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Will the Money Shop really pay 80% of refunds? No!

UPDATES

In August 2019 the Money Shop announced a Scheme it expected would pay c 80p in the £ to customers of the Money Shop, Payday UK and Payday Express who are owed compensation for unaffordable loans.

I said pigs might fly – see the article below. And I think other people such as the FCA and the Ombudsman also express some scepticism…

A month late, in September 2019, a revised version clarified how the Money Shop will assess claims for refunds, accepting all loans over 6 years and more claims in general. And it now thinks that more people may apply for a refund than it had factored in. So the 80p in the £ refund may turn out to be 14p in the £.

In February 2020, the quarterly Scheme Update to Creditors suggested that the return may be about 10p in the £. And they warn there are “material uncertainties” around this figure.

In May 2020 the estimate dropped to 3-4p in the £.

It is now expected to pay out about 4p in the £ in May/June 2021.

For more information, see the Latest news on the Money Shop, Payday UK and Payday Express Scheme which is kept updated.

On August 14 2019, people who had borrowed from the Money Shop, Payday UK or Payday Express started to receive emails from Instant Cash Loans (ICL), the company that owns these payday lender brands. The email asks customers to vote to approve a Scheme of Arrangement.

The Scheme limits the money ICL will pay to customers who have an affordability complaint  – they were given loans they could not repay without hardship or borrowing more money.

Here I am looking at one aspect – the amount customers may get back.

ICL said in the Scheme Explanatory Statement:

We think that: former customers with complaints about loans will receive about 80% of what we owe them (although this amount may be lower)

A flying pig - my first thought when I heard the Money Shop said it would be likely to pay 80% of refunds

That 80% figure looks astonishingly high based on Financial Ombudsman (FOS) decisions I have seen and what we know is happening in the Wonga and Wageday Advance administrations.

It seems to me that the figure can only be accurate if one or more of the following applies:

  1. ICL rejects a large number of complaints that the FOS would be likely to award compensation for;
  2. where ICL does approve a claim, it will often be for fewer loans than FOS would say to refund;
  3. ICL is assuming that a low number of claims will be made.

People are being asked to approve a Scheme where they may reasonably assume their claim will be assessed in a way that is broadly comparable to what FOS does.

I think ICL needs to say more about how it is planning to assess complaints and what further evidence people may be required to produce to have a claim accepted.

Without this detail, I think the statement that people may get 80% “of what we owe them” may be misleading.

Assessing refunds for WageDay Advance and Wonga customers

As background, let’s look at how two sets of Insolvency Practitioners have decided how to assess claims against major payday lenders that have gone bust.

Both Administrators have developed a Claims Calculator, pointing out that an automated process was essential as a manual one would cost so much there would be no money left to pay refunds.

The Calculators follow the FOS approach as far as is possible, considering the size of loans, the customer’s declared income, any previous payment problems, the number of loans and whether there were large gaps between loans or there were long chains of borrowing. Loans over 6 years old are treated in the same way for a refund as more recent loans.

Previous settlements are also being reviewed by the Calculators. Some customers who were made a low offer either didn’t understand how poor it was or were in such financial difficulty they had to accept it. They are being informed they are entitled to additional compensation.

In both cases, the Administrators have started informing customers whether they have a valid claim and how much it has been calculated at, so people have seen actual numbers.

With any automated process, some people will feel that they would have got a better result from going to FOS – that is inevitable. But so far the comments I have seen from people are broadly happy. Some people will just have been surprised and have no idea what the number should be, but others have had settlements from other lenders or via FOS so they have a reasonable feel for what they should get back.

To me it feels as though both sets of Administrators are doing a good job of assessing the Claims in a neutral way.

Comparing numbers – The Money Shop with Wageday Advance

Let’s compare the numbers ICL have given in their Explanatory Statement with the numbers from the Wageday Advance (WDA) administration, summarised in this BBC article.

Total number of customers:

  • WDA 800,000
  • ICL 2.6 million.

Estimate of number of customers entitled to redress:

  • WDA 330,000
  • ICL – not given.

Estimate of total redress:

  • WDA £223m
  • ICL  £17.1m (page 20 of the Explanatory Statement).

