. On the Completion Certificate it advises any PPI realised after the completion of the IVA, will be realised by the Supervisor acting in trustee of those assets and will be distributed in accordance with the IVA. I have rad my IVA documents and nowhere does it mention PPI, and one section of the IVA states ‘All assets not specifically included in the proposals, will be deemed to be excluded. I have recently found out I am entitled to PPI, but like many people, this is being paid to PayplanDoes this mean that because PPI is not mentioned within my documents, it is excluded and. should receive all the PPI money?
Thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I am not optimistic, but you can ask Payplan to explain why they are entitled to PPI given what you say is in your IVA documents.
stephen rayner says
To me it seems that there is still a grey area, A very big one. My IVA finished in 2011 and my ppi mis selling could have been unlocked but was not as I did not know it was there but PPI mis selling was known then so I accept the ruling. On the other hand my pension was there and still is, will my IP insist it was an asset when it unlocks in 5 years time? There is also PPI commission under the Plevin ruling, my iva finished in 2011 and the ruling was in 2014 so the argument is that it cannot be an asset as it was unknown of but it now retrospectively becomes part of the trust as an asset when in fact it should be a windfall payment. It seems now that IP’s have carte Blanche to attach any assets to the trust that appear after completion of an IVA that could well include my pension as it was present during my iva. There seriously needs to be some rock solid clarification after the court of appeals decision.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
“On the other hand my pension was there and still is, will my IP insist it was an asset when it unlocks in 5 years time?” no, there is not the slightest chance of this happening.
” It seems now that IP’s have carte Blanche to attach any assets to the trust that appear after completion of an IVA that could well include my pension as it was present during my iva.” no they don’t.
Danielle says
I believe that this will be the next scandal and Iva firms will soon by exposed.
What the law currently fails to recognise is that most of these people would not have been in debt if it hadn’t have been for the PPi scandal and the IVA firms are worse for taking advantage of vulnerable people. I look forward to seeing someone challenge this head on.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
The loser in the Green v Wright case had court costs well into 5 figures. No one is going to fund a further challenge after a clear legal decision, however much you (or I) wish it had gone the other way.
Nicola says
Hi we have finished our Iva in April 2017 we waited a while before claiming ppi for old Lloyd’s bank loans which we had and paid off prior to the Iva we won our case and was awarded ppi this has now been sent to the Iva company what rights do we have
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Probably no practical rights, unless your IVA firm agrees the money should go to you. Have you read the article above these comments?
Nicola says
Yes Sara it doesn’t look good . But we will try and see what they say we was with Debt Free Direct and we wasn’t notified that they had changed we had no phone numbers nothing now that we have claimed ppi all of a sudden it’s got to go to the Iva company when will it ever end they say it’s only for such amount of time but it now looks like it will follow us around for the rest of our lives
Nicola says
Hi Sara. Having looked through emails from the Iva company I found a part that states the the continuation of the super IOU’s role in respect of assets held on trust will come to an end when all assets are deemed recovered and distributed in accordance with the termsof the variation proposals or the outstanding assets are deemed to be irrecoverable for whatever reason and valued under £100 in aggregate the Iva may only remain open for a maximum period of 12 months does this mean 12months after the Iva has finished I’m confused please help
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest you ask your IVA company (now Aperture) to explain it. But your IVA finished after the Green v Wright verdict was known – I would be surprised if DFD allowed your IVA to be completed without having a good legal basis to continue to collect PPI afterwards. I am not going to encourage you to pay for legal advice as it seems to be unlikely to help.
Jay says
My Iva completed 2010 I moved several homes since received a letter from Capital One asking me to apply for PPI due to a recent court ruling. I filled out the new application ad sent it off after several weeks I revised a letter from them requesting. I send in IAV completion form ,which I did, again several weeks later I received a letter stating they had placed the IVA refund into my old capital one account I contacted the IVA company and they said as they were part of the IVA agreement. And the Iva was closed the money should have been returned to me . But captial one refuse to return it stating they have put in into my old captialone account which legally should not exist
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Who was your IVA with? The first thing is to ask them if you would get any PPI refunds – if the IVA firm will claim them, there is no point in arguing with Capital One.
Andy Miles says
I put a complaint into Aperture and they have failed to respond within their own 10 day and that is despite sending a further email to them. Even though I have obtained an automated response still not received a rèsponse therefore I escalated to Insolvency Service for them to investigate. In my opinion the whole scenario of IVAs has been missold and cannot waut for this to be exposed as the next misselling scandal
Teneka Joseph says
Hello Just wanted some advice if possible?
