A reader asked:
I went bankrupt in March 2017 and discharged in 2018. I am not paying an IPA. My question is about savings. Can I save now without any risk of my savings being taken from me?
Also my grandmother wants to put a large sum of money in my name but I’m not sure if it would be safe so the last thing I want is for her to lose money, so I’ve been reluctant to do it.
This article looks in detail at what happens when you are discharged from bankruptcy: the practicalities, the implications for savings and gifts and the restrictions that end after discharge.
Contents
When do you get discharged and why may this be suspended?
Almost everyone is discharged 12 months after the date they went bankrupt.
During these 12 months when you are bankrupt, you have to co-operate with the Official Receiver (OR) and give information when asked to do so.
If you don’t co-operate, the OR may ask the court to suspend your discharge, so you won’t be discharged at the end of the 12 months.
This is very rare and you will know if this happens, it isn’t done in secret.
This isn’t something you should worry about. The OR doesn’t expect you to have a perfect memory or receipts for everything bought over the last five years. “Not co-operating” means refusing to answer questions or concealing things.
If your discharge from bankruptcy is suspended, you will be told by the court whether you have to do anything in order to get your discharge.
Discharge day – nothing happens!
You may have had the day ringed in your diary for months, but nothing visibly happens when you are discharged! You don’t get a certificate or even an email from the OR.
If you haven’t heard anything from the OR about your discharge being suspended you can safely assume that you have been discharged.
Getting confirmation that you have been discharged
You can ask for a confirmation letter that you have been discharged from the Insolvency Service by emailing them at discharge.queries@insolvency.gsi.gov.uk – this is free.
Some lenders, especially mortgage lenders, will want to see a Certificate of Discharge. How you get this depends on how you went bankrupt.
If you applied for bankruptcy online after April 2016, you can email the Insolvency Service and ask for a Certificate of Discharge. This is free.
If you went bankrupt before April 2016 or if you were made bankruptcy by a creditor you should complete form LOC013 and send it with a cheque payable to ‘HM Courts and Tribunals Service’ to the court that made you bankrupt. It costs £70 for three copies of your Certificate of Discharge and £10 for additional extra copies.
What happens when you are discharged
When you are discharged you are released from your debts (except for any such as student loans which couldn’t form part of your bankruptcy .)
Your bankruptcy ends, you are no longer bankrupt!
After discharge, you don’t have to tell the OR about assets or money that you receive, unless you were already entitled to these before your discharge.
The events you no longer have to tell the OR about include:
- receiving redundancy money (see Redundancy and bankruptcy);
- getting an inheritance (unless the person died before you were discharged, see Inheriting money when bankrupt); and
- a pension lump sum or money you withdraw from a pension (see Bankruptcy and Pensions).
There is a small exception here if you are paying an IPA/IPO, see below.
So the reader can safely be given money by her grandmother – it won’t be at risk at all.
And she can save as much as wants. She could have saved a small emergency fund before discharge, but few people can afford to save much at that point.
The restrictions of bankruptcy also end when you are discharged, unless you have a BRO/BRU, see below, so you will be able to:
- borrow more than £500 without telling the lender you are bankrupt (but if a lender asks if you have ever been bankrupt or insolvent, you still have to reply Yes);
- be a company director;
- change the name of your business if you’re self-employed; and
- buy a council house using the ‘right to buy’ scheme.
Your possessions and assets
Personal possessions – normally safe!
Most people do not lose any personal possessions when they go bankrupt, see Will I lose my lawnmower? and other questions for details.
Most assets apart from your home that have to be sold are dealt with within the twelve month bankruptcy period.
In the unusual situation that you have assets that the OR has told you within the 12 months that may have to be sold, this still applies after discharge.
If you have not heard anything from the OR by the time you are discharged, that is the end. You will not be asked anything afterwards and nothing can be taken.
Family home
There’s a 3-year time limit for the OR to start legal action to sell the family home. If your share of the equity (or your “beneficial interest”) is less than £1,000 three years after you went bankrupt, no action will be taken, the interest will return to you and the restriction at Land Registry will be removed.
“The right to something” may be an asset that now belongs to the OR
Sometimes you have a legal right to do something, for example make an insurance claim, ask for a refund, sue someone.
If you had this legal right before you went bankrupt, this right is an asset that transferred to the OR when you went bankrupt. It does not transfer back to you when you are discharged,
This may include any ongoing complaints and court cases, and also ones which have not yet been started.
That last point surprises and disappoints many people. There is no point in you asking for a payday loan refund for loans taken prior to your bankruptcy after your discharge because the money will go to the OR, not to you.
BRO/BRUs – restrictions still apply
The government says “Any dishonest or blameworthy behaviour could lead to a BRO”. That may sound alarming because most people who go bankrupt think they have been blameworthy to some extent… but very few people get BRO/BRUs.
If the OR has imposed a Bankruptcy Restriction Order (BRO), or you have agreed to a Bankruptcy Restriction Undertaking (BRU) you will still be discharged after twelve months and released from your debts.
