Have you had big overdraft problems for a long period?
You can make an affordability complaint and ask for a refund of overdraft charges if:
- your overdraft limit was increased to a level you are unable to clear; or
- your overdraft usage showed you were in long-term financial distress. For example, being in the overdraft all the time, or using an unauthorised overdraft a lot.
This article shows how to make an affordability complaint to your bank, with a free template letter to use.
These complaints do not hurt your credit record.
Contents
Overdraft affordability complaints
Overdrafts are supposed to be for short term borrowing
Overdrafts are intended to be used for short-term problems, not as long-term borrowing. A bank should review a customer’s repayment record and overdraft limit and if there are signs of financial difficulty, offer help.
One sign of financial difficulty is hardcore borrowing for a long period. The Lending Code defined hardcore borrowings as “the position where a customer’s current account overdraft remains persistently overdrawn for more than a month without returning to credit during that period”.
Some Ombudsman decisions
All cases are very individual. But these examples give you an indication of what the Ombudsman thinks is important.
In this 2020 NatWest decision, the Ombudsman decided:
NatWest did have an obligation to monitor Miss K’s use of her overdraft facility.
Any fair and reasonable monitoring of Miss K’s overdraft facility would have resulted in NatWest being aware Miss K was in financial difficulty … by October 2014 at the absolute latest. So NatWest ought to have exercised forbearance from this point onwards.
In this 2021 Santander case, the bank didn’t notice hardcore borrowing:
By this point, Miss C was hardcore borrowing. In other, words she hadn’t seen or maintained a credit balance for an extended period of time. Santander’s own literature suggests that overdrafts are for unforeseen emergency borrowing not prolonged day-to-day expenditure. So I think that Miss C’s overdraft usage should have prompted Santander to have realised that Miss C wasn’t using her overdraft as intended and shouldn’t have continued offering it on the same terms.
A similar decision was reached in this 2021 Lloyds case:
Mr and Mrs C’s statements leading up to the renewal shows they hadn’t really had a credit balance on their account for a prolonged period. Indeed, they’d had regular returned payments and had also exceeded their limit. In these circumstances, it ought to have been apparent Mr and Mrs C were unlikely to be able to repay what they owed within a reasonable period with overdraft interest, fees and associated charges continuously being added.
Decide which reasons apply to your overdraft complaint
Read through these and think about which apply to your case.
The bank set your limit too high
This may have been from the start when you were first given an overdraft. Or the initial low limit may have been fine, then the bank increased it to a level which it was impossible for you to repay.
If the bank saw signs of financial difficulty, it should not have increased your credit limit, even if you asked for it. And it should have considered offering your help (the regulator’s word is forbearance) for example by stopping adding charges.
How high is too high?
There is no set figure, it depends on your income and expenses. An overdraft of £2,000 for someone whose income is £1,800 a month is a lot – but if you earn £5,000 a month, then a £2,000 overdraft may be reasonable.
The bank should have seen you were in difficulty
Overdrafts are meant to be used when you have a problem. Using the overdraft a lot for a few months is fine. Or for a few days at the end of a month before you are paid.
Banks should review your overdraft annually. This is in most overdraft tgerms and conditions. And even if it isn’t the Ombudsman says this is good industry practice.
So at one of these reviews, your bank should have seen if you were in financial distress. For example if you are in the overdraft for all (or almost all) of the month for a prolonged period. Or if you were exceeding your arranged overdraft limit regularly for a significant amount.
I would say over a year is prolonged.
Other points that help your complaint
You don’t win an affordability complaint by saying the charges were too high.
Instead, you say the bank should have known they were unaffordable for you because of all the financial problems it could see on your statements and your credit record.
Here is a checklist, work out if any of these apply to you:
- often having direct debits or standing orders not being paid;
- a lot of gambling showing on your statements;
- significantly increasing other debts with the same bank;
- being recently rejected for a loan or a credit card by the bank;
- significantly increasing debts with other lenders showing on your credit record;
- a worsening credit record – maxed out credit cards, new missed payments, defaults etc;
- using payday loans;
- increasing mortgage arrears;
- making payment arrangements with other creditors;
- a reduction in the income going into your account.
Any of these suggests you are reliant on the overdraft to pay everyday bills and you will find it hard or impossible to repay the overdraft and not use it the next month.
If you can think of another reason your bank should have known you were in trouble.
Making your complaint
What you need at the start
You don’t need to know the exact dates your limit was increased before complaining.
If you have paper statements or you can download them from the app that may be useful for you. But you don’t need to send these statements to the bank with your complaint – the bank already has them!
You can’t go back and see exactly what your credit score was in say 2018 when the bank increased your limit. But your current credit record shows what was happening in 2017 and 2018. So download your credit report now and keep it. The sooner you get the report, the further back it goes. I suggest you get your free TransUnion statutory credit report.
Send a complaint in the app or by email
I don’t recommend phoning to start off a complaint. It’s too complicated and you will be talking to someone that doesn’t specialise in these complaints.
When the account is still open, you can send your complaint by secure message in the app or on the bank’s website. Take a copy of what you put in the message – you could email it to yourself so it won’t get lost and the date is recorded.
Most banks now have an email address that you can use if you prefer or if the account is closed so you can’t use the app. But banks don’t make these easy to find, so here is my list of bank email addresses for complaints.
A template you can adapt
The section above looked at the reasons to complain and the other good points that apply to your case – you are now going to turn those into a complaint.
In the template below, I’ve invented some examples and dates so you can see how a complaint email could read. The bits in italics should be changed or deleted to tell your story.
The bit about other points is important – what should your bank have noticed that showed you were in difficulty?
I am making an affordability complaint about the overdraft on my current account number 98765432.
Your identity details (these are needed if you complain by email, not if you use secure message):
My name is xxxxx xxxxxxxx. My date of birth is dd/mm/yy. The email address I use/used for this account was myaddress@whatever.com.
START BY SAYING they should have noticed when your overdraft usage got worse
Overdrafts are meant for short-term borrowing but that was not what I was using the account for. The fees and charges you were adding were making my position worse.
I am complaining that every year since [20xx] you have failed to notice my difficulty during the annual reviews of my overdraft. You should have offered forbearance eg by stopping interest and charges being added.
By 2014 I had been in my overdraft constantly for many months, not getting back into the black even when I was paid. This “hardcore borrowing” is a clear sign of financial difficulty. My income was only £1,850 a month – after I had paid bills, there was no way I could hope to clear an overdraft of £3500 in a reasonable length of time.
OR
By 2017 I had a large unauthorised overdraft for many days each month.
some other points that you can include if relavent- see the list above – these are just a few examples
You should knew I was in financial difficulty because you had rejected my loan application in 2016.
You should have noticed that the income going into my account decreased from 2018.
From 2018-20 there was a lot of gambling showing on my account.
In 2017 you should have seen from my credit record that I had made payment arrangements with other debts.
ALSO Was the limit to high when it was set?
(It may have been ok then and things only got difficult later – in that case miss this out.)
You should never have given me an account with such a large overdraft. When I applied in 2015, you should have checked my credit record and you would have seen I had recently missed payments to a credit card and had taken several payday loans.
OR
You should not have increased my overdraft limit in about 2014. When you increased the limit, you should have seen that my debts to other lenders on my credit record had increased a lot.
I do not know the exact months of these overdraft limit increases. In your reply to this complaint, please tell me when the increases were and how much the limit went up on each occasion.
END BY asking for a refund of charges and interest:
I would like you to refund all the interest and charges that were added to my account from 2016 when you increased my overdraft limit.
OR
I would like you to refund all the interest and charges that were added to my account from 2018 when you should have realised that my finances had got worse to the point that I was no longer able to clear the overdraft.
The Financial Ombudsman says that 8% simple interest should be added to any cash refund paid to me.
I would also like any late payment and default markers to be removed from my credit records.
Points to note
Personal accounts, not business accounts
The complaints covered here relate to personal accounts. For business accounts, talk to Business Debtline about your options.
You can complain if the account is still being used or if it is closed
These complaints can be made in a lot of different situations. For example:
- you are still using the account or you have stopped using it and are paying it off;
- the account has been closed;
- the bank defaulted it and sold it to a debt collector (here you still complain to the bank, not the debt collector). If the debt collector has gone to court and got a CCJ, add to your complaint that you want the CCJ removed as part of the settlement of your complaint.
But if you have had an IVA or bankruptcy after these problems, or if you are still in a DRO, then you shouldn’t complain – ask in the comments below for details.
Old accounts
Banks may say FOS won’t look at an old complaint, but this isn’t right. FOS will often look at a complaint if you have only just found out you can complain.
Open and recently closed accounts aren’t a problem – the bank will still have your statements.
If your complaint is about an account that was closed more than 6 years ago, it’s harder to win. The bank may no longer have much information about the old account. If you still have copies of your old bank statements for these old closed accounts this is worth a try.
If you feel you have a good older case take it to the Financial Ombudsman and let them decide!
Packaged bank accounts
These affordability complaints are nothing to do with packaged bank accounts. MSE has a good page about how to complain about packaged bank account charges. I suggest you don’t try to combine this with an affordability complaint – make two separate complaints to the bank and leave a gap of at least a month between them.
Student overdrafts
You are unlikely to win a complaint about a student overdraft saying you were a student and it was unaffordable – they are at 0% interest and nothing is charged until you are in work. So you need to argue it was unaffordable at the later date when they started to charge interest.
The Bank replies
They want to talk to me on the phone!
People are often scared if they get this message. But it may be good news!
You can just ignore it or say you would like a reply in writing.
If you decide to take the call, it helps to be prepared. Have a pen and paper handy so you can write down anything. If they say they are partially upholding the complaint, ask them the date they are refunding the fees from and how much. Also say you would like to see this in writing before you decide whether to accept it.
If they want to ask you questions that sound complicated or worrying (this is unusual), ask them to put the questions in writing as you find the phone difficult.
Rejection or a poor offer – go to the Ombudsman
The bank should reply in 8 weeks. You can’t go straight to the Ombudsman, you have to wait for the bank to reply.
Banks reject many good complaints, hoping you will give up. So don’t! You know if the overdraft has caused you a lot of problems.
And the bank may offer to refund fees for the last 15 months say, even though your problems have been large for many years. Think twice about accepting a low offer – you won’t put this offer at risk by going to the Ombudsman. If you aren’t sure, post in the comments below.
In particular, if the bank says you could have declined the increase to your overdraft limit or you never let the bank know you were in difficulty, FOS may not think that is a good reason. And ignore any statements by the bank that FOS will not look into things that happened more than 6 years ago.
Santander has been rejecting some cases then giving a full refund only a few weeks later if the case is sent to the Ombudsman – before the Ombudsman has even looked at it! Santander obviously knows it has been sending out misleading rejection letters.
The easy way to complain to FOS is by completing this online form:
- you can use what you put in your complaint to the bank;
- if the bank rejected your complaint or made a low offer, say why you think this is unfair;
- use normal English, not legal terms.
If your credit record shows that you had other debt problems send it to FOS. You don’t need to send your bank statements – the bank will send those to FOS. And you don’t need the policy documents for your bank account the lender will supply those to FOS if they are needed.
Do these complaints work?
Yes! In 2024, some banks are making more offers directly.
