Have you had a catalogue, credit card or store card where your credit limit was too high? So high that the monthly repayments were hard to manage and you got into more debt?
Many people were originally given an OK limit, but the lender kept increasing them.
You may have a good complaint that the lender was irresponsible in allowing you to borrow so much that the debt was unaffordable.
This article explains how to complain and ask for a refund of the interest you paid
Contents
What is “affordability”?
The following is my summary of the regulator’s rules:
- a lender must check if credit is affordable when you apply for it. A mortgage lender will ask for bank statements, but a catalogue offering a £200 credit limit doesn’t have to go into so much detail;
- a lender should also make new checks when deciding to increase a credit limit;
- credit isn’t affordable if paying it leaves you short of money for your bills,everyday expenses, and your other debts;
- if you have to borrow more most months, this would not be affordable. This could be borrowing on the same account – making a credit card repayment but then using the credit card to pay for food so the balance never drops is “borrowing more”;
- you have to be able to repay the balance within a reasonable period of time. Paying the minimum amount is OK for a short while, but not for a prolonged period.
How to complain
Good reasons to complain
If the lender could see any of these on your credit record, they should probably have declined your original application:
- recent credit record problems: defaults, missed payments, or arrangements to pay, mortgage arrears, payday loans;
- you already had a different credit card with the same lender where you were only making minimum payments and were using it for essentials like food and petrol. If you were given two credit or catalogue accounts by the same lender, often the second one should never have been given.
- other credit cards where you were near your limit and persistent overdraft usage. Here is an Ombudsman decision saying Zopa should not have given quite a low initial limit in this situation;
- a level of borrowing that looks too high in relation to your income.
Your credit limit should not later have been increased unless you could afford it. In addition to the points above, the following should have also warned the lender you were in difficulty already:
- making minimum payments for a long while;
- using a lot of your limit for a long period;
- a lot of gambling showing on the account statement;
- recent missed payments or an arrangement to pay on this account;
- your overall level of debt on your credit record has gone up a lot.
You don’t need all the details to complain
When your lender increased your credit limit, you don’t need the exact date. If all you can say is “you increased my credit limit several times” that is fine. You don’t need to ask for copies of all your statements – you would get a ton of paper!
But getting your credit record can help. You can’t go back and see exactly what your credit score was in say 2018, but take a copy of your current credit record as soon as you complain (get your free TransUnion statutory credit report). That will show what the pre-2018 problems were that the lender should have spotted.
Template to complain & the email address to use
The best way to complain is by email. It’s free, instant and you have a record of what you sent and when. Here is a list of credit card and catalogue email addresses to use.
In the suggestions below, I’ve invented some examples for the bits in italics in brackets. Change/delete these to tell your story.
I want to complain about irresponsible lending by you for my Barclaycard account number 987654/444. My date of birth is dd/mm/yy. The email address I used for this account was myaddress@whatever.com.
Then say they should never have given you the account:
You should never have allowed me to open an account with such a large credit limit. When I applied in 2015, you should have checked my credit record and you would have seen I had recent missed payments to a credit card and a default only two months before on a loan.
Or say that they should not have increased your credit limit:
You should never have increased my credit limit in 2015. At that time I had only made minimum payments on this credit card for a long while and/or I was using a very high level of my credit limit.
If you had properly checked my credit record before increasing my limit, you would have seen that in the two years since my account with you was opened, I had got additional late payment markers and defaults and/or taken out a lot of other credit. This should have warned you I was struggling with my finances and it was not responsible to lend me more. By increasing my credit limit you made my financial position worse. Instead you should have offered me forbearance by freezing the interest on the card.
I do not know the exact months of these credit limit increases. In your reply to this complaint, please tell me the dates and amounts.
If the lender should already have known you had problems with your account, mention these
You should also have realised that I was having difficulty because:
of the late payment charges you added to my account
of the gambling transactions showing on my card statement
I had missed two payments to you the year before in 2017
I had already asked you on the phone if it was possible to stop adding interest for a while.
End with asking for a refund:
I would like you to refund me all the interest I paid and any late payment charges from the point the account was opened
OR
I would like you to refund me all the interest I paid and any late payment charges after you increased my credit limit in 2018.
I would also like any late payment and default markers to be removed from credit records after this point.
I understand that if I take this complaint to the Financial Ombudsman, 8% simple interest is usually added to a cash refund.
Points to think about
Timing
These complaints can be made if your account is still open, or if it is closed and settled, or if it is with a debt collector (NB the complaint goes to the original lender, not the debt collector.)
You can complain if you already have a CCJ for the debt. Add a sentence to the template saying you want the CCJ removed as part of the settlement of your complaint.
If you have had an IVA or bankruptcy after these problems, or if you are still in a DRO, then ask in the comments below, as this can be complicated.
Old accounts
The Financial Ombudsman (FOS) can only go back to April 2007, when the law changed to allow these complaints.
Many lenders will reject complaints about something that was more than 6 years ago and say the ombudsman won’t look at them. But FOS will often look at old problems if you have only found out in the last three years that you can make the complaint.
If your account was opened in 2015 but the lender increased your limit in 2018 and 2019, then the two limit increases are within the last 6 years and can definitely be looked at.
However, complaints about things that happened more than 6 years ago may be hard for you to produce much evidence for. But if you feel you have a strong older case and you have some evidence, then take it to the Ombudsman and let them decide!
An alternative approach for old accounts
If your account was opened a long while ago and you defaulted and still owe a balance, perhaps in a DMP, think about asking the debt collector to produce the Consumer Credit Act agreement for the account.
If the current creditor can’t produce a proper copy of the agreement, the debt cannot be enforced in court and you can simply stop paying anything to it. This applies to all credit cards, store cards and catalogues.
It may be that the balance on the account is larger than any refund you might get. In which case if the CCA agreement cannot be produced, you would be better off.
Is a refund what you really need?
This depends how large your current financial problems are.
Complaining about newish debt will often only get the interest removed – you still have to repay what you borrowed. Don’t spend months arguing with lenders and going to the ombudsman if you will still be in a mess even if you win.
So phone National Debtline on 0808 808 4000, tell them you are thinking about affordability complaints but you would like to know what your other debt options are.
Poor reasons to complain
You can’t complain just because the interest rate was high or because you have paid them a fortune over the years.
A poor credit score on its own isn’t a reason why you shouldn’t have been given an account. But if your credit score was poor because you were having a lot of problems with your existing debt, the account should have been refused.
You won’t win an affordability complaint if something unexpected went wrong later in your life. If you had been managing a credit card fine for years but then you lost your job or separated from your partner and you defaulted, this isn’t the lender’s fault.
Don’t be put off by a rejection or a poor offer
Lenders often reject good cases
If a lender rejects your complaint or offers a low “goodwill” gesture, don’t be fobbed off – they want you to give up.
In particular, if the lender says you had made all the payments to them on time so they had no reason to think you had problems, you can ignore this. Or if the lender dismisses your complaint as the account was opened over 6 years ago.
When you have a Final Response from the lender – or after 8 weeks if you haven’t had a Final Response – send your complaint to the Financial Ombudsman Service (FOS). Don’t delay doing this!
Is a “partial uphold” good enough?
If the lender says they should not have increased your credit limit in June 2018 when your limit was increased and they will give you a refund of interest for balances over the previous limit, that may sound good. It is sometimes called a partial uphold or a partial refund or proportionate interest.
But often the amount of money refunded in this situation is a lot less than you might expect. So tell the lender you want to consider their offer but need to know how large the refund will be.
Often you were already in a difficult financial situation at that point, with cards close to maxed out, being used for everyday essentials and only paying the minimums. At that point the lender should have stepped in and offered to help you by freezing all interest. That is why a partial refund is often not good enough, you should have all the interest refunded from that point.
How to send a case to FOS
Send FOS a complaint using their online form. You can use bits of what you put in your complaint to the lender. If the lender has rejected your complaint or given a poor offer, say why you think this wrong.
The FOS form at the end asks you to add supporting documents. Don’t worry if you don’t have A copy of your credit or finance agreement – lots of people don’t and the lender will supply a copy to FOS if FOS asks for it. Don’t delay sending a complaint to FOS while you try to get this from the lender.
If your credit record shows that you had other debt problems, send FOS a copy of it. If you have kept some, send the oldest one you have, otherwise send the current one. Also get your bank statements if they will support your complaint and send those to FOS too.
FOS is a friendly service but not fast. Just use normal English, not legal terms. Using a claims company or a solicitor doesn’t help or speed this up.
Ask questions below!
There are hundreds of comments from readers who are using this template. It’s a good place to see how these complaints often go and to ask any questions.
FAQs about Affordability claims
Can you get an overdraft refund?
Could a Debt Relief order help you?
A says
My DMP ended in 2019 as I had paid all of the debts down apart from the Barclaycard, it went down to, but it never cleared. I intended to get a better card and transfer the remaining balance as Barclaycard had midway through my DMP started charging me interest again and it looked like I was going to be in the DMP even longer.
A friend advised me to close the DMP as I wouldnt get a transfer card being in one. Unfortunately the DMP damage was already done. Barclaycard were getting minimum payments while I was in the DMP, I had the Very catelogue getting the larger £150-160 per month. The other few credit cards I had in the DMP were getting around 20-30 and the payday loans (which were the last to drop off) were getting around £10. It took a full 5 years for a £300 lending stream loan to come off the DMP, something that could have come off in 6 months if they were getting the payments Barclaycard were getting. i dont really get how Stepchange works those payment plans out.
I cant wait to get rid of Barclaycard. I dont even have an overdraft now and want completely rid of credit. my partner now has savings and handles the money. I feel like my financial picture is improving slowly with my last default just dropping off on 14th of this month.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Well your friend obviously knew nothing about balance transfers if they though you would get one with a poor credit record :(
So part of your complaint should be that because Barclaycard started adding interest while you were in the DMP, the time to complete your DMP was unreasonably prolonged. point out other creditors stopped adding interest and Barclaycard has stopped adding interest at the beginning. Read https://debtcamel.co.uk/creditor-wont-freeze-interest/
Lee says
Hi All
I’ve had my Very Subject of Access request infomation emailed to me but no final response yet. It contains 137 pages.
I cannot work out how much interest I’ve paid over the years due to its layout, but can see around 20 times my credit limit amount has been changed over the years.
About 15 of which were increases to as high as 4k at one point. My current credit limit is 500 as I reduced it following a gambling win about 12 months ago.
Just wondered if anyone else could work out the interest they paid from what very sent them. It is not easy that easy to follow.
Anth says
It’s been a while since my SAR with Very but amongst the original statements was a list of transactions that showed the adjustments such as administration fees and interest that’d been applied. That was only (relatively) easily readable for my Very and IsMe accounts though. Littlewoods works differently as the interest is front loaded to the order value at the point of placing the order, so it’s impossible to tell how much exactly it was. Even seeing the interest added though, it’s difficult to work out things like cashback offers, or where you’ve paid toward the balance for a BNPL purchase right at the end of the period and the interest has then been removed.
My advice would be to concentrate on the reasons for your complaint such as your credit limit increases and the balance on your account – they’re listed on your original statements in the SAR. It’s their job to work out the interest paid depending on the conclusions they come to. You can always query things once you receive a final response and a full breakdown of dates/amounts.
Jben says
118 money credit card
Just had quick success with 118 money credit card. Limit of £250 taken out in 2019.
Complained never should have been issues. Had 3 ccjs, defaults and mortgage arrears at time card was accepted.
118 have refunded all fees so balance is wiped. Stated they will close card but all information removed from credit file
Took less than 30 days for outcome.
Also successful with Lending Stream went to ombudsmen.
Awaiting Very catalogue – roughly 5 weeks
JD Williams x 2 – currently with ombudsmen.
Tracey Waite says
Same here wiped debt & compensated me with £1,645.32 dont give up my biggest win was with Littlewoods put in complaint about February received updates all the time then in May received notification that they were at fault went right back to 2008 calculated interest etc received a cheque for £5,468.00 & wiped off the bit of debt I had they admitted they were in the wrong!!
Asl says
Hi Sara
Can you advise what process I should follow to take my complaint to the Financial Obundsman?
Very have only upheld my complaint based on one credit limit increase?
I asked in my letter fir them to provide a list of the credit limit increases, they haven’t fulfilled that in the final
Response either?
Also they have stated that my account is in arrears because I missed a payment while the investigation was taken place, surely that’s not right? (Added an admin charge too)
Any advice would be much appreciated.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Have you stopped paying them?
Is this your only problem debt?
Asl says
I haven’t did anything yet they are looking for a £500 minimum payment including the £300 arrears, I defo can’t afford that.
Yeah at the moments this is my biggest problem, I’m in arrangements with other creditors which I am
Managing. But I have heard Very aren’t very accommodating to payment plans the balance is £2900 on the account.