But a BRO/BRU means you will continue to have a series of restrictions on what you can do for the period of your BRO/BRU.
IPA/IPOs – must be set up before discharge
If you don’t have an IPA/IPO
More than 80% of people who go bankrupt do not have an Income Payments Agreement (IPA) or an Income Payments Order (IPOs) set.
If you don’t have an IPA when you are discharged one can’t be set up later and you don’t have to tell the OR about any changes to your income or expenses.
(There is a rare exception – if the OR has applied to court for an IPO before your discharge, then it can be set up afterwards. If this affects you, you will know about it.)
IPAs/IPOs carry on after discharge
Here you have to make monthly payments to the Official Receiver for three years from the point it was set up. During these three years, you have to tell the OR about changes to your income and expenses and the IPA may be adjusted.
Being discharged doesn’t change this.
You should also tell the OR about any windfalls that you receive after your discharge while your IPA is continuing.
This does not mean that the OR can claim your redundancy money or an inheritance – this won’t happen, see the links above.
But some windfalls are actually a form of income, for example a refund from the tax man, and you may need to pay a lump sum to the OR for these.
Your credit record after discharge
The details of your bankruptcy are kept on the Individual Insolvency Register for three months after discharge. If you check the register after this, your name should no longer appear, unless you have a BRO/BRU.
Your credit rating won’t improve immediately you are discharged. It will take some weeks or even a month or two for creditors to mark your debts as settled/partially settled with a zero balance owing and the bankruptcy marker itself will remain on your file for another five years.
After a few months, you can start the credit repair process, including getting creditors to correct any records which are wrong. See How to repair your credit record after bankruptcy for details.
“What about… ?”
The Insolvency Service helpline can answer general questions, but if you have questions about your specific case, the best thing to do is to contact your OR’s office.
Repairing your credit after bankruptcy
What happens when? A bankruptcy timeline
How can you start to save small amounts?
Andrew says
I rang the Insolvency Practioner and they said if you have assets etc you have to comply even when you are discharged from bankruptcy. I told them I had zero assets and filled in their expenditure form 6 months ago and I have no IPA therefore I don’t need to comply no more. They didn’t say much but I called my creditors and my debts are settled so still not sure why they have contacted me
Sara (Debt Camel) says
hmmm I suggest you send them a letter repeating what you have just said but rephrased as “I am happy to complete this expenditure form if you can explain to me why it is required as I have no assets and was discharged from bankruptcy on ddmmyy without an IPA/IPO in place.”
Tom says
Hello,
In the above Article you state “If you don’t have an IPA/IPO when you are discharged – and more then 80% of people don’t – one can’t be set up later…………” and you go on to say “There is a rare exception – if the OR has applied to court for an IPO before your discharge, then it can be set up afterwards.”
Since my Bankruptcy I have had one meeting with the OR and I have never heard from the appointed Insolvency Practitioner, no IPA/IPO has been requested or set-up. I was discharged according to the register on 8 November 2018, and since my original meeting with OR in December 2017 I have received no formal communications from the OR.
My question is could the OR have applied to the court for an IPO prior to discharge without my knowledge?
I just want to put this episode behind me and move on with my life knowing there are no hidden surprises.
Many thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I don’t think you have anything to worry about. An IPO will not have been applied for unless you refused to agree to an IPA. And then you would have been told what the OR was doing. Unless you had gone into hiding, this can’t have happened without you knowing!
If you want to be 100% sure, contact the OR’s office and they will confirm this.
Tom England says
No I have always tried to co-operate with the OR and he has had my address, telephone and email which has never changed.
Thank you for your prompt response
Bridie says
Hi. I was declared Bankrupt in May last year. I may be entitled to a sum of money from my ex Husbands pension. Claim made before Bankruptcy. If the sum is higher than my debts , am I able to keep remaining amount? I may not know until after my 1 year discharge. Bit confused with it all. Thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
This claim is as part of a divorce settlement? If it is, you need to ask your solicitor about this.
Amanda says
Hi I had to go bankrupt in 2006 I got my discharge. In January 2007 I claimed some ppl which went straight to them I wondered why once discharged . Will this effect me claiming other ppl.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
All PPI refunds for PPI you paid before your bankruptcy will go to the OR, even now. Unless you can claim for PPI you paid afterwards, there is no point. See https://debtcamel.co.uk/ppi-iva-dro-bankruptcy/ for why.
Barbara hawkins says
Hi I was made bankrupt 2006 discharged early 2007 I have ppi relating to prior 2006. If I claim this would I have to pay it back towards bankruptcy
Thanks barbara
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Yes. See https://debtcamel.co.uk/ppi-iva-dro-bankruptcy/ for details.
Maria says
Hi I’m about to apply for bankruptcy. I have about £200 left after paying debts but this will be for food, kids haircuts, school clothes, regular clothes, car maintenance. £200 a month is not enough really.
I might be getting a bonus at work end of the year.