A Guardian article featured a case where someone used the template letter here. Barclays denied it has done anything but made an £8,000 “good will” payment to the customer.
And if yours doesn’t, people are winning cases at the ombudsman. FOS is a friendly service although it isn’t speedy. It isn’t any faster if you use a solicitor or a claims firm,
The comments below this article are from other people who have made this sort of complaint. That is a good place to ask for help if you aren’t sure what to do.
If you have priority debts such as utility bills, rent, council tax and benefit overpayments, these can’t wait until your overdraft complaint is settled. Start the overdraft complaint now, but you need debt help as well. So phone National Debtline on 0808 808 4000, tell them you have made an affordability complaint but you would like to know what your debt options are.
Is your credit card limit too high?
Get a refunds from large loans
Unaffordable car finance – your options
Rachel says
The decision is from the investigator:
‘Your packaged account was sold in March 2003 – more than six years before you first made your complaint. I also think you should reasonably have known you had a reason to complain more than three years before you did – so unfortunately your complaint falls outside the three-year time limit as well.’
Yes, I would be happy if they looked back six years or from 2021?
Should I just go back to the investigator?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest you go back and say that you had no idea it was possible to make these complaints earlier. But you also think that the bank should have reviewed whether the account was suitable for you, not just assumed that it would continue to be. Especially as Natwest have accepted that they should have reviewed your overdraft account from 2021, and a proper review should have taken into account the packaged bank fees as well as the overdraft fees. Point out that is within the last 6 years.
S says
Hi Sara. A positive update! Lloyds acknowledged they had been irresponsible from September 2021 onwards. They said they should have recognised there was no regular income into my account after I left the UK despite being in perpetual OD. They offered a partial settlement of around £4k for the last 2.5 years, which is about half what I claimed for.
I’m (happily!) surprised as I was expecting me leaving the country to be a problem. They also didn’t mention anything about the generic “help” letters they had been sending since 2021. I know they have used this as a defence before. My gut feeling is the default response with large claims is to offer a partial settlement.
During the call I was pressed to accept the offer. I asked several times why they hadn’t accepted my complaint for May 2018-September 2021 and all they said was it was “affordable”. I asked them for a summary of his findings and bizarrely they said they can’t do that and they will only send me an outcome letter when I accept the offer. After I pushed back they agreed to mail me the findings.
I am almost certainly going to go to the ombudsman for the remaining £4.2k from May 2018-August 2021 as I genuinely feel they were irresponsible then too, but will wait for the letter to arrive.
Whatever happens with that, having 4/5th of my OD wiped out after one phone call is a pretty amazing feeling. Thank you so much for this resource and helping so many people out. I will keep you updated :)
Sara (Debt Camel) says
If you end up going to the Ombudsman, make the point that you feel it was unfair to push you to accept the offer over the phone when you had asked to see it in writing
Catherine says
Hi Sara. I complained to hsbc for my mum in January for irresponsible lending for loans and overdrafts of course they didn’t uphold the case so sent it to the ombudsman. The investigator upheld the loan case early March and that has been settled. She then upheld the overdraft case 3rd April and sent her decision to HSBC since then they have completely ignored her and she sent them numerous emails since. In the end she’s had to send it higher to an ombudsman they today have agreed with her and upheld the case. What if HSBC ignore this decision too? I find it very strange that they’re not replying to anything from the FOS. Have you ever heard of this?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
HSBC won’t ignore a Final Decision from an Ombudsman. Let me know if they haven’t paid in 28 days.
Catherine says
I find it strange they’ve ignored the investigators emails never known that before. Hopefully they’re quick with they’re repose to the ombudsman.
Adam says
I’ve had similar from Lloyds, ignored a deadline from the ombudsman who ruled in my favour, and will now have to complete another deadline or will go to final decision from ombudsman. Frustrating
Jason says
Hi Catherine,
I have an ongoing overdraft affordability complaint with HSBC and they’ve been ignoring some of the adjudicators emails too when asking for certain evidence. I also asked for copies of documents over the past few months and they never arrive. I had to make a complaint against them for them to finally send it.
Catherine says
I emailed them direct on the bamber email with what had gone on. They emailed back apologising saying they hadn’t received any of the investigators emails so they had proactively reached out to the ombudsman asking for an update. I forwarded the email to the investigator who’s been dealing with the case and she said they have definitely received the ombudsman’s final decision and she also showed them the proof of the previous emails she’d sent them that they’d ignored. Hopefully they’ll be pretty swift sorting out the refund now as they’re being monitored by the FOS with this case now.
Catherine says
Well it’s been 5 weeks since the ombudsman decision and still no refund. I’ve emailed the investigator today to let her know. She said she’d chase them up. It’s been nearly 3 months since the investigators decision and find it absolutely ridiculous that they’ve still not sorted it. Yet charges for the overdraft are still being applied every month.
Katy says
Can I ask whether anyone has had any success with a Monzo affordability complaint? Monzo are not my main bank account (I.E not the account my salary gets paid into) I have a £2k overdraft with them which I am in permanently. The only money that goes into my Monzo account is the £50 a month interest/overdraft charge I pay. I can’t remember when the £2k overdraft came into effect but it was at least a year ago.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Can you say a bit more about the history of this account? when was it opened? was there an overdraft then? was the limit increased?
Katy says
It was opened approx. 3 years ago. No overdraft initially, a £2k one was applied for about a year ago and have been stuck in it ever since. It cost me £50 a month in charges.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Overdraft complaints only tend to work for long term. You aren’t likely to win this. What other options do you have to get it down, do you you have other expensive debt as well?
Jane says
My first complaint last year was rejected as I was on maternity leave. I complained again a month ago and they’ve refunded pretty much a grand. Although I’m going to the financial ombudsman because I think the fees should be further backdated!
John Wayne says
Hi Sara,
I have raised a complaint with Santander over 4 weeks ago for my £1800 overdraft. Initially I was given a student account at uni for £1500 and when I graduated in 2018 they changed the limit to £1800 without any application. Due to unemployment, low income and life events I remained in the overdraft for years clearing it and then reusing it etc. I was in the position to clear the overdraft and used some savings and a 0% balance transfer. It has been 4 weeks since I raised the complaint and they said they require more time to investigate. On a yearly statement it shows I spent around 300-330 days a year in overdraft each year. I currently have no overdraft usage as I’m trying to figure out all my debts and clear them. Do I just need to keep waiting for Santander ? Do I have a case? From my calculations I’ve easily paid them £3000-4000 in fees since graduating and not once was I offered any help.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
You can’t go to the Ombudsman until Santander has had the case for 8 weeks. So 4 weeks longer.
The savings you used to help clear it – how large were they? do you have other savings?
John Wayne says
It wasn’t much savings maybe £900 and the rest I had used a balance transfer as I’ve got more organised with budgeting and plan to clear existing debts on credit cards. I have some savings but it is an emergency fund to avoid using credit cards or monzo flex for living expenses. I didn’t want my overdraft to be passed on to debt collection agencies as some other comments suggest this has happened to them. I don’t mind them removing the overdraft or reducing the limit but I don’t want to risk any adverse credit history so decided to repay it and claim.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
ok, well see what the response is. I can’t guess how strong a case this is, but my standard suggestion is that it is you who knows what difficulty it has caused you.
John Wayne says
Hi Sara
I have received an update the complaints handler as not upheld.
Their argument is that it was not my main account and I had access to funds elsewhere, which is true I got my salary paid into monzo because it’s more convenient. However I have struggled for years between overdraft, credit cards and monzo flex. Only recently have I been able to clear the overdraft in full which they acknowledged. However, they’re saying the financial support will be in touch to set an arrangement which would appear on my credit file- I have called them straight back and said I do not need any formal arrangements as it will have adverse credit impacts and they said I will have the overdraft removed. I said that’s fine as long as there is no credit impacts. The complaints handler said that this is what happens when I “make allegations of unaffordable lending”. It’s not an allegation I explained they were fine to charge me interest and charges for years, between graduating uni and finding steady jobs, now I’ve made a complaint they’re threatening me with an arrangement for an overdraft I’ve paid in full. What do you advise Sara? The overdraft caused me stress for years, I was ashamed and struggling and now I’m clear I don’t mind removing it to not pay any charges. Can I take this further with FOS without risking my credit file?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
the person you spoke to doesn’t seem to know what they are talking about – you don’t owe them any money so what could you make a payment arrangement for? If they remove an overdraft you are not using, that will not harm your credit record.,
I suggest you send this to the Ombudsman now.
Matthew says
Hello Sara.
I just thought I would give you an update on my case. The Ombudsman came back in favour re Barclaycard-but only after Barclaycard fought tooth and nail and dragged it out against me for 6 months. I’ve now won on each of the three cases. The total refunds came to £9039.80 (£586.91 Amex, £4998.85 Barclays O/D and £3454.04 Barclaycard). This has now cleared all of my remaining debts and I’m now in the black for the first time in a decade! I can now get on with my life.
I’d like to thank you for all the help and advice you gave me-I wouldn’t have succeeded without you. I’d like to go further than words-I think you suggested to someone else that a charitable donation can be made?
Yours
Matt
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Well done! A small donation to your local Citizens Advice or foodbank would be lovely.
Matthew Wright says
Will do.
Thanks again Sara.
Teddy says
I want to share my story with you all, as Debt Camel and the advice and stories here led to a positive outcome for me, and I hope it gives you hope too.
In September 2019, NatWest offered me a pre-approved overdraft increase to £7,000, and a month later, to £15,000, which I accepted without any application. Looking back, it’s clear they shouldn’t have extended such a large overdraft given my modest salary and previous tendency of using my £1,800 overdraft.
Instead of using the overdraft for short-term needs, I ended up maxing out the £15,000 due to poor money management and gambling tendencies, eventually paying around £450 in interest monthly for nearly three years after I had maxed out the £15k overdraft.
Desperate for a solution, I found Debt Camel and wrote to NatWest, but my complaint was dismissed. I then took my case to the Financial Ombudsman Service (FOS). After four months of discussions, the FOS ruled in my favour, stating NatWest should have proactively contacted me about my financial situation and did not.
NatWest was instructed to refund £9,500 of interest and charges, significantly easing my burden. I set up a payment plan for the remaining £5,500, which I have now fully paid off. My account is finally at £0 for the first time in a long time!
To anyone fighting against unfair banking practices—keep going. I never thought I’d get a positive outcome, but I did, and you can too!
Sara (Debt Camel) says
what a great result!
Ava Staley says
Hi Sara,
Have a large overdraft with HSBC, £3.400. It was upwards of £4k at one stage but I got it down a little.
It’s around 10 years old now and I’m constantly right up against the edge of it, often going over.
At the time I had a partner who was simply going online and putting the overdraft up by £300, often once a week, spending it, doing it again. (Not a nice person). This happened over and over again and I feel they shouldn’t have allowed that and should’ve seen something was amiss just by how often it was being put up and spent.
I asked to see what terms they have for giving people overdrafts and my affordability in particular/why they thought I could afford such a large amount and they have refused to give me this info. The woman in the email was quite rude actually.
I only had my wage going in at the time which was a standard living wage amount. I’m struggling to pay it off, is it worth complaining about?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
so you are in the overdraft all or almost all of the month?
