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Provident’s Scheme to cap refunds – the background

UPDATE On 4 August 2021 the Scheme was approved in court.
See Provident Scheme – 4 million people can now claim a refund to find out how it will work and how to make a claim.

This article gives the background to the Scheme and what happened before voting started.

In March 2021 Provident Financial Group (PFG) proposed a Scheme of Arrangement to reduce the refunds it has to pay to customers. They are the second major lender to seek refuge in a Scheme after the pandemic  – Amigo is also proposing one.

The PFG announcement also said that the FCA has started an investigation into Provident’s affordability assessments and complaint handling since February 2020.

PFG says it can’t carry on paying refunds to customers winning affordability complaints about Provident Home Credit loans and Satsuma payday loans. The Financial Ombudsman (FOS) has been upholding 75% of these complaints against Provident;

If the Scheme is not approved, PFG says it is likely that Provident Person Credit Ltd (PPC) which operates the Provident Home Credit and Satsuma brands will go into administration which would mean no cash refunds for customers. In administration, however customers with a current loan would be entitled to balance reductions or write-offs if their claim is upheld.

PFG has two other divisions which will not be affected by the Scheme. Vanquis Bank is best known as a credit card lender. Moneybarn provides high cost car finance.

Outline of the Scheme

PFG has operated Provident Home Credit, Greenwood Home Credit (a small brand no longer used), Satsuma payday lending and Glo guarantor lending (a small brand no longer used) through its PPC subsidiary.

PFG is proposing the Scheme for all these four brands. It wants its PPC subsidiary to be able to carry on in business with new lending products. It has not given any details of these new products.

The Practice Statement Letter (PSL) gives an overview of the proposed Scheme, which will limit the refunds PFG has to pay to Provident Home Credit and Satsuma customers payday loan customers. FOS fees will also be included within the Scheme.

Provident is proposing to put aside £50 million to pay cash refunds in the Scheme. It says customers may get paid 10% of their proper refund. I think 10% is too optimistic, see Provident’s Scheme – will customers get less than 2% ?

The first court hearing for the Scheme on 22 April 2021 approved the voting arrangements. Voting started on 17 May, see Provident Scheme to limit refunds – how to vote on it for details.

Background to the Scheme

Provident started offering Home Credit, also known as doorstep loans, in 1880. It is the dominant lender in this sector of the UK bad credit market.

PFG’s problems began back in 2017 when it reorganised its doorstep lending operation. This went badly wrong with big software problems and sharp drops in the number of debt repayments being collected and in new loans being made, see Provident – home credit crisis for details.

PFG hoped 2020 would be the year home credit returned to profitability. But this plan was derailed by three factors.

1) The pandemic

The pandemic created major problems for all bad credit lenders as the 6-month payment breaks impacted on cash flow and made it hard to assess the numbers of loans that were likely to default.

Provident Home Credit faced additional problems as doorstep collection of weekly repayments was difficult or impossible for much of 2020. Satsuma stopped lending at the start of the first lockdown and Provident tightened its lending criteria, resulting in fewer loans being given.

2) Increasing numbers of affordability complaints in 2020

Many borrowers have had Provident loans continuously for very long periods, often increasing in size – five years is common, ten years is not unusual. An initial smallish doorstep loan often left the borrower too short of money to manage, so the loan was refinanced or another loan was taken.  Too many collection agents tended to offer new loans rather than payment arrangements when a borrower was in difficulty.

When Provident loses an affordability complaint it has to refund the interest paid. Where there has been long-term borrowing, these affordability refunds can be very large.

Complaint numbers increased significantly in 2020 as several claims management companies started advertising on social media. The number of new complaints sent to FOS shows this:

Graph showing how the number of new complaints against Provident at the Financial Ombudsman (FOS) has jumped sharply in 2020 from 2019

Provident often made very poor offers to these complaints, and sent people cheques, hoping they would be so desperate for some money they would cash the cheque and not take their complaint to FOS.

3) Legal/regulatory environment

In March 2020 FOS published a key decision on a case where a customer had 12 loans between 2009 and 2015 upholding loans 4-12 as being unaffordable.  FOS uses key decisions to set out in detail why it has made a decision.

In August 2020, the Kerrigan judgment found that a breach of the FCA’s CONC rules on affordability caused an unfair relationship and that a refund of interest paid would be an appropriate remedy. This judgment is in line with the approach FOS takes to affordability complaints.

The same month, the FCA’s Review of re-lending by high-cost lenders said:

We have significant concerns that repeat borrowing could be a strong indicator of a pattern of dependency on high-cost credit and levels of debt that are harmful to the customer.

Together FOS key decision, the Kerrigan judgment and the FCA re-lending review seem likely to have dashed any hopes Provident had that its doorstep lending could continue as it used to. In May 2020, Provident announced it was closing its doorstep lending operation completely.

Comments are now closed on this article. See the latest news about the Provident Scheme and add your comment there.

Comments

  1. Caroline Gibbs says

    I think they will all follow suit sooner than later, thank god I just got my complaint upheld by FOS and have been paid by Provident, feel for those that are still waiting! It’s soo frustrating and upsetting.

    • Amie says

      I am awaiting my breakdown and cheque. Providents 28 days are up on Wednesday just hope I get it.

        • Ruth says

          Hi Caroline
          How and who did you contact at Provident to chase your redress please? I’m only on day 7 but I’m really panicking now 😞

          • Caroline says

            Hi Ruth, it was chased by FOS. The Adjudicator and the Ombudsman but they must have a complaints team, try calling and asking for the
            Redress/complaints team or if with the FOS, email or call them to chase on your behalf.
            Good Luck hope you get it soon.

        • Amie says

          should i call them? i have emailed Joe and Neil, that was yesterday but i haven’t received an email back yet.

  2. Margaret says

    I contacted Provident at end of Jan with my complaint. If they haven’t replied in next few weeks should I continue with complaint to FOS?

    • Sara (Debt Camel) says

      Probably. Sorry the Provident announcement only came out today and I doubt FOS has had a chance to think about it yet.