I defo want to take it to the Fos they have sent me through the credit limit increases and there more or less every 3 months
Jax says
I found them extremely difficult to deal with when I got into difficulty. They wouldn’t accept a payment arrangement. I was lucky that I had a bonus at work and was able to clear my arrears.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
if they won’t accept a payment arrangement go to StepChange – that is the simple way to deal with this.
Asl says
What was the balance at the time Jax can you remember?
Sara if I go to stepchange what mark is on your credit file, is it just the same “payment arrangement”
Sara (Debt Camel) says
a debt management plan is in theory the same as a payment arrangement. In practice, some lenders seem quicker to mark debts as in default in a DMP than an arrangement.
BUT this is normally to your advantage! A defaulted record drops off your credit file after 6 years from the default but a payment arrangement stays for 6 years from the settlement date, which can be harming your credit record for a LOT longer. When a lender says they will be nice and not default you, what they actually mean is they will be able to sell your debt for more to a debt collector if it isn’t defaulted.
And of course if you win an affordability complaint the default is removed anyway.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Well I suggest you ask them for an affordable payment arrangement. these cases can take a long while to go through at FOS, so you need to be in a safe position while they do.
Very have to listen when you ask for a payments arrangement. If you have several of these it can often be easier to go through StepChange who will administer them all, you just pay SC one payment, they divide it between your creditors and SC don’t charge you anything at all.
Do you think you had several credit increases? You can also ask them for the details of them when you phone up.
Asl says
Yes there are over 20 credit limit increases on the paperwork
Ok I will phone and arrange payment arrangements, hopefully they will listen. But should I have had arrears/missed payment wen they were investigating? The payment was dues on the 14th and their final
Response was the 21st?
With regards to the FOS, do I email or send letters to them, do you have a template for sending the stuff on??
Sara (Debt Camel) says
But should I have had arrears/missed payment wen they were investigating?
Yes if you missed a payment.
Asl says
What about sending the complaint on?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
The article above explains how to send a complaint to FOS.
Jax says
My balance at the time was about £1400 Asl.
Jax says
And my problem at the time was that some of my debts where in my maiden name and some in my married name. I couldn’t continue with Stepchange until I had updated all of my accounts to my married name. I needed to get payment arrangements sorted quickly. I was so stressed by it all as I had over £50k in debts because of a gambling addiction. It was just easier to pay the arrears from my bonus. About 15 months on and I have approximately £22k outstanding. In honesty I would have taken the Stepchange option if it hadn’t been for the added complexity of sorting my maiden/married name issue out. I have however been gambling free for about 14 months now.
Asl says
Thank you for your information. I will give them a call see what my options are. Glad you have nearly halved your debt. And you are on the mend x
Bev Clifford says
I have received the statement of account for the complainant I have currently waiting to be allocated with FOS regarding Vanquis credit card, it contains 77 pages, how do I work it out, do I manually add up all the categories seperate, like over limit and late payments, thanks in advance for your amazing knowledge and help/advise
Sara (Debt Camel) says
What is your complaint to Vanquis?
BC says
Affordability, I have had the card from March 2014, increased from 500 right up to max 4000, even though the minimum was paid, along with late & over limit charges, they also offered me 2 loans and allowed me to take one loan whilst at maximum and still only paying minimum payment for the last few years. I did put in an affordability complaint, , so I sent it over to FOS and still waiting for this to be picked up. Not Upheld – Unable to agree our lending was irresponsible. Satisfied all relevant checks completed prior to lending and none of these revealed anything which would deem further credit irresponsible.
I have on the report BILLED DEFERRED FINANCE CHARGES, BILLED FINANCE CHARGES, OVERLIMIT CHARGE, INTEREST DEBIT ADJUSTMENT, LATE PAYMENT CHARGE, all with a figure by them.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Well one option is to just keep the pile of papers and only go through them if FOS come back saying something you don’t agree with.
Alternatively I would:
– first put all the paperwork into date order if it isn’t already
– then go through and set up a spreadsheet with a line for each month noting what happened. Including those numbers, whether you only paid the minimum and when your credit limit increased.
Michelle says
Does anyone have a email address for freeman’s catalog ? Thanks
Bc says
Thanks for the reply, I will do that, just wondering do Vanquis normally reject with a few weeks of the complainant in most cases, as they didn’t give me an option to go back to them to re look.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Sounds quite common – most lenders don’t give you an option to ask them to look again.
Michelle says
They rejected mine in 11 days of complaint , sent to ombudsman today , feels like are reject good complaints
Rob says
Have a Vanquis complaint with the ombudsman now, from 2014 as I was unsure they were supposed to conduct checks and such and followed your advice and feel I had a good complaint.
They’ve asked if I have any ‘exceptional circumstances’ as to why I didn’t complain earlier.
Well I didn’t know it was even possible or they should have done that – it’s not as if the creditor gives you a list of what they should & shouldn’t be doing. How best to respond?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest you reply that you have only recently found out that a credit card lender should checked that the credit limit they gave would be affordable for you.
If you only made minimum payments for a long period – years not months – you could also say you didn’t realise the lender should have monitored your account to see if you were in financial trouble.
Say when you found out about these complaints and how [a friend told you, you read an article in the Sun, you saw an advert from a claim company on Facebook, you were contacted by the administrators of a payday lender… whatever, just say how you found out about these complaints]. Say you are therefore complaining within 3 years of finding out you had cause to complain.
Lauren says
Hi Sara,
I’m just wondering if you can help me with the below?
Next have upheld my complaint and agreed to refund interest etc but only to the balance once they’ve bought it back from Caboot.
Can they not refund me the interest and I pay this against the Caboot debt as they are not removing this from my credit file anyway?
See below for some of their response :)
‘We agree with your complaint
Thanks for getting in touch about your NextPay account and for taking the time to speak with me today. I’d like to say again how sorry I was to learn about the financial difficulties you’ve experienced. I completely understand how stressful this can be.
As promised, I’m writing to confirm that we agree with your complaint relating to irresponsible lending and want to put things right. My reasons are set out in more detail below.
I’d like to offer you £441.15 as an interest refund to the balance and £100 as an apology
We’re arranging to recall the account from Cabot and will reduce the balance by £441.15 for an interest refund. Just to let you know, this is £408.47 for all the interest ever added to the account plus £32.68 for an additional 8% .
To say how sorry I am for any distress and inconvenience this situation has caused you I’m arranging to transfer £100 in to your bank account within the next 3 to 5 days.
What we should have done better
Whilst we undertake affordability checks, using multiple sources of data, before increasing anybody’s credit limit, having reviewed all the available information again today, we now feel the increase we gave to you, to £3750 in June 2017, was too high.
To put things right, we are going to transfer the ownership of the debt and the credit files back to Next, to enable us to make the interest refund as above. I’m afraid this can sometimes take several months to complete, so I will keep in touch with a monthly update until the process has been completed.
I explained that we wouldn’t be able to remove the default from your credit files altogether, as we have a duty to accurately report how an account has been run, and other lenders rely on this information when making their decisions. I explained that the default will fall off your credit files by 05 February 2024, as three years have already passed since it was registered.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
When was the account sold to Cabot?
Did Next stop adding interest when your account defaulted in Feb 2018?
Do you think the limit was too high before the last increase to 3750?
Lauren says
Hi Sara,
March this year by the looks of it.
Interest has been added, the account on Cabot is now £4064.46?
No, the limit went from £300 to £3750, I was making minimum payments only prior to the increase.
Do you suggest I take this to the FSA?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Some of these figures seem a bit odd. Do you agree they have only added £408 in interest to the account? If you current balance is just over £4000, that seems like a low amount of interest? Do you have any old statements you could look at?
They liked your limit from 300 straight up to 3750 – wow!
Lauren says
I did think it was really low.
They’ve sent me nothing other than a phone call today and that email to confirm the claim was upheld.
I’ve tried to log into my old account but access has been barred!!!
I’ve requested additional information to them, in terms of the refund should that be against my balance or should it go to me and I use it to pay to Cabot? I just think with them not removing it from my history or anything I’d rather continue paying Cabot.
Thanks :)
Sara (Debt Camel) says
yes it looks low – that’s why I asked if they stopped adding interest back in 2018…
From what you have said it looks as though they got two things badly wrong
1) that great hike in your credit limit
2) continuing to add interest after they had defaulted you
Now they have accepted your complaint, it is fair for the refund to be against the balance owed. But they may have got the amount very wrong. And FOS would probably say they have to remove the default.
I think you should ask them to send you copies of your statements from 2017.
Lauren says
Hi Sara,
I’ve just spoken to them and suggested that they refund the interest direct to me and I pay Cabot myself with it if they aren’t willing to remove the default it makes no sense waiting months for it to be rectified when I’m already making regular payments.
Would you suggest that this was a fair offer on my behalf?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I think you should find out how much interest you did pay. Because it may be a lot more, and that’s more important to get right surely?
Chris says
JDWilliams update: 8 days ago, they messaged me to say they had calculated the redress but needed to get in touch with the debt purchaser to find out how much was still owing. They said they would be back asap. I can find this information out in 10 seconds. Emailed them yesterday to enquire about progress and got a standard ‘we will be in touch shortly’. What happened to the asap? So, this is 8 weeks after accepting the Adjudicator’s ruling – who, ofc, had given them 4 weeks to respond. Started the whole thing in May 2019.
Mr and Mrs C says
They are a complete joke! I have been waiting since Feb for my refund, its been 6 months now. I have reported to FCA as per some advice on here and now JDW have said they are looking at calculations (still) and they hope to have an answer for me by this Friday.
Chris says
Ha! Well got a further email from them today saying the email they sent 2 weeks ago asking for the Debt Purchaser total has not been answered. They claim to have sent a chaser a few days ago. It really does not take 2 weeks to obtain a figure on this. Having read other posts, I am now expecting the calculations to be wrong too.
Mr and Mrs C says
I am on tenterhooks here – today is the day I should finally receive the calculations. The excitement is palpable !
I also don’t expect to receive any information from them at all.
Rose says
I’m guessing they ended up letting you down yet again? Or did they finally come through?
Fingers are crossed (whilst simultaneously dreading what I have to come, assuming the adjudicator finds in my favour, of course…)
Andrew says
Hi so made 3 complaints vanquis, aqua and marbles
Vanquis fully upheld 900 I still owe to Cabot the interest they charged should wipe out the balance and change although I am yet to see the interest figures
New day(aqua and Marbles) both partially upheld form second increase in May 2017 to date so do I just add the increase from May 17 to date or would it only be the difference on the interest charged between say a 600 debt then increased to 1200 to 3200 etc?
Also the 8 simple interest how do yoh work that out I worked out 2500k interest since May 17 until card was suspended in 2019 but I was adding the full interest which I suspect is wrong if I still owe 2800 to Cabot do they have to pay simple interest
Thanks for any help been a great help this site Sara thank you
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Vanquis – have they also agreed to remove the default?
Aqua & Marbles do I just add the increase from May 17 to date or would it only be the difference on the interest charged between say a 600 debt then increased to 1200 to 3200 etc?
That depends on how they have worded it…
Do you think this is a fair decision, or do you think they were unaffordable from the first credit limit increase?
I worked out 2500k interest since May 17 until card was suspended in 2019 but I was adding the full interest which I suspect is wrong if I still owe 2800 to Cabot do they have to pay simple interest
I am not sure what you are saying. is this Vanquis or New Day?
Andrew says
Vanquis have responded with comments to adjudicator but adjudicator has emailed to ‘head off that argument’, adjudicator ordered the defaults be removed but still waiting to hear whether they agree
So I owe 2800 to Cabot on behalf of new day but if I add up all the interest from May 17 (the increase when fos said was unafforbale) it comes to 2500 because technically they won’t owe me money will just be wiping a balance off then simple interest wouldn’t be applied would it ?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
ah ok, I didn’t realise these decisions were both from FOS.
yes I think you should gte back all interest charged after the second increase. But if you still owe them money at the end of this, no 8%.
Andrew says
So an update vanquis initially disagreed with adjudicator but following discussions they have now relented has anyone a timeline form agreement to figures sent to you to payment
New day (2 cards aqua and marbles) despite adjudicator trying to sort it same way they rejected so on way to ombudsman
Lou says
So I put in affordability complaint to vanquis a week or so ago I have had a reply today rejecting my claim….. the account was taken out in 2011 and was at 250 it was this amount for years I only ever made the minimum payments and I always spent whatever little money was on there…… in 2017 they whacked it up to 1000 then up to 1750….. again only paying minimum payments and maxing…. my argument they never did credit checks as I have my report from that time and if they had they would have seen the payday loans and extra stuff I had out… they say that they had put on the letter that I could have told them that I didn’t want the increases it stated in the increase letters….. is it work taking to ombudsmen… for 2 years shortly after the increases I had to activate the rop as I couldn’t afford payments…. now I’m on debt management plan…. they did not check my personal circumstances if they had they would have seen I was on universal credit at the time of increases etc and not long had my little boy so alot had changed… they claim they did credit check I also asked for all my data which they have not supplied as of yet..