I asked to see what terms they have for giving people overdrafts and my affordability in particular/why they thought I could afford such a large amount
how long ago did you ask?
Ava Staley says
My overdraft is £3,430 currently and I’m always at —£3,430 and often go into an un arranged overdraft which they charge me additional interest on. I just can’t pay it off. I’ve had to move back to my parents simply to pay off the debt there’s no other way I can do it. If I didn’t move, which I did last week, I just won’t get rid of it.
I asked the later end of last year for them to tell me what they saw on my account that made them believe I could afford this and was told that they couldn’t tell me due to confidentiality.
Thanks.
R says
Hi Sara,
Santander have responded to the FOS with an offer and i was wondering if you could help.
They have advised:
What Santander have offered to do
Santander will agree to refund fees and interest between 18 December 2019 until present, due to your financial difficulty when they should’ve stepped in sooner to support you. They can see on both bank accounts an “Early intervention letter” was sent on 18 December 2018, therefore fees and charges to be refunded would be 12 months from this date.
As part of the settlement Santander would like the following agreed and accepted with you before they move this complaint to a close to ensure they can work in the best way possible with you, to resolve the complaint.
I don’t agree with this because even if a Early intervention letter was sent they should have stopped my OD or intervened. Are they just using this to save them money because looking back at my statements i had a lot of Charges from 2018 – 2019.
The FOS investigator then goes on to say: If you would like to accept Santander’s offer, please let me know by 13 June 2024 and I’ll arrange for Santander to get in touch with you.
If you are not happy with the offer, please let me know why by 13 June 2024 and we’ll continue to investigate.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
What were the charges in 2017 like?
R says
The charges were pretty much £40-80pm. I was always in Overdraft.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Then if you don’t think the offer is adequate, go back to the adjudicator and say that your problems with the overdraft start years before December 2019 and you think the offer is inadequate
Nicola says
Hello,
I wonder if you can help, I have recently sent a complaint re my over draft, £4650, I am in it more or less every day, clearly struggling financially. Paying about £1700-1800 per annum in interest for this. Had the large over draft for in excess of 10 years, my salary has never been enough to cover it.
In my online banking, there is their bog standard letters about “find out ways we can help you with your overdraft” with no solutions listed. They then got in touch in March saying they would reduce my interest from 49% to 17% and the savings made would be used to reduce my OD.
I have not even had enough in the OD to allow that to happen, hence my researching and stumbling across this forum.
My question is do these “bog standard, let’s talk about your OD” clear them of any wrong doing?
Thank you in advance x
Sara (Debt Camel) says
No they don’t.
What other debts do you have?
Nicola says
Thank you for your help.
Credit cards, a loan, catalogues. I am contacting all to make payment arrangements etc.
the OD just seems excessive and I have been wary to complain for fear of them closing my account etc. But now they have forced the issue I think, good greif you have had thousands from me and it’s never enough… thanks again!
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I think you should consider a Debt management plan with StepChange for all of your debts including the overdraft.
See https://debtcamel.co.uk/debt-options/guide-to-dmps/ for info on DMPs and https://www.stepchange.org/how-we-help/debt-management-plan.aspx.
A DMP has the same effect on your credit record as a series of payment arrangement, but it is a lot less stressful as StepChange do all the work in contacting your creditors and you only have to make a single payment a month to them. Do not use any DMP firm that charges fees – they have no advantages over StepChange and the DMPs last a long longer because of the fees.
Then you can make affordability complaints about the overdraft and about any of the other debts in the DMP. Winning any will speed up the DMP.
Khateeb Qureshi says
Hi Sara, I made an affordability complaint for a credit card via a claims management (before I read your material and have since complained to my bank myself).
The credit card claim management has now come back to ask for further info, any advice on how to respond would be much appreciated:
“The ombudsman is requesting more information regarding your Vanquis claim, please see below.
What exactly led up to you realising that the lending decision reached on 26 November 2014 was unsuitable for your circumstances. Please be as specific as possible
Can you tell me when you started your research that you may have needed some help with your financial situation? Did anyone help you with this? And what was the trigger that caused you to start your research?
Vanquis has shown that on 28 September 2018 it defaulted your account due to overdue repayments and you exceeding your credit limit. Why didn’t you think, at that time, that Vanquis may have been responsible for the difficulties you were having in making your repayments
Did you complete any research when Vanquis sold your account to Lowells on 23 September 2019 that they may have been responsible for the situation you found yourself in.
Was there anything that prevent you from contacting Vanquis sooner than you did, such as any extenuating circumstances.”
Sara (Debt Camel) says
You need to make it clear to FOS that you now blame Vanquis for this as they increased your limit too high, but in 2018 and before you thought the arrears were your fault because you had used the card too much and you still blamed yourself when the debt was sold to Lowell. Say it wasn’t until you saw an advert on social media (say where and when) from a claims firm that you had any idea that a lender should have checked for affordability.
Jenni says
I put in a complaint after seeing a programme on the BBC in March leading me here. HSBC replied within 24 hours to say they didn’t agree so I sent this to the ombudsman. Weeks later I was assigned an investigator purely to tell me HSBC had made me an offer. They returned exactly enough in fees to remove my £1600 overdraft with a little left over so I’m now overdraft free for the first time in 24 years! I kept my complaint to nothing further than 2018 as I knew that was a grey area (and feel I probably could have got more) but I’m happy with this & now looking at my credit card lenders. Thank you Sara!
Khateeb Qureshi says
You’re a star, thank you so much!
Heidi says
Hi Sara,
If I put in a complaint for my overdraft, is it likely that the bank would try to immediately remove it and try reclaim the money in full/ reduce it? I am living in my overdraft and have been for about two years- I don’t want to put in a complaint and then lose what little money I have left. Thank you
Sara (Debt Camel) says
In theory a bank can remove an overdraft at any time without any reason.
But this doesn’t seem to happen when someone makes a complaint about an account that they are actually using..
If you are very worried, you may decide it’s sensible to get another bank account and move over all your income and payments before complaining.
what is NOT sensible is not to complain and just carry on as you are – because that is basically a lifetime of paying high overdraft fees.
Clara says
Hi,
Halifax contacted me about the complaint today. In short they wouldn’t look back past 6 years and don’t feel that my income was fine compared to my outgoings and no refund is due.
Almost 1 week after I’m paid I’m inside an overdraft and many times I’m in unarranged, even now!
He said he was able to total up all my necessary bills based on transactions and I had enough surplus to clear the account.
Just wondering if this is worth passing on to the FOS. I’ve had few failed debt management plans and payday loans defaulted, in the process of slowly sorting them out. Would I forward the letter I receive from the bank onto the FOS as well?
Thank uou
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Failed debt management plans and defaults on payday loans don’t sound like someone who is managing to me… yes I suggest you send this to the ombudsman. Yes you can attache the Halifax reply when you set up the complaint with FOS – use the link in the article above to do this.
Have you had a letter from Halifax recently about overdraft charges changing?
These failed debt management plans – who were they with? What went wrong, did your income drop? Were you too optimistic about managing on lower expenses?
Clara says
Hi Sara,
Thanks for getting back. I don’t think they’ve sent about overdraft charges changing. All three debt management plans were with Stepchange, mainly hitting the 3 month failed payment mark. It was just low wages and costs and overdrafts.
I’ve had poor mental health and months just blend in together, just a terrible circle.
The man I spoke with on the phone said I had an ultimate reward account for 8 years but this definitely wasn’t true, he just said I had a monthly fee taken out from back until 2010 so those charges aren’t taken into consideration.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
so what is your current situation – how large are your debts? are you making payments to them? are you buying to renting? are you behanind with any bills?
Clara says
Debts are slowly coming down but still trying to chip away at them. My credit score is 146, and many defaults missed payments this year. Really trying now to get priority debts in place but no more than £2,000
Sara (Debt Camel) says
could you list the debts? including the arrears on bills?
are you buying or renting?
Chris Clarke says
If I was to take my complaint to the FOS, which of these factors would be key to focus on?
The fact Lloyds never told me they would eventually charge OD fees on my student account.
My financial hardship / lack of ability to pay off the OD.
The total time lapsed since I was last out of the overdraft.
Lloyds refusal to acknowledge my hardship, let alone even realising it in the first place.
Lack of help from Lloyds overall.
The fact Lloyds have granted me a credit card AND a loan whilst I was already using the OD heavily.
The fact Lloyds are happy to continue charging daily OD fees until I can miraculously get out of the overdraft, even though I’ve told them I’m struggling.
If I was to also claim for credit card and loan interest paid, would it make sense to include that when contacting the FOS about the OD too, or would I have to contact Lloyds themselves first? I’ve only contacted Lloyds regarding the OD so far.
Thanks!
Sara (Debt Camel) says
The fact Lloyds never told me they would eventually charge OD fees on my student account.
Mention this but you may find it hard to prove it. lloyds probably sent you something that said it even if you didnt focus on it at the time.
My financial hardship / lack of ability to pay off the OD.
The total time lapsed since I was last out of the overdraft.
These are the key points for winning an affordability complaint.
Lloyds refusal to acknowledge my hardship, let alone even realising it in the first place.
Lack of help from Lloyds overall.
Did you ask for help? Or do just mean their unhelpful response to your complaint?
The fact Lloyds have granted me a credit card AND a loan whilst I was already using the OD heavily.
mention this as it should have affected the reviews they did of the overdraft. BUT you also need to start seperate complaints about both of these.
The fact Lloyds are happy to continue charging daily OD fees until I can miraculously get out of the overdraft, even though I’ve told them I’m struggling.
Have you asked them to stop interest being added?
Have lloyds written to you recently about changes to overdaft rates?
If I was to also claim for credit card and loan interest paid, would it make sense to include that when contacting the FOS about the OD too, or would I have to contact Lloyds themselves first?
You should claim for these – make two seperate complaints. one for the credit card and one for the loan. In each of them mention that you were using your overdraft heavily when the loan/ credit card was given to you.
Chris Clarke says
When taking out the student account in 2021 they didn’t say it would change to a normal account which charges daily OD fees, the first I heard was the letter I received in 2018 stating that it was was changing.
I’ve been in the OD every day since 2022, and as hard as a I try I can’t seem to make the £1000 OD any smaller, let alone get out of it. Definite financial difficulty, but Lloyds say that I’m not struggling.
I’m not even sure HOW to ask Lloyds for help, but after my complaint they should be aware now that I’m struggling, and have offered no help. Before the complaint, they never realised that I was using the OD heavily and struggling to pay it off, which they should have.
I didn’t know I COULD ask them to stop the fees? Even after the complaint they haven’t offered to stop the fees. Are they likely to stop charging the fees if I ask them to? No current changes to OD rates, still the same as before the complaint. I do know that while I’ve been using the OD over the years, they’ve put interest rate up to the highest (49.9%).
I’ll open separate complaints for the credit card and loan at a later date, will focus on the OD for now then.
I just want the OD fees to stop so I have a fighting chance of getting out of the OD, and would really like the £1200+ I’ve already paid in fees back so I can pay off the OD, but I know that’s a long-shot.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I’m not even sure HOW to ask Lloyds for help, but after my complaint they should be aware now that I’m struggling, and have offered no help. Before the complaint, they never realised that I was using the OD heavily and struggling to pay it off, which they should have.