  3. Nicola Simmons says

    Hi Sarah

    I sent my complaint into Amigo last May and apart from a few emails in the beginning to say they would be in touch soon- I’ve heard nothing. With them seeking a scheme of arrangement is there anything I can do?

    • Sara (Debt Camel) says

      Have you sent the complaint to the Ombusdman?
      I assume you don’t still have an Amigo loan?

        • Sara (Debt Camel) says

          ouch.
          Are the repayments affordable? have your household finances been affected by Covid-19?

  4. Issy says

    Hi I’ve already got a complaint with provident with the FOS still waiting on an outcome will this affect me and my complaint

    • Sara (Debt Camel) says

      Yes it is very likely to affect you I am afraid. If Provident hasn’t accepted a FOS decision by the time a Scheme starts, then you case will have to go into the Scheme and you may end up with a very low percentage of the refund you should have got.

      • Laura Kilgariff says

        I have just spoken to them. They are halting all action on current claims until. So I don’t think we will be getting anything :-( gutted I was so close.

  5. Staci says

    This is so unfair for those awaiting answers from fos. I think there should be a date in which they had a previous complaints in . Having waited almost a year for mine to be assigned i could cry and now it looks as though they will get away with so many complaints and paying people back. So much injustice

    • Laura Kilgariff says

      Im in same position. I just called Ombudsman and they are halting all current claims. So doubt we will get anything :-(

      • Staci says

        I know sad times they upheld about 3/ 4 of mine which were total at random and been waiting since
        September to be assigned to an adjucator at fos while they been waiting for stuff from
        Provident seems so unfair as the correspondance or lack of and delays in picking up cases has now screwed us over

  6. Amie says

    Oooo noooo provident have got until Wednesday to provide breakdown and cheque. Just my luck this would happen lol.

      • Amie says

        I think they will try and stall it even longer because of their current plans. Never mind. Thank you for sharing this information Sarah.

    • Andrea Young says

      I’m on day 32 adjudicator has chased them I’ve emailed them today still no cheque or breakdown they really taking their time

      • Amie says

        O dear 🤦🏼‍♀️ It’s not fair is it! Have you got a contact number for provident? I wouldn’t k ow who to call?

      • Amie says

        Good morning. How you getting on with provident? Have you herd anything yet? Iv sent emails this morning as it will be 28 days tomorrow.

        • Andrea Young says

          Sent another email this morning stating it’s over the 28 days and I got no reply back yesterday so fingers crossed today

        • Ruth says

          Hi Amie
          I also sent an email this morning but have just rang them and got put through to the complaints team. The man was very nice and said my redress will be paid by the 28 days through the proper channels and is not affected by the proposed scheme.

          • Amie says

            Iv just got told the same but obviously not within the 28 days as it’s day 27 today lol. He just said obviously it’s taking a while longer because of the current situation I told him I completely understand that. I am hoping my nice caring, considering tone won them over and they hurry it along 😂😂

  7. Vickie says

    Hi Sara,

    My complaint has been with fos for just over 4 months now. I called after reading your article to find out if it’s still awaiting an audjudicator to try and get it pushed through but she said unfortunately it is still waiting. She said they have not heard anything about this scheme but will continue to look at cases unless the company went into liquidation or administration. Is that them just not hearing about it yet? So frustrating as I’m so near the end to find out i might not even get an outcome from FOS and it end up in a scheme :(

    • Bev says

      Hi my case has been with the ombudsman since 6/11/2020 I hadn’t heard from them since I sent my case in, I decided to ring them today to see what was happening they told me it hasn’t even been picked up yet,

      • Laura Kilgariff says

        I just spoke to them. My case was being looked at. They have advised me that any claims they have are now being halted. Letters will be sent out to advice.

  8. Linda says

    Hi Sara sorry I have just had a letter telling me my redress from provident after they agreed with the FOS, they said my cheque should be with me in 14days do you think I will be ok and still get the cheque

      • Linda says

        It’s 28days tomorrow but I did keep ringing them. Just hope I get the cheque soon as it’s a large redress

    • Sara (Debt Camel) says

      I hope so. But all I can say is do not make plans for what to do with the money just in case it doesn’t.

      • Linda says

        Thank you I thought the cases that have been agreed with the FOS by provident should be ok, am I reading this in correctly

  10. Jo says

    What happens if they’ve already had the 8 weeks and you’ve sent it to the ombudsman but not been picked up yet? (As I hear it’s taking a while)

    • Sara (Debt Camel) says

      I don’t expect Provident will be replying to your complaint. Or supplying a case file to FOS.
      Do you still owe them any money?

      • Alyson says

        If mine is with the fos and have received the file off them already will my claim still go through as normal do you think

        • Sara (Debt Camel) says

          I think you have to assume it is very unlikely you will get a good result.

          Do you still owe them any money?

      • Jo says

        No nothing it was all paid up in 2018. It’s my mother-in-laws she’s only a pensioner. Providents 8weeks are up on the 23rd of March.

  11. Issy says

    Absolutely disgusting how these company’s treat people , they get away with it time and time again , so I’ve basically wasted my time , and it’s not fair as the fos have been sitting on my case since December!!

    • Amie says

      I wouldn’t worry to much just yet. Providents first court hearing isn’t until 22nd April, from what I have been reading it Sounds like a very long winded process and provident have got to win at the courts plus it can go to customer votes. Fingers crossed your claim
      Is picked up soon

  12. abdul hussain says

    i have just read on the provident website under the scheme Faqs that: i have received a decision from the FOS, but have not received a settlement offer from you within two weeks?

    You do not need to take any action, unless you have a different claim.
    You will be paid any amount in the FOS decision in full.

    so you should get your cheque, fingers cross

    • Sara (Debt Camel) says

      Yes I know. I think this refers to Ombudsman decisions, not adjudicator decisions.
      But if Provident has said they will accept an adjudicator decison I hope this mean they will pay out in full.

      There has been a lot of argument and some disappointments in similar situations with Amigo, so until the Provident cheque turns up, no-one should rely on it.

    • Amie says

      Thanks, this sounds promising. So if provident have already agreed with the adjudicaters decision they will most likely still pay out?