From what I have seen of complaints against the Money Shop, Payday UK and Payday Express I would say those lenders had been just as “bad” as Wageday Advance in irresponsible lending.

If ICL’s redress total was 3.25 times as large as WDA’s estimate, to reflect the larger number of customers, it would be c £725m.

That is why I find the £17.1m estimate of the value of ICL redress claims very unlikely. It must be based on a completely different sort of calculation to the ones the Wonga and Wageday Advance Administrators are doing.

80% – really?

Wageday Advance approached the FCA to approve a proposed Scheme of Arrangement at the start of 2019, proposing to cap their liability to pay refunds at c £18m. The Administrators later said that:

redress creditors would … have faced a very significant shortfall against the value of their claims in the Scheme.

It is very hard to see how this can be squared with ICL’s assertion that its customers may get 80% of their redress paid when it has so many more customers and is only putting in c £20m.

Above I estimated ICL’s total redress bill at £725m. using that, the payout would be about 2%, not 80%.

But a large number of customers with small claims may not bother to apply, so the bill could well be halved, resulting in an average payout of about 4%.

It is possible that people whose claims are accepted would get close to 80% of the interest on the loans to be refunded, but the number of loans being refunded will turn out to be surprisingly low and many people will have their claims rejected entirely. But that is not what people would expect to happen having read the Explanatory Statement.

What does the FCA think of this?

I wonder what the FCA thinks of ICL’s proposed Scheme?

Although the FCA didn’t say No, to Wageday Advance’s Scheme, it just kept asking for more information until the company concluded the Scheme would not be approved.

So now the FCA has an authorised firm, ICL, with three times as many customers as Wageday Advance, proposing to put in about the same amount of money that the FCA did not seem to think was satisfactory for Wageday Advance.

More clarity is needed before people vote

If the Scheme is turned down, the company will go into administration. So perhaps customers should vote for the Scheme because they would get less in administration.

But I think it is unreasonable to ask people to vote for something until it has not been clearly explained. Especially where one of the biggest selling points – the possible 80% payout – could well be a lot too high.

UPDATE – the Scheme was approved.

Comments on this article are now closed – please see
Latest news on the Money Shop, Payday UK and Payday Express Scheme which is kept updated. 

Comments

  1. MoMoneyMoProblems says

    Hi there – does it cover a number of companies? I received this email, as did a friend, but I don’t recollect ever having loans with this company.

    • Sara (Debt Camel) says

      yes – here is a list: Cash TilPayday, Pay Advance, Payday Control, Fast Forward Loans, Payday Tomorrow, Payday Solutions, Wage Advance, Which Payday Loan, Payday Express, Loan Solutions UK, Payday Finance, Wages Today, Express, Payday 22, Payday 29, Payday 36, Your Pay Today, Flexible Payday, Payday Manager, Money Bridge, Loan Lounge, Payday UK, Month End Money, MEM Advisors, PDUK, Payday Now, KW and Co, Three Month Loan, Keyes Whitlock & Company, My Payday Loan, The Payday Store, Ladder Finance, Ladder Credit, Ladder Loans, Kyzoo, Kyzoo Clear, Kyzoo Ultra, Kyzoo Classic, Kyzoo Flexi, Kyzoo Platinum, Kyzoo Vintage, Ladder, Ladrloan, Kyzoo Control, Kyzoo Black and Ladder Loans Lite.

      NB some of those names are quite similar to other lenders which are not connected to ICL.

    • Thomas says

      I got loads of loans about 10 years ago and took me years to pay for them and it destroyed my relationship with my ex fiencee. I have dealt with payday loans in about 4 or 5 years

  2. Joe says

    Thank you for this Sara. I already voted no based on the fact I don’t trust them one bit. My claim is HUGE and they announced this on the last day they had to respond to me. I don’t think that is a coincidence. I’d rather stick with the old system than give them what they want. I do not trust them and I have no reason to.

    • Faith Sinclair says

      Well if you voted no you are guaranteed to get nothing, at least with this you would get something! 80% 50% or whatever!!!