My question is- Will I have to give that money or keep it for the essentials mentioned above which I won’t be able to afford on a monthly basis? Thank you
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Hi Maria,
have you talked to an adviser about bankruptcy? It may well be the best option for you but it’s always good to check and the adviser can answer your questions about whether you may have to make any monthly payments to the Official Receiver after bankruptcy. 5 out of 6 people going bankrupt don’t have to make any payments.
You can talk to National Debtline this morning on 0808 808 4000.
To answer your question, £200 a month isn’t enough for food and toiletries for you and one child, let alone all the other things you have listed. BUT once you go bankrupt, you won’t be paying any debts, so you will have more than £200 left. What matters is how much money you have left after the essential bills (rent, utilities, council tax etc). the OR will allow money for clothes, uniforms, haircuts, car maintenance. it is a fair system.
Iain says
Hi, I was declared bankrupt in August 2013 and discharged in 2014, there are still two creditor on my credit file showing as a default. How can I get the settled?
Also, When will the bankruptcy be completely rrmoved from my credit file?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
This article looks at how to get your credit record corrected: https://debtcamel.co.uk/credit-file-after-bankruptcy/
The bankruptcy marker itself will drop off in August 2019. So its a question of making sure all the debts in your bankruptcy also drop off then.
Maria Sierra says
Hi am I allowed to receive a bonus at work in the form of vouchers? I only ask because my boss knows about me going bankrupt and wants me to be able to keep my hard earned bonus. I think it’s nice of him to do.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Have you been discharged? Are you paying an IPA? How large is the bonus?
Maria Sierra says
I haven’t applied yet for bankruptcy. Getting all my ducks in a row.
If I get the full bonus it’ll be £3100 before tax.
I asked him not to be paid it if I get it December.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Realistically the OR wouldn’t care about £50 of M&S vouchers at Christmas, but that is a lot. It doesn’t matter how it’s paid, cash or vouchers, you will have to inform the OR as you will not have been discharged in December and the OR is VERY likely to claim the money.
Your alternatives are to shrug and say it’s still best to get your debts sorted in bankruptcy now even if you lose this bonus or to postpone bankruptcy until December, get the bonus, use some of it to buy absolutely essential items around the house and the rest to pay your bankruptcy fees.
Of course if you hope to get a bonus in December 2020, if you put off going bankrupt until early 2020, that bonus would go to the OR.
I think you should talk to a debt adviser about your situation – whether bankruptcy is the right choice (it may well be but this is ALWAYS worth checking with an expert who may spot something you don’t) and if so the timing.
Robin says
My daughter has asked me whether I can act a guarantor for her. I was bankrupt in 2013 and discharged the following year in 2014.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
is this for a tenancy? a guarantor loan? something else?
Farrokh says
Hi Sara,
Does Bankruptcy affect your car insurance price? I have gotten quotes and so far they are a lot higher than last year, even though I now have a drive and a year of no claims bonus. My insurance runs out on march 22nd and my discharge is 16th April. Is it worth waiting for my discharge and making do without a car? Will the quotes even go down after my discharge?
Thank you
Farrokh
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Insurers will be aware of your bankruptcy from your credit file, and this may make it harder to get a good quote.
If you pay for your insurance by monthly instalments and it is more than £500, you’ll have to tell the insurance company about your bankruptcy until you have been discharged. If you can wait until after your discharge, you only need to tell your insurer about the bankruptcy if they ask.
Have you tried talking to a broker? They may be able to talk about your options and how much difference waiting would make.
Peter says
Hi Sara,
I’m wondering what happens to the property that was reported in bankruptcy if OR doesn’t sell it on time to discharge? I know that home will be returned if it wasn’t sold within three years, but what about the rest? For example, a car or a second house (to make it harder it can be abroad)? What happens if OR doesn’t sell them? Who becomes the owner of these things after discharge? Do they come back or does OR transmit them somewhere (but where)?
I can not find the answer to this question, I will be very grateful for any info.
Thanks a lot Sara for everything what you are doing for us.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
The OR is the owner of these things, they do not have to be sold within the 12 months, they do not transfer back to be owned by the bankrupt. A car normally would be. A second home, especially abroad, may take longer. If you want someone can make an offer to the OR to buy back an item.
If you are already bankrupt, I suggest you talk to the OR about what will happen. Shutting your eyes and hoping the OR forgets will not usually work out well, it is better to know and to be able to plan.
If you are thinking of bankruptcy, talk through any possessions which you are concerned about with a debt adviser before submitting your application.
ZB says
Hi Sara,
I was made bankrupt last year (April 2018). At the time, I needed to (& was very fortunate enough to be able to) stop work & live with family.
I do remember on the online bankruptcy forms they asked abt earnings (which I said where £0) & again in my call with the OR I informed them I was unemployed. Therefore an IPA was never even discussed.
As I have heard nothing from the OR since, I think (from reading above) I am safe in assuming I will be discharged this month. If I begin working again (which I hope to do soon, in a month or so), will I need to tell the OR? Could I be given an IPA after discharge?
Many thanks for all of your advice.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
unless there is something very unusual in your case, which you would have heard about, you will be discharged after a year. If no IPA has been set up by then, one can’t be afterwards. And with no IOA in place after discharge you don’t have to tell the OR if you get a job.