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest you send this straight to the Ombudsman. Those were 2 very big credit increases if you had only been mak9ng the minimum payments.
Lou says
OK I have popped it through now… what happens though if they say I could have turned the limit down?!? I honestly didn’t know I could but apparently it said in the letters… do you think I still have a strong enough case regardless? Tia
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Credit cards always say that but they are still losing many of these cases at FOS. They should not have offered an increase you could not afford.
Lou says
Thank you for your help, also, I have called the ombudsmen service as I’m a little un happy well let’s say very…… I know there’s delays etc but my Fashion world case was already picked up once and put away they have now been sitting on this for 11months and I’ve heard nothing I have also put a complaint in about the service as I feel this may have detrimental effect… I have heard nothing this was over 2 months ago so I called again last week had a complaint raised and apparently should have had a manager call me within 48 hours still nothing…… would you happen to know what I should do now or do I just sit and do nothing and just wait however long …..
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest you call again if nothing by the end of this week.
Bill says
Hi,
I’d like to make a complaint to both Vanquis & Capital one (both taken out 2016) but don’t know if the below is ok to send.
Also I’m not really sure what to ask for. I was thinking maybe finish off by saying I’ll pay 10% of the total debt but would like the account to be removed from credit file?
Can you kindly advise ?
Dear Sir/Madam,
I want to complain about irresponsible lending by you for my Vanquis/Capital One Credit Card account number xxxxxxxx. My date of birth is ,,,,. The email address I used for this account was …
When I applied in 2016, you should have checked my credit record and you would have seen I had recently (2015) defaulted on a NatWest credit card, Natwest loan, Hitachi loan, and PRA credit card.
Also I don’t think you should have increased my credit limit (applies to Vanquis). I do not know the exact months of these credit limit increases. In your reply to this complaint, can you please tell me when the increases were and how much the limit when up on each occasion.
If you had properly checked my credit record before increasing my limit, you would have seen that in the two years since my account with you was opened, I had got additional late payment markers and defaults and taken out other credit. This should have warned you I was struggling with my finances and it was not responsible to lend me more. By increasing my credit limit you made my financial position worse.
Kind regards
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Looks ok to me.
I suggest you ask for a refund of all interest added. That is the “correct” redress for an affordability complaint. Offering to pay 10% is just random, it could be too much – they may owe you money! – or too little, you have no idea. Just keep things simple, you don’t have to guess at this.
If you have late payments or a default showing, ask for them to be deleted.
What is the current balance, are you making the minimum payments at the moment and can you afford these? Do you have other debt problems and are you behind with any bills?
Bill says
Thanks for the reply
I was already in a DMP when I took these two credit cards out. It wasn’t long till these two accounts were also included (about a year)
I don’t think any interest or charges have been added.
The starting balance Vanquis was £250 I think but was increased by over a thousand pounds within a year if I remember correctly current balance £1248
Capital One starting balance was around £550 I guess, current balance £479
Been paying £1 towards these debts monthly for the last few years.
I have other debts that you advised me to ask for a CCA request just waiting to hear back from those 8 creditors.
That’s why I’m wasn’t sure what to be asking for. Ideally I’d like them to admit that I probably shouldn’t have been offered credit and come to an arrangement eg paying 5 or 10% of current balance and having account removed from credit file ?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
The starting balance Vanquis was £250 I think but was increased by over a thousand pounds within a year if I remember correctly current balance £1248
It is VERY unlikely that Vanquis would have offered you a large credit increase if you weren’t paying interest.
Been paying £1 towards these debts monthly for the last few years.
And have they been sold to debt collectors? Have you asked for the CCA statement for these?
Ideally I’d like them to admit that I probably shouldn’t have been offered credit
This is VERY unlikely. lenders don’t have people trying to decide what to do with these complaints. If they accept, you will be offered the standard redress – a refund of interest. If they reject, it has to go to FOS who will say you have to repay what you borrowed with not interest. You may think you are offering a good compromise but that isn’t how these things work,
Bill says
Thankyou Sara
Then I think the best thing to do is also ask for CCA requests from these two. Vanquis is now with Moorcroft & Capital One is with Lowell.
Capital One (Lowell) defaulted Oct 4th 2016
It looks like I started paying towards this debt in Aug 2016 according to payplan
Vanquis (Moorcroft) defaulted May 2nd 2018 – I feel this should have been some time in 2017 as I started paying £1 towards this debt in my DMP starting July/Aug 2017
I think you’re right I probably was paying some interest for the Vanquis card.
Hopefully if the CCA requests aren’t provided I will then negotiate just to be done with it (offering 5-10% of balance and asking for account to be removed)
Sara (Debt Camel) says
oh I would pursue the affordability complaints to the ombudsman as well – it is very likely you have paid interets so any you can get removed will be good if the CCA route doesn’t work. But do this both at the same time – sequentially takes too long.
Bill says
Thanks
Just so I understand it’s worth CCA requests as well as writing the email above to both Vanquis & Capital One as I remember reading that complaints first need to be made to relevant business and then to financial ombudsman if there has been no agreement?
Many thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
yes. And remember the CCA requests go to the current creditor, NOT the original lender. But affordability requests go to the original lender.
Chris T says
Thanks for all of your advice on here Sara. It’s very much appreciated. I have a very similar complaint as above with the FOS. (Credit card limit raised over and over again, 4 cards provided by the same lender, all minimum payments and all maxed yet continued to lend more and more despite my income being very low). The FOS case handler asked for further evidence as above and I sent an email I had received from a payday administrator in 2019. However, the case handler replied saying that “ You mentioned in your submission that you didn’t know you could complain until another provider contacted you, to tell you that they had lent to you irresponsibly and it was the same lending as X, which was why you hadn’t bought your complaint sooner.
There are certain exceptional circumstances that can be considered if a complaint hasn’t been bought in time; however not knowing a complaint can be made or not knowing that time limits apply are not seen as an exceptional circumstance.”
I had understood that this could be exceptional circumstances and that precious cases had set a precedent for this? Any advice would be much appreciated!
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest you reply saying that this decision https://www.financial-ombudsman.org.uk/files/17783/payday-loans_time-limts_final-decision-lender-C.pdf says
“I wasn’t persuaded that Mr H ought reasonably to have made the connection that Lender C might have been responsible for any difficulties he faced in repaying the loans he was complaining about. And so I wasn’t persuaded that Mr H ought reasonably to have been aware of his cause to complain sooner than he actually became aware of this in 2014;
Mr H had complained within three years of becoming aware, or the point at which he ought reasonably to have been aware, of his cause to complain. So we could and should look at Mr H’s complaint about the loans he took in March 2010 and April 2010.”
And you think the same should apply in your case as you were unaware a lender should have checked credit provided was affordable until 2019 and you have complained within 3 years of that.
Say you would like the decision to get referred to an ombudsman if the adjudicator does not change their mind about this.
Chris T says
Thank you Sara – that’s really helpful.
Anton says
Hi Sara
I have had a reply back form very in regards affordability claim. They upheld and my balance went from £956 to £563, gave me back refund admin charge of £48 and a refund interest charged £321. I won’t receive this refund to me, will it just come off what I owe?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
How have they explained the balance reduction?
Do you think this refund is adequate? It depends how much interest you have been paying over the years.
Also are there any missed payments or defaults on your Very credit record? You should Ask for them to be removed.
Anton says
Hi Sara.
The exact wording is ‘having reviewed your account and taking account of all the relevant available information(including the information that you provided within your complaint), we are upholding your complaint from 23rd November 2019 when external data worsened on your credit file. Accordingly, SDFC(Very) will calculate the redress from this date’
Standard interest £321.96
Buy now pay later deferred interest £0
Administration charges £48
Total £369.69
8% simple interest will not be provided in this instance because the interest and charges form part of the outstanding debt which exceeds the redress amount. As you have not actually paid these amounts, you have not been deprived of use of these funds.
I thought when I’m making payments each month I would be paying interest off so why wouldn’t I get this back has a refund back to me?
Anton says
I didn’t open a credit account with them till November 2019 hence why it’s so low. The numbers seem right tbh I just wasn’t sure if when I’m paying each month i would be paying interest so wasn’t sure why I wouldn’t receive that back to me!
Sara (Debt Camel) says
If they are refunding all the interest they charged right from the start, then your account balance should be left at a balance which equals ther amount you borrowed less what you have paid. So you are repaying this without any interest, which is what FOS would say is fair.
Anton says
Ok thanks for clarity Sara.
Lee says
Hi Anton, how long did it take for Very to get back to you from the initial compliant?
Anton says
Hi Lee.
It didn’t take too long, I got the redress letter in less than 4 weeks BUT due to my original complaint not being picked up from May they apologised and said it’s a mistake their end then within 4 weeks my balance reduced and I got the letter breaking down what I have been refunded.
Joanne Trees says
Hi can I ask how you contacted very about complaint I’ve tried loads and no response x
H says
Hi Joanne, I had same issue then used “Resolver” recieved acknowledgement via post and then final response came on the day of the 8th week deadline
A says
Hi. Was just wondering if anyone has had any recent outcomes with barclaycard? I’ve recently put in an irresponsible lending complaint about the increases in credit they gave me over the years. Just prior to this I had a letter saying they were refunding a couple of charges that they shouldn’t have made. Both were over credit limit charges and they must have been some years ago as the interest was over £50 (charges were £12 each). Would this be an indication that they’ve acted irresponsible with their lending also?
Michael says
I complained, and it is now with the FOS, the investigator didn’t uphold, so it’s waiting to be reviewed by the ombudsman. My credit limit went from 3.5k to 17k over the period.
Anton says
I’m awaiting a response too, my complaint went in back in March, I had a reply to say they would investigate the complaint and get back to me
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Hi Anton. that is well over 8 weeks – have you asked them why they haven’t replied? Sent your complaint to the ombudsman?
Anton says
Hi Sara
I haven’t sent to ombudsman yet. I have just sent an email asking why haven’t I had a response or update yet.
They replied on the 10th May, they did state and I quote ‘ Please expect a delay in response as we are working with reduced staffing due to the current global situation. Sorry for the inconvenience caused’
Anita says
Hi Sara,
Some time ago JD Williams has provided my adjudicator with their calculations.
a Interest and Charges £903.72
b 8% interest £41.60
c 20% tax on interest -£8.32
d 8% minus tax £33.28
e Total (a+d) £937.00
As per your suggestion I have asked for the explanation as it seems like the 8% interest looks like exactly 8% of the refund.
Today I have received an email from the adjudicator
The business have provided the below explanation for how the offer was calculated.
‘We’ve recalculated the balance on the account removing all interest and charges from March 2014. From this point onwards the balance is now lower than the actual balance. With the same transaction history (orders and payments) on the account, it is in October 2017 when the account balance goes into credit. From this point onwards, 8% interest is applied to the balance to date.’
Based on everything we have seen we are satisfied that it has been calculated within our guidelines and is correct. If you would like to accept it please let me know and I will instruct the business to make payment.
I am not sure what to do. Please let me know your thoughts
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Did you ask them for a copy of your statements from 2010-2014? because that Interest and charges numbers looks very low. There is no point in arguing about the 8% number until you know the “main” number in the refund is correct.
Anita says
Yes, I did. I was in touch with Head of FS Compliance and as her request my redress was recalculated. I have not received the numbers though.
In that case I must relay on the Adjudicator’s word that ‘Based on everything we have seen we are satisfied that it has been calculated within our guidelines and is correct.’
Maybe I am making a big mistake…
Sara (Debt Camel) says
so are they going to send you the numbers from the statements for the period you are being refunded?
I assume JDW stopped adding interest in 2014?
Anita says
Apparently not. The sdjudicator is propbably already tired of me. And I am tired as well.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Did you ask JDW to send you the statements or the adjudicator?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
If you are just sick of this and want to stop that’s fine.
If you still want them to look at the 8% again, what matters is what happened to the account after March 14. They stopped adding interest and charges?
When did you clear the balance (I am assuming you don’t still owe them money as they haven’t mentioned this?)
Anita says
Thank you Sara. As J JD Williams has only spoken to the Adjudicator I have asked him. I was assured by the head Jjbrown from JDWiliams that it will be recalculated.
My account was sold to Cabot in 2019 and no interests has been added sińce. Nott able to establish whether interest has been stoped before that date.
Like I said. I went through a few years with FOS and do not have other choice than relay on their Word that they aporoved calculations.
Anita says
Hi Sara. I have received a detailed calculation from JDWilliams.
According to the Adjudicator decision ‘ Funds should be refunded along with 8% simple interest* – calculated
from the date of overpayment to the date of settlement’.
What actually is ‘the date of overpayment’??
Looking forward to your advice.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
probably the point at which you don’t owe them money.
David says
Next rejected my complaint it’s now with the FOS despite this:
—————
Our records show your credit limit fluctuated, because of the information we’ve received, in addition to how your NextPay account was managed.
The limit was set at £3000.00 in January 2015 and due to a deterioration in the information we received from Equifax this was reduced to £1000.00 in September 2015. It remained set at this amount until the data changed again in October 2017.