I didn’t know I COULD ask them to stop the fees? Even after the complaint they haven’t offered to stop the fees. Are they likely to stop charging the fees if I ask them to? No current changes to OD rates, still the same as before the complaint. I do know that while I’ve been using the OD over the years, they’ve put interest rate up to the highest (49.9%).
So there are two points here.
First is whether lloyds should have offered to help when you complained – you are taking that forward by going to the Ombudsman.
Second is how to get help now. Phone them up, say you are taking the complaint to the Ombudsman but you cannot manage at the moment and you would like them to freeze charges on the account. This will impact your credit record, but the negative marke should be removed if you win the FOS complaint. Importantly it helps you now.
Matt says
I have recently terminated an IVA after 2 years and want to go ahead with an affordability complaint. I had an 11k loan from Barclays which was approved to me in 2019 right after I had an overdraft increase from £400 to £1.1k with Barclays as well. I have already submitted an affordability complaint for the loan because I should not have been approved for it at the time as I was constantly in my overdraft and had increased it every month 5 months prior to getting approved for the loan. Also my wage at the time was only £1300 a month. Should I wait to hear a response from this complaint before looking into an affordability complaint against the overdraft?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Who was your IVA with? There is some risk that the IVA firm will try to claim a refunds even though the IVA is terminated. But this may not happen.
I suggest you should complain now about the overdraft. Add a sentence into the template saying that you have already complained bout aa loan and now you want to make an affordability complaint about the overdraft.
Matt says
The IVA was with McCambridge Duffy. They’ve sent me the certificate of termination so I feel like that should mean I’m not tied to them anymore
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Ok,well you may as well proceed with the complaint. I just wanted to warn you
Matt says
Thank you. Will see what happens
cece osa says
i finally heard from the ombudsman who did not agree with the investigator and has made a provisional decision not to ask the Barclays to do anything.
I have filed a request for reconsideration with the most compelling ground being that my husband had similar issues and in his case, the investigator found that barclays was obliged to conduct a yearly review and had they done so, they would have found hardcore borrowing and should have taken steps to help my husband. Barclays accepted this and paid
In my case however, that was not the reason cited by my investigator. She said Barclays should not have borrowed because of earnings.
In essence i have notified the ombudsman using my husband case and outcome to try and persuade him to take a look at barclays failure to react after a yearly review.
My other ground for seeking review was INCONSISTENCY.. I argued that if my husband had similar issues, why was his outcome different.. again referring to the yearly review barclays should have done but they did not.
Are there other tips that you think could work?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
What would a yearly review have shown? That is the important part to emphasise.
cece osa says
both accounts had similar issues. The yearly review would have shown hardcore borrowing and that the overdraft was always maxed out. What are my options here Please? …. I always paid the maximum interest possible. I also went into unarranged overdraft … this happened weekly until Barclays closed the account without notification.
Is the ombudsman obliged to comment on the points i raised before they issue their final decision?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
so you need to argue that a yearly review would have shown hardcore borrowing.
FOS is not a service that determines cases “by precendent” so point out your husband was in a similar situation will not necessarily help you.
cece osa says
thank you sara… i understand the issue with precedent, but they also say that they have to be consistent…….. i actually sent the ombudsman the pdf of the decision that was reached in my husbands case, so he could compare.
Does the fact that Barclays agreed with the yearly review issue in my husbands case help?
Thank you
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Not directly. But read your husbands decision in detail and argue that those points apply to your case. For example (and an irrelevant one to illustrate what you need to do) if your husbands decision said the lender failed to check that Mr O’s car was purple and that meant it was more likely to break down, then you need To argue that your car was purple and this caused all the breakdowns, you don’t have to say my car is purple and my husband won a case with a purple car.
So start from your bank statements. Read Mr Os decision in detail. Read the Ombudsman.s preliminary decision on your case in detail. What has the Ombudsman missed? Or not taken fully into account? What useful phrases could you borrow from your husbands decision to make your case?
cece osa says
Thank you Sara….. below is Ground 1 of my representation… what do you think
1. In accordance with the Consumer Credit Sourcebook (CONC 5), the bank should
have reviewed my overdraft facility after a year. Had they done so, they ought to
have seen i had become heavily reliant on my overdraft.
HOW is the actions of the bank fair when no actions was taken to help me?
Overdrafts are intended for short term emergency use, but a review would have
shown hardcore borrowing and that I was using the overdraft for prolonged periods of
time.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
It would be stronger if you go Into detail about how many days of the month you were in the overdraft for what period… eg in 2019 I was in my overdraft for more than 26 days of every moment. In 2020 my situation was worse and for most of the year I was in my overdraft every day of the month. Etc
Cece osa says
Thank you Sara,
In 2019 and 2020 my barclaycard was in.persistent debt. The overdraft was given to me by barclays in 2020. Would this constitute a further ground?
Also according to the terms and condition of my overdraft barclays was to conduct constant reviews of the overdraft but usually anually. Had they done this, they would have found hard-core borrowing after a year.
Please let me.know what you think.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
If Barclays offered you an overdraft after they had sent you persistent credit card debt letters and you had not increased your credit card payments, that would suggest it was unwise to give you an overdraft
cece osa says
This email was sent to me by Barclaycard on march 19 2020 , 3 weeks before the 1st overdraft was granted “We’re pleased to tell you that you’ve paid enough to get your account out of persistent debt. This means you can continue to use your card as normal. By continuing to pay as much as you can each month, you’ll pay less in interest.” the persistent debt payment was the 18 months leading to march 2020
1st overdraft granted in April 15, 2020 : £2750
April 18 2020: limit increased to £3850
April 22 2020 : limit increased to £4490
even though i was paying a bit more on credit card for 18 months, i was still using the whole of the balance. It is not that i stopped using the card, i was still using it.
please let me know what you think
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I think that is a good reason why Barclays should have thought twice about giving you such a large credit limit.
Matt says
I heard back from Barclays regarding my affordability complaint for the loan I have and they chose to not uphold the complaint, due to my disposable income being £500 and loan repayments £300. I explained on thr phone that I had defaulted on a car loan of £7500 prior to this which I still hadn’t repayed plus another loan in default but they didn’t seem to know about these from their checks. They advised me to go to the Financial Ombudsman. I have not heard back about my complaint regarding my overdraft yet, should I wait for a response on this or go ahead with the complaint to the Financial Ombudsman now?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Send the loan complaint to the Ombudsman now. Send the overdraft one later.
Matt says
So I heard back from Barclays regarding the overdraft complaint. They have said they’re investigation didn’t see any evidence from the bank of wrongdoing however they would be offering to refund the charges and interest as a goodwill gesture of around £350. The account was closed in 2021 and I still owe around £500 on it. They said because it’s a goodwill gesture they wouldn’t be able to remove any negative reports from my credit reports. Do you think it’s worth going to thr Financial Ombudsman to try and get them to advice the negative report is taken off the report? Or worth negotiating with Barclays to settle the account as a good will gesture as its only a couple hundred more? Or should I just take the offer? I’m torn because I’m grateful for the goodwill gesture but I don’t know if I could get more
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Tell me about the overdraft – when was the account opened? how many days a month were you in the overdraft?
Matt says
Hey I filled out a form online to complain to the Financial Ombudsman about my loan as soon as I recieved the final response letter from barclays. I got an acknowledgement email saying that if they can help I should hear back within 7 working days. I haven’t heard back from them. Do you think this means they cannot help at all or I should wait a bit longer? If I still don’t hear anything is it worth complaining again?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
You dont need to do anything. FOS will look into your case. If you have Heard anything in a month ask them what is happening.
The only people they “can’t help” are people complaining about non UK authorised financial firms (your bank in Texas, your water bill, poor work by your electrician etc). Also people who have gone straight to the Ombudsman get told to complain to the lender first.
Matt says
So the account with Barclays was opened quite a while ago but the overdraft was accepted April 2019 at £400. From then til July 2019 I was able to increase the overdraft 6 times to a final amount of £1100. At this time I was in my overdraft about 80% of every month as my wage was about £1300. The account was closed and defaulted in June 2021 when I entered into an IVA. I left the IVA in May 2024. I’m not sure how much is left on the account.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
So you are getting all the interest back? And just care about your credit record? I don’t it is worth going to the ombudsman for this – your credit record is going to be dreadful until the IVA drops off anyway, getting the odd default removed won’t make much difference.
But you need to know what the balances are on the debts that were in your IVA. Are there many of them? Why did you leave the IVA?
Matt says
Yeah that makes sense about my report. I left the IVA because my circumstances changed, was getting a substantial bonus payment and pay rise and didn’t want half to go towards the IVA and fees. My plan is to tackle the smaller debts (under £1000 cards etc) first then make final settlement offers for the bigger ones. The final report they sent me with the cancellation certificate just showed me the amount each company had claimed during the IVA, didn’t show me how much I have contributed already.
I think in terms of this overdraft I might try to negotiate and see if they can reduce the balance down to £400 (the original overdraft amount) with the goodwill gesture then I can pay the rest off.
Matt says
So Barclays have rejected my counter offer to reduce the remaining balance down to £400 because they say if they do that they have to admit to wrongdoing which they believe they haven’t.
If I were to take this to the Ombudsman and they find the bank haven’t done anything wrong, can I still accept the offer from Barclays? Would the Ombudsman be able to offer any more compensation above the interest and charges refunded?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
If the offer is a “goodwill” offer, in theory it can be withdrawn if the ombudsman finds in the firms favour.
Are they offering a full refund of all fees and charges? If they are, you are VERY VERY unlikely to get a better offer by going to the ombudsman.
Has this debt been sold on to a debt collector?
Phil says
Hi!
I raised a complaint against Lloyds for an unaffordable overdraft that was refinanced with a personal loan also with Lloyds.
I realised I was struggling with my overdraft in 2019 and went to Lloyds for help. They didn’t offer any forbearance, dept-management plans or even debt advice etc. Instead, they offered to refinace the overdraft (£4800) with a personal-loan to be paid off over 7 years with an APR of ~23%. I didn’t know any better and accepted this offer.
In response to my complaint, Lloyds agreed that the overdraft was not affordable and offered a refund that I accepted (~£4500). BUT they have insisted that the loan itself was affordably / fairly offered. I have argued that the only reason I had the loan was to refinance a debt that Lloyds unfairly let me accrue. Lloyds disagreed so I sent it to the adjudicator who upheld my case. Lloyds did not respond to the adjudicator’s decision so I am now waiting for an ombudsman.
Do you know how the FOS typically handles / decides in these cases – where an unaffordable overdraft is refinanced with the same provider?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
There isn’t really a “typical” case here where someone has had more than one product from their bank. It depends on the numbers and the timing and your situation. They very often are strong complaints because your bank knows so much about you. But FOS doesn’t have a blanket ban on a bank refinancing another debt – for example if the loan had been refinances at 8%, that may have been affordable and a great help to you, whereas 23% was too high to be manageable.
Phil says
That makes sense thank you.
I had assumed that if they agreed the original debt was unfairly lent, any additional refinancing of that debt would also be deemed unfair by association.
It sounds like instead the FOS won’t treat products as inherently linked together, but will still view them in context / relation to each other.