ADAM says
Hi there,
I was entered bankruptcy in May 2017 and was discharged May 2018. I entered an IPA but soon after was made homeless so ended up moving into a place with higher rent. I explained to the solicitors that i could no longer afford to pay the IPA and sent the relevent requested documents. I didn’t hear anything back even though i sent many emails. I received an email from the OR and explained the situation and they said that was fine and they would chase this with the solictors. I didn’t hear anything for over a year then today recieved an email saying I’ve failed to pay ect. Any help?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest you go back to the OR and explain what has happened. It sounds as though there has been an administrative error.
Adam says
Okay i will do. I am now in a better financial position. Will i have to pay the IPA now for 36 months based on my current situation or will they factor in when i was unable to pay?
Thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
The IPA ends 36 months after it started – this time can’t be extended. It’s natural to feel apprehensive about this, but most find that they are dealt with very fairly and professionally.
Adam says
Thank you Sara, i spoke to the OR who explained to me that they closed my case a year ago and the solicitors failed to inform me. Does this mean its completely over or can they reopen it?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
You should have asked the OR that! I could make a guess, but really that isn’t going to help you. You can either go back to the OR and ask, or inform the solicitors that the OR says your case has been closed and see what they say.
Grant Lees says
I have just been discharged from bankruptcy- based on the fact that’s it’s a year since I was made bankrupt.
I had my interview with the OR and supplied full information. The case was then passed to a new company. The new OR wrote to me once asking for information which I have I supplied.
My question is- myself and my wife have rental properties which are run through a limited company although mortgaged in our names. I had no contact from the OR referring to the properties saying they would be taken from us and sold.
How do I find out if there is a “charge” on them from the OR, and how to I get it removed assuming they are not taking the properties?
I hope that makes sense!
Thanks.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I assume you are a shareholder in this company. I suggest you talk to Business Debtline about this see https://www.businessdebtline.org/.
S says
Hi I was after some advice. My husband went bankrupt in Oct 16 discharged on Oct 17 we were separated and living apart then. Recently he has moved back in. There is a deed of trust in place dated November 2011 in my favour. As the 3 yrs has not ended till Oct 19 will they change Their mind and take my house. The mortgage is in joint name, and there is equity and existing charges from him before the bankruptcy which remained on the house even with the deed of trust
Thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I am sorry but I think you need professional advice. I suggest you talk to the solicitor who drew up the deed of trust.
Jasmin says
Hello I wanted to asked if i go bankrupt and have been emergency taxed when starting work will they take my tax pay when it comes into my bank account
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Yes, if you get a tax refund it will be claimed by the Official Receiver.
Young and free says
Hi Sara,
I was declared bankrupt in early 2009. I was badly informed by my accountant and if I knew then what I know now and the battles I’ve had I wouldn’t have so easily done it. But here we are. I have been discharged and it’s been over 10 years. I am applying for a job working with travel money, they are doing a credit check and I have worked so so hard to get my credit score back to a good number over the last 10 years. But they have asked additional questions. One about bankruptcy… as it’s been over 10 years, can I just leave this question blank? I don’t want it to affect getting the job if I say yes to it if I don’t actually have to. You’re advice would be greatly appreciated! Thank you.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I always advise telling the truth.
J says
Hi, I am seriously considering bankruptcy at the moment. Over a short space of time I’ve managed to get in a right pickle and it’s this or IVA being considered.
My biggest concern is my car. My parents have just paid my car off (it was purchased new on contract purchase, my parents paid the balloon sum rather than me having to give it back). I believe the car is worth about £8000. I do 100 miles every day for work, I live in a fairly remote village and my car is absolutely essential. I am massively concerned that if I go down the bankruptcy route they will insist I sell my car, giving me £1000 to buy another instead. I clock up so many miles I can’t be having the worry of being in an older car that will inevitably come with greater problems and expense and highly likely be far less economical on fuel.
Is the removal and selling of my car an absolute?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
oh dear. It would have been much better for the car to be handed back and for your parents to have bought a second hand car with the balloon payment. the car would then be theirs and you could have driven it.
How large are your debts? Have you defaulted on them? Are you renting or buying?
Why have all your problems happened in a short space of time – sometimes this isn’t relevant, but sometimes it helps to understand your situation.
Evelyn Kock says
It has been 14 years sine my bankruptcy I received letter from OR giving me permission to now claim PPI will this now come to me
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Can you say EXACTLY what the letter says?
Patricia says
I received a letter from the insolvencyservice re my ex he went bankrupt in 2011 after he left me his name is still on the mortgage as they company refused to take it off im worried sick im going to loose my home do they have a right to do this this is the first letting i have ever had from them
Sara (Debt Camel) says
It is surprising that this is the first letter you have had about this. Were you aware your ex had gone bankrupt?
I assume you have been paying the whole mortgage and property upkeep costs since 2011, or earlier when he left?
Were there any communications between you and your ex, possibly including solicitors or court decisions, before 2011 relating to how large his share of the property was?