Taking into account the improvement in the data received and the way in which the account had been managed, with no arrears and the balance never exceeding £691.00, we took the decision to offer an increase to £3750.00. At the time you had the option to accept or refuse the increase.
The data continued to improve and in March 2018 we offered to increase your limit to £5,000.00.
Jax says
No response from Very yet. 8 weeks are up within the next week. Logged in today though and my credit limit has decreased. I’m not bothered about that but it does seem strange.
Anth says
It took until around the 9 week mark to see any movement on my accounts, so they’re taking a little longer at present. You should have got an acknowledgement within a week, another letter around the 4 week mark saying they’re still looking into it and one saying things will take probably another fortnight or so just after the 8 week mark.
Michelle says
How did you complaint to very ? I sent a email over 3 weeks ago and had no response what so ever , maybe was wrong email address, anybody know a email for them ?
Thanks
Anth says
I complained via letter (recorded delivery) to their customer excellence team:
The Very Group
Customer Excellence Team
Sandringham House
Sandringham Avenue
Chelmsford
CM92 1LQ
Good luck, awaiting my final calculations at present!
Jax says
Thanks Anth. I have had no communication whatsoever from them since the initial acknowledgment, not even a communication to say they were decreasing my credit limit. I will give them until Monday before referring to the FOS as 8 weeks will have passed by then.
matt says
Thought I would give some encouragement for those complaining about Overdrafts.
Back in 2015 I went from zero overdraft to £5000 in the space of around 3 months, multiple increases, mainly due to gambling. I complained April 2020 and Halifax dismissed it pretty quickly. I sent to the FOS and the investigator agreed with halifax. I felt this wasn’t right and pointed out that since the overdraft increases I had relied on this overdraft facility to meet all my expenditure. This resulted in overdraft charges totalling at least £180 per month. This wasn’t an isolated occurrence and meant the only way I was able to meet my repayments was by relying on the overdraft facility. As this is not a sustainable way to repay debt, I don’t think you should have agreed that this Overdraft facility was in any way affordable for me and requested an Ombudsman look at it.
Anyway last month the Ombudsman agreed with me and this results in £5000 being wiped, and all negative credit marks removed plus another £1330 back to me in redress.
Very very happy!
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Good result – and encouraging for people to learn that an Ombudsman does sometimes overturn an adjudicator decision.
Lee says
This is great. I have just put in a Nationwide complaint back in late Maythat Nationwide rejected and now with. the ombudsman. Nationwide allowed me repeatedly to have high overdrafts then asked me to increase to zero. Then allowed to take out again. This has happened 5 times. And been able to increase around 26 times. My arguement is you are my main bank account can see all the debt, credit cards, payday loans and gambling debt. on 10 years worth of bank statements. You put me on payment plan to get to zero but like 2 or 3 month later allowed me to take again. And this was allowed 5 times. Since July 2010 to present 90% of the time been in a negative balance. My current payment plan to bring my balance down from £2000 to zero has taken me over 2 years already and still £300 to go
Based on frozen overdraft during the payment plan worked out I maybe only entitled to £1240 based on the 10 yearly summary reports obtained before the 8% on top. Worth a shot.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Have any of your communications with Nationwide (ie from you or from them) ever referred to you gambling?
Lee says
No Sara. But am sure when previously in payment plans back in 2015 / 16 they definitely were told over the phone that I had a gambling problem.
I know they asked this for the reason to setup my plan.
I also had a number of loans seperately that I kept topping up and consolidating gambling debt. Haven’t complained about that through just the overdraft.
Would I need to complain seperately about the loans with Nationwide?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I think you should make a single complaint to Nationwide about the loans and the overdraft – knowing about the loans should have made them less willing to increase your overdraft and vice versa.
I suggest you send in a complaint now – adapt the template letter above so it mentions the loans as well and also your gambling problem. Make the point that you have been in your overdraft for 90% of the time since 2010. Say Nationwide failed to spot the woarning signs and stop lending to you, both in the loans and the overdraft. Say you are complaining now because you have only recently found out that a bank should have made affordability checks.
Also send them separately a Subject Access Request (SAR). Ask for details of all your loans and the overdraft, including the affordability and credit checks they made before lending to you each time and the payment plans they set up for the overdraft.
I think it would be a good idea to construct a single timeline of your bank account and the loans, showing what happened and when. This will show if they gave you a loan when you were in a payments arrangement. Or if they allowed you to have an overdraft just after giving you a loan.
Daniel says
Hi Sara
Is there a email address to complain to very/littlewoods ?
Thanks
Lee says
No email to complain to Very. You have to call them lodge the compliant over the phone with them. Is best to write down main points you want them to include in your compliant. I had already wrote out my compliant letter so just got them to note all the points I wanted to raise. Also while doing it request a subject of access request for data they hold.
I complained about 4 weeks ago with very received my SOA 2 weeks ago and just in last 2 days had letter to say they are still investigating and will get back to me shortly.
Is frustrating as wanted to send the complaint letter I already had written out and kept incase need to go to the FOS.
Elle says
I sent my complaint via Resolver and as other folks here can verify they will reply but usually in writing by post… and in my case it was 8 – 10 weeks later, they sent the most info/pages out of all my catalogue company complaints but they didn’t uphold my complaint,.. My case is now with the FOS which I also escalated via Resolver, it’s still with them nearly 2 years on… I’ve sent all my catalogue and bank complaints via Resolver as you can keep a record of everything there and upload copies of letters/statements/other info/proof etc if required. Good luck.
Anita says
Hi Sara. Looking forward to your advice. I have send mu complaint to Littewoods in Nov 2018 and again in April 2020. I have never received any response. Is it sensible to Ask them for response?
Thank you.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest you send them a Subject Access Request by phoning 0800 051 1136 and asking for a copy of all your personal information. That will show if they have responded to your complaints or not.
Anita says
Thank you so much.
Mr and Mrs C says
So finally I have the calculations from JDW – these are the exact same calculations that they gave the FOS over a month ago. Why has it taken so long to give them to me? Delaying tactics. The FOS told them to refund me from March 2008 onwards – JDW have only calculated from Sept 2009 saying they don’t have the information. FOS said that JDW should use what information it does have, and make a reasonable estimate of the refund due and explain its calculations. JDW have just dismissed March2008-Sept 2009. What do I do now? Do I have just to accept that neither party has the information? Obviously my account wasnt cleared over this period as they increased my credit limits from £900 to £2250.00 you wouldnt do that if the account was clear?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
How much have they offered you?
Do you know how much interest they were charging a month in Sept 2009?
Mr and Mrs C says
Hi Sara – they have offered £1984 inc 8% interest less 20% tax. In sept 2009 they have that i was paying £60/month interest on Simply be and £15.87 on Viva la Diva.
I have queried why they havent paid from March 2008.
Their response:-Prior to September 2009, we do not have complete records so what I have done is recreate, where there was enough information available to, a statement and what it could look like with the information we had. I had enough information to recreate back to April 2009 on both accounts to give a line by line breakdown.Prior to this, we had no information but what we do know is the total amount of interest you’ve paid on your accounts over their lifetime. For C3732994, the total amount is £291.24 and for G3477508, it is £838.93.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest you ask for copies of the statements they have “recreated” and for copies of all the other statements.
Without this, you can’t see if what they have done is reasonable or not.
Mr and mrs c says
Thank you I will do that.
Anth says
Got my final cheques today, so just to run through my story and to encourage people to keep at it! I followed the instructions via Debt Camel and sent a letter via recorded delivery complaining of irresponsible lending back in the middle of May. I had a SAR from a while back due to a separate complaint about default dates being incorrect a number of years ago, so this was handy in determining credit increases and account balances.
I received a confirmation letter and complaint reference from Very a week or so later, a follow up saying they’re still looking into it at 4 weeks and a further one at 8 weeks saying it’ll take a little longer. A week or two after that I received a letter upholding my complaints against 3 different accounts with IsMe, Very and Littlewoods.
Redress ended up totalling £18,643.60 across all three accounts, and taking off the remaining balance from Lowells I’ve received cheques last week totalling £17,686.33. I absolutely cannot thank this site enough for the guidance it provides, and also to all those who’ve commented with their successes, failures and problems. The information was absolutely invaluable in getting to where I am, and the money will go toward paying off the vast majority of my outstanding debt, with the remainder being a much, much more manageable amount. I don’t think I could’ve ever imagined being in the situation I’m now in, all thanks to a few hours and the cost of a stamp!
Lee says
Congrats Anth. I’m hope I get a big payout like you. Only problem I have is it’s currently only £470 outstanding balance and £500 limit at present due to a gambling win about 18 months ago so I paid a lot back plus reduced the limit at the time. Was £4200 limit at its highest and purchased lots of high cost items to sell to cex to fund gambling addiction and pay my payday loans and other debts as was in a constant debt trap paying 1 off with another. Been very silly in past. Believe about 26 limit increases in total. My soa was 137 pages long which I will be honest haven:t gone through fully as difficult to follow it and calculate the interest paid from it. Not very clear.
I had the account since summer 2015. If I got paid anything £1500 or above will be delighted as want to clear and close this very account and get rid of my JD Williams account for good. Which Im about to complain about but not holding out hope of getting anything back from that one.
Jax says
Very have rejected my complaint saying they did checks and I didn’t use my full credit limit. Oh well, off to the FOS I guess.
NICO says
Had some news from Capital One today – FoS upheld my compliant, there was some negotiation but finally go c£500 written off, c£1100 refund and credit file update in 6 – 8 weeks. Thanks Sara for the help on this, keep going everyone :).
Lee says
Hi Sara,
Need some assistance complained about Aqua Card about 6 weeks ago had the account since 2012. Around 2017 they raised my credit limit from £1250 to £4200. I complained I never should of had a limit so high, due to gambling, payday debts etc they did reduce my interest rate as told them I was struggling in 2017. In 9 year’s still hovering on just under £4200 owing. I also have a marbles card with New Day with £250 limit I hadn’t complained about.
I had just logged on to my app.
Noticed my Marbles card app I didn’t complain about has been credited 3 credits of £293 & £240 & £736.41 on 9/8/21. They have closed the card and credit showing of £1031.90. Looks like credits still pending.
Meanwhile on my Aqua Card I have been credited just 1 amount of £994.13 reducing that card to £3,164.09 owing. They closed the account.
I was expecting aqua card credits to be significantly more. I didn’t expect them to look at the marbles card. Haven’t had a final response letter or accepted anything?
What does this mean? Do you think they are still working on my Aqua card side? Does it mean I will get any money back? Do I still owe £3,164.09 on my Aqua card? Do I have any right to appeal of don’t agree with the final response now
As not accepted anything. Very confused considering Aqua credits would of been much more than Marbles.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I think you need to ask them for the response to your complaint. It’s hard to guess what has happened and there isn’t any point – find out. Also why didn’t you complain about the. marbles card – was the limit in that increased?
Lee says
Hi Sara.
As Marbles was only a £250 limit all the time I’ve had it didn’t complain. Didn’t realise it was new day either.
My Aqua card went from £1250 in 2012 to £1750 around 2014 then to £4200 about 2016 / 17. Always been only £50 from my outstanding balance for at least 5/6 years. Have paid £70 min payments and then withdrawn cash virtually every single month incurring charges to pay other debts. As was on a reduced rate of interest pay about £27 as told them I couldn’t afford the high interest rates back in 2016/2017 when they went through my income and expenditure but they didn’t freeze the account.
For about 12 months after they raised it to £4200 before I said I was struggling they were taking a min payment of about £130; of which about £80 taken up in interest each month. Then you have all the £12 overlimit fees and cash withdrawal fees each month that I did ask in my complaint to also be included in any refund plus a further 8% simple interest.
I kind of am hoping they are still working on calculating my Aqua Card. Am thinking surely they would apply the credits refund to correct cards.
I am thinking I should just leave it a week or so. Keep checking my Aqua Card balance and hope before contacting them if no final response received.
I just wonder if I don’t agree with the calculation that I can still go to the ombudsman. As I haven’t accepted any redress they have applied.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
were you in the habit of withdrawing cash before they increased your card limit in 16/17?
I think you should get a full refund of fees and charges from that 16/17 credit limit increase. And if there is a remianing balance you should be allowed to pay that off interest free at an affordable monthl amount.
If if they offer you an amount which you think sounds low, ask them for copies of all your statements since 2016/17 so you can go through and see what you were charged.
It’s not worth worrying about which account they credit a refund to – you don’t have the full picture at the moment and anyway any credi can bemoved to a different account if you want. What matters is the total refund tyou are offered and whether this is adequate.
Yes you can go to FOS if you don’t think what you have been offered is enough.
Lee says
Thanks Sara. The marbles credit of £1031 I will use if need be to reduced the Aqua further. I’m definitely not touching it at all till I know what’s going on. But your right don’t know final response. However the Aqua card redress is very low in comparison to marbles on the face of it at the moment.
