UPDATE
In May 2022, the new Amigo Scheme was approved by the court and went live. See Amigo’s Scheme for details about this.
This page on the old Scheme is now no longer relevant. Please leave any comments and questions on that new page.
The approval process for the first Scheme (this ended in rejection)
On 30 March, the First Court Hearing gave the go-ahead for Amigo to organise the creditor voting.
An online page to vote was set up and a creditors’ meeting held.
The FCA has published a letter saying:
The FCA considers that a fair compromise could have, but in this case has not been, proposed to Scheme Creditors to vote upon. Therefore… the FCA has decided that it intends to appear at the Sanction Hearing through counsel to oppose the sanction of the Scheme, even if approved by the requisite majority of Scheme Creditors, on the basis that the Court cannot be satisfied that the Scheme in its current form is fair.
On 19 May the Second Court Hearing took place. The FCA opposed the Scheme going ahead
On 24 May the judgement in the case was published – the judge accepted the FCA’s arguments and did not approve the Scheme.
An overview of the first Scheme as it was proposed
Amigo is proposing a Scheme because it can’t afford to pay refunds to all the customers who were given unaffordable loans. It says it will go into administration if the Scheme is not approved.
Amigo says customers may get a cash refund of about 10% of their proper refund value. I think the amount may be lower.
Customers with a current loan, however, will be able to have the full amount of their refund deducted from their balance and their guarantor released in the Scheme if Amigo upholds their claim. And they can also get this if Amigo went into administration if the administrators uphold their claim.
About a million Amigo customers have been texted or emailed about the Scheme. This includes current customers – the borrowers and guarantors for the current 137,000 loans – and all previous customers whose loans have been repaid. If you haven’t received an email about this, check your spam folder!
Amigo has set up a website with information for customers about the Scheme. This contains the Practice Statement Letter (PSL) which sets out more details. And a longer Explanatory Statement.
If the Scheme starts, all open FOS cases will be sent back to the Scheme.
Under the Scheme, customers can put in a claim if they have affordability complaint or if they have any other complaint about a loan or the way Amigo treated them.
There will be a six month period for these claims to be sent in after the Scheme start date. After that time you will not be allowed to make a claim in the Scheme and will not be able to take a complaint to the Ombudsman either.
Amigo will decide whether to uphold each claim:
- The Explanatory Statement lists a lot of factors that will be taken into consideration in Schedule 4.
- Will Amigo uphold the same very high rate that the Financial Ombudsman (FOS) does? It has not said this.
- Amigo will appoint an independent person to look at any appeals – you can’t go to the Financial Ombudsman.
Amigo will then calculate the redress (the legal term for the refund you would have received if there wasn’t a Scheme) for the claims it upholds:
- for borrowers this is the interest they paid.
- it seems likely Amigo will be applying the “unpaid interest deduction” that it started making in summer 2020. This will reduce people’s refunds, see Amigo should end unpaid interest deductions and remove CCJs for details.
- guarantors the calculated refund will be a refund of everything they have paid.
- where a guarantor is being paid a refund, the guarantor payments are removed from the borrower’s account. If the borrower has also had a Claim upheld, interest will be removed from the borrower’s account. A borrower won’t be left worse off after this, but they may get little or no refund.
If you have a balance still owing to Amigo:
- your balance will be reduced by the refund;
- if you still owe a balance after this reduction, you can make an arrangement to repay it at a more affordable rate and your guarantor will be released;
- if the refund is larger than the balance this extra will be paid from the pot of cash Amigo is putting aside and you will only get a small percentage of it.
If you are owed a cash refund:
Customers whose loans have been repaid will have their cash refunds paid out of the pot of money Amigo is putting aside for this. But there won’t be nearly enough money to pay full refunds.
The pot will be divided up between all the people who are owed a cash refund who will all get the same “pence in the pound” percentage of their proper redress.
Amigo is putting in £15m, which could be increased by up to £20m if the balance reductions are lower than expected – this sounds unlikely to me. Amigo is proposing that it will add 15% of its profits in the next four years into this refund pot. As Amigo is currently loss-making this sounds like some jam in a few years, or possibly none at all.
Amigo says people may get paid 10% of their proper refund in the Scheme. On my figures, it could be even less, possibly as low as 5%.
clare says
Good Evening all,
I just wanted to share with you some information that I am hoping that some may find useful.
I had three loans with amigo, back in September after only 3 weeks amigo said my 3rd loan was unaffordable, wiped my exisiting balance and paid me over 5k cash in redress. However, they did take away 2.3k in an unpaid interest charge.
I accepted the money but then sent the complaint to the FO. This was done in November.
Last week FO and Amigo upheld my second complaint. I was paid full redress on loans 1 and 2 and refunded the full unpaid interest charge.
FO agreed that the unpaid interest deductions that are being made are unfair.
I believe it have been dealt with so swiftly because FO deemed my case as urgent and prioritised it, they told me that cases that have been prioritised do seem to be getting dealt with by Amigo, so that may offer hope to some.
In total I had my 3 balance wiped off and 11k in redress.