  13. Leslie says

    I just received a cheque this morning, but it was a really low offer and put in a complaint with FOS 2 weeks ago when the 8 weeks was up. Provident said if I cash the cheque that it will be final settlement. After todays announcement my head is spinning on whether or not to just cash the cheque.

    • Sara (Debt Camel) says

      Horrible decision.

      How large is the cheque? Do you know how much interest you paid on all your Provident loans? how many loans were there?

      • Leslie says

        The offer was around 3000, I paid over 9000 in interest and provident only upheld 5 out of 20 loans and they were r of the smaller loans.

        • Linda says

          Yes…provident just sent me a cheque without me accepting it. I still have the cheque but my complaint is with the ombudsman now, not sure what to do

          • Terri says

            I cashed my cheque and recently had my complaint upheld by an adjudicator at fos. Provident have agreed with the adjudicator and I’m now just waiting for final settlement. There is no harm in cashing on the basis that the fos will either agree with what provident have already done or ask for further payment to be made

    • Michelle says

      Have you cashed the cheque? I still have mine and unsure what to do Its a tricky situation.

  14. Charles says

    Good afternoon Sara

    My case is already at the FOS but they have not picked it but they have received the file from Provident.

    Given that they are going to court for this scheme on 22/04/2021, I don’t think FOS would have made a decision on my case. Will the scheme affect my case?

    Thanks

    Charles

    • Sara (Debt Camel) says

      It sounds as though your complaint may end up falling into the Scheme if it goes ahead in July.
      Do you currently owe a balance to Provident?

      • Charles says

        Thank you Sara.

        Provident’s final response to me was that all my loans were affordable as the agent did not report difficulties in paying back even though the last seven loans ended up on DMP. But they said they they will write them off as a gesture of good will. They have indeed written them off and stopped accepting payment from my DMP company. They have also removed the loans from my credit file.

        As they responded after 56 days, I had already referred my case to FOS. When I got their response, I also forwarded it to FOS telling them I was not happy with Provident’s decision. I have called FOS a few times and they have confirmed they have everything and they are waiting to allocate an adjudicator.

        It is over four months since referring my case to FOS. I pray they allocate an adjudicator and I get a decision before the scheme comes into force.

        • Sara (Debt Camel) says

          I think this is very unlikely. You should not assume that you will get any refund from this – there may be a tiny amount in mid 2022 if your claim is upheld in the Scheme.

    • Linda says

      Hi Im the same my complaint is currently with the FOS and only went to them a few weeks ago, so I doubt my complaint will be dealt with before this scheme happens.
      What do you advise? I do have a cheque off provident which they offered me before it went to the FOS, should I just cash this, or this will this be classed as be excepting their offer?

  15. Hugo says

    They should be forced to pay out in full if not and they continue giving new loans that just perpetuates the misery for NEW customers the best is if their license is revoked and the business sold to a better organisation with HONEST interest rates and fair proportionate fees and constructive help.

  16. abdul hussain says

    Hi Sara

    The complaint flow chart that has been put up on the provident website , and they state ‘You will be paid in full outside the scheme, for upheld complaints by the FOS, but doesn’t states whether it is adjudicator or the ombudsman decision. maybe both is ok i guess. And the same applies to upheld claims made by provident directly recently, they will also be paid in full outside the scheme. any others that are still waiting decision from provident or with the FOS, will be dealt within the scheme, next month after court date.

    This is such as shame for those who are waiting for decision, really sad news.

  17. Margo says

    Hello Sara, I know we tried complaining about Provident few years back. Me and my husband had loans with different lenders at that time. I believe case was with FOS but can’t find any email with final answer from Ombudsman. Should we complain again to provident. Other question is about Barclays Card. I know they reduced my balance recently but can I still complaint about not being affordable?

    • Sara (Debt Camel) says

      Your comments on here were all back in 2016 and you never mentioned Provident. I didn’t have a page about Provident until late 2017. Are you sure you ever complained about them?

      BarclayCard. I know they reduced my balance recently but can I still complaint about not being affordable?
      Yes possibly. See https://debtcamel.co.uk/refunds-catalogue-credit-card/

      • Margo says

        Thanks to you website we did push with lenders and won with some and with some not. We did try with Provident, I saw emails from adjudicator but not from Ombudsman. So now I don’t know if we can complaint again or not.

        I will try with Barclays, where should I send my complaint, please?

        Sara and thank you for all your work in here!!
        Can’t even imagine how many people had turn their lives around because of what you are doing!

        • Sara (Debt Camel) says

          So the adjudicator rejected your Provident complaint and you did not ask for it to go to be looked at by an Ombudsman? It would not be too late to go back to FOS about that. You can’t make the same complaint now to Provident. If the Scheme goes ahead 9won’t be known until July) you may be able to claim in that, but may be barred by your previous complaint. If your complaint is upheld in the Scheme it is possible you may only get 2% of your true refund, see https://debtcamel.co.uk/provident-scheme-tiny-refunds/
          So generally not good news but you will have to wait and see how things go to see if you can make a second complaint.

          Barclaycard – as you have an open account, you could use the secure message facility to complain. Chase if you don’t get a replt within 8 weeks. Any further questions on the https://debtcamel.co.uk/refunds-catalogue-credit-card/ page please.

  18. Sam says

    Hi Sara I’ve just read about this provident have got till tomorrow to reply to the fos if they accept there findings what are my chances of them agreeing and being paid out before the scheme happens thanks

      • Sam says

        Thanks Sara I received a email from fos last night and they said provident have replied saying because they agreed to the fos before the scheme news as a good will gesture my claim will be paid out in full and will not be part of the scheme So hopefully I’ll get my redness breakdown and cheque in next 4 weeks thanks

  19. Ruth says

    Hi
    I’m on day 7 of 28 of waiting for a breakdown and cheque from Provident after they agreed with FOS decision. Will this affect this in any way as on the website it does say that Provident will pay any FOS decision already agreed? Would it be advisable to also phone Provident to see if I can now cash this cheque as part payment?

    • Amie says

      I can’t find this info on the website. I’m on day 26 of waiting for breakdown and cheque it would be fitting wouldn’t it after going through all this lengthy process to only get a fraction of what we are owed or nothing at all.