I would just be happy if the end result is enough to clear my aqua card my biggest credit card debt of the lot. Will take a huge pressure off me.
yes always withdrawn cash before the £4200 limit increase in 2016/17. I know I have been very silly financially in the past. I just want to get debt free and never gamble again. Your amazing site and others given me the push to sort my debt problems out once and for all.
Lee says
Hi All, Anyone know JD Williams email address to complain? .Just writing up this complaint letter now. Thanks Lee.
Elle says
Hi Lee,
I used Resolver for all of my catalogue complaints,.. including JD William, they will reply in writing (by post) normally,…easy to use and you can upload info/images/proof/notes etc to keep track of everything and upload and pass on further info if/when requested.. and you can also escalate directly to the FOS from there too should you need to later … like many of us have…and who are still awaiting final outcomes 2 years on…. Good luck. :)
Lee says
The Very one also in. I wasn’t going to bother with JD Williams due to everyone saying it’s long winded with them and in really busy I’m week with work. Git this week off though so trying to spend a bit of time getting these jobs done.
Lee says
Hi Sara getting a lot done today. My nationwide complaint I did the other week was purely related to my overdraft. They rejected it and it’s been submitted to to FOS about 4 weeks now.
I am thinking of going back to Nationwide and complaining about my consolidated loans. I had about 5 loans consolidated due to gambling debts time and time again. Should I raise it as a seperate compliant then when likely rejected as the FOS to link the 2 nationwide complaints together. I don’t hold much evidence regarding my loans now so would have to get Nationwide to provide further details. Loans were from around 2010 to about late 2016 / early 2017 I think
The loans were around 10k each time. After 2 years or so I would ask for a new loan to top up funding gambling addiction.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
yes a separate complaint now.
Use the template letter over here https://debtcamel.co.uk/refunds-large-high-cost-loans/.
Add to that template letter that Nationwide could also see your finances from your current account where they could see the gambling and kept increasing your credit limit.
Michelle says
Hi Sara , capital one rejected my complaint today stating this
Please note, your initial credit limit on your first account was £500. It was then increased to £1500 on 2 April 2013 and then to £1750 on 28 January 2014.
You also haven’t provided any explanation or evidence, which suggests that this complaint has been made within 3 years of you becoming aware that you had cause to complain about the lending decisions taken.
What evidence of finding out complaining was a option am I meant to show them ?
Their only reasons for reject is that it’s too late
This is because we believe part of this complaint has been made outside the time limits for referral to the Financial Ombudsman Service, as are set out in more detail below and in the FCA Handbook, DISP 2.8.2R.
Specifically, the complaint was referred to us more than 6 years after your accounts were opened on 24 October 2012, 29 May 2014, and when your limit was last extended on your first account ending (1397) to £2000 on 26 November 2014.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
go back to them and say when and how you became aware of these affordability complaints.
eg I didn’t know that a credit card lender was supposed to check a higher limit was affordable for me before offering it. In 2020 [or whenever] I saw a newspaper article in the Sun/an advert on Facebook for payday loan refunds/a friend said they had had an affordability refund/whatever. I made some loan affordability complaints and then I did some research and found out this also applied to credit card lending. So I am complaining to you within 3 years of having found out that I have cause to complain which is within the DISP rules that cover FOS’s time limits. I would like you to look again at my complaint or I will be sending it to FOS.
But change the date and how you found out so it is really accurate for you.
Katrina says
Hi there,
I am looking for help for my husband, he took out a loan from Tesco 3/4years ago, which was for 25k. At that point in time he was having a breakdown, he lost his job and was on antidepressants, he had late payments and not certain but possibly defaults on other accounts, and had taken out a few credit cards around the same time. Anyway, it wasn’t long before he defaulted and missed payments, he has a payment arrangement with them and is paying a debt collector (I believe it is moorcroft) a low amount monthly. But I really believe it was irresponsible lending. He didn’t have to provide any details of employment or affordability, so I’M trying to help him get his finances in order, do we stand a chance with irresponsible lending claim? They have added nearly 7k in charges onto the debt amount.
Do they take current circumstances into account or is it actually, they shouldn’t have lent him that money full stop. I don’t want to risk opening a can of worms if they are going to say, actually you can afford to pay more now.
Hope that makes sense.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I hope he is on the road to recovery – getting his finances sorted out may help with this.
That was a huge loan – what was it for?
What has happened to the credit card accounts, were any of the balances he was given large? If thye were, then they too could be “unaffordable”.
His current circumstances are not relevant to whether this was an unaffordable loan.
Could he afford to pay more? Does he have payment arrangements with the cards and other debts?
Are you buying or renting?
Max says
Hi Sara,
Just sharing my story so far about NewDay, as an FOS adjudicator ruled in my favour a few days ago about my irresponsible lending complaints for Marbles and Aqua credit cards dating back several years.
I feel they will almost certainly appeal as the combined refunds would be over £10,000, hence I’d be surprised if it doesn’t end up on the desk of an Ombudsman who might take a different view.
Over two years they implemented a series of credit limit increases on both cards, one limit jumped by nearly 400% in just five months to more than £3,500, the other rocketed over 350% in a year to more than £5,000. I complained in late 2020 and NewDay rejected (of course) my arguments, so off it went to the FOS.
They assessed all the info in a little under two weeks, in the reasoning for their decision they noted multiple times that NewDay failed to carry out any sort of proportionate affordability checks whatsoever, relying on information that was many years out of date. They also said several thousands of pounds of payday loans should have set alarm bells ringing, as should my permanent presence in a £3,000 overdraft and the fact I was on a DMP through PayPlan.
I had expected the adjudicator to also highlight scores of gambling transactions, but they made no reference to that whatsoever.
Max
Max says
In case anyone is unaware, the FOS publishes all Ombudsman-level decisions on its website, and I’ve garnered a lot of valuable information from other people’s complaints (upheld and not upheld) about what factors I should highlight/gloss over should my complaint be appealed (which I’m sure it will looking at posts on this lengthy thread).
That said, it does seem to be the luck of the draw very often, as there are many parallels among the cases that are won or lost.
I did notice in some cases the FOS has awarded “compensation” for stress, anxiety and inconvenience (among other health/well-being issues. As such, I intend to try and secure such an award (say, £500-750) from NewDay as their irresponsible lending has caused a substantial number of sleepless nights and stress/worry within my household for several years.
Sara, any thoughts on the compensation angle? While refunds and 8% simple interest are great, surely the “guilty” party should not get away with their damaging lending activities without actually receiving a tangible penalty? You never know, if such compo was more common and bottom lines hit harder, it might be more of a deterrent?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
The problem with FOS published decisions is they are often (but nit always) the unusual ones, not the many run of the mill cases which are settled at the adjudicator level. So if a lender routinely accepts standard adjudicator decisions, which many do, you only see the more difficult cases.
I agree getting compensation for stress etc is a bit of a lottery. But the purpose if FOS us not to punish bad behaviour but to compensate for loss. The best deterrent is fir a lot more people to make complaints when they were given unaffordable credit and to take the case to the Ombudsman if the lender rejects. The redress plus the standard Ombudsman fee will far outweigh any extra awards for stress.
Mike_p says
I’m not sure they take much notice of what you right, just see it’s an affordability complaint and deal with it in the same way as the other 500 they are looking at.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
That is definitely what a lot of lenders do.
But FOS do tend to read what you write and id you say you would like compensation for something then they may say No but they aren’t likely to ignore it.
Lee says
Hi Max,
Just dealing with New Day. Still waiting for the final response as I haven’t accepted anything, but so far on the 6 week mark they have already refunded me around £2280 for 4 seperate payments as noted a few days above on the posts.
For new day I had to send my complaint in the post, (To Aqua Credit cards website complaint address) unlike most others sent via email. I posted copies of evidence with bank statements at key points when credit card taken out and a few around any limit increases etc to give them further snapshot of your finances at the time. I also think this demonstrates you are serious about taking it to the FOS as you have put in a lot of evidence. I also sent them a photo of my TransUnion report that I said I’m keeping incase needed for the FOS as holds around 120 pages of credit report debt history with over 1000 payday loans, credit cards, loans etc.
Good luck with your complaint.
Max says
Thanks Sara, and Lee, for the feedback – glad to hear NewDay are treating the latter better than moi.
They overwhelmingly rejected my two complaints fairly quickly, some of what they wrote in their justification was ridiculous, to be frank.
They’ve got until mid-September to contest the decision from the adjudicator, but my gut feel is they will given it’s a potential five figure refund, and because there were half a dozen increases, so I even if they successfully argue one or two of them were right, they would see that as a “win”.
I will ask for compo in this case and various others (I have double-digit claims in the FOS system) as have nothing to lose by doing so.
I could do with the money ASAP (still paying about £400/month off the two – now suspended – cards) so hope any appeal/escalation to Ombudsman doesn’t drag. I note NewDay Ombudsman decisions contained in their website search function are 422 upheld, 488 not upheld….
Will update this thread in due course.
Cheers,
Max
Max says
Hi Sara,
Despite the adjudicator’s best efforts, this is going to be dragged out even further as it’s now going to be decided by an Ombudsman.
NewDay rejected all the adjudicator’s arguments in an extremely long defence (so I’m told) so I’m not surprised, but disappointed, at the outcome.
Based on my experiences with them to date, they appear to be an exceptionally nasty company to deal with.
I’ll update the thread in due course, but have been warned it could be a long wait for a final ruling.
Scott says
Hi Sarah,
Good news the adjudicator upheld my complaint with likely loans. All interest has been removed and they have been told to remove it from my credit file. The balance was £3600 and has now been reduced to £1300. I couldn’t have done this without your help. The adjudicator was really nice.
My HSBC complaint has now been picked up by the adjudicator and he has contacted me saying he has all the info from HSBC and has started working on my complaint. I wish i had the same adjudicator but I am just hoping he is fair. I am hoping that he agrees that HSBC were irresponsible as I explained to him that my bank at the time refused a £100 overdraft due to my poor credit score, live defaults and that I was in a payday loan cycle along with numerous other debts all on payment plans.
Surely that now I have won the claim against likely loans I have a good chance with them one that amounts to 10k loan 14.6k with interest, 2k overdraft and 1.5k credit card that’s been on payment plan 2 months after given. Plus when I got all of this credit I had more debt and creditors than I did before I got accepted for the likely loans.
Ams says
Can I ask how long it took the adjudicator to reach this decision? I am also waiting for them to make a decision on my likely loan. Thanks
Scott says
I made the complaint in October 2020. The adjudicator picked it up in April and I received response in July. Likely Loans accepted in August
Sharon says
Hi Sarah
Has anyone had a Lloyds overdraft complaint, where it has been upheld by the ombudsman but Lloyds drag their heels in paying out?
Thanks
Sharon
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I don’t remember anyone mentioning this. When was the ombudsman’s final decision?
Sharon says
It has only been a week, but I was wondering if anyone else has had dealings with Lloyds before?
Ali says
I’m waiting for adjudicator to be allocated since last October for my natwest one…but had an update a few weeks ago to say it could be a few months at least yet as they have a specialist team now for overdraft ones so hopefully hear again by Christmas!
Chris says
I would appreciate some advice on my complaint with JDWilliams. On June 1st, the Adjudicator let me know that JDW had accepted his ruling – they took 14 weeks to do this. He gave them 4 weeks to be in touch. It is now nearly 11 weeks on. JDW have told me that they have made a calculation but that they are waiting for the debt collection agency currently running the debt to let them know the balance. They told me this 4 weeks ago. I have been in touch with them twice since to ask about progress but am told that we need to wait for the figure. Is there anything I can now do to get this sorted? Can I ask the Adjudicator to send it to an Ombudsman so that I can get a legally enforceable ruling? At this stage, the complaint has taken 2 1/2 years already so I think I am now ready to wait if needs be. Thanks.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
if you ask for it to go to an Ombudsman they may just stop work on the calculation – it’s not clear this will actually speed things up ay all :(
Mr and Mrs C says
Chris, I waited 6 months for my refund, once the FOS had made their decision, which I have finally got last Friday. I emailed my adjudicator every 2 weeks to chase it, rang JDW every 2 weeks to chase it. I finally emailed chris.rothwell@nbrown.co.uk; sarah.brown@nbrown.co.uk and copied in consumer.queries@fca.org.uk. The query was resolved within 2 weeks of me doing this. They only refund by cheque too, which is annoying as I then had a 20 mile round trip to bank it, but its finally over. I urge anyone who is waiting to email these 3 addresses and keep the pressure on.
chris says
Thank you so much – these addresses are really helpful. Glad you have finally got yours sorted – I know it’s been a long one :)
Franky says
Hi, I have been on benefits for a few years, I recently applied for credit cards telling them I was self employed,they never done any checks. I now owe about £2000 over 5 cards. They have increased my limits but the cards arnt maxed out yet. Could I complain that I shouldn’t have been given these cards? I can just about afford minimum payments
Sara (Debt Camel) says
So for each of they cards, what was your initial limit? And what has it been raised too? Eg Card 1 £250 now £500.