        • Sara (Debt Camel) says

          It is likely that you will get more if there is a Scheme than if there isn’t. It’s not certain, because there is the possibility that your claim may be rejected in the Scheme but accepted in administration.

          • Joe says

            Exactly. No guarantees one way or the other.

            I do not trust that The Money Shop has our best interests at heart.

  3. Lorraine says

    Oh no! I received my email from paydayuk and have already voted based on what this email said. 🤬🤬

  5. David S says

    I haven’t made a complaint against any of these companies, but have received the email. Is it possible, that these companies have automatically contacted people that may be due a refund? I know with HSBC have actually contacted myself regarding these matters.

    • Sara (Debt Camel) says

      So far as I know, they are writing to all customers, not distinguishing between people who have complained or not. And not distinguishing between people they think have a valid claim or not.

      If you had payday loan but have never considered affordability complaints, then you should read up on them. You may have a good complaint even if you repaid all your loans on time. See https://debtcamel.co.uk/payday-loan-refunds/ and also think if you have claims against other lenders.

  6. Turtle says

    I wouldn’t trust this crowd as far as I could throw them. Also the administrators will eat up a hell of a lot the money.

    Amazing how ICL/Wonga/WDA made INCREDIBLE profits handing out unaffordable loans then just bust the company to get out of paying customers back what is rightly theirs.

    What is also disgusting is that both ICL and Wonga were forced to write to customers a few years ago re unaffordable loans and gave pathetic levels of set refunds. In my case Wonga refunded me £400 after a “thorough investigation” when I paid over £7k+ in interest over pretty much constant loans for 2 years.

  7. Scott Rowell says

    What I’m not clear on is that the scheme voting doesn’t end until nearly the end of September, however my claim can go to the FOS tomorrow. According to an email I received at 11pm last night from The Money Shop, “It would not be fair to consider some customers’ claims before the Scheme and others in the Scheme” and also “we understand the Ombudsman Service is unlikely to look at individual complaints until they know whether the Scheme is approved”.

    So my take on this is that they are hoping people will not go to the FOS and then they can put them into the scheme and pay out less which to me is an absolute disgrace considering that they also state “You will receive your payment at the end of the Scheme, which is expected to be before the end of 2020”.

    Looks like I’ll be going to the FOS!

    • Sara (Debt Camel) says

      Although you can send your complaint to FOS, it won’t be looked at :(

      If the Scheme is approved in September, it will cover all complaints including those at FOS. If it isn’t, then ICL intends to go into administration, in which case FOS cannot make any further decisions.

      So FOS is taking the very sensible view that there is no point in them wasting any time on looking at these complaints as they won’t be paid out on.

  8. Denice says

    I went through a bad period where I had to use payday loans to survive and from several of the companies above. They all kept lending me money directly I paid off the previous loan and at higher amounts. I paid most of them off but defaulted on a Payday Express Loan. This debt was brought by PRA Financial. I had forgotten about it. I have now received a letter from Lowell Finance about the matter who state they are taking me to Court. Will this debt be covered by the Money Shop vote? It becomes statute barred in October this year so am guessing I need to ay it and then see if I get a refund? Advice please.

    • Sara (Debt Camel) says

      What exactly have you received:
      – a letter threatening court action?
      – a letter headed something like Letter Before Claim/Action, with e Reply Form enclosed?
      – a Claim Form from the court?

  9. Claire says

    Can someone help me understand please? My complaint had been upheld by the FOS but they now tell me that MEM Consumer Finance has went into an agreement and that they cannot take my complaint any further…

    • Sara (Debt Camel) says

      Hi Claire – yes MEM Consumer Finance is one of the companies included in the Money Shop’s Scheme of Arrangement. read the article about which describes what is happening.

  10. Lisa Baxter says

    I received this letter today for the past 2 years I’ve been at a standstill in regards to the interest I’ve paid on payday loans – so far all I have got is they are looking into my accounts this I feel is just a fob off not to address my issue but I have no idea what else to do?

  11. Sue says

    Now that Wonga has nearly paid all of their redress payments – has anyone had any news recently from Money Shop regarding redress payments?

  12. Jamilla Khatun says

    Hi can anyone tell me if i will get a refund on pawning jewlery at the money shop in last few years.