    • Sara (Debt Camel) says

      Yes you can ask Provident. Other people have said they pay you a lower amount as they assume you will cash the cheque, but I am not certain if that always happens.

  20. Lauren says

    Ive received my email from fos stating my unaffordable loans, provident have also agreed, they’ve got until the 30th of this month to contact me with the amount. Will I fall into this new scheme? Tia

    • Sara (Debt Camel) says

      As Provident have agreed, I hope they will payout now and in full. But don’t bank on getting this cheque until it arrives!

  21. Alan Brookes says

    I sent a complaint into provident mand they replied to me asking for all my details and past addresses and customer number I gave them my details and told them i can no longer remember mr customer number they asked for all of this on 3 separate occasions, now they are saying they can’t find my details . What can I do now

  22. Timbouk says

    Provident did not upheld my original complaint and said they would not investigate further unless I provided new evidence. As the evidence I required was the recording of my loan applications I requested the last three application recordings. Provident then came back and said they did not have record of the recordings so I opened a new complaint that recordings have been lost so I can’t provide further evidence for my original complaint. Today they have upheld my complaint about the recordings and still not upheld my original complaint. Despite upholding my complaint about the loss of recordings they are not offering anything in compensation or goodwill. Is it worth sending this to the ombudsman?

    • Sara (Debt Camel) says

      I doubt you will get anywhere with FOS, there isn’t enough time. But you can re-submit a complaint to Provident Scheme (assuming it goes ahead) and hope they accept it the second time around.

  23. Lesley says

    I still owe provident money, what would possibly happen with my case?? Its currently with fos.

    • Sara (Debt Camel) says

      are you making payments at the moment?
      how many previous loans did you have from them?

      • Lesley says

        I owe provident for one loan, I’m paying it off monthly at 20 pounds since that’s all I can afford. I’ve had many loans from provident always getting bigger. Its been with the fos since last year about November time, I’ve asked for an update the fos has my file from provident and i have been waiting to be assigned an adjudicator

    • Sara (Debt Camel) says

      from what you say In that case you probably have a strong affordability complaint and would normally get your balance written off and a decent cash refund – but if the proposed Scheme goes ahead you will only get a tiny amount of that back :(

      The best thing is probably to stop paying them anything now. Every £20 you pay them, you may get back less than £2 of…

      In the Scheme you will get your balance written off if your complaint is upheld. If they go bust the same would apply, so you don’t need to worry about that.

  24. Leanne moore says

    I had an email last month to say an adjudicator had reviewed my case and agreed my loans were issued irresponsibly and I was due a refund of the interest from my last 5 loans plus 8% interest. Provident accepted this and I am currently waiting to hear from them about how much I will get refunded to me. After reading this report I emailed Provident to ask if this would still happen and the reply I received stated that if they have agreed on a settlement via the FOS before 7am on 15th March 2021, that will be honoured and customers will still receive their full settlement amount.

    • Ruth says

      Hi Leanne

      Please do you have the email address that you used as I am in the same predicament

      TIA

    • Amie says

      This is very reassuring. Thank you for that. Who did you email? I really don’t know who to contact regarding provident.

          • Leanne moore says

            I had another email from them this morning to say I will get my full amount, they’re just working out the figures now and will hear from them again before the end of the week with a settlement figure.

          • Leanne moore says

            Not yet. I emailed them this morning to ask if it is near completion but not yet had a reply. Feel like they’re dragging it out for as long as possible, really hoping I get a reply soon.

          • Amie says

            Hi Leanne I have emailed them every day this week lol. And some woman from provident is chasing it for me and she does reply to my emails quite frequently. I emailed Jeffery but it’s a woman who is replying to me. My figures are still not ready 🤦🏼‍♀️ Day 31 now. It’s a complete nightmare isn’t it. I will call and email again Monday. Any joy with yours yet?

  25. Cj says

    The fos upheld 17 out of 19 loans now I’m waiting for breakdown..does this mean I wont get what they agreed with the fos and they not gonna do this within 28 days

    • Cj says

      I’ve seen the flow chart it says that if fos decision accepted before today then we would be paid outside the scheme in full..what are the chances of this happening

      • Sara (Debt Camel) says

        well it should happen – I am just saying don’t organise your life around that cheque arriving.

    • Sara (Debt Camel) says

      I think if they have accepted the FOS decision they should pay you. But I would feel more comfortable if an amount had been agreed.

      • Cj says

        I’ll ring them tomorrow I think. I’ve emailed twice in two weeks and they havent replied..now I know why

    • Staci says

      I rang fos yesterday and got told their basically not even looking at cases now that have been in for ages until they understand more about the scheme—— end of april by the timeline- its so unfair for those who have been fighting this for ages, court shudnt allow it and fos in my eyes seemed to know this was coming as took soooo long to assign cases . Shocking. Been screwed right over

  27. Claire A says

    Hi Sara

    I’m a bit confused about what to do in my circumstances. I made an unaffordability complaint to Glo guarantor loans (part of Provident) last year. The rejected it so in May 2020 I escalated to the FOS. I’ve chased it a few times since then and I’ve been told they have accessed my case file from Glo but it hasn’t been assigned yet.

    Although I am absolutely crushed, I am assuming that my complaint will end up in the scheme which I can cope with. However I still have a balance with Glo, I should be paying £177 a month but due to Covid this is reduced to £60 at the agreement of Glo. I have a balance of around £1500 left to pay. I’m not sure if I ought to contact Glo and ask for a further reduction – because if it’s decided in my favour I won’t actually get this money I’m paying now refunded, if that makes sense? Like assuming I pay another £500 before any decision is made, I was ok with that before as I was anticipating it would be refunded in cash if my claim was successful but now I know that won’t be the case I feel like I’m just throwing money at them?

    Any advice would be massively appreciated as I really appreciate what you do here.

    • Claire A says

      Sorry what I meant to say was – I realise you answer this at the top and suggest stop paying them but mine is a guarantor loan so I obviously don’t want them to chase my guarantor or have this effect his credit file.