So I was with an IVA Blair Endersby in 2006 which was taken over by Grant Thornton in 2007 and is now Aperture 2018. My IVA ended in 2012 but they only gave me my certificate in 2018 last week per request as they held onto it (but the end date is 2014) to try and get my signature to claim PPI. Back in 2013 I applied for PPI from one of my creditors, they were requesting signed documents from the IVA to say that I have entitled them to that money, the IVA were never able to provide them with anything because I never signed anything, anyway I left it due to the harassment I got from the IVA and that case was closed.
Now I have tried to reclaim, the bank are still under the impression that I am in the IVA. I have told them I am no longer in it, but they are waiting for the IVA to accept there offer. My question is does the IVA have rights to the money if I have not signed any documents? The creditors were requesting signed documents before, why are they not requesting that now? I would appreciate your advice.. Thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Aperture may argue that after the Green v Wright case last year they don’t need you to sign anything.
Catherine O'Donnell says
Hi
I was discharged from my iva in 2009 , I originally done my Iva through invocas basedbin glasgow, they went into insolvency last year , the bank of scotland have upheld a ppi claim but keep telling me they don’t know what’s happening . It has been weeks and I don’t know who to contact
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I know this is frustrating, but I suggest waiting a couple of months.
Catherine odonnell says
In this case can the ive be opened back up by anyone else ? Thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I wouldn’t like to guess what an administrator could do, but after so long I think it’s unlikely.
Lyn Kelly says
Hi
we have sent several emails no reply and sent one with complaint as a header on 3/4 how long do we wait and what are the next steps i give up trying to get through on the phones
Andy Miles says
If Aperture you will not get a response. I have escalated my complaint to the Insolvency Service. Aperture state they respond within 10 working days however more like 10 yrs
Nicola says
Hi, my IVA completed in 2012 and I have my certificate. I never had PPI – I always refused it – but I am being harassed by an agency associated with my IP. Can I get in trouble for ignoring them?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
As the article above says ” it isn’t clear what possible sanctions they have if you refuse to co-operate”.
A year later, I am not aware of anyone in your situation having any trouble by ignoring this.
I suggest you tell the agency that you want a letter from your IVA firm explaining why you have to do this and also what will happen if you refuse.
Nicola says
Brilliant- thanks for your help.
Mark says
I’ve also made some assumptions which I know you shouldn’t but to keep this shorter I have sorry in advance for the punctuation also.
I began my IVA in 2006 and have a copy of original agreement this was completed I believe in 2013 I dont have my completion certificate but have checked the insolvency registert, checking the agreement there is a list of Assets in appendix A that list states I dont have any and I believe my agreement does not follow the R3 standard. I made a effort to recover PPI last summer I even provided my IVA to the agent to give them a more exact information and was assured they would deal with it, I did not meet with much success and just forgot about it. This year I was awarded a payout and paid my agent there fee and some debts, bought a new laptop and left any excess in my bank account assuming all was good. A week later I revived another award only when reading through the paper work at the end it was mentioned if I had ever had a IVA I should contact them!!!!!
This wasn’t present in the first award letter, I did some research and discovered my IVA company had changed hands around five times, basic sleuthing led me to a dead website and a inactive contact number. A few days later another significant award was made with the same recommendation to contact my supervisor!!
So I investigated further and believe I have found them I also contacted the second business who was giving this award to ask if I had any issues with my compensation they told me no and that I should just wait for the cheque. All this time my agent is prompting me to pay the fees on second two awards, jump forward a few days yet another large award this time my agent had not made any contact before I received the letter it just came out of the blue!!!!
Would anyone care to advise me please
Sara (Debt Camel) says
So has your IVA firm been in touch at all?
Mark says
Nothing so far!!
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Well I wouldn’t worry too much about it until you do. If you want to be totally safe then leave the money in the bank for a few years but if your sleuthing suggests the IVA company has disappeared without trace then being contacted sounds pretty unlikely.
Mark says
Do you think its a real possibility Ive fallen through the cracks lost paper work etc Im just afraid six months down the line they will demand the money which I may no longer have!!!
Elaine says
Hi started IVA in June 2007 and completed in September 2012 with certificate. Just had a letter from clear debt who was one of many companies handling the iva as we were being past from one company to another. They want me to sign forms to claim my old ppi’s . Do I have to sign them . What happens if I don’t. Its been such along time now I just want to forget about the whole situation.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
It’s not clear to me that anything will happen if you don’t, as the article above says.