Patricia says
The only thing i got was a solicitors letter in 2009 asking for his name to be taken off the property bit mortgage company has refused to in 11 years i had no idea he went bankrupt in 2011 first i knew was week and a half ago desperate for help called so many solicitors who dont seem to deal with this
Ps he never paid anything to the house he was only here a year
Sara (Debt Camel) says
So the solicitor’s letter was from his solicitor?
When the house was bought, where did the deposit come from, how large was it? How much equity is there in the property now?
If you can afford to pay for a solicitor, I may be able to suggest one with insolvency experience.
Patricia says
Yes so i can prove when he left i think they thought he still lived here when he went bankrupt i paid 9000 plus 3ooo fees i have asked my then bank for statements but not able to find reept so far from 2007 if they contacted me at the time i would have had everything pleas if you could im in leicester i have most bank statments from 2010 to prove he never paid
Ps had a valuation yesterday there’s 12000 in the house but i don’t have 6000 to pay them but why should i up until last year the house was in negative equity
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest you talk to https://www.cals.uk.net/debt-advice/.
Arthur says
Hi I was made Bankrupt in November last year 2018.
I was told I had to pay a set fee for 3yrs but I would be discharged after 12 months.
Is this normal?
Also if it is, after I’ve been discharged am I allowed to do Overtime without having to declare it to the Or?
Thanks in advance
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Yes it’s normal to have to pay an IPA for 3 years. About 1 in 6 people going bankrupt has enough spare income to pay an IVA.
Is the amount proposed affordable? If your expenses increase or your income falls you can ask for the IPA to be reduced, it is completely flexible and can drop to zero. But after you are discharged you still have to report more money earned including overtime – most people decide to take it easy for three years and not do any!
Maria says
Hi,
I earn £19k a year with an annual bonus of £3000 net. The £19k a year is not enough to pay all the bills as per the debt service I still need an extra £500 a month to be able to cover essentials. This is where my partner has been using his credit card to help.
In regards to the bonus, will I need to pay that as IPA as I need it for bills?
On top of that I now need to pay monthly credit cards bills. So exhausting having a job that doesn’t pay well.
Thank you for your assistance
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Have you already gone bankrupt?
Maria says
Hi Sarah,
Not yet, getting all my ducks on a row at the minute.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
It’s good to think ahead!
If you are still making payments to non priority debts (loans, credit cards, catalogues etc), you need to stop that now. If your pattern is running up credit card bills to let you make these payments, that credit card debt will not be wiped out when you go bankrupt.
I think you should talk to National Debtline on 0808 808 4000 about your situation. Then can confirm if bankruptcy is a good option for you and if you are likely to pay an IPA. 5 out of 6 people going bankrupt don’t, buy you need someone to look at your case in detail. A bonus is just part of your income, it isn’t more likely to be taken by the Official Receiver, but clearly you have a difficult budgeting problem if you have to rely on an annual bonus to makes ends meet.
Sandi says
Hello Sarah,
I went bankrupt in January 2019. I was advised as I am self employed I would be monitored every three months. By that I mean I would have to send a 3 lined account of my spending details. Along with receipts from my small business. I had to fill in a comprehensive form detailing all expenditures within my household including my partners earning. I did this at the end of May 2019. I was expecting to have to do this again at the end of July. I have heard nothing from OR. I earn aprox 1000.00 per year. Ironically the OR emailed me to ask if I had sent documents, when provided proof of postage (I sent tracked and signed) they had lost them. I then re sent via email with confirmation they had been received and sent on to be assessed. Since then I have heard nothing?
Thank you for your assistance.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Have you asked them if you should send the end July information?
Sandi says
No Sara, I have not asked them. I received a letter informing me to send I documentation at the end of the first three months. I assumed rightly or wrongly they would contact me. I also assumed I would get a reply of some sort from the first correspondence and info I sent. Thanks for the swift reply:). Sandi
nancy says
i have recently gone bankrupt, i have been told i need to pay £77 a month to them as this is what i have “left over” after all my bills and living expenses are paid, come March ill start paying tax again, which means i wont have anything left over. what will happen then?
also after i am discharged in a year if my income goes up for some reason will they still take money? or can they not because ive been discharged
Thankyou
Matthew says
Hi Sara,
I made myself bankrupt in March 2019 and after some back and forth discussion between the OR and my accountant it was decided that I wouldn’t have an IPA. I have been given a BRO for 3 years for failing to submit accounts and keep my affairs in order, nothing fraudulent, just head buried in the sand. My question is this.. If my income increases following the end of the 12 months of being bankrupt can the OR still ask me to make a payments arrangement or ask to see my accounts. I’m a self employed agent just trying to make a living so if I have the opportunity to make a bit extra in a years time when discharged will it be worth it only to have to hand it over…and then some?
Ali says
Hi Sara,
I went bankrupt in April 2019 – Since then due to a divorce I changed my surname back to my maiden name, I did it without thinking anything of it at the time. But recently I’ve been thinking (perhaps I am overthinking?), will it in any way affect my bankruptcy discharge come April 2020? As the debts were and the bankruptcy was using my previous surname.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
It will make no difference at all legally and you will be discharged as usual.