  29. Karen says

    Hi Sara,
    I received a response from the FOS adjudicator last Friday upholding loans 4-14 from provident. Provident have until 26th March to respond to FOS.
    Does this mean my claim will now go into the scheme? My FOS decision was before 15th March 2021.
    I can’t believe I’ve waited all this time for this to happen. It’s so unfair 😡

  30. Annie says

    My case is with ombudsman it’s classed as priority will this mean after a year half waiting I will end up in scheme of arrangement I doing it through allegiant

    I’ve had my file everything had gone to ombudsman in January case ongoing since July 2020 so what does this Provident news mean to my claim has it Ben a total waste of time I have suffer d mentally and am on medication because of all the strain will this make any diff fos is aware and case is highlighted as a priority case

  31. schd j says

    Hi,
    I used your letter to contact Provident and I received a response detailing the 23 loans I’ve had since 2005. In total I’ve borrowed £21,700 and repaid £48,364.90 – £26,664 in interest.

    They’ve replied to say they don’t believe they were irresponsibly lent etc and its closed…

    I can go to ombudsman if I choose to – so I want to do that but I want to put myself in the best situation to claim. I borrowed multiple loans to repay old loans as they fell behind etc – and I’d say definitely 3, more likely 14 loans were repaid with funds from new loans.

    Are there any guides or help to follow up with the ombudsman?

    Thanks for all your help :)

    • Jayne says

      Hi dj,
      Wow, I think this is the biggest claim I’ve seen on here.
      I would suggest you send to FOS asap, they usually take around 4 months before they’re assigned to an adjudicator.

      Good luck!

    • Sara (Debt Camel) says

      You can send it to FOS but realistically given the news about the proposed Scheme it is unlikely it will get progressed by FOS. Even if FOS want to, there are thousands of cases in the queue ahead of you – unless you have some reason to be treated as a priority case by FOS?

      Do you still owe them any money?

  32. Maria says

    I was very lucky then. I received a cheque for a five figure sum from Provident via the Ombudsman. The only delay to me was that the cheque was issued in the incorrect name. I hadn’t realised Provident has always incorrectly spelled my Christian name. It took a month for the cheque to be reissued. But it was a life changing amount of money for me. From the letter from the Ombudsman to payment was approximately two months and quite a few telephone calls and emails.

  33. Jade says

    Hi Sara,
    My complaint was accepted through fos last Monday so I am currently waiting for Provident to send breakdown and redress through the post. Do you think I will be affected by the recent news?
    Thanks so much

    • Sara (Debt Camel) says

      It should be ok – see the comments here, other people have been told they will be paid.

  34. Amie says

    So I have just had an email from my adjudicator saying they are not dealing with any provident cases old and new. So I guess it’s up to me now to keep on at provident for my breakdown and cheque as it’s 28 days tomorrow.

  35. kirsty says

    I am so angry, I am owed over £8000 with provident, my complaint has been with FOS since beginning of October. Provident have dragged there heels for so long and now I probably wont get anything :-( I was made redundant last year and had to give up my house and move back in with my parent, this was my light at the end of a very dark tunnel. Heart-breaking, feel so sorry for everyone who was close to having there case picked up by a handler. FOS have put all provident complaints on hold.

  36. Ruth says

    Hi
    I’ve just spoke to my adjudicator who said Provident have said they will honour agreements made before yesterday morning. I’ve then just phoned provident who are being vague about whether they will honour it or not so I asked if I could cash the cheque I have here in part payment and the lady said yes but is unable to confirm that in writing 😤😤😤 is there anything at all I can do?

      • Ruth says

        I have actually just received an email stating that I am able to cash the cheque with no impact on the agreed FOS decision apart from deducting the amount already cashed after speaking to a very helpful man in the complaint department

          • Ruth says

            Yes Amie that’s all I did and he put me through to a very helpful man in the complaints department. He said I can ring up whenever I want to see if they have a final figure for me yet but the notes on my file say that it needs to be completed by 6 April

  37. Cj says

    I spoke to someone at provident this morning ..this person was working from home and to be honest I don’t think she knew what was happening

  38. Dave R says

    Hi Sara
    For those of us with FOS cases awaiting allocation to a case handler – do you know how this would impact credit records? As if the complaint is on hold and not moving for the foreseeable – we’re potentially stuck with loans on our records for even longer. Is there any grounds to reach out to the CRAs and request the data is suppressed until scheme situation with Provident/Satsuma is confirmed?

    • Sara (Debt Camel) says

      do you know how this would impact credit records?
      sorry, how what would affect your credit record? Making a claim in the scheme? or stopping paying? or what?

      Is there any grounds to reach out to the CRAs and request the data is suppressed until scheme situation with Provident/Satsuma is confirmed?
      No, I don’t think so.

      • Dave R says

        Just in terms of having a complaint of unaffordable lending for settled loans over a few years. Satsuma rejected my claim so I took it to the FOS in January. Was hoping to have a response from the FOS within the next few months and have adverse information eventually removed from my credit file if successful as a result. But since the FOS will now be pausing on these complaints – it looks like I’ll have to wait until either the scheme is rejected or approved before I can potentially get information potentially remove…

        • Sara (Debt Camel) says

          I think you should assume you would not get a resolution from the Scheme this year.
          How many Satsuma loans did you have and how large?
          You have a had a lot of success with other lenders, this one may prove trickier.

          • Dave R says

            I had three with them, £200, £400 (which was given whilst the first was still live) and then £800 but that was about a year later..