Have you ever made more than the minimum payment? How soon did they increase the limit?
Do you have other debts as well? Loans, catalogues, car finance, behind with bills?
frank mcdonnell says
Most limits were 250 or 300, increased to 1200 some up to 1500. Increases within a few months. Mostly minimum payments but sometimes I borrowed money by paying with card then paying more than minimum back from my benefits
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I think you could reasonably complain that the original low limits were fair but they did not check properly that you could afford the larger limits. Point out that your credit record will have showed that you had taken out a lot of credit recently when they were increasing your limits.
BUT what other debts do you have at the moment? Are you still on benefits? An affordability complaint is not always your best option.
frank mcdonnell says
Am still on benefits, have an overdraft at about 950 and a morses loan, owe about 500. What would my complaint be if it wasnt affordability?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I think that sounds like a lot of debt if you are on benefits.
If you have had several loans from Morses, you can make an affordabilty complaint to them to: https://debtcamel.co.uk/refund-doorstep-loans/.
But while complaints go through, you need to get yourself into a safe financial situation so you aren’t paying out more than you can afford. I suggest you talk to StepChange on 0800 138 1111 about a debt management plan. If you win all the affordabilti complaints these will be paid off MUCH faster! So it’s in addition to the complaints, you don’t have to choose a DMP or complain.
Credit card complaints very often have to go to the ombudsman and take a long while to get sorted. In a DMP interest will be frozen. And that will apply to your overdraft too.
Sam says
So, an odd one from Littlewoods.
End of June I submitted affordability complaints on my Very and Isme accounts. It took them around 3 weeks to agree it was irresponsible and wiped the balances totalling 12k. A huge win.
At the time, I just presumed that my Littlewoods account would be included in this. Obviously it wasn’t, so 21st July I submitted the same complaint to Littlewoods.
The account was opened after the Very and Isme ones, which I had maxed out and was making minimum payments on. Couple that with an outrageous amount of credit and it was a bad situation.
So my presumption was that given the positive results for the other two accounts, this would be a formality which would take them a week or two.
Not so, had the obligatory 4 week letter saying they need more time, last week.
So the point of all that waffle, really, was what are people’s experience of Littlewoods/ am I wrong in thinking that this complaint should also be upheld?
Cheers for any feedback.
Als says
Hi Sarah
I’m submitted my very complaint to the obundsman ( I only received a partial refund, even though they had clearly not checked my credit file from the start) only about 2/3 weeks ago, they came back today and asked old and current address as the company (very) we’re querying it?
So my question is, is that what they do contact the company to ask what went on? Before making a decision, I expected to wait months for a reply, is this just the initial start up of it?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
The Ombudsman (know as FOS as it’s shorter) will tell the lender when someone makes a complaint and ask for their case file. If the address you gave FOS is now what Very have on their records, then that needs be cleared up, it’s just housekeeping at the start.
Once FOS have been sent the case file by Very, you will be in a queue to be picked up by an adjudicator who will actually look at the case.
Matt says
Hi Sarah
By any chance do you know of a way of emailing Barclaycard? I had a complaint rejected by them but now have new evidence which I think will change their decision.
I’m unable communicate over phone. They have disabled their messaging system and the mobile chat just says to call them or write in. (I don’t have a printer).
Thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Try jo.woodman@barclayscorp.com. But you will have to explain why you can’t talk on the phone (anxiety or whatever) and why you can’t write a letter.
It may be simpler to send the case to the Ombudsman….
Dave R says
I have a Lloyds overdraft complaint with the FOS that they’ve had since December 2020. Repeatedly told I would have a case handler very soon and then just nothing. They emailed me about a month ago to say they envisaged it being another 3-4 months. Apparently, they are overloaded with complaints like mine and have changed the way they review them. They are re-reviewing historic cases under new guidelines which will apparently help inform how they view current complaints… I hope after such a long wait it will be good news!
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I have seen some good FOS decisions on overdraft complaints recently: https://www.financial-ombudsman.org.uk/files/308265/DRN1491178.pdf
Max says
Hi Sara,
Just had a read of that decision, and many others relating to overdrafts, on the FOS website. This has reinforced my view that I have a strong case versus Halifax.
I complained a few weeks ago about my £2,500 overdraft and also my packaged bank account (PBA) [Ultimate Reward] – they rejected the PBA one in just a few days, but didn’t give any explanation whatsoever as to why.
The overdraft one must still be in their system, but I quoted them text from their website that says an arranged overdraft can act as a “short term safety net”. Well, their definition of short-term must be different to mine, as I’ve been stuck in it for 11-12 years, during which time they more than doubled the limit, and raised the charges.
I don’t know how far back I can go with the overdraft fee claim (six years probably, but hopefully more). I’ll wait for their letter (which I’m sure will be a rejection) and then get the FOS involved yet again. Imagine it will be a very long wait, but at least no chance of them going bust…
Ali says
Hi Dave
Yes they advised me the same with my natwest overdraft one they’ve had since last October :( I guess we will be looking at Christmas time now…
Good luck
Sharon says
Hi Dave
My complaint with Lloyds has been with the ombudsman since March 2020, and I have just had the final decision which is in my favour I am now waiting for Lloyds to agree, it is driving me mad after so long, but they are right in saying that there is a back log.
Good luck
Dave R says
Thanks Sharon and thanks Ali – fingers crossed for all. Appreciate you sharing the link Sarah, will have a read!
Wester says
Hi,
I just wanted to say thanks- I complained to capitol one about credit limit increases (from £200 in 2015 to £2750 in 2016). I did have a history of payday loans, returned direct debits and always in my overdraft.
Capitol One initially rejected my complaint.
The FOS investigator has upheld my complaint and recommended I am refunded all interest, fees and charges since 2015!! I am over the moon, especially as I only paid off my credit card earlier this year. Fingers crossed capital one agree and it doesn’t have to go to the ombudsman.
I’ll update with actual refund if it comes through.
NICO says
Fingers crossed for you here – I have heard and with mine included, C1 normally just accept the final decision – hope this happens for you, keep us posted.
Jax says
Hi Sara, I wondered if you could give me your view please. Many years ago (around 2000) I took out an MBNA credit card. It was sold on to a debt collector and I finally settled it in around 2014. The default shows on an old credit report I have from 2016. In 2017 MBNA approved me for a credit card again with a limit of circa £5k. I’ve since defaulted on that too and again it’s been sold on. I’m wondering whether it’s worth putting in an irresponsible lending complaint based on my previous relationship with them. My credit file at the time showed the previous MBNA default, a payment arrangement with Barclaycard (that had been paid off in 2016), a catalogue, a 5k loan and an overdraft that I was continually using.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I think a 5k credit record is large. Was it affordable at that time? MBNA should have checked it was regardless of the previous credit record. Being in your overdraft continuously suggests that you were in trouble at that point.
Jax says
Thanks Sara. It wasn’t affordable at the time. I had a gambling addiction.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Were they aware from your previous account that you had a gambling problem?
Jax says
I can’t remember Sara. I don’t think so. I was too embarrassed to tell them to be honest.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
ok, well 5k is still a very large limit and as you had had problems before, I think you can argue that they should have looked more closely.
Jax says
Thanks again Sara. Credit file shows another credit card maxed out plus cash withdrawals (usually online gambling), always in my overdraft, etc. I have to thank you for your tireless support and the encouragement of others on here. You have given me strength and hope when circumstances have been very challenging.
Lee says
Hi Sara.
New day have finally provided a final response letter today in it respect to my Aqua and Marbles card.
In relation to Marbles side they refunded 3 payments of £293 in cash advance fees, £240 in overlimit fees and £736.41 in interest charges. This is 100% since 7/6/16 when opened. I am happy with this.
The Aqua side however was opened on 10/7/12.
Limits increased
Oct 2012 – £250 to £600
Feb 2013 – £600-£1000
May 2014 – £1000 to £1750
Dec 2014 – £1750 – £2500
June 2016 – £2500-£3400
Feb 2017 – £3400-£4200
They said June 2016 the limit increase to £3400 was not suitable for me. As I had recently exited a payment plan and data suggests I had another payment plan with another creditor.
I was credited £12 of 1 late payment fee and a proportionate interest refund of £994.13.
This is the amount of interest you have paid as a result of the credit limit increase. Interest would of always been chargeable on the previous credit limit. And why they are stating they are not giving me a full refund of all interest on the aqua card. Bit confused by this.
Then in relation to 8% simple interest on top. New day state not applicable in this scenario.
They also won’t make any amendments to my credit file.
Sara I feel the Aqua side refund is extremely low due to proportional interest. What do you think?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Do you think the increase to £2500 was affordable?
and what negative marks are there on the credit record for this?
Lee says
Sara, I don’t think £2500 was affordable. I understand this 6 year rule might mean I cannot go past this time so am ok with this.
But in late 2015 to 2016 I was struggling to make payments. My payday loans started around 2016 though and serious gambling issues, debt etc.
I just don’t this this proportionate amount. How can the marbles balance with a much lower credit limit get paid out 100%. But my Aqua doesn’t. I also don’t get why I can’t have the 8% on top. They said it was because I was paying a reduced rate of interest to the typical amount.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I don’t think the proportionate refund is reasonable.
Aqua could argue that if you had been charged interest on the lower balance, then the extra credit above that limit should be interest free.
But this is NOT what results if they give you a “proportionate refund” – because when there is an interest free tranche, all your payments should have been going to pay off the part that interest was charged on. So every month the part that interest is charged on gets less much fasted and the interest charged should drop even more.
If Aqua want to do that complication it is complicated and it will produce a MUCH higher refund to you than giving you a proportion of the interest back.
You won’t get 8% paid on top while you still owe them money – you cant work that out until the basic refund calcuation is correct.
FOS may well decide that you can go back further than 6 years. In addition to the “6 year rule” they can also look at cases where someone has complained within 3 years of becoming aware they had cause for complaint.
You could just decide to send the case to FOS now and argue for a refund from an earlier point, and for it not to be “proportionate and for your credit record to be cleaned.
If you want to try to reach a compromise with Aqua, I have no idea if they will listen to you. You could say suggest that if you send the case to FOS they will probably look further back than 6 years, but you would be happy with to settle now for a full refund of all interest after June 2016 in the interest of a speedy resolution.
Lee says
Sara,
I think I might go back to Aqua stating if you give me a full interest refund on June 2016 onwards. Plus you give me the cash advance fees for the 79 cash advances I’ve had since June 2016 as noted from my credit report. I will settle this matter now.
In total I reckon this could be another 3k which will basically clears the aqua card remaining balance. I will them be able to use the 1k credit on my Marbles to clear my JD Williams catalogue balance and close it.
If they don’t agree I will state I will go to the FOS ask them to consider going back further than 6 years and the additional 8%. Does this sound ok?
They state if you don’t agree I will seek the FOS looking at back further than 6 years and ask them to consider the 8% aswell.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
That’s sounds a fair compromise to me – whether Aqua will agree or not I have no idea.
Lee says
Just checked Aqua on hard copy TransUnion report. 79 cash advances taken out since June 2016 to May 2021. No cash advance fees paid back for that I took some large cash amounts out of £870 / £760 in
May 16 / June 16. But Marbles cash advance fees paid back. So think I should request this.
The credit report for aqua all showing ok or 0 on payment / account status but was paying reduced interest rate during this time since 2016. Is that why I cannot apply the 8% simple interest?
I want to argue the portionate amount based on Marbles being a much lower limit. It was actually reduced from £600 to £250 for at least past few years. Marbles reduced it not me.
Lee says
Sara, In addition to above they have closed both accounts but said nothing about freezing further interest to pay any remaining balance off my aqua card.
Also the £1031 credit now on my marbles card if I transfer to my bank account will that be deemed as acceptance and will then mean I cannot the aqua side to the FOS?
Need your advice.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I think you need to decide if you accept their offer before working out what to do.
Lee says
Sara, I am definitely not settling. I am just working out if should go straight to FOS or counter offer like discussed yesterday saying go back to June 2016 after refund 100% interest from that date to present and also pay me the 79 cash advance fees during this time.
However I have been reviewing my SOA file they sent me. It has around 470 pages.
I can see in late 2014 I started to struggle and in May / June 2015 I was really struggling and told Aqua I was in financial difficulty with the repayments which I said we’re too high, they then acknowledged this in about 4 letters around that date. They still raised my limit to £3400 and £4200 after this time despite being on a reduced interest rate of 12% due to telling them this to present. I also see they didn’t fill in the income and expenditure forms that I went through at the time on the phone.
So I do think on the Aqua they should really go back to May / June 2015 when it was quite apparent they failed me.
I also want them to freeze the interest until this matter is settled.
Then in respect to the Marbles Card 1k credit should I just leave this alone until the Aqua card is resolved or can I get it transferred to my bank now? I am happy with the marbles calculations. I just want to know me doing this doesn’t mean I’ve settled and stops me going to the FOS or counter offering.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
told Aqua I was in financial difficulty with the repayments which I said we’re too high, they then acknowledged this in about 4 letters around that date.