However my case was simple as I never had any guarantors payments or issues.
Sara your website is a god send and offers help to so many. It’s changed my life getting this resolved and I can’t thank you enough.
GOOD LUCK EVERYONE and don’t give up.
Tom says
May I ask how you went about getting your case prioritised??
clare says
I was really honest with them about my financial situation. When they prioritised my case my Amigo loan was already settled but they understood the knock on effects.
I found the FO to be really really helpful, they will ask you a series of questions and as long as your honest they will make their judgement based on that.
Tom says
Thanks for the reply clare, was this all decided after the 21st of December?
Clare says
This was all done before Dec 21st x
Tom says
I think its extremely unfair that new and existing complaints stand to get pennies compared to what previous claimants have received. Amigo loans have ruined mine and many others lifes and should pay the consequences. I’m personally owed around £7000 and I stand to get a few hundred £s if I’m lucky. I certainly will be voting NO!
Laura says
Hi Tom,
Just to let you know, my cases were upheld In February by FOS, and I’m a priority case – amigo owing me about 12k (makes me feel quite sick I won’t get this) – and they haven’t replied to FOS. In my view, even if you’re priority they’re not replying now.
I stopped paying what I had left because they’ll owe me a lot more.
Hope they get back to you, but from my experience, they won’t.
Dan says
I made my complaint to Amigo in September 2019 received a response in December 2019. I forwarded the complaint to the ombudsman in February 2020 and received an adjudicator decision in my favour in October 2020.
The FOS is now saying my complaint will be put into the scheme of arrangement despite me making my complaint over a year ago and Amigo ignoring correspondence from the FOS.
They have recently sent my guarantor a threat of letter before action. I only owe £900 and am behind one payment by 3 days as they won’t allow me to change my payday.
Why are the FOS not supporting and upholding complaints made last year ?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
You would have to ask FOS that. And the FCA – it is the FCA that is really at fault here – they are the regulator with the rules that say lenders should co-operate with FOS, follow FOS decisions in their internal handling etc. But the FCA has not enforced its rules, which leaves FOS stuck.
Clare says
Hi Sara, I have recently received my second lots of redress and had my unpaid interest refunded. I asked amigo why I didn’t receive 8% stat interest on the second amount and they came back with the below answer. Does it make sense to you?
We have looked into this for you and can see you have received 2 different redress payments. The first redress included 8% statutory interest, however the second redress payment did not. The reason for this is because the 8% statutory interest only applies to an overpayments you have made. As we have already paid 8% on any over payments in the first refund in 2020, no further over payments were made towards your account. Therefore the 8% statutory interest does not apply for the second redress amount.
I hope this clears up your concerns, but please let me know if you have any further questions at all.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
No it doesn’t. Go back and say the second log of redress meant that your overpayments were larger so additional 8% is due.
Sandra says
My case has been on going since last August roughly, the fos adjudicator was in touch with me about two weeks ago just for more information, he believed my first loan was affordable on the first loan I made 7 payments of £97.68 but did agree the second loan was definitely unaffordable and it was the one I paid most on that amigo didn’t uphold with the first loan also, he went through everything with me fos adjudicator and said they have till the 31st of this month to respond but some how I can’t see them doing this. He also agreed they never done a proper check as they would of seen form my bank statements etc gambling and payments to a debt collector.
Mr F says
Hi Sara,
I’ve said it be before (I think) but THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK YOU, this morning I had an email from my adjudicator stating Amigo have upheld on all three of my loans, and they are dealing with my redress outside of the scheme, I am.so grateful to you for this site and all your advice this will put me debt free for the first time in 17 ISH years.
Could anyone share the timescale of agreeing to the figures to actual payout please. ( I don’t think il shake my remaining concerns till it’s on the bank though can’t see why they wouldn’t pay after agreeing too.)
Sara (Debt Camel) says
excellent!
Clare says
I was told my loans upheld, waited a few days for figures, then two days later the money was in x
Alexandra says
Hi, I put in a complaint about my loan in feb. I’ve had an email today to say that my complaint will go straight into the scheme if it gets approved, but I can go to the Financial Ombudsman because its been 8 weeks since I made my complaint. Am I better off waiting to see what happens with the scheme or going straight to the Ombudsman? Thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I don’t think FOS is taking any more cases :(
Do you have a current balance?
Alexandra says
Yes I currently have about 7500 left to pay. What does this mean for me? Thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
can you afford the repayments? Have your finances been affected by Covid-19 – if yes, have you taken a 6 month break?
What is your guarantor’s financial position like – could they afford the repayments, because if not they too can complain.
Alexandra says
My finances haven’t been affected by covid but it’s a struggle. My guarantor would struggle to repay the loan but they havent had to make any payments.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
then it would be good for you both to make a calim in this Scheme if it goes ahead – it gives an extra chance of your guarantor being released if you win your case or they win theirs.