    • Sara (Debt Camel) says

      Not so far as I know. Pawning items is not covered by the affordability rules.

  13. Justin says

    If you have a default from PaydayUK will this be taken off your credit file or is this something you would have to request separately?
    They’ve contacted me and I’m part of the scheme.

    • Sara (Debt Camel) says

      if your claim is upheld, I expect any negative marks on your credit record will be deleted.

  14. Michael says

    Is there any update? Has anyone started hearing back yet as the Wonga stuff last year was much further along? Do we know if there’s a hold up in proceedings?

    • Sara (Debt Camel) says

      You aren’t going to get any money this year and will probably get less than 10%. I suggest you try to forget about this for a few months.

  15. Lauren says

    If I have a debt with The Money Shop, do I have to repay it now? Not looking for anything but just want it off my credit file/repayments.

    • Sara (Debt Camel) says

      Yes you do – unless you put in a Claim for unaffordable lending, but the deadline to that is passed.

  16. Axel Bin says

    My claim was upheld and I will be getting £900….I expected it to be rejected.

    • Sara (Debt Camel) says

      If they assessed your claim at £900 you are likely to only receive c.£40

      • Colin says

        Sara – does the 3-4p in the £ refer to the total redress or is interest dealt with separately ? Also will they have to pay HMRC the full 20% of the taxable redress amount before the dividend reduction is applied ? Thanks.

        • Sara (Debt Camel) says

          It refers to the total redress including the 8%. It is possible (Based on what happened with Wonga) that ICL will reach an agreement with HMRC that you will be being paid your amount out of the “interest refund” part so no tax will be payable.

  17. Tracie says

    The Money Shops website states:

    We will start writing out to claimants in June and all decisions will be sent out by the end of October 2020.

    Looks like they have updated the Q&A’s on their website.

    Are we to assume that the quarterly reports received at the beginning of the month is them writing to us??

    • Sara (Debt Camel) says

      They have started sending emails to people with the decisions on their cases Some of these have been ending up in spam, so check that regularly.

  18. H.K says

    I received the emails regarding the scheme and so on when they were sent out and voted … I checked my credit report today to find that they have removed the debt from my credit history does this mean they have decided they lent to me irresponsibly ?( which they did ) I’ve not had any emails to let me know of this but I just wondered if anyone had any idea .

  19. Melissa says

    I’m also apart of the scheme and was told that the maximum potential redress I would receive £5989. I know there won’t be any payments this year but what do you think I would receive?

  20. Colin says

    Update : the Courts have granted a 12 month extension to the administration period, so no payout to creditors until until the end of 2021 at the earliest.

  21. David says

    Just had email through apparently upholding two loans, supposedly redress of £815.. doubt it’ll be that, probably £20 if we’re lucky!

  23. Maria says

    I received a potential redress amount. I agree with the potential amount, but not the figure I may end up with. I don’t know if I should appeal or not? Will I gain or lose?

    • Sara (Debt Camel) says

      No, you cannot appeal because of that. They are dividing up all the money there is.

  24. Cheryl says

    Hi Sara I have just received the following email from TMS, may I ask when they say I can appeal, is there any point? It’s almost like a kick in the teeth knowing that I’m not going to get anywhere near that amount, why don’t they just put the amount you are likely to receive? I have copied and pasted and would I possibly receive more by appealing? …. thank you! :)

    We hope you will be satisfied with our assessment. You now have 30 days in which to decide whether or not to accept the outcome, or to make an appeal. After 30 days, if you haven’t made an appeal, the outcome shown below will become final.

    Decision Information:

    Overall Decision:

    Partial Uphold

    Total Potential Redress (£):

    2155.66

    Number of loans in lending period:

    4

    Number of loans upheld:

    3

    Number of loans with no issues:

    1

    Please let us know your decision by selecting your preferred option from the drop-down menu below and clicking ‘Continue’. If you choose ‘Accept’, and are eligible for any redress, we’ll ask you to check the contact information we currently hold for you and give us your bank details for any payment that will be made to you at the end of the Scheme.