Then you have a good case saying they should have frozen interest from that point. And certainly not later increased your limit! Nor should them be trying this “proportional refund”. Mention all this in your request for a review.
You may as well make an offer to settle if you would be happy with that amount and if interest is frozen without it hitting your credit record – say the case goes to FOS in a week if they do not respond.
The Marbles question – I don’t think there is a clear answer.
Ams says
Hi Sara, I’ve had a response from barclaycard saying they have not upheld my complaint. They have stated that they done the correct checks and that there was no information on my credit file to say I couldn’t afford the increases and that my payment history reflected this (mostly paid minimum payments apart from few times I borrowed from family to pay lump sums). My question is though, would the fact that I’ve lived in my overdraft (with barclays) for the last ten years not show that barclaycard acted irresponsibly?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Have you been continuously in your overdraft – rarely in the black? Or do you just mean that you have used your overdraft every month, getting back into the black on payday?
(Apart from your Barclaycard complaint, you may have a good complaint about your overdraft…)
How much was your Barclaycard increased and how often?
How often did you make lump sum payments and did they ever clear the card?
Ams says
I was continuously in overdraft, never getting out of it. Barclaycard started at £3000 in 2010 and went up and down throughout the years (one point to £8000) cleared the card once and made maybe 2 or 3 lump payments. It currently is now back at £3000 which is now the limit
Sara (Debt Camel) says
How large was the overdraft and was this limit increased during the 10 years?
You may well be able to win a complaint about the overdraft even if the limit wasn’t increased, but if it was, that would make the complaint even stronger.
Here is a FOS decision on a NatWest overdraft https://www.financial-ombudsman.org.uk/files/290226/DRN5869499.pdf. FOS doesn’t operate a “precedent” system, so you can’t assume that will mean you will win a complaint about your overdraft, but it shows the way FOS is thinking about these sort of cases. (It’s a very long decision – FOS only writes a small number of these, where it wants the lender to pay particular attention as the points crop up in other cases as well.)
I suggest you go back to Barclaycard and point out you were always in your overdraft for 10 years. Say this shows you were reliant on credit to meet everyday living expenses. Ask them to review their Barclaycard decision as they should have taken into account everything they knew about your financial situation which included your overdraft usage.
Also say you also want to complain that they failed to monitor your overdraft usage and should have offered you help with this and you would also like to request a refund of overdraft fees charged.
Ams says
Sorry I have another question! I had a successful complaint with very from an account that I finished paying in 2018 that finished on a debt management payment plan. They then gave me another account in 2019 with initial limit of £2000 that quickly went up to £2500. I don’t feel that they should have given me this second account and not sure if I should complain about this one too? Thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
You didn’t mention this account in your first complaint? And Very did not mention it in their reply?
Ams says
No it wasn’t mentioned by either of us. They only went on the previous account number.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
then send them a complaint!
chris says
Update on J D Williams: the final one? I have today received the figures for redress having first complained in May 2019. Thanks to Debt Camel and the other people on here who have posted about JDW, the use of the senior people’s email addresses magically got the ball rolling. I am promised a cheque in the next 14 days. The figures on the 8% interest do not look right though and I should appreciate it if anyone could take a look below and explain them.
Redress amount: £2351.04
8% interest £127.99
The Adjudicator asked for all interest and charges to be refunded since October 22nd 2013 and for 8% simple interest to be added.
I will not be disputing or rejecting the amount btw. It has taken too long to get this far and the money will genuinely help me.
Thanks. Chris.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Is there a current balance? If not, when was it cleared? If there is, how much are you paying them every month?
chris says
Hi yes – There is a balance of £825.49 in a DMP. I pay £6.66 a month from the plan.
Jay says
Hi Sara, I’ve made an affordability complaint to HSBC regarding a credit card opened in 2012. The complaint outlines the level of borrowing I had at this time with other creditors, including additional accounts held with HSBC including a loan and overdraft (which I was always in). HSBC have dismissed the complaint on grounds that they did the appropriate checks. I have now been assigned an investigator with FOS.
I am about to embark on a high % mortgage as it’s my only option for a house purchase, if this case wins I could have my CCJ removed and go to a high st lender (it’s the only adverse thing on my credit file).
The investigator wants to know when I was made aware I had cause for complaint, since 2012 is outside the 6 year time scale. I only found out on this website that it was an option but am not certain how to word this back to her.
I was also one of the people who received a cheque this year as part of operation “eagle” by HSBC refunding interest and charges, but coincidentally received this a few days after I had sent the complaint. The call with HSBC also suggested that these cheques were sent as HSBC failed to freeze interest/charges to help their customers at the time. Therefore, I am hoping I have a stronger case since they have admitted they didn’t freeze them when they should have done, the balance grew as a result, the card wasn’t manageable and later a CCJ was applied as it simply was not affordable. Any advice greatly appreciated.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
If you can postpone the mortage application until this complaint is resolved at FOS, you could possibly get a much better mortgage rate.
How did you come across this website? Did you read an article about affordability for loans and that made you wonder about your credit card? Did a friend or family member tell you they had had a refund?
When you say you were always in your overdraft, was that always in the red, never back in the black even on payday? or
Jay says
Hi Sara, it’s quite late in the day to postpone the mortgage application, received the MOS today. I raised this case in Feb, forwarded to FOS and I’ve been assigned an investigator now. I thought it might take longer.
I was researching how to buy a home with a CCJ. I’d paid all my debts off (even the CCJ) I used this site as I was researching how to get a default removed. The default had been applied years later after the account defaulted, I won this and HSBC altered the date and it dropped off my file. Then I found your article about credit card refunds.
This c/card account was used as means to live/ survive oppose to how a credit card is intended. The card was issued in March ’12, I was on MAT Leave from June ’11, so when I applied, I had been in receipt of low income for 9 months prior. I don’t think HSBC would have carried out any income checks. The loan repayments were being met, but I was always juggling at this time.
Total Debt in 2012 was £17,487, estimated repayments were £500 pcm (most of my MAT income). Account balances were between 83%-100% utilisation. I had 2 overdrafts, 1 with Natwest that was ALWAYS OD, & HSBC which must have been OD at the time as low income.
I would really appreciate some help with the answer as to ‘when I was made aware I had cause for complaint’, if you feel what I have said above is sufficient – re: researching, I will include this. Thanks so much for your swift reply.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I was researching how to buy a home with a CCJ. I’d paid all my debts off (even the CCJ) I used this site as I was researching how to get a default removed. The default had been applied years later after the account defaulted, I won this and HSBC altered the date and it dropped off my file. Then I found your article about credit card refunds.
Than that is what you explain to FOS. Say you knew at the time that the card rapyments were causing you difficulty and you were juggling everything, but you didn’t realise the lender should have checked the repayments were affordable so you had no idea you had cause to complaint until you found this article.
Point out that HSBC could see from your overdraft that you were always overdrawn and using credit to pay for everyday essentials.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
You also have a possible good claim against NatWest and HSBC that they failed to monitor your overdraft usage because you were always in your overdraft for years. See https://www.financial-ombudsman.org.uk/files/290226/DRN5869499.pdf which is a case where someone won a similar complaint against Natwest.
Jay says
Thank you Sara!
Amazes me how how financially savvy you are. Thanks for the heads up on the Natwest, I was about to read that article as saw it mentioned previously. But I need to tackle this one head on first!
If I win this case, I will be eternally grateful. From £17k to £0 its been quite the rollercoaster, but an experience I have learned so much from. Removing the CCJ will be the icing on the cake. I hope I can help and inspire as many people as you do.
I will update you with the outcome regardless.
Mel says
Hello,
Does anyone have any information on the HSBC review that is going on this year? I have just submitted my complaint to them for irresponsible lending but then I read about a review instructed by FCA and cheques are to be issued ? I am assuming that these will likely have been paid by now but I haven’t found anything
Sara (Debt Camel) says
where did you read about this review?
Mel says
Hi Sara,
https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.moneysavingexpert.com/news/2021/07/hsbc-first-direct-m-s-john-lewis-bank-customers-payments-thousan/amp/
I have sent my complaint and spoke (briefly!) to a HSBC customer service advisor who also said they are currently carrying out a review
Sara (Debt Camel) says
ok, I did see that. It seems to be related to debt collection practices rather than affordability. So where HSBC were aware that a customer was in difficulty but they failed to freeze interest and charges on an account.
Was your complaint about affordability? You may have to complaint – your limit was set too high AND they failed to freeze interest when they knew you were in difficulty. It is worth being very clear in a complaint if you are complaining about both these points.
Were you complaining about a credit card? Did you also have an overdraft from them?
Mel says
Hi Sara,
It’s actually still quite traumatic for me to even go back to my HSBC bank statements at that time (2014 onwards) but in essence I was in serious financial difficulty (mentally unwell) and I was able to take out a loan (£5k) which I defaulted on a year later, but is now settled, a credit card (£3.3k) which is now closed and take an overdraft (£3.5k) which I reduced and then was able to take out again (£2.5k) and I have only just repaid that in the last month or so. I don’t owe any money to HSBC any longer.
So my complaint is based on unaffordability and irresponsible lending – which I read the review to be looking at, sub standard customer care to customers during 2010 and 2019. All the red flags were there but they kept lending to me and I know I should never have kept asking but i had lost the plot completely. My grandad, stepdad and best friend died within 18 months of each other from cancer and I was going through a divorce – I was reckless with money and didn’t care what the consequences, and believe me, I have paid the price for my irresponsible behaviour and not just financially :(
Sara (Debt Camel) says
these reviews resulting in refunds tend to be for very specific collections of circumstances, normally just relating to one account. In your case you want ALL your borrowing sonce 2014 to be looked at across all your accounts. You may have been reckless, but they were your bank and they should have seen what was going on from your account history and your current transactions.
Good luck and keep at it – send it to the Ombudsman if they don’t make you a reasonable offer – and if you aren’t sure, pop back here to doscuss it.
Paul says
Hi,
I last contacted the site in June asking about my 2 Tesco cards. After the adjudicator ruled in my favour it was rejected by Tesco but once an ombudsman picked up my case Tesco agreed with the decision before the Ombudsman even read about my case.
This site is the best and Sara is spot on and a great help.
Thank you for your advice and hard work.
Dave L says
Anyone had any issues with Monzo, I’ve recently had a complaint upheld by an FOS adjudicator which they’ve accepted. This is where the fun starts sent them my new sort code and account details only to receive a reply which stated they can’t accept a card number for payment . Replied that is my account details and haven’t had a response off them
Since I’m a week despite emailing their complaints and their customer service chief. Just seem to be totally rude and ignorant at worst, totally incompetent at best.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Is your complaint against Monzo and you want it paid into a different bank?
Or your complaint against a different bank and you want the refund paid into your Monzo account?
Dave L says
Hi Sara
Complaint is against monzo , I have now closed my account with them and wanted the compensation to be paid to a different bank. They seem to have made a mistake in their initial reply and have been unable to get any response from them since . Just very frustrating
Dave
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Well how do they expect to pay you if it’s not by bank transfer? Are they offering a cheque – that would be weird for a challenger bank.?
If you are on Facebook or Twitter I suggest you ask them there.
Dave L says
Thank you I’ll try that I think it seems they’ve realised they made a mistake in their initial and now don’t want to acknowledge that
Simon says
Hi.
My Complaint was rejected by Monzo but it’s now with the Ombudsman.
Chris says
Anyone have experience of Santander current account complaint. In short I complained that they were continually charging in the past for overdraft fees and missed payments that were unreasonable as on some occasions fees were over £300 a month. They have written back after second complaints as they did not reply to my first complaint at all. They have not upheld my complaint as they always gave three weeks notice of charges and that gave me time to dispute before they charged. Not sure whether to pursue or just drop as unlikely to win?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Can you say how you have used this account over the years. Have they increased your credit limit? Have there been long periods when you were never or almost never out of your overdraft?
Chris says
Hi Sara thanks for getting back so quickly! In my complaint I did state that’s for over 80% of each month i was in my overdraft and they had also increased the limit without being asked to. Also said that there charges each month compounded the problem as would set me back every month and led to a financial spiral. However they have just stated they gave notice of charges. Not sure I can pursue further as hard to win?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest you send this straight to the Ombudsman. Notifying you what the charges are each month doesn’t make them affordable!
Chris says
Thanks Sara I will do that do you think I should ask for a full transaction list of charges from them before I go to fos? It’s a closer account so do not have access and do they have to provide to me?
Cheers
Chris
Sara (Debt Camel) says
No, send to FOS and ask them for the list of charges at the same time. Don’t delay the FOS complaint.
F says
Hi Sara
I am currently in the process of applying for a Debt Relief Order, am I still able to make affordability complaints against my catalogue lenders, credit card companies and my bank if I actually go ahead and enter the Debt Relief Order? Thank you.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Do you owe them money at the moment?