Pam says
I wonder how they are dealing with guarantor complaints under the scheme? I was scammed by the borrower (very embarrassing and horrible situation) and paid virtually all of the loan myself as the borrower he never any intention of ever paying. The FOS adjudicator said not only should I have not been accepted as guarantor but that the borrower should also not have been accepted. When guarantors have been left to pay the debt but didn’t get the benefit of the loan in the first place it just feels incredibly wrong to have complaints fall into this scheme and only get a small percentage back if anything at all :-( . I lost over 14k of my own money on the end and ultimately my home. I really started to have faith last year in the system when the FOS appeared to confirm amigo had acted wrong. Just so incredibly disheartening to think amigo will get away with this.
Thank you for all your advise in this site. I regularly come on here for updates and to see how things have progressed.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
The Scheme will look at whether the borrower could afford the loan and whether you could. That’s the good news.
The bad news is (a) you will only get a tiny per cent of what you paid back and (b) it looks as though Amigo may be rejecting many complaints that FOS might have upheld.
L says
Just to let you know TFS are absolutely disgusting in the way they deal with people. Good luck dealing with them.
They assured me my payment would be in my account ‘by today’ and so I ordered a food shop because I have nothing in. I noticed this morning there was nothing in my account and just spoke to Louisa, who is abhorrently rude and patronising.
She said payment could be made any time up to 6pm tonight. I said that I understood if payment was to reach me by the 30th, I assumed it would go in overnight.
I asked her to please get the payment made this morning so that I would not lose my delivery – being clinically extremely vulnerable and very ill – and she told me that there was no “magic button” for her to make the payment sooner.
I said, obviously, this is being paid by bacs for the payment to be paid into my account between now and 6pm so someone could pay this before then, and she said yes, but that it’s my problem (in a really sarcastic and horrible tone), because I shouldn’t have spend money that wasn’t already in my account!
They absolutely disgusting in how they deal with people. Truly disgusting.
I booked the slot because I expected the money to go in overnight as I kept getting told the payment would be made on 30th.
Louisa Sutton is awful. Also gave me wildly wrong figures.
Can’t wait to have nothing to do with these people.
L says
So, TFS did not pay me despite putting it in writing and confirming on a recorded call that this payment would be made and received by today. Will now have to cancel a private biopsy, because the payment had to be made tonight. Absolutely appalling behaviour by Louisa Sutton and Paul Auger.
This goes beyond them being bad. Their actions are malicious and – in my opinion – intended to cause harm.
Hope other people have a better experience.
Saz says
At least you are the lucky ones to even get a full pay out
L says
Im doubting I’ll even get it. And it’s definitely not lucky having to cancel an urgent biopsy, this has caused me horrific stress – as I’m sure was intended. This is TFS, not Amigo.
Mike says
Looking forward 12 months to 2 years or so. Will Amigo, and indeed Provident, still be judge, jury and executioner of what redress they deem suitable on affordability complaints or will it fall back under the juristiction of the FOS to decide who gets what? If the SOA gets approved that is.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
all affordability complaints will have to be made within a 6 month window in the relevant Scheme. You will not be allowed to make one afterwards.
Nazia Bibi says
Hi sara my complaint is still at fos since last august im struggling with payments with amigos ive already had a 6 month break can my guarantor ask for a payment break now please advise thankyou
Sara (Debt Camel) says
No sorry, not if you have had 6 months break.
At this point if you are struggling you probably need to talk to your guarantor about you stopping paying and your guarantor cancelling their direct debit and continuous payment authority to Amigo. Explain abiout your complaint and putting a claim into the Amigo Scheme which is expected to start mid May.
Amigo has said once the Scheme starts it won’t start legal proceedings if you have a claim into the Scheme until the claim is decided by the Scheme. And there is no time for Amigo to go to court before the Scheme. So Amigo may huff and puff but your guarantor won’t be affected (I am assuming you will win your claim here.)
Nazia Bibi says
Hi sara will my complaint be affected at the fos it is on priority spoke to them today they said will be assigned to a adjudicator in a week or two and also how do i get into the amigo scheme
my complaint is on priority now
Sara (Debt Camel) says
ok, so customers are now being asked to vote on the Scheme. If it is approved, it will go live for claims late MAY.
At that point FOS will retunr you complaint to AMigo.
FOS have already stopped work on most Amigo complaints, if they are picking up yours as a prioirty it may be they want to try to get it through before the Scheme starts but that is going to be tight. Amigo are accepting and paying out in full on a few complaints that FOS have prioritised. I am sorry I can’t guess how likely this is to happen for you.
Amigo will have discretion within the Scheme to make additional payments outside of the Scheme to customers it considers to be particularly vulnerable. I have no idea if this is at all likely to happen with your case.
There is little you can do now apart from hope FOS progress your case. Then if it has not been settled before the Scheme come back here then?
Ryan says
Have you heard how the court case has went today ? Has it been approved ?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
still on going!
But this 1st hearing would very rarely stop a Scheme progressing to the next stage.