Andrew says
Hi my former IVA supervisor David Emanuel Merton Mond is insisting in mail that it is a requirement that I claim PPI through a company he has assigned to us DRSP. I am comfortable with any outstanding monies owed to me through PPI to go to my IVA however I never had any intention of looking to see if I had any. The reason being I lost my house before my IVA and the PPI I had with themNationwide)turned out to be useless since that time I have been specific in asking not to have PPI anytime I have borrowed money, now whilst the lenders may not have been upfront I would like to think they did not charge for PPI so I have no claim. Is it a legal requirement I comply with this? Also mr Mond is offering me a cash incentive of £500 of any money I receive. I just cannot be bothered to fill in the paperwork do you think he has any legal grounds that require me to comply?
ps none of the harassment I am getting is good for my mental health which has suffered severely as a result of my financial situation also the Nationwide was not part of my IVA as I had settled before my IVA started
Andrew
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Hi Andrew, see this article I wrote about this situation a few days ago: https://debtcamel.co.uk/cleardebt-ppi-closed-iva/
Andrew says
Thank you Sara
I will be ignoring it
I will keep you informed of any further communications
Andrew
Sara (Debt Camel) says
It might be good to add any news about further communications on that other page.
Karen says
Hi Andrew
I am receiving exactly the same letter from the same person with the same offer. I ignored it several months ago and just received another one. My IVA completed in December 2009 and when i started it in 2004 there was no issue with PPI being such a huge issue, I have never requested PPI after the IVA nor am I interested in doing anything about it. I’m about to post a letter to them telling them I have no interest in their offer. My IVA has been completed over 7-1/2 years ago. I find this extremely upsetting to be getting this now after I successfully fulfilled my obligation.
i would be interested in any further information you and Sarah may post.
Thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Several people here seem to be having difficulties getting answers from their IVA firm.
You may be asking a factual question about what has happened in the past – this sort of query could include
– I want a copy of my IVA and all documents relating to it?
– who is my IP and when were they appointed?
– do you have my IVA records because I understand you took over IVAs from [your previous IVA firm}?
– how much has been distributed to my creditors so far? and how much money are you currently holding that you expect to distribute?
For any of these queries, you could send the IVA firm a Subject Access Request, see https://ico.org.uk/your-data-matters/your-right-of-access/. You could ask your specific queries or simply ask the firm to send you copies of all the personal information that they have relating to you – that could be quite a lot of information. NB You can’t be charged for making a SAR, but if you were to make repeat requests, you may be.
If you don’t get a response within a month, you could complain to the ICO.
Making a SAR is in addition to your right to put in a formal complaint in writing to the IVA firm about their failure to communicate with you, and to send that complaint to the Insolvency Service if the firm does not replay within 8 weeks.
You can’t use a SAR to get a firm to answer a question about what it intends to do about your case – it is just a way of finding out what has happened in the past.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
You could also send a SAR to any claims firm that is dealing with your case, asking them for all the information they currently have about you. That should show how much PPI has been collected to date and where there are other live claims in progress.
Elaine says
Does the insolvency practitioners have a right to pass on personal information to a third party e.g. ppi companies.
Regards
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I don’t know, but the Claims Co will need your consent before they enter a complaint on your behalf.
Alan says
Would Aperture have been required to send customers an updated agreement regarding their data and use of it due to the change in the law.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
There is no point in me making a guess about that. Here is Aperture’s Privacy Policy: https://apertureiva.com/terms/privacy-policy/. That has details about how to ask for a copy of your data and how to complain if you want to.
Sue says
What happens to any money paid into an IVAwhen it is finished from PPI
Sara (Debt Camel) says
It gets distributed to the creditors in your IVA.
Robert says
I was in an IVA which started from March 2007 onwards. I had various Loans from Barclays that were completed “prior” to 2007. In that sense the term asset should “not apply” as this is really a “mistake” not an “asset” because it was outside the IVA agreement. I can understand any loans “listed” at the time under the IVA should be paid back to your creditors but loans that have been finalised and sorted prior to heading into a financial crisis – that cant be right?? Think about it for one moment – if you were sent to court for GBH and they started bringing up previous fights that happened at school that involved cuts and bruises – would that be relevant? Would that be fair? The term “asset” in my opinion has been loosely agreed for the benefits of the IVA companies and the creditors. If something has been “completed” successfully then the “mis-selling” has to benefit the consumer – otherwise they are having their cake and eating it! You cant punish for non-compliance and compliance as one – why a solicitor hasn’t picked up on this point baffles me?? What I’m trying to say is if a loan has been successfully completed it should not be treated as a “default” loan – the 2 are entirely different and should be treated like so in a court of law. Assets should only apply to “income” that relates “within” an IVA – its the terminology that needs to be argued.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I am sorry but this is simply wrong legally. The “asset” that is being talked about is your right to make a complaint. It has nothing to do with whether the debt with the PPI was included in your IVA or not.