J says
Hi Sara,
I have two questions for you. I went bankrupt in May 2019. I have no IPA. 5 months in, is it likely that one will be set at this stage? Secondly, I’m the only one earning as my wife looks after the kids. She is though currently looking for work. Were she to get a job and have a regular income, is that something I should inform the OR about? And what might the implications be? We have separate bank accounts.
Thanks for your advice as ever
J
Sara (Debt Camel) says
5 months in, is it likely that one will be set at this stage?
What did the Income & Expenses section of your bankruptcy application show?
Has your OR’s office been asking you any questions about this?
Were she to get a job and have a regular income, is that something I should inform the OR about? And what might the implications be?
Yes you should. Because with an income, she will be expected to pay some part of the household expenses.
That may not be significant. Especially if she also gets extra costs (eg childcare, commuting, lunch at work). And of course any benefits you currently get may be reduced.
I suggest you should talk to a debt adviser about whether you are likely to get an IPA and how a job your wife gets could affect that. If you won’t get an IPA if she doesn’t start work but would if she does, it could be worth her postponing this until you are discharged – after that point an IPA cannot be set.
We have separate bank accounts.
That isn’t relevant.
J says
Hi Sara,
Thanks for you quick response.
What did the Income & Expenses section of your bankruptcy application show?
Has your OR’s office been asking you any questions about this?
My and I and E form showed that roughly what came in covered what went out. I discussed with the OR how being freelancer meant that monies would fluctuate from month to month. The OR said he’d calculate my monthly expenditure based on an average of the past3 months income from my bank statements. That conversation happened on my one and only call with him and I haven’t heard anything since.
Which debt advisory service would you recommend?
David Bishop says
I was discharged in 2014, but in Oct 2019 I won my PPI. The monies went straight to the Insolvency service! Is this correct?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Yes. The right to make a PPI Claim was an “asset” which you owned in 2014 even if you didn’t know it. When you went bankrupt that asset became the property of the Official Receiver.
David Bishop says
Smacks as being slightly unfair. Oh well…
Matthew says
Hi Sara,
I made myself bankrupt in March 2019 and after some back and forth discussion between the OR and my accountant it was decided that I wouldn’t have an IPA. I have been given a BRO for 3 years for failing to submit accounts and keep my affairs in order, nothing fraudulent, just head buried in the sand. My question is this.. If my income increases following the end of the 12 months of being bankrupt can the OR still ask me to make a payments arrangement or ask to see my accounts. I’m a self employed agent just trying to make a living so if I have the opportunity to make a bit extra in a years time when discharged will it be worth it only to have to hand it over…and then some?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
You are still discharged after 12 months even with a BRO. And an IPA can’t be imposed after you are discharged.
I suggest you ask your OR. when you are discharged if you still have to show them your accounts, if the answer is Yes, ask why.
Matthew says
Thank you Sara
MIKEY says
HI I WANTED TO ASK A QUESTION
I WAS MADE BANKRUPT IN APRIL 2108 AND BE;LIVE IM DISCHARGED AS OF APRIL 2109 AS MY NAME DOES NOT APPEAR ON THE REGISTER
HAVENT HERD FROM ANYONE SINCE ANYWAY
BUT CAN I SEE IF I AM ENTITLED TO A TAX REFUND
Sara (Debt Camel) says
You can ask your OR’s office to confirm that you are discharged.
Which tax year do you want a refund for?
Matthew McAllister says
Hi, very good article. Can I ask are the rules the same in Scotland. I’m in Scotland and due for discharge next March. Will I be able to earn more money and not have any deductions? I’m currently working part time and have no deductions being taken off, but would like to go back to making a decent living following this fresh start.
Thanks, Matt.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I will ask a Scottish adviser to answer this.
Alan McIntosh says
Hi
The rules in Scotland are different.
The 1st thing is unlike the rest of the UK there is no automatic discharge after 1 year.
The 2nd difference is, you make a contribution for 48 months, not 3 years.
When you go bankrupt, the Accountant in Bankruptcy sets a contribution order for 48 months. This can be a nil order, but every month still counts towards the 48 month.
If your circumstances improve and you can make a contribution, the Order can be changed to require you to make a payment.
Normally what happens is you will get discharge after 1 year and if you have paid nothing the Trustee will seek their own discharge, effectively ending the bankruptcy.
However, if the Trustee still has to deal with your home or other assets, they may remain in office. This means although you are discharged your Bankruptcy isn’t finished and your Trustee could still change your contribution order to for the remainder of the 48 months.
So, basically, if your Trustee remains in office, you could be asked to make a contribution after your discharge, even if you had not made one up to that point.
If your Trustee is out of office or it was a Minimum Asset Bankruptcy, this is unlikely.