DM says
Hi Sara, I am on a 3 month Covid payment break with Amigo which expires at the end of April (payment is due on the 1st) and have a complaint in the FOS queue from Aug last year (1 loan and 4 top ups over 7 years). I still have around £6.8k outstanding paying £375 a month (You have calculated my address previously last year at approx £14k in addition to outstanding balance). I am loathed to pay any more to Amigo but guarantor does not want any hassle either. If I want to ask for an extension to the payment holiday under the covid legislation am I required to offer any additional evidence other than the brief form I filled out previously (if anybody has had experience would love to know how they got on requesting the second three months break) and do I need to do it before the end of March or before the current arrangement ends? Also just wanted to clarify with relation to the scheme. If Amigo were to go into Administration, would you get all payments made from that point back (assuming redress figure was higher) or would it only be form the point the administrators set up a scheme that was approved?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
So the rules about another three month break are:
After 31 March 2021, you can apply to extend an existing payment holiday up until 31 July 2021, as long as:
– it doesn’t go over the 6-month payment holiday limit, and
– there are no breaks in the support.
Are your finances still being affected by covid-19?
“Also just wanted to clarify with relation to the scheme. If Amigo were to go into Administration, would you get all payments made from that point back (assuming redress figure was higher) or would it only be form the point the administrators set up a scheme that was approved?”
Are you asking what happens if Amigo starts the Scheme but then a few months later it goes under?
Kirsten Smith says
Hi Sara,
Thank you for everything you did for the hearing. I wasn’t able to attend due to capacity, but it sounds like you held our corner, when it feels like no one else is.
Kirsten.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Thanks!
Well as expected, after the FCA said it wouldn’t oppose the Scheme, even though it didn’t like it, the Scheme got through the first hurdle and on to the voting.
Amigo will be publishing more details in a few days.
Kyle says
What a let down the FCA are :/
David says
Hi Sara,
Wondering if you can help me with how to vote?
I had a loan with Amigo from Jan 2017 and fully settled it in Dec 2020. During that time I submitted an irresponsible lending claim which was subsequently rejected by them in September past year. With that I took it up with FOS who had been handling my complaint until I received an email from them today stating “they would no longer take my complaint further until the outcome of the scheme is known”.
Can you advise where I am most likely to get some/most of my money back? Thanks
Catalin says
Hi,
I am trying to Vote against the scheme but every time I try I get an error.
I am guessing they have that in place on purpose and some people, due to error, will try to vote pro scheme, just to see if is working? and maybe they end up with lots of incorrect pro Scheme votes.
Amigo never let us down.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
really? You have managed to log into the portal ok? What error message do you get?
Ruth says
I’m also struggling, when I log in to the vote portal the error comes up
Sara (Debt Camel) says
ok thanks for sending me the screen shots, I have passed them onto Amigo.
Mr A G W says
I am a Guarantor for £5,000.00. I took on the payments after my son was unable to repay the monthly amount. I wanted to settle the balance until I heard about the Court Hearing. I dont know whether to pay the loan off now in its entirity or wait for the outcome of the Vote. I dont know how long it will take to recive any compensation for the interest I am paying and I dont know how much I may receive. If I continue to make monthly payments will I end up paying more in interest than I will receive back? If I pay the whole amount now will I be treated as a previous creditor and there fore get less money back (10% or less)
Sara (Debt Camel) says
The important question is whether this loan was always unaffordable for your son, so he should never have been given it. A loan is only unaffordable if he could not make the payments and still pay his other debts, bills and living expenses. This is a test of his situation at the time the loan was taken out. Many people have been given unaffordable loans by Amigo who hasn’t been properly checking – people have been winning 88% of these complaints at the ombudsman.
But now you can’t take a claim to the ombudsman – it will have to go into the Scheme (or into administration if Amigo go bust – you will get exactly the same in administration that you would in the Scheme, the Scheme is not better for you and you do not need to worry about it not being approved and Amigo failing.)
If the loan was unaffordable for him, then you can make a claim in the Scheme. If your claims is upheld, you will be released as guarantor and will not have to pay any more. You will also get a tiny amount (say 5-10%) of the amount you have already paid back in a refund.
But if you take a loan and repay this in full now, you will only get that small amount back of the whole amount. So it’s MUCH better to not take the loan and settle it.
Also you may want to stop paying Amigo now. every payment you make, you are effectively throwing most of that money away as you will not get refunded much. Stopping payments cannot hurt your credit record as this Amigo loan does not show on your credit record. Amigo will not be able to take you to court as there is not time to do this before the Scheme starts and Amigo has said it will not take people to court if they have put a claim into the Scheme until Amigo has decided whether the Calim should be upheld.
So the best plan may be to:
– talk to your son about the affordability issue if you don’t already know the answer to this. (he can also put a claim into the Scheme.)
– stop paying Amigo now, by cancelling your direct debit and any Continuous Payment Authority with your bank or credit card
– put in a claim as soon as you can – likely end May
– plan to get a loan to settle the debt if in the end your claim is not upheld in the Scheme.
If you would like to talk this through with a debt adviser, call National Debtline on 0808 808 4000. They know about affordability complaints.
Mr A G W says
Good Morning Sara
thank you for your prompt reply.