This is not the IVA firms using a term loosely or inventing something to suits them. This treatment of assets is what Official Receivers in bankruptcy have been using for many years. See this chapter from the Insolvency Service Technical Manual relating to bankruptcy: https://www.insolvencydirect.bis.gov.uk/technicalmanual/Ch25-36/Chapter31/part9A/Ch%2031.9A%20Introductio.htm
Lucy says
My husband completed his IVA in April 2017 and whilst he was paying, the IVA company claimed any PPI that was available. His IVA is on the insolvency register as completed in April 2017 but has a footnote saying: Individual Voluntary Arrangements will remain visible while they are Current, and for a period of 3 months after the Secretary of State receives notice of the revocation order, full implementation or termination of the agreement.
The completion documents were sent in February 2018 so we understand that he should be removed from the register by now, however he is still on the register and the notification date has been changed to 1 May 2018 (very sneaky). We think this may be to do with the trust remaining open despite the IVA being completed. Would this assumption be right?
Will whoever changed the notification date just keep changing this until they are satisfied that they’ve claimed as much as they can from PPI? This is annoying as we understand they’ve already pursued all possible claims so the trust should now be closed and his name should disappear from the register completely. We just want to move on with our lives and put this IVA behind us for good. Surely keeping a trust open indefinitely is unacceptable?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
If you have had your completion certificate, you should ask your IVA firm why you are still showing on the Insolvency Register, this has nothing to do with the trust continuing, it sounds like an error by the IVA firm. Come back here if you can’t get it sorted in a few weeks
K lambert says
I think reading all these comments it’s pretty clear IVA’s were a scam from start to finish and you just keep on defending what is clearly fraudulent Sara. Shame on YOU and the IVA dictators
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I have a clear position that IVAs are only a good option for a small number of people with big debt problems. Anyone without a house with equity should look at a DRO or bankruptcy. And that IVAs are often being mis-sold.
I also wish the Green v Wright decision had gone the other way. But it didn’t. There is no chance of this being overturned in another case because no-one is going to risk the large costs involved in bringing one.
So what am I supposed to say? I am sympathetic but I am not going to encouraging people to think there is chance “this will become the next PPI” when it looks extremely unlikely to me.
Sally Horne says
I have gone through a PPI claims co to claim PPI, as I thought all my PPI was taken when I was on my IVA. Barclays Bank contacted me saying they would not work with an agent, and that they owed me £37,000 in PPI which they were sending to my IVA agents (W3). I contacted the claims co and they told me there was nothing they could do, I also received a receipt from W3 to say they have paid the claims co £13,000 for an invoice sent to them. So everyone gets paid apart from me is this correct??
Sara (Debt Camel) says
“So everyone gets paid apart from me is this correct??”
Sounds right :(
Except
a) that is a very large amount. how does it compare to the size of debts that went into your IVA? And how much did you pay a month into the IVA?
b) when did your IVA finish? Do you think you may have paid some of this PPI after your IVA was completed?
Steve Kilbee says
As I mentioned before why are we paying IVA companies many thousands more than we actually owed. Iva’s are supposed to reduce your debts but in many cases I can guarantee this is simply not the case, since the ppi scandal woke IVA companies up to the fact that they could rake more money in. They are taking the ppi in but not sending out upto date reports on how the money has been distributed. Because no contact even though we have contacted them means they will do as they please. They will hold it as long as possible earning interest in their bank accounts and if and when they get challenged on their say”Oh we’re in the process of distributing it. What a load of codswallop I personally think they do nothing after completion only receive not redistribute until I see proof they’ve cleared debt’s. Nothing will change my mind and I think alot of people think the same.
Not heard from my IVA company for 2and half years paid over£51,000 on debt’s of £40.000. So there’s £11.000 straight away and I know there’s more ppi waiting but they can keep it my IVA company has stitched me and many others up.
They are ripping us off.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Have you sent them a Subject Access Request asking for a copy of all your personal information?
Steve Kilbee says
No. I last spoke to them (Credit fix) on the phone and they said we will contact you in due course. In other words when I get fed up and contact them again or not at all. I haven’t even had so much as a letter. So I would say that speaks volumes. As I don’t have time to do much with my job and looking after my daughter while my ex is working time has just passed me by. I scane my messages when I can that’s about it I survive on about 4hours sleep a day more often than not. Always working or driving looking after someone. Will do as you said and see what happens.
Alan says
When my MP spoke to Aperture he was told that they can continue to collect money for your creditors up to the full amount, 100% as they said. My problem with that is that you will always end up paying over 100% as they have their fees on top of the amount you owed. Maybe there should be a cut-off at the original amount including fees.