Matt says
Yeah they are offering a full refund of fees and interest and no the debt is still within the Barclays collections team.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Well it’s up to you but I think you are wasting your time trying to go to the Ombudsman. And isn’t getting the interest refunded a reasonable result for you?
HG says
Hi Sara – I complained to Barclays years back 2015 about irresponsible lending but about my overdraft (student and current account), loan and credit cards (x2). All on an individual basis but now I have complained saying that it is only now I realise that Barclays should have looked at my complaint holistically as one, since they had access to more data that just my credit report. For example, they knew I had called to say I couldn’t make a payment for a loan (which they said I had to at all cost and I borrowed to pay the payment) and also they knew I was constantly in my overdraft and with returned direct debits (including to my Barclaycards!). The continued to lend to me, increasing my card limits on the cards (I was only paying min and cash advances).
Barclays have come back to me saying they won’t uphold my complaint, they won’t look at it as ‘one’ complaint and they won’t look at it as it’s time barred. Since I still have a current account with them, they’ve credited my account with £50. I’m a little concerned that this will be classed as compensation but I wasn’t even given the option to accept or not.
I’ve gone to the FOS but I’m not sure what my chances are. It will be a large refund if successful.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
The £50 sounds like some goodwill offer. But if they didn’t ask you to accept it or not, it will not prevent FOS looking at the complaint.
What happened to the 2015 complaints? were they really about “affordability”?
Hg says
Their response:
I can confirm we’ve sent a letter on 6 November 2015 about you letting us know that you’ve asked a Debt Management Company to help you with your finances. At this point, you’d have known whether your financial difficulties had been caused by a change in your personal circumstances after we lent to you. If it wasn’t due to a change in your circumstances then it’s fair to conclude that a reasonable person with this information would have thought that there may be a problem with having been given a credit card/or having the limit increased and that they would have thought that they could make a complaint.
The event mentioned above, would have made you aware that you had a cause to complain regarding the lending that had been provided to you on your Barclaycard. If this was not the case, they ought to have reasonably done so.
In checking your accounts, I can see that we’ve provided monthly statements. Our terms and conditions describe the importance of the information provided within these communications.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
ok so you didn’t complain in 2015, Barclaycard are saying that you should have. Ignore this and send the complaint to the Ombudsman. The fact they you knew you were in financial difficulty in 2015 does NOT mean that you thought it was the lenders fault. You may well have blamed yourself in 2015 for having been bad with money and borrowed too much.
To “have a cause to complain” you would have to know that Barclaycard had been partly to blame by failing to make adequate affordability checks – but you probably only found out about this in the last 6 months.
HX says
Good evening Sara!
I requested all of my data from Barclays and have read through 950 pages!! I have tabulated all of my complaints made and it seems that all of my complaints up until this year (after finding your informative and helpful site), were (bar 1) in fact just requests for help. Interestingly, the one that is about irresponsible lending for Barclaycards (x2), was last year in 2023 and they said it was time barred BUT they say they would consider anything the FOS brings to them post 6 months (is this unusual?!).
I have sent everything tabulated and my data request to the case opened by the FOS. It shows that the complaints were requests for help and the only time I claimed irresponsible lending was recent. I said I always blamed myself and never considered Barclays were partly to blame.
B/Cards were used maxed out for years, min. payments, cash withdrawals and the complaints I made back up that – I found it really hard going even from 2009. There were consistent returned direct debits, I called about a Barclays loan and said I couldn’t make the first payment in 2011 and they said to make it, no matter how I had to (this is the data request). My joint account was consistently in overdraft, even though returned direct debits were the norm. Each year, Barclays sent hardship letters, saying I needed to think about reaching out if needed to. My student current account OD was -£1230 from 2009-2018 (!)
Sara (Debt Camel) says
“they say they would consider anything the FOS brings to them post 6 months” i have no idea what that sentence means
HX says
I’ve copied and pasted from Barclays letter:
The time limit for referring complaints to the Ombudsman is usually six months but we will consent to the Ombudsman considering your complaint even if you refer the complaint later than this.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
yes that is unusual.
I am not sure it helps you at the moment though. There are two sorts of “time barring” – the 6-month rule for going to FOS which Barclaycard said it would waive, and the “over 6 years / over 3 years” rules – it doesn’t sound as though Barclaycard have waved that?
HX says
I have said to the FOS that it was recent that I realised that Barclaycard were partially to blame and so the time barred doesn’t apply. Then onwards from that, although I am past 6 month, Barclaycard said they would let FOS investigate.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
ok so FOS needs to make a decision about going back further than 6 years.
Dave Smith says
So we’ve followed all the advice on this site and my wife filed a complaint with Halifax about the 12 years she was in her overdraft (never leaving it the entire 12 years!) eventually we took out a secure loan to pay off this and other crippling debts.
At first we talked to them via the app and asked how we would like it resolved? My wife said she wanted all the fees plus interest back (this would be in excess of £7000) they just replied with a couple of questions ‘when did you realise your OD was unaffordable?’ And ‘why are you complaining now?’ My wife answered the questions as per advice on here and they just replied with ‘are you happy with how we have resolved this issue?’ Obviously my wife replied no because they hadn’t resolved a damn thing!
They then said they would escalate her complaint and would be in touch. After 4 weeks we got a questionnaire once again asking if she was happy with the outcome of her complaint. She contacted them again via the app where they said they had written to her with their response (they didn’t say what that response was and we never received it anyway!) they then said they would ‘re-open the complaint and would be in touch. We reminded them that they only had 20 days of the 8 weeks left and we would not accept them resetting the clock on this.
That was several days ago and no response since. Sorry for the long winded response but does anyone know what they are playing at here?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
It sounds incompetent rather than a deliberate game.
I suggest you send the complaint to the Ombudsman at 8 weeks.
Tammy says
I made a complaint to TSB for unaffordable planned overdraft charges I’ve been. They responded:
“My investigation is now complete, and I agree that we did make some mistakes. I have provided details below.
Our records show you raised a similar complaint under reference ********. We issued you with our response on 14 April 2022, which you took to the Financial Ombudsman. However you were outside of the timescales for them to consider your complaint.
For this complaint I have therefore only reviewed your Overdraft facility from the date of our previous final response.
Your Overdraft limit has been £3,000 since 22 December 2014 and after reviewing your account and the ongoing affordability of the Overdraft, whilst I cannot agree we have made an error in allowing you the Overdraft facility it’s clear you’ve been struggling to maintain the Overdraft on your account.
We will be removing your Planned Overdraft limit on your account on 10 June 2024. At this time, I’ll be arranging to refund all charges applied from May 2022 and it may be likely that an outstanding balance will remain on the account. This will mean your account will be passed to our Financial Services team (FS) who will try and contact you.’
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Did you delay more than 6 months in taking the previous compilation the Ombudsman?
Tammy says
No so the overdraft was given in 2014 and I was out with the 6 years of making a complaint and they asked why I was told to say I was only recently made aware I could complain and they said that’s not a good enough reason it needs to things like you where in a coma etc. I think the person dealing with the new complaint thinks I was outwith the 6 months of going to the ombudsman as I don’t think they’ve properly reviewed it I did try tell them they have it wrong and asked if they would like to review the old complaint again and they replied saying they will not be reviewing it again if I’m unhappy to go to the ombudsman
Sara (Debt Camel) says
so did you take the previous complaint to the Ombudsman?
Tammy says
Yes – I made an irresponsible lending complaint and took it to the ombudsman in 2022 and they couldn’t help because the overdraft I was saying was loaned irresponsibly was given in 2014 and it was passed the 6 years mark.
In my new new complaint I have requested the repayment of all charges and interest related to my overdraft as I believe that the continuous charges and interest levied against my account are in violation of the principles outlined in the Lending Code (Section 9) and the Banking Conduct of Business Sourcebook (Section 5.1.4), specifically emphasising fair treatment for customers facing financial difficulties.
They have only refunded the charges back to April 2022 when I made the irresponsible lending complaint?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
when did the financial difficulties start?
Jane says
Hi Sarah,
I am living in my arranged overdraft which is always maxed out and has been for at least 3 years. It regularly goes into an unarranged overdraft and direct debits bounce due to insufficient funds, particularly when £39 interest comes out preventing me from paying a direct debit.
I first got this overdraft as a student, and has since gone to a postgraduate account now an everyday account. I went back to Uni since to do an MA while having an everyday account. My MA loan paid the overdraft off from my BSc but of course went back into it. I didn’t occur to me at the time, to switch my account back to student for the 0% interest and instead have been paying interest since my BSc. Living constantly -1400 and then a further -39 for the interest (sometimes -77 if they take a double interest fee that month which happened in this month). I only have around £40 I can spare a month towards paying off the overdraft to start getting it down but then I will still be slapped with interest which will just eat that up and back to square one. I also suffer from severe mental health but not receiving treatment at the moment.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
when did it switch to an everyday account?
Jane says
Hi Sara,
6th April 2020 was when it switched from postgraduate to an everyday current account. My £1400 arranged overdraft interest rate is 39.94% EAR.
the account switched from a postgraduate to an everyday current account on the 6th April 2020. Also to add, over a two month period, from 9th September 2022 – 23rd November 2022 I was a problem gambler. I went from -£885.54 to -1399.56 from my gambling habit when my mental health was critically low.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
do you have other debts as well as the overdraft?
have you asked if you switch the account to a student 0% interest one?
Do you know how much you have paid in interest and any bounced DD charges?
When does your MA end? Because it isn’t clear that getting a refund here will actually resolve your money problems?
Jane says
Only a couple of small debts. £80 DVLA penalty for a missed direct debit payment due to insufficient funds, now gone to Advantis Credit. I have a small debt for an old mobile phone that has gone to Lowell.
I started my MA in 2021 and finished in 2022.
The furthest I can go on my banking app is 22nd July 2022. I can confirm I have paid £889.07 in interest from 22nd July 2022 – 18th June 2024. Just to clarify, I have been paying interest since the 6th April 2020, I am just unable to see how much from then until July 2022. These monthly fees show up on my account as ‘Arranged Overdraft Interest’. I can’t see anything on my statements in regards to bounced DD charges.
Getting a refund will help me massively. I am paying an interest fee every month and has often resulted in me missing a bill and having to pay a penalty. Not only am fully maxed out every month, I also go into a further minus on top of that due to the interest. I am struggling to pay the overdraft off because what little money I have per month to go towards paying it off/reducing it gets eaten by the interest fees. The refund will be able to clear the overdraft.
I was heavily gambling during a 2 month period in 2022 where I went into my overdraft significantly. Santander never once reached out to me about my gambling activity.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Then make that complaint!
Jane says
Thanks. Do you think I stand a chance of being refunded?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
yes but this may need to go to the Ombudsman.
Awo says
Hi Sara,
Please could you give me some advice…again. I made a statement of affordability complaint to Santander regarding my 2500 overdraft in Dec 2023 (ive been in this for over 10yrs.) They wrote back within 8weeks saying it is taking them longer than they expected, they wanted to look at all my concerns before responding and if i did not want to wait to contact the financial ombudsman. Which I did In March, they wrote back acknowledging my complaint and went on to say that they would contact Santander for my records. Then this would be assigned to an investigator who would usually be in touch within two to three months. I recieved another letter on the 5th June from the ombudsman apologising as they are still waiting for my case to reach one of its call handlers and they have alot of complaints and are working through cases as quickly as possible. Do I just wait to hear back from them? I don’t feel forgotten about and understand the backlog. But I just feel like I woke up coming across your website and felt I was back in control and now feel fed up and impatient and growing sick of the monthly charges that could go to our daily costs. Thank you so much for your time and advice.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I would wait a month and ask again what is happening
Awo Ahmed says
Thank you Sara.