1. The original loan agreement taken out by my son became unaffordable as he was made redundant.
2. Amigo insists I continue to make the payments. I think I heard in the Hearing that the current customers were legally obliged to continue payments.
3. Amigo are saying on their web site today that Creditors will get nothing if they go into Administration but will get something if we vote FOR the Scheme. The Amigo WebSite very conveniently does not allow anyone to register a vote today!
4. If I get back 5-10% by way of compensation is that compensation not compromised if I stop payments as I will not be honouring their Terms and Conditions of the Agreement
5. If I cease making payments to Amigo will they not charge interest and therefore inflate the amount of monies owed making the percentage of any redress far smaller.
6. Where is it written ” Amigo will not be able to take you to Court as there is not time to do this before the Scheme starts and Amigo has said it will not take people to court if they have put a claim into the Scheme until Amigo has decided whether the Claim should be upheld.”
Sara (Debt Camel) says
1. The original loan agreement taken out by my son became unaffordable as he was made redundant.
Nevertheless it is still worth considering if it was unaffordable from the start… he may have been struggling to pay it and his other debts may have been going up. Have a talk to him about it.
Also is the loan affordable for you? Can you make the repayments and still pay your own debts bills and expenses or are your other debts going up at the moment?
If either he can win an affordability complaint or you can, then settling this loan now is a bad idea as you will get dramatically less compensation from a claim in the Scheme.
If you are sure neither of you can win a claim, then it would make sense to settle the loan now. But in this case you do not need to make a Claim or vote as you aren’t going to get anything back.
2. Amigo insists I continue to make the payments. I think I heard in the Hearing that the current customers were legally obliged to continue payments.
If you listened to the whole hearing, you would have heard Amigo’s counsel say that Amigo will not commence legal proceedings until a claim is determined.
3. Amigo are saying on their web site today that Creditors will get nothing if they go into Administration but will get something if we vote FOR the Scheme. The Amigo WebSite very conveniently does not allow anyone to register a vote today!
yes a few other people have reported this. Probably teething troubles – I suggest you try again in a few days.
4. If I get back 5-10% by way of compensation is that compensation not compromised if I stop payments as I will not be honouring their Terms and Conditions of the Agreement
No, that is not a problem.
5. If I cease making payments to Amigo will they not charge interest and therefore inflate the amount of monies owed making the percentage of any redress far smaller.
Interest carries on being charged until it hits the “cap” – no more can be charged than was explained when the loan was taken out.
If you win a claim, you are removed as guarantor and it makes no difference how much interest has been added. If you don’t you are not going to get any payout from the Scheme anyway so the percentage is irrelevant.
6. Where is it written ” Amigo will not be able to take you to Court as there is not time to do this before the Scheme starts and Amigo has said it will not take people to court if they have put a claim into the Scheme until Amigo has decided whether the Claim should be upheld.”
The “no time” is a fact. If you stop paying, before Amigo can go to court they have to send you a default notice. Then after 14 days they have to send you a Letter Before Action, which you can ignore for three weeks then reply saying you are taking debt advice and ask for various documents from the creditor. Then they cant go to court for 30 days after they have sent you those documents. There is zero chance of this all happening before the end of May!
The second point was what Amigo said in the court hearing yesterday.
So the important point for you is to decide if the loan was affordable at the time it was taken out for you or for your son.
If it was affordable for both of you, then settling the loan is a good idea. And you will not win a Claim in the Scheme.
If it was unaffordable for either of you, then you should consider stopping paying, sending in a Claim and only settling the loan if you lose the claim.
Mr A G W says
thank you …. thats very informative
Chantel Richards says
Hi this is the1st I was hearing about the scheme, I took an amigo loan out in 2018 for £6000 over 60 months. I have repaid £8063 back of my loan what will this mean for me if the scheme is approved?
All the technical jargon non their site is confusing
Sara (Debt Camel) says
How have the loan repayments been for you? If paying Amigo has meant your other debts (cards, loans , overdraft, catalogues) have gone up or your you have got arrears on bills, the loan may be “unaffordable”.
But if the repayments have been fine the loan probably was “affordable”.
If you say which, I can answer your question
Mr A G W says
Just in from Amigo Loans: ” ……On the 30th March 2021, the Court agreed that a virtual meeting of creditors should be held to consider and vote on the Scheme. If you think you have a claim, you may be a creditor and can vote on the Scheme. ……… by following the instructions of how to do this on the Scheme website at http://www.amigoscheme.co.uk. If the Scheme is approved and then you do not make your claim by the claims submission deadline (expected to be in mid-November 2021), you will lose your opportunity to submit a claim under the Scheme (even if you didn’t think you had a claim before the deadline). Amigo Loans!”…. Does this mean we have to wait until November to receive any compensation ?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
It is going to be a lot longer than that!
See the article above which has a timescale. Likely to be 2 quarter 2022. They have to have dealt with everyone’s claims and the appeals on them before they can calculate what the payout percentage will be.
Your claim will be assessed before and at that point you should be released as guarantor. Then it’s a long while for a tiny amount – everyone gets very fed up with waiting in my experience of these insolvencies.