David Green says
My IVA failed at the end of the term as I could not pay a capital sum . Outstanding amounts to card companies has now been passed over
To a collection company 5 have accepted a final lump sum payment in settlement . 2 I’m still in negotiations with. . I believe I have a claim of PPI
On all . I understand and accept that outstanding amounts must be paid . My question ! My claim will exceed the debt outstanding
Will I be able the receive the balance ?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
are these the last two debts in your IVA that remain unsettled, or are there more? when did your IVA fail and who was the firm?
David Green says
My certificate of termination is dated 27th Dec 2017. The last two remaining debts are from the original iva .
The company handling the iva at the termination was Harrington Brooks.
Andy Miles says
For those doing battle with Aperture dont give up. After 3 months they finally addressed my complaint and what a shock the PPI paid into my failed IVA was not due to them so they are refunding back. I have reported them to the Insolvency Service and I’m now in the process of reporting them to Financial Conduct Authority
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Well done for persevering! Was the PPI not due to go into your IVA because all your creditors have been repaid?
K l says
A question
IF your IVA has failed does this stop the ‘firm’ (and I use that term lightly) from pursuing PPI from you? (the deadline is August 2019) I know a completion certificate will never be issued but after six years who cares. No name on the insolvency register after this. Would be interested to hear you views on this.
Paul moore says
Hi.completed my iva june 2017.have my completion certificate
.i have since claimed ppi against rbs who say they owe me not short of £7000.my wife was not on the iva just myself.is she still entitled to her half.says on my completion certmy obligations to wards my deptcovered by this arrangment have now been settledcreditors have no further claims against you for these depts.
But the money from rbs has all gone to my ip.and rbs sent letter about 2 months ago saying they would be intouch soon but hued nothing.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
yes you should let your old IVA firm know that half the compensation should come to your wife.
Paul moore says
Thanks for that.hurd nothing from rbs or my iva company over this even though both said i would here from them.ill ring iva company as u say
Jamie says
Hi Sara
I finished an IVA in September 2011. I had decided to claim for ppi. But after reading lots of comments online. It would appear to be pointless as any money owed to me will go to debt free direct. Do you think I’d be best off not clainlming anything!
Regards
Jamie
Sara (Debt Camel) says
DFD IVAs have been taken over by Aperture. As yours is so old, it is possible that they don’t have the details of it any more.
You could send Aperture a Subject Access Request asking for a copy of all personal information they have about you, see their Privacy Policy https://apertureiva.com/terms/privacy-policy/. If they don’t have any information, it may be that your details were never passed to them… in that case you may be able to reclaim the PPI… so it’s worth trying but don’t use a claims management company!
Andy Miles says
Aperture respond you are joking. They fail to respond to complaints and only do so once regulator becomes involved and there’s a risk of sanctions. For 3 months they kept my ppi refund then all of a sudden they refunded it back to me no apology no nothing. Just proves what robbing bastards they are and dont like it when people fight back
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Well if they don’t respond to a SAR within a month you can report them to the ICO. See https://ico.org.uk/your-data-matters/your-right-of-access/ .
Matthew Grimsley says
HI Andy. I have just found out that a recent PPI settlement has been sent to my IVA company namely Aperture. Can you tell mw what you did to claim your PPI back please ?
Andy Miles says
By constantly complaining to them and when they didn’t respond referred to Insolvency Service
If you call you shall be lied to also take them 3 months to refund and you won’t get an apology
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I think the question was about what your grounds for complaining were?
Andy Miles says
I told them they were not entitled to it
Richard says
I completed my IVA in 2010. It was originally with Haines Watts, who became RSM Tenon, who it seems became insolvent themselves, their business now being dealt with by Aperture.
Recently, I rather stupidly engaged a claims company to pursue PPI for me from Cooperative Bank. The bank came up with an offer of over £9000 but insisted that the money go to Aperture. But the claims company will still want their fee, according to their Ts & Cs, so whether I accept or reject the offer it seems that I will get nothing but still have a fee to pay. Can anything be done?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
If the IVA company keeps the PPI they will normally settle the claims firm’s bill, but this isn’t guaranteed. It is a shame you went to one of these leeches… did they ask if you had been in an IVA?
Re Aperture, I suggest you send them a Subject Access Request asking for a copy of all your personal data, it will be interesting to see what they have. You can do this by phoning 0333 939 7919 and you will need to give information so your case can be identified, name, address, whether you have moved since the IVA, date of birth, and any RSM Tenon reference number you have.
Richard Larkin says
Hi Sara. Thanks for replying.