Jason says
Hi Sara, I still have an affordability complaint ongoing with the FOS regarding my overdraft with HSBC. However, in that overdraft I also have HSBC Insurance Aspects at £11.95 per month. I now longer use this account except for that insurance. A couple of months ago, the insurance payment which comes out at the end of each month, took me into an unarranged overdraft (which happens each month but I always put money in to cover it). This one time though I completely forgot about it and they marked it as a missed payment on my credit file? Is this possible as it’s not like a loan or credit payment that I entered a contract into, it’s more of a product, therefore if I don’t have the funds to pay it then surely I just lose that insurance? I raised it with transunion who just said they’ve spoken to HSBC and said it’s a ‘missed payment’ and I contacted HSBC who just said the same thing…. Is this the case? Thank you
Sara (Debt Camel) says
so the money was actually paid to the insurance?
Jason says
Yes it was. I have gone into an unarranged overdraft several times in the past (not because of insurance) but it’s never been marked as a missed payment on my overdraft.
Jason says
The missed payment is on the overdraft, I’m assuming at it was in unnarranged. And I paid it when I realised probably just over a month later.
For the record I’ve been in an unarranged overdraft several times before for over a month and this has never marked as a missed payment on my credit file
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I am sorry but marking an overdraft that has been over the limit continuoyusly for more than a month as a missed payment sounds pretty normal to me.
How long has this overdraft been used continously? You don’t use the account any more?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
sorry the “missed payment” is on the overdraft? or the insurance?
how long were you in the unarranged overdraft for?
Jason says
Yes I agree but it’s the fact that it was product from HSBC themselves which states that simply if not paid then I won’t get the insurance. Much like a gym membership or something where if I don’t have the funds in my account, it just doesn’t get paid. For example many, many times in the past, a direct debit has been returned if its taken me over my limit, rather than putting me into an unarranged overdraft and marking it as a missed payment to my overdraft.
I have an affordability complaint for this overdraft is currently with the FOS and has been for 14 months now. As I was continuously in it from 2010-present. Usually at its limit
Sara (Debt Camel) says
ok well if you win the affordability complaint, any negatives marks on your credit record will be removed.
Meanwhile if you do not need the insurance, I suggest you cancel it!
Will says
Hi Sara,
How long does it usually take for Financial Ombudsman cases to be assigned to an investigator? I received an email saying my claim was accepted and would hear back once it’s been assigned. This was around a month ago now. Thanks!
Sara (Debt Camel) says
This is an overdraft case? they are normally pretty quick, in the first couple of months. FOS has to wait for the bank to send over their case file.
Ume says
Hi Sara, I was scammed up to 2 3000 dollars by an globl agent for comission work (company was called smart sites) where we had to invest into digital products and then sell them. To pay for the items i had to use transfer apps like remitly and transfergo to convert the currency and send the money to the agent via bank trasnfer. I then realised this was too good to be true and the amounts just kept increasing. I told the bank the whole situation and they recorded everything down and disputed my money from the trasnfer apps. I made it clear the transfer apps were not at fault it was the company who did this all to me. The refund in total was about £3000 in dispute. I recieved a letter to say that the transfer apps have won the case and now i have to refund the money all back to bank. After a while they put my account into an unarranged overdraft and now having the nerve to ask to pay back the money i was scammed for which wasn’t even mine. I never had a agreed overdraft on my account. They didn’t assess my affordabilty and can see from my statements that i was struggling to make ends meet anyway such as unable to pay my phone bill. I want to complain to the bank to remove the charges so I can close this account down and get rid of nationwide for good. Could you tell me how to please and the likelyhood of me wining the case?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
if you need help with an unusual case like this, I suggest you go to your local Citizens Advice. I can’t guess at the chance of you winning it, that doesn’t mean i think it is low, just that i haven’t dealt with anything similar.
Jamie Duffy says
Hi Sara,
I was wondering if you had heard any more about the 3&6 year time barred cases? I haven’t been able to get much of an update from FOS regarding when this is likely to be resolved and my complaint has now been with them a year. Any information would be greatly appreciated.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
still waiting…
John wayne says
Hi Sara,
Currently waiting on FOS decision been only 3 weeks. My query at the moment is would switching current accounts for overdraft complaint affect it in anyway? As Lloyd’s are offering a £175 incentive to switch. Could it impact my complaint at all ? I repaid the overdraft and don’t have any preference for the bank anymore as I use an other bank as my main account.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
nothing you do now can affect whether the overdraft was unaffordable in the past. You could emigrate, win the lottery, whatever.
R says
Hi Sara,
Please find a responce to my ongoing od complaint with Santander, how do i go about answering these.
You’ve said that you wasn’t aware you could complaint to Santander until you saw a social media ad. I must be clear that not knowing you can complain is different to having a reasonable awareness that something is wrong and that Santander were to blame for irresponsibly lending to you. What we are looking at is when you were aware or reasonably aware you had cause to complain.
You’ve mentioned you didn’t complain sooner because you lost your father in 2017. I am truly sorry to hear that and appreciate you sharing this with me, but can you clarify if at that time you knew something was wrong but you didnt raise it due to the loss of your father?
Santander have also said that you were sent an Early Intervention letter on 18 December 2018 and I can see you had a promise to pay set up in 2020.
I am able to review your other complaints and can see your comments, but for clarity can you please confirm again for this case specifically the following:
During this time in 2020, were you struggling financially and were you aware something was wrong?
Who did you think was to blame for this?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
when did you financial problems really start?
R says
It really started in 2016
Sara (Debt Camel) says
So you could say something like:
Looking back my financial difficulties started in 2016, but at this point I just thought this was my problem and I needed to repay what I had borrowed. The death of my father the next year made it harder for me to cope and from 2017 I had a significant gambling habit which made things worse. If you had asked me then or for the next 5 or 6 years I would have said that I was bad with money and had a gambling problem – I do not think I would have blamed Santander as I thought I had caused my money problems.
r says
thank you so much Sara, i appreciate it
Lauren says
Hey Sara, I just want to say a massive thank you for your very helpful template and advice. I received £4,400 of refunded overdraft fees from HSBC, and for the first time in 16 years, I am finally out of my overdraft.
Thank you for everything you do! You really make a difference in people’s lives ❤️
Jason says
Hi Lauren,
Congrats! Just out of interest, did HSBC uphold yours or did it have to go to Ombudsman? I’ve just had mine upheld by the FOS as I was in in my overdraft of £4,900 for 14 years but HSBC said that as so long ago they could only ‘assume’ that they did the correct checks and problem was that as all my increases were over 6 years ago, HSBC had zero bank statements of mine prior to this. Its only by pure luck I found statements at my parents house that I’d hoarded 10 years ago that I was able to get this looked into properly.
Also, how many years back have they been able to refund interest? As even though mine has been upheld, the FOS has said that HSBC probably won’t know how much they’ll need to refund me in interest and fees as don’t have any information any more on how much I’ve been charged…. Just wondering from someone else who’s had similar issue?
Thank you!
JD says
Hi Jason,
Great result! Can I ask if your case was delayed at all due to the 3&6 year rule? My complaint is in relation to activity 10 years back and it has been with the ombudsman for almost a year now.
Jason says
Hi Lauren,
It wasn’t delayed, the FOS agreed it could look further back and HSBC allowed them to. It just took a long time for FOS to look into it. Even though its been upheld, HSBC have already said they don’t have any of my statements or records before 2018 (6 years ago) and therefore won’t be able to calculate the interest and fees I paid for some of my overdraft (I took it out in 2010 and have still been paying it now).
I was just wondering how you received the £4,400 refund? Did they calculate that from within the last 6 years? Or is that refunds from going back further? If so, was wondering if you know how they calculated that as they’ve told me they can’t access any records to find mine out?
Thank you
Jason says
Sorry JD, I’ve just got up so though I was responding to Lauren! Haha.
But no mine wasn’t delayed due to that ruling, it just took about a year for anyone to even look into it. They then asked me the usual questions and determined they could look into it. Then it was about 2 months after that they started to look into it.
HH says
Hi Sara, an investigator from the FO recently upheld an affordability complaint in a matter where there is also a CCJ recorded, the FO have requested the company removed all adverse entries on my credit report but they have no power to remove the CCJ which I understand as it’s an order of the court. On this basis, is the correct way for me to apply back to the court to remove it enclosing a copy of the FO findings which the company accepted? Thank you.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Go back t your investigator and say the FOS decisions tell the lender to arrange for a set aside for the CCJ. This will mean the debt collector applying for a set aside if they got the CCJ not the lender.
HH says
Thank you, I have and the investigator said they’ve no power to ask them to do this, this can’t be right though? Otherwise do I just apply to the court but it’s then me bearing that cost? Thanks again
Sara (Debt Camel) says
no that isnt right – tell the investigator you want this to go to an Ombudsman if they wont change their mind.
There is no reason why you should have to pay the cost of the set aside application. Also it is more likely to go through easily if the claimant applies for the set aside, not the defendant.
Heidi says
I used the template and emailed it over to the address provided for Santander in this page. A day later I received an email to state they had received my complaint and to expect a telephone call to discuss. I missed a call a week later but a voicemail message was left stating I would receive an outcome by the following Friday. Fast forward a week to today and I missed the call again! I checked my bank and seen my overdraft had been removed. I was panicked. I rang back but my case handler was on lunch. Having to wait for my call back was stressful as I was worried how I would manage financially without my overdraft. My case handler called me back and advised that they have reviewed my case and there is an outcome. She advised my payout is from 2019, I an owed £3749.82 but with interest and tax the amount to be paid to me is £4586. I am shocked that from just one email I’d receive an outcome to this magnitude. Thank you so much for all your advice. You’ve helped more than you can imagine!
Awo says
FOS says Santander will refund overdraft charges from Feb 2020, but I’ve been in trouble since 2010, especially after losing my job in 2016 and not having a regular income until Feb 2019. I think the refund should start from 2016 if they cannot look back as far as 2010.
I’m worried about losing this offer if I push for a full refund, but I need advice.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
So Santander has just offered this before the investigator has started. In theory if you reject it, the investigator can make any decision. In practice FOS normally seems to work from the lender offer and think if it should be more.
It is normal to be able to go back 6 years and FOS can decide if should go back further.