Lee says
Hi,
I have looked into my query, but cannot find anything related to it, so apologies if I am repeating information already posted, but ….
Refunds are proposed for 2022 for settled cases
… but what about those of us who have a successful complaint and still have a balance? Does anyone know when we should expect the interest to be removed from our outstanding balance? Removing £363 from my monthly budget would be like a £7k per year pay rise!
Thanks
Lee
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I am guessing here.
But I expect once your claim is upheld, the balance reduction should be applied, your guarantor should be released and you should be able to arrange a lower, affordable payment. I would hope these non cash elements would all happen pretty quickly, within a couple of weeks at most.
So the question is, how soon will your claim be upheld?
How affordable are these payments at the moment?
Do you expect the balance to be cleared or will you still owe money even if your claim is upheld?
Lee says
Thanks, Sarah – that was my assumption, too, as if feels far less complicated.
It will more or less clear my balance. If it takes more than a couple of months, then it would clear it altogether.
The payments are affordable now, but that is because my position is quite different to what it was when I took out the loan.
Lisa b says
Has anyone else had a letter from amigo offering £100 because of the delay
Kelly says
Yes I had 100 off my bill this morning because of the delay.i have outstanding balance of 3,500 I’ve paid back 4700 in interest if my complaint is upheld how soon will the address the set off. If its 2022 my loan will be paid by that point
Sara (Debt Camel) says
oh so for you this £100 isn’t real – it will just increase your calculated redress and mean you get an extra £10 from the eventual payout :(
Kelly Stephens says
Hi sara what do you mean I will only get £10 . They sent me 100 off my outstanding bill which is 3700 at the moment . I’ve had a number of top ups over the years and on this one I have already paid 4700 if I stop paying now wil me and my guarantor be in trouble because by the time they sort all this out I would have cleared that 3500
Sara (Debt Camel) says
You have already paid more than you borrowed on the last loan?
Say it was 4000, you have paid 4700. If you don’t make any more payments and the loan is upheld, you will get the balance cleared and the extra 700 you have paid more than you borrowed is the cash refund you will get. But Amigo says it will probablu only pay 10% of that amount (and i think it will be less) so yopu will get back £70 in cash.
Now Amigo have decreased your balance by 100. That’s will increase the extra 700 you have paid to 800. So instead of getting 70 back, you will get 80 back. Thats why I said you really only get 10 more.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Points for you to think about.
1) you have had several top ups. The very big problem for you is, what if Amigo doesn’t uphold all your loans? There may be some loans that only ran for a few months where there wasn’t much interest paid. You might assume it wouldn’t matter much if Amigo didn’t uphold those…
But in this situation Amigo makes a deduction “for unpaid interest” where a loan wasn’t upheld but was settled by a top-up loan that was upheld. They are trying to say the previous loan was never properly settled (even though it was) and so they charge you the extra interest on it.
For some people these deductions are only a few hundred, but other people have had their refunds reduced by thousands, and been left owing a large balance because of this.
The Ombudsman never applies these deductions. So I don’t think administrators would.
The result is, that if you had 3 loans and Amigo upheld the last one, and the administration the same happened, just the last loan upheld,, you would be faced with a larger balance in the Scheme than in administration. So you would be better off if the Scheme doesnt go ahead and Amigo go into administration.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
2) should you stop paying? It’s not an easy choice.
If the payments are causing you problems, there is a good case for stopping. If making the payments means you are getting behind with bills and running up more debts that is bad news as these claims are unlikely to be quickly resolved in the Scheme.
If you stop paying, it will hurt your credit record (but the negative mark will be removed if you win your claim in the Scheme or administration). It won’t hurt your guarantor’s credit record as the Amigo loan does not show on there.
Amigo will make unpleasant noises but there is no time for them to take you to court before the Scheme starts and they have said that they will not commence legal proceeding until a claim in the Scheme has been decided.
If the payments aren’t causing you difficulty it may be easier to carry on paying.
Lewis says
So Amigo don’t report on the guarantors file?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
that is correct, a guarantor can look at a credit report to be sure of this themself
Ruth says
No? They tend to ignore me a lot though!
Lisa b says
Unfortunately, we did not manage to fully resolve your complaint before the scheme was announced and for this I can only apologise The time taken to investigate and respond to the complaint that you raised is unacceptable to put things right for the delay we are making a payment of £100 to you for the inconvenience this has caused you
Angela says
What a con 100 pounds its a scrap to catch a mackel amigo must think we are all thick they will take that back from your claim tenfold don’t be fooled just look at wonga l say let them all go bust good riddance the sooner customers realise that they not going to get what they are entitled to the better and sooner amigo will go down the pan
Mr A G W says
Well… given your advice sara, and the timelines involved, if its any help to your other readers I am going to suspend payments to Amigo now,. I am not going to pay off the balance of the loan in May as I intended to instead I shall wait for my claim to be processed and await Amigo’s reply to the validity of my claim, whenever that will be, and see what happens. If anyone sees any folly in that approach please let me know!
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Do encourage your son to also put in a claim – that gives you two ways to be released as a guarantor, also it means the interest will be removed from the remaining balance.