  39. Amie says

    Right then, so I have just came off the phone to provident. Firstly they said they had got no complaints on their system going from my current address so then I gave them my previous address. Then I got out on hold they said had I got the ref number (I couldn’t find it) got put on hold again they then said they couldn’t find my case! Got out on hold again! at this point I found the ref number so someone else came onto the phone and before they could speak I said Iv got my reference o gave them my reference and they went through things with me about the scheme dated back to when they spoke to FOS and said my compliant will be honoured as it was done within the time frame but may take a little while longer to sort been as tho we are on day 27 now and I haven’t received anything. He said I should receive my breakdown and cheque soon. (We will see)

    • Cj says

      Fingers crossed for you I’m in day 13…my acceptance of offer was not showing on my account ..only the fos letter staying what provident should do .. I asked do I need to get another copy of acceptance email sent to them as fos sent this to them on 3rd march..she said no there is a backlog of email and even though email wasnt on my file the 28 days would.start from 3rd march…I so hope they keep there word ..as should be large redress

      • Amie says

        It felt like to me that they were trying to get out of it they told me they couldn’t find my account, then they couldn’t find my compliant! Luckily I put the laptop on and got all the old emails up to find the case number once I gave it to them they were like. O yes I can see we last had contact with the FOS on the 17th Feb. Hopefully our wait isn’t to much longer now

  40. Issy says

    I’ve just spoken to someone from the ombudsman apparently everyone with a complaint with provident are getting an email saying everything put on hold until they see the outcome from the vote of scheme of arrangement, Disgusting how th it s can happen , so looks like everyone will get next to nothing like the other companies who are allowed to do the same 👎

    • Amie says

      It is terrible isn’t it! Especially for those who haven’t yet had their complaint picked up by an adjudicator. There’s still hope for the the ones who have had their complaint upheld and provident have agreed but even that is 100% guaranteed. It could change at any time

  41. Issy says

    I’m disgusted this can even happen , also did you know provident owe other credit services which cannot be held accountable, so they basically just don’t want to pay people what they owe money to , they are thieves the lot if them !!

    • Sara (Debt Camel) says

      I agree. Provident Financial Groups owns the very profitable Vanquis credit card and the profitable Moneybarn car finance lender. But this is also structured through company subsidiaries so they can close the Provident doorstep lending one down and walk away from their obligations to the customers they mis-sold loans to.

      If Provident wanted, it could just carry on using the profits from Vanquis to pay oput on provident claims. Or it could ask the shareholders to contribute through a rights issue, in which case there would be a LOT more money in the pot for paying refunds than the current pathetic £50m.

      But Provident would rather not annoy its shareholders and doesn’t care if you get scraps.

      There was a very nice editorial in the Times this morning about it. I am afraid this link https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/provident-boss-is-playing-hardball-nsbqj0qdv?shareToken=22b42df9583c3a956a894dff119d7bda won’t work unless you have a subscription but it ends by saying:
      If Provident’s not set on trashing its reputation, it should pay up. This sort of carry-on is as subprime as the business.

      • Issy says

        Unbelievable isn’t it how they can get away with it , but even if the DONT win the vote they will just let it go into administration and everyone will get nothing , how do these people sleep at nite 🙄

        • Sara (Debt Camel) says

          Well that isn’t quite true. Anyone who owes Provident money will have the right of set-off in administration against the refund they should have got.

      • Stu says

        First Amigo and now Provident. I have claims in with the FOS for both companies for historic lending and they are both looking at Schemes of Arrangement now – with Provident, it is likely my complaint would fall into the Scheme as it was made in October 2020 but didn’t go to FOS until late Dec 2020 and I don’t think it has been picked up yet, as they were still waiting for a file from Provident, three weeks after the deadline the FOS set them. My Amigo loan will be similar.

        It has happened with other providers I have used over the years too who have either gone down this route or into administration.

        Thankfully these are all historic claims and I don’t use any of these loans now but there are people who continue to – and they are not getting the money they are rightfully owed if irresponsible lending is found, which can often be a lifeline.

        If companies have been lending irresponsibly, why should such they be able to pay back a few pence in the pound and still continue to trade (if that is what happens here) – and ultimately continue to make money?

        What sort of message does this send to companies who lend money at high interest rates? It will set a dangerous precedent where lenders can hold customers over a barrel when it comes to paying compensation.

        It isn’t all negative from me though. Sites like Debt Camel do an amazing job and it is clear that your work Sara is helping hundreds, if not thousands of people. So thank you!

  42. Kelly McCandless says

    I would like to start by thanking Sara and everyone else here for all the amazing advice. Finaly received a cheque from provident this morning £12.5K. They sent me a breakdown last week which I didnt think was right (I have a figure of £17.5k) so asked them to send me a breakdown for each loan. Of course they ignored this and sent cheque stating once banked this would be final. I contacted vanquis who my last 4 loans were sold to (provident were to buy these back and use in calculations) Vanquis states provident have not been in touch and they still have the debt. In provident calculations they have deducted £436 for outstanding agreements????. I have emailed ombudsman again as this was part of desision, but should I bank cheque? In light of yesterdays announcement, should I be thankful in what I got or push them for the other 5k and debt written off?

    • Sara (Debt Camel) says

      you should definitely cash the cheque but tell Provident that they have not bought back the Vanquis debt or taken into account the payments you have made to Vanquis. And tell your adjudicator what has happened.

      • Kelly McCandless says

        Thanks Sara, I have contacted the adjudicator again and also smile to Neil Iveson on the phone ( he was very very helpful) he is going to look into it for me. He is also going to provide a loan by loan breakdown and check the calculations for me. Told me to bank the cheque and if anything else Is due it would be payed to me.

  43. Abdul says

    Hi
    Just to let u know that the adjudicater at fos upheld my complaint on the 5th jan 2021, then provident agreed and sent my breakdown letter offering £3049. 1920 was redress of the two loans i took in 2012 and then sold to cabot and ended with ccj. Whats interesting is i borrowed 1920 and paid only 900 back then debt sold to cabot. The letter arrived in the 5th feb and check was to follow in 14 days. Check arrived saturday 13th, i put it in my tsb account on monday 15th and i have just checked my account and the cheque has cleared and money in my account. I was scared when i heard about tje scheme and thought my cheque would be cancell. Looks like if u are expecteding breakdown or cheque you will get paid full amount.

    • Amie says

      A bit of good news, there’s still hope for those that have reached the stage of receiving an offer.

      Thanks Abdul

      • Andrea says

        Hi Aime
        DiD you receive your breakdown ? Mine got emailed to be yesterday so keeping my fingers crossed a cheque will arrive in 14 days , I am so nervous with not knowing for sure . Good luck

        • Amie says

          Nope not yet, I got an email from provident today saying they are looking into my case and will shortly give me their outcome. This worries me a bit because the outcome is to send me a cheque and breakdown so I hope this is what they are referring to lol. They also asked what was my chosen email address I use as I put the claim in through resolver so there’s an email to go through them too. They did email me on my personal email so I said this was my chosen email. Hopefully I’ll get my breakdown soon 🤯.