I don’t think they asked if I had been in an IVA. I seem to remember mentioning it to them in conversation but I’m not entirely sure. In any case it’s not in writing. However, didn’t they have a responsibility, legal or ethical, to advise me of the consequences of the Green v Wright case in the event that I had or had been in an IVA? I didn’t know about it and it came as a shock when I found out. Obviously, I would not have entered into dealings with them or anyone. Also, they came touting for the work – I didn’t go looking for them. That alone should place a duty on them to advise me of any pitfalls
Richard Larkin says
Hi again
I rang Aperture and it appears that they don’t hold any information about me, IVA or otherwise. I then rang the bank to inform them of this and they are going to conduct their own inquiry. If they receive .the same answer they will make a decision regarding the destination of the payout. Fingers crossed!
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Let us know what happens!
malcolm says
IVA finished 2 years ago, no records anywhere on credit files or insolvency register. If PPI is claimed from companies not in IVA and sucessful how would IP ever get to know about it?
Elaine23 says
Can you advise. I am on an Iva that finishes this month. My ex husband has put a claim in for pppi and I have just received a letter from co op bank to say approx £7000 refund is due to me. This ppi was from 22 years ago and the letter says it will be paid into my Iva. Is there any interest I can claim from this. Would it be worth talking to Iva company.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Was this a joint debt?
Sarah says
Hi. I am currently putting through a PPI claim with the FSCS. My IVA with Freeman Jones started in 2009 and completed in 2015. I have received the completion certificate etc. I had a PPI claim through Lloyd’s whilst I was in the IVA and £3000 was paid into this. I understand that due to the Wright vs Green case even if your IVA has completed any further PPI will still go directly to them. I contacted Freeman Jones to request a letter of No Further Interest and was told they would send this out, no questions asked. I did not receive this and only a copy of my completition certificate and my initial contract. I contacted them again and they said they would pass this onto their PPI department to see if they can send this out and if so I would receive in the next week. Just wanted to see if anyone has ever received this from Freeman Jones. Like I said, completion certificate has been received and I was never asked to sign anything regarding them reclaiming Any PPI after my IVA had ended. I’ve looked through my documentation and assets was only added for my car but said this would never be taken. What should I look for on this to see if PPI could be claimed. Really hoping someone can help. Thank you!
Sarah says
Just to give you an update. I received a letter of no interest from My IVA so now pursing my claim for PPI. Out of interest does anyone know how they work out PPI payment if it was put in as part of my IVA? Thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
They may set off the PPI refund against the amount of debt that was written off in the IVA. Or they may not. Hard to predict.
Mark says
I believe I have been mis sold my iva.
I struggled for over 5 years to pay back 700 a month leaving me nothing spare, I did ask about bankruptcy but was made out to be the worst thing I could do and from that fear did the IVA. I very much regret this now because even year’s after the “completion” they can still take ppi. They should be ashamed, they act like they are there to help but more interested in squeezing every penny from you.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Bankruptcy may have been better for you, but after bankruptcy you would still not be able to reclaim PPI, it would go to the Official Receiver.
Mark says
Yeah that’s true. But I can’t get them 5 years back can I. If I can go back I would go bankrupt.
It’s rediclus looking back now, how little money we lived on. My advice to anyone. Don’t do it.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
IVAs are great for anyone with assets to protect or some well-paid jobs that would be badly affected by bankruptcy. But they are being sold to many people who would be much better off going bankrupt, see https://debtcamel.co.uk/hard-choices/iva-vs-bankrutcy/
Mark says
I had no assets and a factory job. They knew this, so why did they say it’s perfect for me.. I really do hope one day I turn on the tv and I see a advert about being mis-sold a IVA. Can’t wait.
Mark says
Do you think there is a case against mis sold iva?
Charlotte Timms says
Is it correct you are still entitled to the interest paid from a ppi claim as in the 6-8% added by the lian company. I have bden told by aperture they keep the redress minus a ppi companys fees and i get the interest and they keep the rest of the award for crediters.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Some IVA firms offer this as an incentive – it isn’t a legal right so far as I am aware.
Sue says
Don’t trust Aperture. I had an IVA with them for 18 months, and have personally cleared all my creditors. They still managed to get more than £5000 from PPI monies, held it for just over 3 years before distribution, and even then, only distributed £1500 of it, apparently the rest was their fees!!! I am entitled to another PPI claim but have been told by Aperture they will receive it first, and out of the £1489 payment, will take £1220 as their fee and the test will go to creditors who I’ve already paid off. Tried telling them we don’t owe money to anybody and how would we get the money back, their response is “you can’t, it’s our money not yours”. Now trying to find solicitor who specialises in PPI. Don’t trust Aperture.