Urszula says
Hi Sara, I just learned about debt camel and feel alerted. I registered my business account in 2015 with Barclays and was doing pretty well making around 35-45K a year. In 2018 I asked about 10K business overdraft to open my own salon. In 2020 pandemic hit and all beauty industry has been closed with no income but still bills to pay. Closed my salon straight before end of pandemic. As cost of living went dramatically up I lost some customers and my income went down to 27k a year while I am staying in range of 9-10K overdraft all the time. There was one moment when I paid the overdraft fully after selling my property in different country to buy a house in UK but straight after getting on property ladder I drowned in 10K again as we needed a cheap but reliable car and needed to renovate the biggest bedroom to salon standard so I could work from home again. The cost of overdraft went up over the years and barclays never even asked if I’m struggling despite my income being slashed and being in overdraft 90% of time. I make around 2500-2700 a month before any costs and deductions and it seems like I can’t keep up with paying it back with £180+ fees… Other credit card lenders like Tesco & Barclaycard also raised my credit card limits to a few K without me asking for, but I realised what’s going on and paid them back fully selling anything from home I could and blocked them. How should I proceed with business overdraft and should I?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I think you should talk to Business Debtline about your options https://www.businessdebtline.org/. they specialise in debt advice for the self employed and people who have a small limited company. And they cover business and personal debts.
It may be very hard to win an affordability complaint about a business bank account – ask Busines Debtline. If they say it isn’t likely, you need to look at your other options as your current position doesn’t sound sustainable.
Sarah W says
We have started a complaint about unaffordable lending for my husband’s RBS overdraft . They have come back to him and asked for all the dates and times of phone calls asking for help (we stated in the letter that we had reached out to them for support ) and the person he spoke to etc. They also said if we didn’t reply in 7 days then the complaint would be closed. My gut tells me that this is not correct procedure. We cannot be expected to remember all these details and surely they have record of this? Also – can they put a time limit on this complaint? Would love some advice so we know how to respond. Thank you
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Do you know roughly when you talked to them?
Sarah W says
Only very vaguely. Several of the conversations were on the chat on the app and we have tried to search for them but the history doesn’t go back that far. We’ve outlined all this to them in an email. Can they expect us to state all these facts in order to continue with the complaint? They are saying they can’t take it forward without the information!
Sara (Debt Camel) says
How far back does the history go? And what responses did you commonly get? What sort of thing were you asking for?
How far back do your overdraft problems go – are you in the overdraft all or almost all of the month and how long has this been going on?
Your complaint, was it mainly about their failure to help when you asked for it? Or was if basically an affordability complaint, using something like the template in the article above, with a couple of extra sentences on the fact they didn’t help you when you asked for it.
Sarah w says
My husband and I were in significant financial difficulty – defaults, missed payments regularly and he had a CCJ when he opened a new RBS account. He was immediately given an overdraft of £1450 and we were so shocked!! His credit rating was awful and was being tuned down for all sorts so we took it as a hint that things may be better than we thought. This was in 2017.since then he has lived within the overdraft for nearly the whole time. The income going in doesn’t cover the overdraft and has been charged every month really for missed payments and going over the limit. When he has been in touch it has been to ask if they can help really- can they freeze interest etc. on a few occasions they refunded him one fee as a gesture really but they didn’t say they could do anything else at all. I think we feel he should never have been given the overdraft at all. We used your template to email them. We thought we would get a standard ‘ we will get back to you in 8 weeks’ letter but it was much more of the ‘we need the information or we will close the complaint’ which surprised us.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Then I suggest you reply saying that the conversations were by chat and you can’t search the messages that far back. Add that the complaint is mainly about unaffordability, and you want a response to that as it will be going to the Financial Ombudsman if it is rejected.
Awo says
Hi Sara,
I asked the investigator why Santander have only admitted liability on my unaffordable overdraft from 2020 when my problems started over 10 years ago. I asked if they can look into this further and this is the response. If you want us to look into issues that happened more than six years ago, we need to first consider whether we have the power to consider the complaint under the rules that apply to our service.
We’re currently considering our approach for complaints about events that occurred more than six years ago, but it’s taking us longer than we expected to resolve these complaint. So I can’t say when I’ll be able to provide you with an outcome and what that will be.
If you wants to look at everything within the last six years, then I can begin my investigation of your complaint. But if I don’t uphold the complaint, Santander may decide to withdraw their offer.
I would consider the charges as part of my investigation, however, we can’t ask Santander to put a hold on any charges whilst we consider complaint. I would recommend contacting Santander to discuss putting a hold on the charges, whilst we look into the case for you. What should I do please.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
So the first thing is, how much of a refund would you get if Santander refunded you from 2018, 6 years before you complained?
Awo says
On average I was paying £500 per year which is £3000. My overdraft they are offering to clear with the refund. In hindsight if I ask them to investigate it will be for an additional 500. I think I should accept the offer as my ultimate goal is to be debt free.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
You can reasonably say you will accept a refund of 6 years not 4. But its up to you.
Awo says
Hi Sara, thank you for all the support and guidance. I have decided to ask the investigator to look into 6 years. I downloaded the statement of fees for the last 6 years to send to the investigator and I noticed total interest paid column. For example for 2022 total fees paid on the account for overdraft use was £633.46. Total interest paid for the same period was £633.46. Does the interest get factored into any fees that could be repaid?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
yes overdraft interest and fees are refunded. But not if these are packaged bank account fees – that isnt just for overdraft usage
Jason says
Hi Sara, I’ve posted on here before regarding this but can’t find the original thread, however… I had affordability complaint with HSBC regarding my overdraft which was taken out in 2010 and increased to £4,900 by 2016. The FOS was able to look at it but originally couldn’t do anything as myself nor HSBC had ANY information regarding it past 6 years. I did by a stroke of luck find screenshots of bank statements from 2014 on an old phone which I was able to then have it upheld from the 2014 increase and HSBC have accepted, which is great..
This though was very long winded and has taken 6 months from the point the FOS looked at it, all because both me and the FOS were chasing HSBC for information and they would take weeks to get back to us just to say they have no information whatsoever regarding my overdraft and the FOS said that this would be hard to calculate a refund, so I just said that I’d be fine for a settlement just to clear my overdraft. With this, HSBC then somehow were able to ‘discover’ all the interest and fees I had paid on the overdraft since 2014 despite this being the exact info I’d previously asked for and they said there’s nothing.
Is this grounds for another, separate complaint? As they’ve willingly held that information from myself and the FOS when it was most needed and somehow found it when it’s suited then to prove they refund me less. Thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
So the total of interest is less than your current overdraft balance?
Jason says
Yes. They are refunding £3,365 which they’ve calculated I paid in interest and fees since Sept 2014. My overdraft is currently at its limit of £4,900. The point in Sept 2014 where its being upheld from is when it was increased from £2,100 to 2,500. The FOS has also said that HSBC are going to lower the overdraft limit to £1,750 once refund has been applied
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Presumably you don’t mind the overdraft limit being reduced.
Well it’s a reasonable result in the end, but HSBC have clearly behaved very badly. I suggest you go back to the adjudicator and say you feel some compensation should be awarded, as either HSBC didn’t bother to look for the data or they lied about not having it and either is a breach of the consumer duty as it could easily have led to a bad outcome for the customer. I suggest you ask for £500. FOS may say you have to make a separate complaint about this
Jason says
No I don’t mind it being reduced. I have already made a complaint to HSBC which is ongoing, about how they’ve delayed the process and provided me with wrong information so I can add this to the complaint as like you said, if it wasn’t for me finding those old screenshots, I would’ve been much, much worse off.
Thanks for your help Sara.
Jason says
So the FOS has said that I need to make a separate complaint about this, which I will do.
One other thing, I had a missed payment reported to credit file back in February for the overdraft so upon this being upheld I have asked the FOS if any negative credit marks will be removed as it wasn’t stated in the final response. The FOS replies was this:
‘Concerning your query about your credit file we would only ask HSBC to amend your credit file if the offer resulted in an overpayment to your account. As the offer doesn’t clear the overdraft any information on your credit file won’t be amended’
So the balance of the overdraft is £4,900. I am being refunded £3,365 which brings it down to £1,535. HSBC have said they’re going to lower overdraft limit to £1,750 so although it doesn’t ‘clear’ it, it still brings to below the limit? And because I had missed payment due it being so unaffordable, which it has now been deemed as, shouldn’t it be removed?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest you go back to the adjudicator and say that:
– you did not have an arrangement in place, just a single missed payment
– as you would never have missed the payment if the limit had not been so unaffordably high, you would like the missed payment removed
– it doesnt seem to be at all relevant to this one missed payment whether the refund clears the balance or not.
Jason says
Hi Sara,
I went back and told the adjudicator the points you have said and the FOS came back this afternoon and has apologised and said that any negative information WILL be removed. Its worried me a bit that they got this wrong in the first place but at least it’s sorted! Thanks for your help Sara
Sara (Debt Camel) says
excellent
Jamie says
Hi there just sent a email to bank of Scotland. I’ve just caught up with these affordability complaints and done it with success to some payday lenders already. I’ve used my bank of Scotland account since I got a job in 2016. Got an overdraft in 2018 and it’s been spiralling since then. My income is 1700ish and have 1300 overdraft. Over these years it’s crept up. I’ve had a lot of gambling transactions on my accounts before during and after my overdraft started. Sometimes I would up my overdraft by £100 then gamble that away and then up it another £100 the next day. One day I got a big one I wiped it out compeltely and paid it off. Only to fall into the trap and gamble again and up it went easy as that. Until I gamstopped. Also a lot of payday loan transactions. More recently I would be in overdraft for sometimes 27 days of the month. After paying some bills. Do I have a good case here ? I’ve sent away anyways. Thanks for the templates and hard work!
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I think payday loans and gambling are signs your overdraft shouldn’t have been increased.
Jamie says
I thought so too, I’ll see what they say. I won’t have any repercussions however will I for this claim? I still use this account day today. Thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
It is very unusual for a bank to decide to close an account that is actually being used. You can say you have now stopped gambling.
But you should consider asking for a payment arrangement to allow your usage to decrease. This will harm your credit record, but would get you out of the current trap. You can’t be sure you will win this claim.
MW says
Hi Sara
A few years ago, I cleared numerous debts via a DRO. One of these was a (very!) long-standing overdraft with Lloyds – I don’t have the paperwork, but I think I was in the overdraft for circa 10-years (if not more). It originated from a student account, that I just never got out of… I recall being given a credit card around the same time, too (2004ish) that – like the overdraft – they kept increasing the limit of.
I don’t recall what happened with the credit card, but it was certainly never paid off in full (I suspect it was closed and passed to a debt collector, before being settled or even just abandoned after a CCJ).
Anyway. Given the overdraft debt was wiped with the DRO, is it worth pursuing this? The overdraft hit around £3k at one point, where it was agreed to be £2.5k maximum (it kept going over due to fees and interest).
Thanks in advance.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
how long ago was your DRO?
MW says
I came out of the DRO moratorium in mid-2018.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
So there are three problems here.
1) the bank may not have retained any records. It has been 7 years since the DRO started and 6 years since the debt at the end was “cleared”. Unless you have kep bank statements, there may be nothing much left.
2) you are complaining about things that happened more than 7 years ago. FOS only has to go back 6 – it can choose to go back further but in this case a court may well decide that that too long has passed for you to bring a case and FOS seems to be edging towards following the same approach a court might when deciding whether it can go back over 6 years.
3) if you win a complaint, then the bank is entitled to offset any refund first against the amount it wrote off on the DRO. You cay not feel that is fair, but that is what is likely to happen and the ombudsman would think it was fair.
So I am afraid its going to be hard to win a case and you may get little out of it even if you do.