          • Andrea Young says

            Try not to worry it took 33 days for them to sort my breakdown . Fingers crossed for us all it’s awful waiting isn’t it

          • Amie says

            Hi Andrea, I emailed provident again today and the reply was: I am still waiting on some additional information and then I can send the figures over to management for approval then I will send you an outcome via email.

            Sounds like they are finally working on a breakdown figure unless they are just saying that to fob me off lol 😂

  44. Kelly McCandless says

    Hi Sara, if provident do get the scheme of arrangement could I make a claim for my mum who passed away in 2014. I was going to start a complaint but seems pointless, but obviously they will have lot of customers who are no longer with us, will they contact families under the scheme?

    • Sara (Debt Camel) says

      I think you should be able to make a claim for your mum in a Scheme in theory. But whether you know enough information to get through Provident’s identity checks, I don’t know.

  45. Susan Holcroft says

    Provident were in touch with me they did not go back far enough it was in the 1990sthey need to go back to

    • Sara (Debt Camel) says

      These affordability complaints can’t be made about loans before April 2007. This isn’t some made up limit by Provident, it is based in law.

  46. Sco tee says

    It’s disgusting that there allowed to do this when vanquis etc are still making millions. Sounds like they’re exploiting the rules to save themselves money! I have a claim with the fos but provident dragged their heals “COVID” etc played every extension to the very last day and then offered a substantially lower offer than my claims company said I should receive. Sounds like provident are just playing the system.

  47. Issy says

    I totally agree with you, they shouldn’t be allowed to even attempt to do this ,!! 😤

  48. Shelly says

    What do I do with this cheque from Provident Do I cash it or maybe end up losing out its a difficult one.

    • Sara (Debt Camel) says

      I agree it’s tricky. But if you look back through the comments here, quite a few people have been told by FOS or Provident they can cash the cheque and carry on with their complaint? So you could try to talk to FOS or Provident? Or you could decide you just want the certainty of that money in your bank account now?

      • Ruth says

        Hi Shelly
        I spoke to Provident on the phone yesterday who agreed I could cash my cheque with no consequence to my complaint and they also sent me an email stating this had what had been discussed.

  49. R says

    Hi Sara,
    I am in a similar situation [to Lesley] with them. Complaint with FOS and have reduced payments on two loans. If I stop paying would they refer it to a debt collection agency and default the loan?

  50. Mr A McClelland says

    I’m still waiting 6 months now.
    Provident are a discusting company. They have plenty of money. They own other Vanquis credit & credit cards.
    Its one Big ” Not to pay it’s customers out in full Con”.

  51. Gemma says

    Hi. My 8 weeks with Provident was up yesterday. I just want to know if I should still send to FOS (as Provident haven’t replied) with the scheme that looks imminent. Or is there no point now?
    Many thanks.

    • Sara (Debt Camel) says

      See article above for more about the provident Scheme.
      I don’t think FOS will take any more provident complaints at the moment.
      Do you still owe them money?

      • Gemma says

        Yes, about £3000 but it is with Moorcroft debt collection.

        I’ve just checked my credit report and it’s listed with Vanquis bank. I’ve had letters in the past with Vanquis so it is correct. But I pay and liaise with Moorcroft.

    • Sara (Debt Camel) says

      ok so that looks as though Moorcroft are collecting on behalf of Vanquis.

      There is some complicated stuff in Provident’s Scheme about what may happen when a debt has been sold to a debt collector – its in the Statement at 6.8-6.10 if you want to look . Technically your debt was probably sold to Vanquis. But Vanquis is another part of the Provident group so I would hope that in the Provident Scheme, any refund you should receive from Provident would be used to offset your Vanquis debt.

      Did you have a lot of loans from provident before this last defaulted one?

      • Gemma says

        I don’t know how many loans I had cause they have never sent me that information. If I had to guess, I would say 10 or 12 and all of them were refinanced.
        The debt with Vanquis/moorcroft now for £3000 is for the last 2 loans I had but it is always communicated as 1 sum that I owe. It shows on my credit report as 2 though.
        I’ll have a look at that information, thank you.
        Where should I go from here? Should I wait til the scheme starts and apply that way?
        I honestly don’t even care about getting any money back, I just want that debt sorted. Is that unrealistic now though?

      • Gemma says

        Okay, I’ll look, thank you.
        I had probably 10 or 12 loans, all refinanced. And this last one with Vanquis/Moorcroft is actually for my last 2 loans.
        Where do I go from here? I honestly don’t want any money off them, I just want these debts to be sorted. Is that unrealistic though?

        • Sara (Debt Camel) says

          ok, so this is obviously very rough, but with a lot of loans it is pretty likely the last three should be decided to be unaffordable in a complaint. If this was going to the Ombudsman or an adminsitrator I would say you are pretty safe in assuming that. We have no idea how Provident is going to decide these cases but i would hope you will be OK.

          how much are you paying to Moorcroft? Is it affordable or causing you problems?

          do you have a lot of other debts as well?

          • Gemma says

            I’m only paying £1 a week so it’s not affecting me but it will take about 30 years to clear.
            So I need to wait for the scheme to be set up isit and apply that way?

            I used to but the last few years I’ve cleared a lot of it. I probably have another £2000 on top of this provident debt.

        • Sara (Debt Camel) says

          So you are paying a tiny amount, it’s probably easier to let that continue as its affordable.

          If the Scheme goes ahead they may sweep your complaint into it automatically or it may be you need to apply to the Scheme.
          Exactly the same applies if the Scheme doesn’t go ahead and they go into administration. – the administrators may teat you as automatically having a claim or you may need to submit a claim.

          I can’t guess if the refund on the earlier loans would clear your balance as it is a large one – but i would hope it should clear a lot.