Stan Keen says
Hi
My IVA was set up in 2012 and a full and final settlement was paid in 2014 after being medically retired and receiving a small lump sum which I negotiated to pay off the IVA due to never being able to work again and now on benefits at 49. After that time the original company was sold to aperture. I received a ppi claim I had instigated against BC in early 2017 for £500. BC sent money straight to me. Aperture found out and now I pay it back at £20 a month. I have instigated another point through BC again for Egg Card. I’ve been told they will send the money to aperture via the point claim company. I never can remember having a certificate of completion and I’m not on the insolvency register. Can I get that money? If not can I cancel? If not can I see if my creditors get any of the money at all? If not, is this all leagal? If yes, it’s a money making scam and should be halted. Now they’re (aperture) taking a lend of the law and should be stopped!! Can I ever be free?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
If you are not on the Insolvency register it sounds as though your IVA completed properly and you will have received a completion certificate.
Why on earth did you go through a claims company as you knew you didn’t get the money from the previous PPI claim?
No it is too late to cancel this claim now. Aperture however should settle your claims company’s fee.
To find out how much your creditors have been paid so far, send Aperture a Subject Access Request to compliance@aperture.uk.com with SUBJECT ACCESS REQUEST as the email title asking for a copy of all your personal information.
You will be free of this when your creditors have been paid in full for the debts that went into your IVA. Of course there is also a deadline for PPI complaints in August 2019.
steve k says
My IVA finished October 2017 with completion letter , I’m assuming trying now to claim any confirmed PPi claims is completely pointless ?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Who is your IVA firm?
LA says
Hello, I have successfully appealed a PPI claim with Egg Loan, Citibank. They have asked me to send them a completion certificate for my IVA. As this finished in July 2011 I have not kept any of the paperwork, past the 6 years. I have tried to obtain proof of my completion, but the IVA has been sold on many times.. (Haines Watts to Tenon to Baker Tilly and now Aperture. I have contacted Aperture for details on my IVA and they cannot find anything due to the multiple buyouts. (To confirm, I completed with Tenon). If they cannot find my IVA, will they be in position to claim my PPI refund? I have phoned the Insolvency Service and they do have a record of my IVA and that it was completed, but that it all. I have written to Citibank explaining all of this, so waiting on their response, but I was wondering if there is anything else I can do in the meantime.
Thank you
Sara (Debt Camel) says
If Aperture can’t find anything about your IVA, they cannot claim the refund. Have you asked them to write an email saying they have no record of it and have no interest in it?
LA says
I only spoke with them on the phone, they said I would need to email their archives department to see if they could find anything, but he didn’t seem overly hopeful. I didn’t tell them it was relating to a PPI claim, as I didn’t want them digging too far, in case CITI bank pursue that far either. Thank you for your response. Hopefully it goes in my favour.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
There isn’t much downside in you emailing the archives dept – Citi aren’t going to just send you the cheque without some confirmation. And they will have guessed it’s about a PPI claim.
LA says
Just to update, I was able to get an email from my IP confirming they did not hold any record of my IVA as it completed more than 6 years ago. I also sent a copy of my credit report, detailing no debtors. Citi have now confirmed they will be sending the full balance of the cheque to myself. Thank you for your advise.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Good news!
james mills says
Hi Sara,
another question on the wright vs Green case. I note that part of the judgement stated broadly that the PPI claims in question were an asset of the arrangement in that they were in existence at the date the IVA was entered into. The right to claim existed even if the debtor was not aware of it at the time. I can see how that applied, FSA referred it to the Comp Commission in Feb 2007, their IVA commenced in Aug 2007 – after PPI was under the spotlight. In my case, I entered into it my IVA in early 2006, before any referral or review by the FSA. There simply was no possibility of a claim/asset at the time of entering my IVA, it did not exist at the time. Do you think I am still caught? I have a tiny £250 plevin payment that Barclays wants to pay to Aperture (I was with GT when I completed in 2012 and BE before that). Hardly seems worth arguing about but interested to hear your thoughts.
Thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I don’t think the date is relevant. You could have chosen to make a complaint about the PPI and potentially won it in 2006 before PPI came under the spotlight.
Morgan says
Hi Sarah, I wonder if you can help, my IVA finished with a full and final offer 5 years ago, so as I understand I have one more year left to have it fully taken from my credit history. If I was to go for PPI and whichever IVA company has taken the records from my original defunct one and reopens the case with the PPI claim would this mean I would be back to square one, (or year one) from the 6 year clearance date, or would I still be a year from a clear credit history. Hope that makes sense. Many thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
when did your IVA start?