You can visit my page on Bankrutpcy in Scotland here https://www.advicescotland.com/home/sequestration/
or you can read the Accountant in Bankruptcy booklet on Bankruptcy here (downloads as a PDF file)
https://www.aib.gov.uk/aib-debtors-guide-november-2016
Mark says
Hi,
I was made bankrupt last December and will be discharged in a week, I have been paying an IPA since January. I contacted the OR to update them on changes in my income and expenditure on which they called me to discuss. They asked me to do another SOA and decided that an IPA is now not necessary as my disposable income was under £20. My question is that they have now stated that once discharged I do not need to contact them again if I get a pay rise/changed in expenses etc again, and I will be free of the bankruptcy?, is that correct as I have read everywhere that I need to update them of all changes until the 3 years of IPA are up?, can anyone shed some light on this. Many thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
they have now stated that once discharged I do not need to contact them again if I get a pay rise/changed in expenses etc again
If you have this in writing, that’s great. If it was just said to you on the phone, I suggest you email the OR or your Trustee and say you would just like to confirm that you don’t have to inform them of any changes in your income or expenses now.
Mark says
Hi Sara,
This was just on the phone, hopefully they will put this is writing over the next week or so. If not I will email and ask for a confirmation letter/email.
Many thanks
Mark
David says
Hi Sara,
Absolutely fantastic site – full of useful information.
I had a couple of questions. I was declared bankrupt last month due to lots of debt that arose due to gambling. My mental state was terrible due to father being diagnosed with stage 4 cancer and my daughter being extremely unwell.
My questions are
– the OR initially asked a lot of questions and I complied with every request, providing honest and accurate descriptions of everything that had happened. The OR has said they have all the information they need and they don’t require any further information at this stage. What are the chances that a BRO will still be imposed?
– second question is – I have been advised not to work by my doctor but as a result of my bankruptcy relationships with my family are strained and I need to move out.
If I was to start a job in Jan 2020 and an IPA is set, but I was then to leave my job before the end of my discharge, and no longer required to pay anything due to no surplus income – will I still need to notify the OR of any income changes for 3 years?
I imagine at the point of my discharge if this situation arose I would be on benefits and not paying anything towards an IPA.
Thanks.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Please do not post here on different pages using different names, pick a name and stick to it. I see you have posted on MSE forum too. No problem with that except… if you tell different people only parts of your story you risk people not seeing the full picture. (The moderators on the MSE forums will also be able to see if you try to post there with another name, so don’t try that!)
You may feel you only want specific questions answered and don’t want to give full details – that’s up to you but:
a) I am not giving you “proper debt advice” here. I am just making some general points in answer to what you have said. Proper debt advice requires a detailed knowledge of your situation. If you have missed off a key piece of information how can I know this?
b) I think fatbelly on MSE would say the same. He is an excellent and experienced debt advisor.
c) you may be posting on other forums as well. Anyone who gives categorical answers to some of your questions is not a debt adviser and hasn’t dealt with many bankruptcy cases.
If you want “proper debt advice” (and I think you should) then I suggest you go to your local Citizens Advice or phone National Debtline on 0808 808 4000. And tell them everything, even the bits you don’t think matter.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Having said all that – and it wasn’t criticism so much as trying to be clear – here are some points to consider.
– I can’t say what the odds on a BRO being imposed are. Gambling is a common driver of BROs. I also don’t know if you carried on making payments to your sister after you had stopped paying other debts, the OR may view that as “preference”. But does a BRO really matter to you?
– you should ignore the suggestion on MSE that you could get a 2 bed flat so you could rent a room out and use that to repay your sister. Until you are (a) discharged and (b) have no IPA that suggestion is wrong in so many ways! For example income from a lodger would be treated as income in assessing your IPA.
– in general if you have a clever plan to let you get around the OR’s restrictions and IPA you would be wise to assume it won’t work and it may be a criminal offence.
– how are you proposing to rent a flat as an undischarged bankrupt and no job or a job you have only very recently started? You will fail most tenancy checks unless you have a guarantor.
– you have mentioned you have a disability. Are you claiming PIP? If you are, then your bankruptcy expenses can include a line for “adult disability costs” equal to the PIP payment. That will reduce some of your other expenses you listed. If you aren’t, then this is a good time to apply for it. The SFS is not published. I think it should be, but it’s not my call.
– if you leave your job, how would you be proposing to pay for a flat? Use https://benefits-calculator.turn2us.org.uk/AboutYou to see what benefits you might be able to get. they are unlikely to cover the sorts of rent you were talking about.
– you asked if you can annul your bankruptcy. Yes if you repay your debts in full plus the ORs high fees. OR if you can get your creditors to agree to an IVA. But an IVA would have to be making large payments to your creditors who (a) may refuse to include the debt to your sister (b) insist your CM payments are reduced to normal levels (c) not be prepared to consider an IVA unless you have been clean from gambling for a period of many months (d) are likely to query some of the expenses you listed on the MSE post and (e) if you lose your job your IVA will fail and you are back at bankruptcy with the IVA fees added on top. For someone with MH problems and no assets to protect, an IVA is not a sensible alternative to bankruptcy – it is not an easy way to clear debts and pay less than in bankruptcy, you will generally pay much more as the payments will be for 5 years whereas an IPA is for 3 years.