          For you the only interesting question is, are Provident more likely to uphold more of your loan in the scheme or the administrators in administration? Because if you might do better in administration, you should probably vote against the Scheme if it gets to the voting stage… but by then we may know a lot more, so you don’t have to make this decision now.

          • Gemma says

            I’m sure people tell you all the time but you are amazing.
            Thank you so much for your time and wealth of knowledge. I really appreciate it X

  52. Stef says

    Hi Sara,
    I’m still paying 2 loans with Satsuma. I only had 3 loans from them for £100, £1000 and £600 between April 2017 and Jan 2018. They approved the £600 while I was still paying off the £1000 loan.
    I made an affordability complaint but they didn’t uphold my complaint at the time but sadly because I didn’t know better I didn’t send the complaint to FOS. I have paid more than I have borrowed from them so my question is, do I continue paying them (around £60 a month – the amount is affordable to me)?

        • Martin says

          I did the same unfortunately complained to them regarding two loans I took out with them being unaffordable to me. I didn’t send to the FOS within 6 months. There is no point now is there?

  53. Rach says

    Hi Sara,

    I have a complaint with the FOS. I’m currently in a repayment plan on two loans £30 on each a month. Both are under the amount I originally borrowed. I did have three loans at one time paying £199 on each. What will happen if I stop paying? I am more concerned about my credit file than the refund. I was hoping to pay them off in the summer as they are the last bad things in my credit file. Accounts are not defaulted just late markers every month.

    Thanks
    Rach

    • Sara (Debt Camel) says

      Did you have three loans in total? or a lot more loans and these 3 the last ones that defaulted?

      • Rach says

        Hi Sara,
        I had a lot more in total. The last three I had at the same time. The loans are not defaulted, I’m in a payment plan with them.

  54. Andrsa says

    Got a cheque today , been straight to the bank to deposit it , fingers crossed all will be ok till it clears . This has all been a worrying time since last June. Good luck to everyone hope you all get what your owed

    • Linda says

      Hi can I just ask how long you waited fir cheque after breakdown, did you get within the 14 days

      • Andrea says

        Hi I waited 34 days for breakdown got by email Monday and got my cheque today so it was really quick

        • Linda says

          Ok thanks for reply I got my breakdown within 28days so cheque should be here no later then the 29th March I’m keeping everything crossed as it’s a large amount , thanks for your reply

    • Amie says

      Brilliant news! It didn’t take them long to get that to you once you received your breakdown. My breakdown is being sorted apparently they just waiting on a some more information then the figures can be sent to the Manager for him to to pass it off then the are going to email me with my outcome. Just wished they would hurry up now

  56. Laura says

    I have had the FOS decide that I am owed around £1500 from provident for 3 loans that they shouldn’t have lent, provident have until 25th March to get back to the FOS on their decision. Are provident likely to agree with the FOS? And if so how long do they have to pay out?

    Thanks

    • Sara (Debt Camel) says

      I don’t know. What used to happen is no guide to what will happen now. I hope they uphold the FOS decision and pay you – let us know!

  57. Emma says

    i was with provident for approx. 15 years , i no longer am, i was also with greenwoods for approx. 8 years again i am no longer am , i received an email this morning regarding the scheme i still have my payment books i have no idea where to go from here.

    • Sara (Debt Camel) says

      Hi Emma,

      Anyone who has borrowed for that long probably has an excellent affordability case. It is good news that you have got your books as if Provident has trouble finding your records, they will help.

      It is a massive shame you did not hear of these complaints before as you could potentailly have got many thousands of pounds back. Now in the proposed Scheme it seems likely you will only get a tiny amount of that, see https://debtcamel.co.uk/provident-scheme-tiny-refunds/. Although the FCA may make Provident improve the offer – let’s hope so!

      The proposed Scheme will only look at loans after April 2007.

      You do not need to do anything at the moment. The Scheme won’t come into effect until late July if it approved then. You can send Provident a complaint now or wait until the Scheme opens and submit your claim then.

      • emma says

        i received an email this morning , regard the scheme , i knew nothing of this until i checked my emails any way i just thought it may of been a scam until i google it and came across this forum

      • emma says

        who do i contact at provident to make a complaint regarding this ? any help would be grateful

  58. Jade says

    Hi All,
    Do you know if you receive your breakdown of redress by post, or email?
    Eagerly waiting for it to come through!
    Thanks and good luck everyone

      • Ruth says

        Hi
        I have just phoned Provident even tho I’m only on day 10 and she said that my breakdown has been posted out today and should arrive tomorrow or Monday but she gave me the figure over the phone and it is exactly what I worked it out to be so it does look like they’re honouring any agreements already made before Monday

        • Jade says

          Oh really! I’m on day 12 so don’t know whether to expect it by email, or post!
          I first put my complaint in on 29th Jan 2020 so over a year! Just want to get it over with now x

        • Amie says

          That’s brilliant! I don’t understand why they are dragging their feet with some people. I’ll call them again on Monday

          • Andrea says

            Hope yours isn’t much longer amie it’s very frustrating isn’t it I was 34 days for breakdown then cheque came three days later so hopefully it will be very soon for you

  59. Anne wiebke Goodfellow says

    sara can you help ironically aduticator has looked at my casevwritten to provident with a recommendation that loans 6 9 and 11 should never have been isdued whete does this leave me i found out this info today i called ombudsman and emms is going to gey my adjuducator amanda to call.me snd go tjrough evrrythihg .as its a recommendation im a prority due to health etc does this mean i wont get tje redress recommended plesse pase when im.this close i cant stand it

    • Sara (Debt Camel) says

      I am hoping that adjudicator decisions may be accepted by Provident, especially you are on the FOS priority list. This has happened with quite a few Amigo priority cases but we will have to wait and see what happens with Provident.

  60. Nate says

    I submitted an affordability complaint with Satsuma / Provident on 25/11/2020 and they just kept saying they were ‘investigating’ and to refer to the FOS. Unfortunately, I left this too late I think as only forwarded my complaint to the ombudsman the day before this scheme was announced. I guess I have lost any chance of a full payout and would have to settle for ~2% they finally offer… lost out on a £680 payout with MyJar as well – bad luck! Should have complained years ago!

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