Jame says
Hey Sara,
I don’t suppose you’ve heard anything more you can share about when they are going to make a decision on these time barred cases? My complaint has been with FOS for about 13 months which is a bit frustrating now
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I think a few key decisions have gone out – FOS may be waiting to see if it gets sued by any of the lenders…
Jamie Duffy says
Hahaha that seems a fairly valid reason to delay, I suppose. I guess that would become apparent quite quickly potentially? I can’t imagine they would pay out based on the ombudsman decision and then sue?
Natalie P says
I was wondering why I was getting the exact same email from my handler at the Ombudsman every month saying they were still reviewing the case and when I asked if there had been any further developments at all, I would get the same email again! They know I want them to go back further than 6 years as I’m still in my overdraft from 16 years ago so am hoping there will be some progress soon as I’m still paying interest on it.
Tammy says
Hi Sara
I live in Scotland and at the moment I’m paying off my debts with a Debt Arrangement Scheme (DAS). Am I able to challenge my overdraft limit whilst I’m using this scheme?
Thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I am not a Scottish adviser, but so far as i know you can make affordability claims about debts in your DAS. Ask in the comments on this blog for confirmation: https://www.advicescotland.com/home/debt-arrangement-scheme/
Jason says
I am currently in an IVA for the past 10 months, am I able to make affordability claims on overdrafts / credit cards?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Yes but if you win the complaints about debts in your iVA, they will just reduce the balance owed, not your payments to the IVA unless you are able to repay the debts plus IVA fees in full.
And if the debts were before the IVA, the refund may be paid to your IVA firm not to you.
Unless you expect very large refunds, this isn’t normally worth bothering with.
Amb says
I have complained to TSB about an overdraft, originally a graduate one then changed to normal with fee’s which I struggled with. They have responded that whilst they don’t feel the overdraft was unreasonable when opened it is clear I struggled to maintain the overdraft since charges were added (October 2023) They have said they will be removing the overdraft in Sept, and will arrange to refund all charges (it does not however mention about the interest occurred). Then, it just says I will be passed onto the financial services team to discuss repayment options for any remaining balance. My question is, should I refer it to the ombudsman or just accept the refund of fees? They have clearly written in the letter ‘I agree we did make some mistakes’.
Thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest you go back and check that interest is being refunded and ask what our remaining balance will be
Khateeb says
Hi, can you please help me respond to Santander on their acknowledgement on my complaint? I just need help on wording suggesting I reject Santander’s presumed deadline and I’m happy to wait:
In summary, you’re unhappy that Santander provided you with an overdraft as you stated it was unaffordable for you. You confirm that you had a poor credit rating from around 2016. You’re also not happy with how your complaint was handled, especially considering that you made it known to them that you were vulnerable. Thank you for sharing this information with me. If there is any way that I can support you in light of your vulnerabilities, please let me know.
If my understanding of this complaint isn’t correct, please let me know by 28 August 2024.
I’m currently waiting to receive Santander’s business file response to your complaint. Once I’ve received this from them, I’ll be in touch.
However, I can see that in their Final Response they let you know that they couldn’t look into your complaint as it was brought too late. Before we start investigating complaints we need to first consider whether we have the power to consider it under the rules that apply to our service. This is something that our service is looking into at the moment. So, to set expectations, we may not be able to resolve your complaint as quickly as we normally would. I thank you in advance for your patience with this
Sara (Debt Camel) says
so that is from FOS, not Santander. Are you happy with their summary of your complaint?
Khateeb says
Apologies, yes to clarify, it’s from FOS.
They’ve basically said Santander said it’s too long to consider the complaint, and given the advice on similar scenarios on here, I refute that.
My credit file problems didn’t begin in 2016 and I have always shown signs of issues which affordability from the outset.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
OK, so it sounds as though you agree with the summary of your complaint. It will probably take FOS quite a while to make a decision on the “over 6 years” part before it starts to look at the affordability issue.
KAD says
I complained to Lloyds Bank on 06/08/2024 asking for a refund of the daily overdraft charges I paid dating back to August 2018 as I was permanently maxing out the £5000 overdraft I had with them due to financial difficulties I was facing. In August 2023 Lloyds Bank offered me a loan to clear the overdraft which I am currently paying back. Yesterday I saw a missed call from Lloyds Bank which was followed by a text message that indicated one of their operatives tried to call me to discuss my complaint and will call again. I then began to notice payments started trickling into my Lloyds Bank account. It was a total of 5 payments in excess of £5K. I have since not heard from Lloyds Bank but was wondering whether in as much as these payments have been made into my Lloyds Bank account I can still refer the complaint to the FOS?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I think you should ask lloyds for a response to your complaint – that will give details of what they have refunded. While its obviously nice (!) to get 5k back, at the moment you know too little to decide whether to accept this or send it to FOS.
S says
Hi, i think you might be able to claim compensation ontop of the 8% simple interest as it says on the FOS website. It might be worth updating the template if what im saying is true
Sara (Debt Camel) says
It is pretty unusual – my guess is less than 5% of upheld cases. Just explain your situation and how the overdraft has affect the rest of your finances.
S says
Hi, one last question, ive made a overdraft claim between 2017-2024 because that was the available bank statements that i had access to(i won that and got my full interest refunded). Someone told me i can claim from the very beginning and i just need to make sure they have the available bankstatements.
Is that true? So i called the bank up later on and now they have access to bank statements from 2009 and are sending me the bank statements. Should i make another complaint with the same details for a overdraft refund from 2009 to 2017 and perhaps claim for compensation since its such a long time frame
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Have you had a response to the first complaint?
Jamie says
Hi- weird one…. Just had a email from bank of Scotland d asking me to call them. So I did- it was the quickest phone cal ever, basically asked me in my own words the reason for the complaint- the reason was in a big email (template from yourself) . So I briefly went through it and expected some more questions etc. just told him I went back my statements seen I was using my overdraft for gambling etc. and he just said ok we will now investigate and they have 8 weeks from my send date etc. is this normal ?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
No. Weird as you say.
Jamie says
Dear …..
Your complaint with us
Thanks for contacting us on 14 August 2024, to let us know about your complaint.
I need some more details to help me put this right, so can you call me back on 0800 096 7461, my extension is 1581374 and our office is open 8am to 8pm Monday to Friday and 9am to 3pm on Saturday, and someone can help you if I’m not available.
This was the email I got, I checked and all is legit and got a Lloyds complaint manager to speak too. Will update when I hear back.
Jamie says
Had a phone call today, said I’m being refunded from March 2019- now. All interest works out around £1450 apparently. Will have it in next 30 days and sending a letter to me about my count going forward…. My overdraft is £1300 currently. Does this mean they’ll use that to pay off my overdraft and then have £150 left or what happens ? He didn’t make it clear to me on phone. And worried they’ll close my account but he didn’t say that on the phone. Thanks a lot for the help again!
Sara (Debt Camel) says
so 5 and a half years of interest is £1450… Thats not impossible – many banks gave you the first £500 interest free for at least three months of covid.
But it looks pretty low – can you back over your bank statements for the last couple of years and see what you have actually paid? And have you had any charges for rejected Direct Debits?
Do you think March 2019 was a fair starting point?
“Does this mean they’ll use that to pay off my overdraft and then have £150 left or what happens ? “
I expect they will credit your bank account with that money. If you are 1300 into your overdraft, this will shift it to being 150 in credit.
“And worried they’ll close my account”
That would be incredibly rare if you are using the account. It only tends to happen with an old account you no longer use for income and spending. They may well remove your overdraft or reduce it to a much smaller level. If you don’t think this is fair, you can suggest an amount you think you could manage.
Jamie says
In the last 12 months, you’ve paid £452.54 in interest, calculated between 1 August 2023 and 31 July 2024.
Year before was £260ish. I started with a small overdraft in 2019ish so this sounds about right if I’m honest. Either way it’s a great result again i believe all thanks to your hard work
S says
Yes i got a full refund on the first complaint+8% interest, and im considering to ask for compensation alongside this for my second complaint
Sara (Debt Camel) says
You made the first complain last year? how long ago did you make the first complaint? Why didn’t you ask for it to go back further then?
Extra compensation is not normally given for older complaints. There has to be something unusual about them. Did the bank tell you originally it didn’t have any records which is why you only claimed from 2017?
S says
From online banking i only had access up until 2017(7yrs) and didn’t know i could access further back so i mentioned this in my complaint but made the mistake of only asking from 2017. But after requesting old statements today i was able to go further back to 2009.The complaint was made two weeks ago and was given the interest refund last week. Also i should of received the decision letter today about the refund but i still haven’t received it. Also they did not contact me but just sent the refund so i couldn’t discuss payments before 2017
Sara (Debt Camel) says
ok so go back to them, say you have not yet received the decision on your complaint and you want to go back further than 6 years so you want to know what they have said about this. Do not start a new complaint if you haven’t received the decision on the first one.
Natalie says
Hi I want to make a complaint against HSBC re my overdraft. I had a £5000 overdraft and was always in it or sometimes out of it, meaning I was paying £5 a day in charges (sometimes for a week out of the month) My pay was around £1400 and sometimes lower when I was on maternity leave. They gave me loans to clear my overdraft. However the account (closed in September 2020) is closed and I don’t have access to the statements to evidence my complaint. How would you advise I get those statements?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
What dates were the loans?
Natalie says
I can’t recall but anytime from 2016 onwards. I realise 2016 may go too far back but I was still in an excessive overdraft in 2018 onwards until the account was closed.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Well you can always go back 6 years, so to September 2018. The Ombudsman can decide whether to go further back of you have only just realised that you can complain.
You don’t need the statements in order to make a complaint, but you are unlikely to win before 2018 unless you can get them. You could make a Subject Access Request to HSBC for your statements or a list of the transactions if the statements are not available, going back to say 2014?
. As you probably cant pass any security any more,, I suggest you right to their Data Prootection Officer, address given in here https://www.hsbc.co.uk/content/dam/hsbc/gb/pdf/privacy-notice-full.pdf
If you get the statements going back, you can also complain about the loans.
Jen says
Hi Sara,
I have recently used your templates after a recommendation, thank you so much!
I put in an affordability complaint to my bank TSB and have heard back today, pretty quickly which is great! I have been in my overdraft for years only briefly coming out of it for days or possibly a week of the year.
They have offered to repay back the fees from January 2023, which should amount to just over £700 which im incredibly happy with and they are closing my overdraft at the end of the month, I have just to find the final few £100 for some breathing space or they want to set up some sort of payment plan and its one big step in being debt free.
Although my debt is low in comparison to some it’s been very stressful due to starting up a business, health issues and bereavements.
I hope this info also helps other people struggling that its ok to reach out to lenders for help and that there is some hope!
Once again thank you so much for you information its so helpful. I am planning on making donations to a local mental health charity once I am clear!
Holly says
Hi I’ve sent two affordability complaints one to Monzo and one to Santander. I have used my Santander one ever since I got my student overdraft 10 years ago, after 4 years it became a current account and the interest began and I’ve now got it up to £500 that I got a person loan for but am still constantly in it. My Monzo I was offered a £2000 overdraft despite all this and offered a loan and they allowed me to increase and decrease my overdraft throughout and apply for a loan. I have been in this overdraft for 5 years and currently have it to £750. For a lot of this time I was between jobs and at maximum I’ve earned a max of £1800 a month.
Do you think this is worth pursuing?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
yes i do