– if an IPA is set, it normally stays in place for 3 years. The payments drop to zero if you are out of work but you have to inform the OR if you then get another job until the three years ends. If it seemed likely because of medical evidence that you could not work again for many years the IPA may be stopped or may just be left at zero. But planning to stop work in month 9, have an IPA cancelled and then get a job again in month 15, say, comes under the heading of “clever plans that won’t work”.
David says
Thank you for your response. I didn’t realise that posting on different forums might have been an issue and apologise for that. Thank you for the information regarding the BRO, IVA and IPA.
I can also confirm that I have not made any payments to my sister and don’t intend to. Having been told it would be a clear breach of bankruptcy means I will not be doing that.
A BRO would matter to me if it lasted for several years. What is the worse possible scenario with a BRO? I have ignored the suggestion on MSE of getting a 2 bedroom flat and renting out a room – I quickly realised that was very bad advice.
I can assure you I am not looking to get around the OR’s restrictions and IPA and just wanted to understand the whole process as I stupidly went into bankruptcy without knowing the full facts. I was exploring the option of going back to work and thus being in a position to be able to rent. I assumed private landlord would be ok with a deposit (if agreed by the OR).
thank you for confirming what I can expense in regards to my disability – currently on PIP.
i don’t plan on leaving my job if I start one And wanted to know what it would mean in regards to any IPA if I did. Is the official receiver allowed to tell me to somewhere cheaper if they feel my rent is too high?
Lastly, from the expenses I listed on MSE (namely child maintenance of £2400) – do you think the official receiver is likely to accept that or refuse it?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
This page is a good summary of BROs https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/debt-and-money/debt-solutions/bankruptcy-2/bankruptcy-restrictions-orders/. But if you want to see some examples of what happens in practice, read https://www.insolvencydirect.bis.gov.uk/IESdatabase/viewbrobrusummary-new.asp. I cannot guess if you will get a BRO. Not everyone who has ever gambled does. If gambling was a major factor why you had to go bankrupt it is more likely.
Renting privately with bankruptcy on your credit record is not always simple, a guarantor helps a lot.
As I said before, the OR is likely to start from the assumption that you should pay child maintenance at the level the official calculator suggests. You can argue for your children’s health costs meaning you have to pay more but I can’t guess if that will succeed.
I would suggest you should assume that if an IPA is set and you then lose your job, your IPA will be reduced to zero until you get another job.
ORs do not want to spend their time telling people who are bankruptcy how to live. I don’t think the OR would tell you you have to rent a room in a shared house given your age and disability.
I think you would find it useful to talk to National Debtline and ask for their help to mock up what your expenses might look like if you earn £X and move out and rent a place costing £Y.
Laura says
I lost my job in August and payments where stopped, luckily I wasn’t out if work for long and informed them of everything along the way. I have been told willmott are extremely busy and responses will be longer. Atm the email time for them to respond is 6-8 weeks, so we have yet to set up a new payment plan. However I am due to be discharged in 4 weeks, will I still be discharged? And if I was to be extended would I have heard by now?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
You should still be discharged from bankruptcy after 12 months. That is normally only extended if you are not co-operating with the OR’s investigations.
So an IPA was set up while you were in work? How much for? And are you now earning roughly the same amount you were before? The IPA is not affected by your discharge.
Laura says
It was for £180 but my salary has dropped and when I done my new budget form I was estimated to be paying £40 as my husband is out of work so I pay more now. Can a ipa still be set up after bankruptcy?
Tony says
Hi, I was discharged several years ago. I now wish yo get a joint mortgage application underway. However I’m concerned about links to banks I defaulted against. For example, Santander has since taken over one the banks I defaulted a loan with. They pestered me for payment even after being discharged. My girlfriend has looked best mortgage deals, and guess who she came up with…. Santander. Do I have anything to worry about making an application with them? Thanks.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Were you discharged more than 5 years ago so your credit record is now clean?
Tony says
Hi,
Yes. Discharged 2008.
But sure I heard somewhere if I was foolish enough to bank with them again, there is nothing unlawful about them taking back the money they had lost. Not sure if that is true. Probably a more realistic concern in this case is having a mortgage being cancelled because they realise from their own records further down the line that I defaulted them.
I’ve tried researching for similar enquiries and cannot find anything regarding using the same bank/broker.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
“if I was foolish enough to bank with them again, there is nothing unlawful about them taking back the money they had lost”
No, they can’t do that.
“ having a mortgage being cancelled because they realise from their own records further down the line that I defaulted them.”
They can’t do that either.
BUT you will almost certainly be asked on your application if you have ever been insolvent and will have to declare your bankruptcy then. It’s fraud if you don’t… and Santander may be able to see from their internal records that you went bankrupt…
Best advice is to go to a good broker and tell them the full story. There are plenty of lenders and good deals around. Your ancient bankruptcy isn’t going to stop you two getting a good deal. But it would he foolish to just apply direct to Santander.