Clare says
I wonder if anyone might be in my situation or could advise me? I started a complaint to Amigo Loans in November 2020 citing their inability to check my ability to pay and was faced with the usual tactics of stalling and waiting and difficult communication. I did this through Resolver and included emails which were proof of of my ill health all around the time of their threatening letters to notify my guarantor if I did not make payment. I got a cursory email back acknowledging it and then nothing until around the 8 week mark saying they were looking into it and would get back to me when they had had a chance to look at it further.
The next communication was on the 1st February 2021 asking if I wanted to attend a court hearing and ‘make a claim in the scheme’. I have nearly paid off a £10k loan (through further borrowing) with an eyewatering 49% APR and actually what I want is my interest back plus 8% interest. Do I continue paying back the loan? Is there any chance of getting my money back? The ombudsman said that there is nothing they can do!
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Read this page on the Scheme: https://debtcamel.co.uk/amigo-scheme-timetable-approval-how-work/
If the Scheme goes ahead you can make a claim to it in late May.
Under the Scheme a refund value is calculated if they uphold your complaint. This is then used to clear any balance. So if you have paid £8000 in interest and your balance is £1000 then your balance is cleared and you will then get the remaining £7000 paid from the “refund pot” – which means you will only get much less – Amigo thinks 10%, I think it may be less… So you would get say £700 in cash.
You aren’t going to get your interest back plus 8%. That isn’t going to happen :(
Do I continue paying back the loan?
Every £100 you pay off this means you will get just £10 more in a refund. So it would be best to stop paying them now. especially if you are borrowing to do this!
Can you explain why to your guarantor? They will also need to cancel their direct debit to Amigo. This can’t harm their credit record as the amigo loan is not on there. Amigo may threaten court but Amigo will not be able to take you or your guarantor to court as there is not time to do this before the Scheme starts. Amigo has said it will not take people to court if they have put a claim into the Scheme until Amigo has decided whether the Claim should be upheld.
re voting in the Scheme. If the Scheme doesn’t go ahead, Amigo will go into administration. In that case you can still make a claim and have your balance cleared. But there would be no cash refund. The unknown here is whether Amigo will uphold your claim in administration. If they don’t then you would be better off if they go under and your claim was upheld in administration! From my experience, administrators usually try to follow what the Ombudsman would decide in the case.
So it may not be easy for you to choose how to vote in the Scheme.
Tom says
My vote is in!! No amigo, I do not agree with your scam.. I mean scheme!
Sean says
I %100 agree! It’s a NO from me.
Lewis says
Same, they deserve to go into administration.
Siobhan says
This is hilarious!!
Even though amigo sent all my loan docs to FOS and FOS made a decision, I am unable to vote because apparently I don’t and haven’t had a loan.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Are there any contact details given so you can phone up about this?
Siobhan says
They never answer the phone to me. I have emailed though.
If I log in to my account and press vote it says you are unable to vote due to not having a loan.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I will ask what you need to do in this situation.
Happy Richards says
You are totally bias and clearly did not listen at all at the court hearing yesterday! You should be ashamed of yourself trying to get other unsuspecting Amigo customers to agree with your negative bias views in your crusade to try and bring Amigo down! The judge agreed, the numbers don’t stack up… accept the SOA and get ‘something’ or Amigo goes into Admin and we get ‘nothing’… I am voting YES, I listened in on the court case yesterday and came to my own opinion! I would highly advise other customers in my position to do use your own initiative and not listen to someone who still cannot present the facts correctly, despite the court hearing yesterday!
Sara (Debt Camel) says
That’s up to you to decide.
As the counsel and the judge said several times, the hearing yesterday was not to decide if the Scheme was fair – that is for the customers to decide in the vote.
we get ‘nothing’
Do you have a current Amigo loan? Because if you do, you will have the same right to balance reduction/write off through the right of “set off” in administration as you will in the Scheme. Or perhaps you didn’t listen to that bit in court?
Customers whose loans have been repaid will get more in the Scheme (well assuming their claim is upheld by Amigo) than they would in administration. They have to decide if the scheme is fair enough to vote for. You have to make your own mind up on this. There is a lot of psychological research that shows some people will often reject an unfair looking offer even if it would benefit them.
Lee George says
Good for you…but, eveyone else shall have their own opinion and hopefully not be called ‘shameful’ because they do not agree with the ‘Scheme’ which is nothing more than a means of remaining operational and not paying compensation fairly.
Unhappy Tom says
Happy Richard doesn’t sound to happy. Amigo can stick it where the sun dont shine. VOTE NO.
Angela says
Yeah Tom l am with you vote NO
l am voting no evan if we vote we will not only get pittance yes but at least they will have to stop trading
NB if they go bust that will save a lot of stress for new customers that they will rip off.
Jenny Gelbman says
Have you taken a loan from Amigo or are you simply a shareholder or employee? Sounds like you have some interest in this!
Simon says
I’m an Amigo customer, unfortunately.