Morgan says
Hi Sara, my IVA started in June 2009 and I received a letter of completion in April 2013. Hope that helps, as I don’t know if going for PPI would reopen the IVA and mean I would be be starting back to year one from completion. Many thanks Morgan
Sara (Debt Camel) says
If your IVA started in 2009, then it, and all the debts in it, should have disappeared from your credit record in 2015. See https://debtcamel.co.uk/repair-credit-record-iva/ which explains what to do if this hasn’t happened.
Making a PPI claim will not reopen your IVA and will not make the IVA or any of the debts reappear on your credit record. You don’t need to worry about this.
But it is possible any PPI refunds will be paid into your IVA so you will not get the money.
Sue says
My IVA failed in 2012. Since then I’ve paid my creditors the full amounts owed. PPI has been awarded to me but Aperture are insisting they get the money to go towards their ‘outstanding fees’. Can they do this? I only had the IVA for 8 months.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I haven’t been asked this before and I don’t know the answer. I will make some enquiries.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I have emailed you about this.
C Standing says
Hi
My Iva failed in 2006 and I filed for bankruptcy , which was also discharged in 2006
In September 2018 I applied to see if I could get ppi back on loans took out and repaid before my bankruptcy.
I have received a letter saying as I was subject to Iva/ bankruptcy the cheque will go to the official receiver. The letterforms the ppi company suggests I talk to my IP if I believe I am no longer subject to Iva
My IP has passed away and the firm has changed hands/ merged . Is there any chance the money will come back to me ?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
If the money doesn’t go to your old IVA firm it should go to the Official Receiver in your bankruptcy.
C Standing says
Hi
Ok thank you , is this for all ppi claims or just the ones covering loans involved in your bankruptcy? I have had previous debt that had been paid in full during the term of the loan, many years before I went bankrupt – 1999 . Will any money due from them be sent to the official receiver ?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
It is for any PPI before the date of your bankruptcy, whether or not that debt was included in your bankruptcy or repaid before.
A Jones says
I am after some advice if possible.
I was previously in an IVA which was completed in 2011 and my understanding was the proposal was based on old terms and conditions. This was what my IVA practitioner stated anyway but didn’t have a clue what it meant.
I have not signed any deed of assignment with regards to PPI.
Last year I was provided a PPI refund. The company asked for a copy of my closure certificate and then issued me with a refund. As I had a number of previous loans with the same company I challenged them on these and it’s now ended up with the ombudsman.
My concern is staff at the ombudsman are stating the refund should have been paid into the IVA despite it being closed fof 7 years. I assume any further amount will not be refunded to me.
I genuinely don’t feel I have done anything wrong as I have been completely honest about being in IVA and provide the company with closure certificate.
I am feeling very angry as the money has been spent so concerned they will ask me to repay this and I wouldn’t be in a position.
Please advise as it’s makinb me ill.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Why has the Ombudsman contacted you about this?
A Jones says
I challenged the company on previous loans which they refused to pay out despite the fact the PPI was sold in the sane way and the ombudsman upheld my concerns,
Thanks for your prompt response by the way Sara.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
OK , well go back to your old IVA firm and ask if they have any interest in the PPI reclaims. For old IVAs they may not! See the result from LA today further up in the comments here.
R says
Entered my IVA with DFD in October 2006 and got my completion certificate in July 2014. All PPI payments have been paid to the IVA firm DFD and now Aperture except one which was paid to me by cheque in September 2017. Aperture have now emailed me and asked me to send this to them or contact them if I no longer have the amount. I put the money in a bank account when I received it and is still there. What do you think might happen if I ignore the email and how would they know if I had spent the money or not.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I don’t know. Aperture have a reputation for being unpleasant, but I don’t know what legal mechanisms they would choose to use here. I suggest you do not ignore but are honest.
Rick Borman says
Wow…you got an email from Aperture??? I have been trying to get them to contact me for over 5 months now and all I ever get are automated replies saying they will contact me “in due course”. I have yet to get through on the phone and have now given up on this route. Maybe if I hinted that I may owe them money they would be more motivated to contact me :-)
Matthew Grimsley says
Lol that reply has made my day !
bree says
hello I received my IVA completion certificate in February 2016. I was contacted by my bank in June 2018 to say i was to be awarded £4,603 in mis sold PPI. on 15th November I was told a Cheque had been issues to the IVA company even though my IVA was completed more than 2 years ago. I did not sign a deed of assignment what can I d to rectify the situation as I believe the cheque shouldve been sent to me and not the IVA company.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
You should talk to your IVA company. BUT because of the Green v Wright case described in the article above, it may well be that the PPI should go to your IVA firm even though you hadn’t signed anything.