F says
Yes, I owe quite a lot to several catalogue companies, have 3 credit cards and a large overdraft with Lloyds. I think they’re all worth putting a complaint in but was unsure whether the DRO would stop me doing that?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
If you owe money, then any refund is first used to clear your amount owed, even if it is in a DRO. So unless the refunds are large, you won’t get any cash.
In a DRo you do not want to get a lot of cash refunds, a over 32000 would mean your DRO is cancelled.
So there may not be much point in making these claims in a DRO – you do the work, but may not get anything back.
Can I ask how large the debts are? One option would be to postpone the DRO now and se how complaints go… but if you only had a couple of wins aand were still left with too much debt, then you would have been better to just get on with the DRO.
Are you in private rented housing?
Ljc says
Hi Sara
I’ve made a complaint to NEXT about irresponsible lending and have requested a DSAR (the debt was sold to a debt collection agency ) however next have coma back to me and said as the debt collection now owns this account I have to go to them and request the SAR and then they ask Next for it ?! They said sorry for inconvenience but as it’s now owned by them I have to go through them first . Is this correct ? The agency is Debt Managers Ltd (DMS) in Rotherham
Sara (Debt Camel) says
How long ago did you make the complaint?
Tell Next you are not interested in the data being held by the debt collector, you want the personal information that Next holds about you and you will report them to the ICO if they don’t send you this.
Elle says
Hi Sarah,
I’m looking for a little help yet again. :) I have received an update on my JD Williams Complaint, which is still in the process of being looked at by the FOS but they have requested the following:
“So that we can progress your case in the best way possible, please send us –
1/ a copy of your full credit report.
2/ copies of your bank statements for the three months leading up to any applications that you’re asking us to review.”
I have downloaded and will send my credit report as I’ve done for many other complaints (that’s the easy it) but my query is,.. whilst it requests bank statements for the three months prior to any applications,.. besides the initial application for an account with JDW (as Simply Be) should I be sending bank statements for the 3 months prior to every increase in credit limit that JDW actioned too do you think? (that would be around 22 months worth all told).
Or would perhaps 1 month prior to each credit limit increase help? I know that much of this is still viewable by the FOS via my credit report anyway.
Or will the FOS ask if they specifically require further bank statements for those credit limit rise occasions?
I could ask the FOS what they need exactly by replying to their email/Resolver reply but I have to upload/send all the files by the 31st of August and they obviously won’t reply that rapidly.
Many thanks, again ~ Elle
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Have you already sent FOS a credit record for a different complaint? or bank statements? because they can just re-use those.
How large was the original credit limit? there were 7 increases?
Elle says
Hi Sara,
In regards to the credit record, yes I sent it previously back in Sept 2020 but it was a complaint which the adjudicator persuaded me wasn’t worth pursuing further and another time for a credit card complaint, again not upheld,.. would they still have those?
It’s not a problem to send an updated 2021 credit report now I have it ready to send… but would there be more viewable (further back) from the previous one as it was a year older? I have that 2020 one too still.
I’ve weirdly never been asked to send any bank statements before even though I’d expected to… is that odd? Should the FOS at early stages and/or all adjudicators request this for all irresponsible lending complaints? I’ve actually found it quite difficult to get beyond the adjudicators with these complaints…as several have appeared to just take the word of the lender (final response) without requesting any further info from me.
Here is the original credit limit below,.. up to it’s highest prior to my borrowing from elsewhere to pay it all off…and this is over the same years that I’ve had similar borrowing/credit with 7 other catalogue companies all increasing their limits similarly and irresponsibly.
There were 6 increases in 3 years,.. the other bank statements I’ve included in my 22 months include 4 months prior to application originally (as it was mid month that I applied) and then 3 months prior to each increase…
12/2014 £400 – 10/2017 £3000
Sara (Debt Camel) says
When are the credit increases you are complaining about?
You don’t “get past an adjudicator” unless you reject the adjudicator decision and say you want it to go to an Ombudsman.
It’s up to an adjudicator what information they ask for. But you should send them information you think is relevant even if they haven’t asked for it.
Elle says
Thanks Sara,
The credit increases I’d be complaining about would be from the first one as I didn’t request it or any after that.
01/2015 £600
06/2015 £900
05/2016 £1300
11/2016 £1750
04/2017 £2750
10/2017 £3000
Thanks for the clarification in regards to the adjudicator/ombudsman info, in those particular cases I’d requested that that adjudicator looked at all the info again, which they did, but I was then still told that as far as they could see the lender’s did nothing wrong,.. however their typed replies to me read suspiciously identical to the lender’s response letters, which I did question, but when I asked if I could send them bank statements or anything else that might make my complaint clearer or assist them before sending to the Ombudsman they said there was no point as they would view it as they had,.. maybe I just got unlucky with who picked up these cases, it was during lockdown and they were working from home and via mobile phones, and being a tad naive then I didn’t realise that I should have simply stood my ground and requested it be taken further regardless of what they thought…but hence why I wish to get it right this time with my other complaints and give as much info as I can from the off.
Thanks,
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Then the earliest credit record you have is best (providing it’s not before 10/2017).
And I would send 3 months of statements before each lending decision,, opening the account and increasing credit limit.
Elle says
Hi Sara,
Another query, this time in regards to Irresponsible/unaffordable lending of a Barclays Overdraft.
I’ve not had the final response letter yet but I’d spoken by phone.
Barclays have just refunded me £3037, but I’ve already gotten the impression by the phone chat, that they will have only looked back 6 years, (from June 2015), even though the issue would have started several years prior to that. It rose from £400 – £5000 in around 5 years and stayed there.
I’ve been self employed (as a Sole Trader) throughout all my time in banking with them, no proof of earnings were requested and I already had increasing debt which should have shown on my credit report.
So, my question is, whilst I know that I can keep the recent payment and I need to wait for the final response letter before I do anything, how far back will/can the FOS look in to a case like this?
Barclays (on phone) they have no records beyond 6 years. I can see from my own Barclays data exactly when the overdraft was raised over the years, but she said it’s because they would have no other info/notes of conversations etc from back then.
So, can the FOS request they look back at 2000-2015 too or are Barclays correct in what they say?
It just seemed odd that ppi complaints went back that far and Barclays refunded for those. Is there a reason why this type of complaint would be different?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
So when was this 5 years period they raised your overdraft?
Have you since then been through long periods – years – when you were in your overdraft continuously? Not going back into the back and then down into the red again, but always overdrawn?
Elle says
I was originally given a Barclays Additions account with a £100 overdraft in 1999 which ran until 2009 but which was then was upgraded to a Barclays Premier Life account in 2009 – 2015.
In 2015 the Premier account was downgraded to a standard bank account but the £5000 overdraft facility has always remained.
I opted to raise the overdraft gradually online myself (and they allowed me to) from 1999 to 2009 from £100 up to £5000. It has stayed at that now. I only state 2009 as the year it hit £5000 as Barclays have shared proof of this previously, however, I know it was long before this, probably around 2004-2005 when it was an Additions account, but finding proof of that to share the date with you here is taking a while as it’s in storage. Being self employed I’ve kept all my bank statements so it’s just a matter of finding it. Is it worth finding it? Or is that too far back?
I have only very, rarely ever been out of my overdraft since opening it, and only then once or twice when I’d used further borrowing to pay it off, from our Mortgage reserve account, which is also with Barclays and is still a debt. I then went into it again.
I rarely went over the £5000 limit, but spent almost 20 years in it, and mostly near it’s limit. I have proof of that from 2009 already as I have those statements to hand.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Right!
To first answer the question about far a complaint can go back.
PPI complaints could go back a long was because they are “insurance” complaints which FOS has always been able to look at. FOS has only been able to look at complaints about consumer credit (loans, cards, overdrafts) since April 2007. It is VERY unlikely you would get any refunds before that point.
FOS also has a rule it can only go back 6 years OR back three years if you have only recently found out you can complain about something. Which is presumably the case here. As you have all your old statements somewhere, evidence about this is not going to be a problem.
There are now 3 sorts of things you can complain about for overdrafts.
1) complaining the charges were unfair and caused you hardship. These complaints have been taking place for years, Martin Lewis has a good page about them https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/reclaim/bank-charges/. But there are pretty hard to win. If you think either of the other two options apply to you, it is probably better to go for those instead.
2) complaining that your limit was increased too high. That is what the article above covers.
3) complaining that you were consistently in your overdraft account for years (not 9 months or a year, several years) and that Barclays failed to monitor your account, to notice that you were using the account for everyday spending over a long period which shows you were in financial difficulty, and that they did not treat you fairly by allowing this to persist for years and continuing to add charges. See https://www.financial-ombudsman.org.uk/files/290226/DRN5869499.pdf which is an example of where an Ombudsman found in a customer’s favor in a similar case against Natwest.
I think you should go back to Barclays and make some of those points from (3) about being in your overdraft for such a long time. You could say that you think all the overdraft charges from 2009 should be refunded because of this (if you think that would be fair?)
Elle says
Hi again Sara,
I’ve received my response from Barclays.
They say that any charges were added inline with their overdraft agreement, but have stated that the £3073 refund (that payment they’d made into my account) is “a partial refund as a gesture of goodwill”.
Weirdly, they then agree that my £5000 overdraft facility is/was unaffordable and unsustainable. They say it should have been revaluated back in 2015 when my account was downgraded from a Premier Account. So this is the earliest point that this person has looked at, from 23rd June 2015 -23rd June 2021.
On closer reading of their letter they’ve stated that their partial refund is to cover the months July 2015 and August 2015 …That’s just 2 months!
…and then covering 27th June 2017 – 25th August 2019, a further 2 years!
They’ve said that this is because they can see that the overdraft was heavily relied upon during these times. I believe I have heavily relied upon it (nearly all £5000 of it) for around 13 -15 years!
I have checked my statements (from 2008) the overdraft limit was raised to £5000 around 2005/06, and the only reason that some months Barclays have just looked at (showed lower overdraft usage, was because I’d borrowed £5000 from our Barclay’s Mortgage reserve facility to clear it again (but which I still owe £26,000 to).
Barclays should have also been able to see this, and I had mentioned it in my complaint.
Continued in following comment…
Elle says
Barclays issue Cont… some further info (wouldn’t fit within the word limit).
I’d assumed that Barclays would again mention the 6 year time limit in their response but they didn’t, they’ve simply taken their search from where they believe there was a slight issue, “overdraft should have been re-evaluated back in 2015”, so they have simply looked at 2015 – 2021.
Interestingly, and may aid other complainants, it took a written complaint via Resolver and then several angry phone calls 8wks later for Barclays to accept my complaint as an Irresponsible/Unaffordable Lending complaint, they’d simply filed it as “Charges and Fees” made no mention of or any reference to the word “irresponsible” at all and had just replied saying they owed me nothing, twice!
Eventually, after some perseverance, someone rang me back saying they would look at my complaint again, and the above outcomes are their response, but even now they’ve headed the complaint “Mis-sold Overdraft facility/Unfair charges.”
I’d like to take this back as far as I can, 2007/2008 if possible. I also wanted to say thank you for your detailed previous comments, I have read it through and I feel I should likely opt for option 3, but do you have any further thoughts?
I now feel that I need a little guidance as to whether to take this back to Barclays or straight to the FOS instead? Can I mention that case you shared, or is that not acceptable behaviour?
Any guidance will be gratefully received.
Thanks again.
Chris says
Hi Sara, looking for a little advice, I commented on here a few days ago that Santander did not uphold my complaint regarding fees and overdraft etc. So was about to send to ombudsman when I noticed the letter they have sent states I have 6 months from the date of the original letter (nov 20) which I did not receive hence why I complained again that they had never replied! The new letter says the original letter date stands so I.e I am out of time?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest you send the case to FOS and say you never received the letter which is why you complain they had not replied.
Ali says
Hi there! I have recently had success with Shop Direct, refunded on both Very and Littlewoods. The Littlewoods account was closed last year after I paid off the debt with Lowells and this was no longer on my credit file. Very was an active account although sold to Lowells also. The refunded awarded cleared this balance and I was left with the remaining as a cheque refund. This was also no longer showing on my credit file, both had fallen off last year some time. Since this happened, roughly 6 weeks ago, I have since had a Very account appear on my credit file, albeit in a closed status. I immediately emailed them on Saturday and had a reply first thing this morning saying they had escalated my complaint and by this afternoon I had a phone call from someone in the Executive Complaints Team wanting to talk to me. I missed the call so they emailed and said they would call tomorrow. My question is, am I right in thinking that they cannot re add this account to my credit file? I waited weeks for any type of response response my last complaint so a little taken aback they are dealing with this within 1 working day. I want to make sure I have the correct information for when they call tomorrow..
Many thanks in advance.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Are there any negative marks on this record – missed payments, arrears, default?
Ali says
No, it says there is no data and it’s marked as closed. I just wondered why it would be added in the first place
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Sounds like an error. Ask for it to be deleted.