    • Sara (Debt Camel) says

      You should only appeal if you think the £2155 figure is incorrect by a lot.
      Any appeal saying it’s not fair you will only get a tiny proportion of it will be dismissed – there is no more money to distribute.

  25. Dai says

    I have the same this morning (redress below) but reading the above comments, if this is likely to be a snippet of this then should we not fight it?

    Can you shed any light on the following also:

    Are we to receive the amount stated in full?

    Does the 12 month extension definitely mean we wont be receiving the amount(s) this year, if we accept?

    Thank you

    Overall Decision:
    Uphold
    Total Potential Redress (£):
    1090.90
    Number of loans in lending period:
    8
    Number of loans upheld:
    8
    Number of loans with no issues:
    0

    • Sara (Debt Camel) says

      You are likely to get less than 5% of the amount stated. Appealing will not affect the % you receive, they are simply dividing up the money there is, appealing doesn’t mean there will be any more.
      If you want to appeal you have to say why £1090 is too low. If it is correct that they have upheld all your loans, not sure how you can argue it should be more.

      • David says

        Hi Sara

        Thank you
        So im not arguing that it should be higher but equally that it should be what they saybthey owe.

        I have seen the example that they use for ‘John Smith’ but the fact is I do not owe them any money.

        From what you are saying the key is to accept the offer and hope they pay out before the slice of the pie disappears.

        • Sara (Debt Camel) says

          No, you can’t argue that they should pay what they assessed as the redress.

          Everyone will get paid at exactly the same point. They need to have assessed everyone so they know what the total owed is. Then they divide up the money between everyone owed so everyone gets the same percentage.

  26. chris says

    I just got an email saying that my claim was partially accepted for 5 out of 6 loans, they said my redress amount was £2368, it says payment will be made by May 2021.
    Lets see how much that £2368 goes down to, from what I’ve read I’m guessing I’ll get about £150 (better than nothing I suppose)

  27. Jodie Riordan says

    I had one on Wednesday for nearly 5K, but reading through these comments guess it won’t be a lot! Bet the government still get their full 20% on it!!

    • Sara (Debt Camel) says

      Probably not… Only the 8% part is ever taxable and with these low percentage funds, HMRC usually accepts the amount you receive is coming from the “refund” part not the “8% part” so there is no tax deduction.

  28. Suzanne Kelly says

    Hello, well after registering, jumping through hoops and thinking I would be entitled to at least a couple of hundred pounds – today I got an email giving me limited time to act – and when I logged in, I discovered without any financial info at all shown, they only identified 2 payday loans (I will have had more!) and the status shown was ineligible or some such nonsense. I had a choice of reasons from a drop down menu – many applied to me and I spelled these out in the message I sent them.

    We’re being railroaded, aren’t we?

  29. Rt says

    Partial uphold, potential redress 10389. Pittance will be repaid.

    The people responsible for these businesses should get jail time for the millions they are getting away with. The devstation they caused in thousands of lives deserve it anyway, but to insult them owing hundreds of millions and having to pay about 30m is a poisonous cherry on a vile cake

  30. Sarah says

    I made an irresponsible lending complaint to payday Uk just over two years ago now, after a very long time they said based on the accounts I had with them I was owed £800. I didn’t think this was correct and queried this, they were insistent it was so I begrudgingly accepted as I was desperate for the money. On Saturday I received a letter from them telling me they have now completed the assessment of my complaint and less the £800 I was previously paid my full redress is £5266.11 for an additional 13 other loans. I’m absolutely devastated and don’t know what to do, I made my complaint long before they went into administration and I believe they deliberately withheld information to avoid making a full payout at the time. I should get the full amount I am due! I’ve already been through this with wonga after being owed £15,000 and receiving next to nothing. This isn’t pocket change; it’s life changing amounts of money. Do you think I have any opportunity for recourse or is it worth trying the Fos?

      • Craig says

        Same thing happens to me got aid out £900 pound before the scheme saying that’s what they owed but now there saying im owed another £4000

    • Sarah says

      It sickens me that these companies are allowed to get away with this; particularly as I raised my complaint a long time ago now before they entered the scheme. I cannot believe they have mislead me, I’ve lost £5000 and there are simply no consequences for their actions.

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