Having taken out a £6,000 loan in 2018 for 60 months, I found myself making an affordability complaint in November 2020. I have already paid back the original loan amount and now I’m paying off the interest. When my complaint with Amigo was (unsurprisingly) rejected, I took it to the FOS. I have heard this scheme now expects all open FOS complaints to come back to Amigo who will decide whether a claim should be upheld and the FOS will have no authority or impartial complaints procedure.
I am paying back a considerable amount each month. My debts have increased since taking this loan and I don’t know how much more I can take. I need to keep paying back each month as I can’t risk knocking my credit file off track again so I feel totally stuck.
I know I’ll be afforded a vote, although the cynic in me suggests this vote has already been cleverly pre-determined. But how am I best voting? Part of me wants to vote yes, with the prospect of at least getting a tiny bit back but part of me wants to vote no as I don’t think Amigo are going to be fair in their redress assessments.
I feel totally anxious and betrayed by the likes of the FSCS and FCA to be honest.
Any help is appreciated.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I think this is a hard balancing act. As you have already repaid more than you borrowed, you SHOULD get your balance (which must be about £7000?) be cleared and a refund back of the interest you have paid so far (which could be £1000? It depends when in 2018 you made the first payment).
I guess your payments are £237. If your other debts have gone up, that may well be because the Amigo loan is unaffordable.
Yes you can now vote.
In the Scheme if they uphold your claim, the balance is wiped and and you would get back Amigo think 10% of the interest you have paid (I think that might be optimistic) – so about £100.
In administration if they uphold your claim, the balance is wiped but there won’t be any cash refund.
So when you decide what to vote, what really matters is whether Amigo or the administrators are more likely to uphold your claim. I think Administrators typically do a pretty good job of mimicking what FOS would do, but would they in your case? Will Amigo? I’m not convinced because they haven’t been making those “we expect to uphold the same sort of cases as FOS would” noises… But this is a hard to call to make.
My debts have increased since taking this loan and I don’t know how much more I can take. I need to keep paying back each month as I can’t risk knocking my credit file off track again so I feel totally stuck.
I am not sure you are going to be able to do that for another 30 months are you? If you are struggling and your other debts are going up, it sounds as though you will get missed payments and defaults before the AMigo loan is repaid…
If you default on the Amigo loan and then win your complaint, in the Scheme or in administration, the default will be removed from your record. If you pay Amigo and default on anything else, you are stuck with that.
From this point on, for every £237 monthly payment you make, you will only get say £23 back in a Scheme, or nothing in administration. Would your guarantor be comfortable with cancelling their Direct Debit to Amigo if you explain why? This won’t affect their credit record as the loan doesn’t appear on a guarantor’s record.
Simon says
Hi Sara
Thank you for replying. I have given this some thought and decided I’ll be voting NO.
I do not believe this scheme is fair to anyone other than those with an invested interest in the company. I understand as a current customer, if the company goes in to administration, any payments I have made after liquidation (subject to a claim being upheld in administration) would be refunded to me in full. Whereas if I vote for the scheme and if I continue to pay £250 a month for another year whilst they sort their mess out, that’s £3000 I’ve paid and likely to only receive an optimistic 10% share of that back.
It makes no sense to vote yes, so I’ll be voting for no.
Dlmb2017 says
Hi Sara,
I’ve already had my amigo affordability complaint dealt with by amigo and balance reduced. The scheme will have no bearing on my account now, is that right? I’ve been asked to vote on it still though?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Yes. I don’t think there is any way you can get anything from the Scheme in your situation.
The FCA wasn’t impressed that Amigo is allowing people like you to vote, but Amigo said it was easier and quicker. (Well that is the simple version, they didn’t exactly say that).
So you could not bother. Or vote against if you think they should be closed down. Or vote for if you think they are doing their best.
CC says
Hi,
What does this mean for complaints currently sitting with FOS?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
FOS has stopped worked on complaints (exception – unless they have given you priority because you are vulnerable?)
If the Scheme starts, FOS will return the complaints to Amigo.
If it doesn’t and Amigo goes into administration, FOS will return the complaints to the administrators.
Mark says
Hi Sarah, thought I’d just let you and your readers know. The information you are posting is incorrect regards the Amigo scheme. You are giving financial advice which is incorrect. As a result, you are misleading the customers you aim to help. I have reported your site for misleading and unlawful financial advice.
Please anyone. If you stop making your payments, you are still liable for them, whether Amigo continues to exist or not. Did all the Wonga customers stop paying their debts because they were insolvent. Of course not, they were sold to a further debt agency.
The ONLY way anyone gets their loan paid off, gets their credit rating unaffected and May receive a settlement is to vote for the scheme.
I am not suggesting you do that, it is each individuals choice.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
None of the points you mention are correct.
reported your site for misleading and unlawful financial advice.
Debt Camel does not require authorisation because it is not carrying out any regulated activity by way of business.
If you stop making your payments, you are still liable for them, whether Amigo continues to exist or not.
I never said otherwise.
However, if you are making a claim, then you potentially have the right of set-off – your debt to the creditor can be offset against a refund that is due to you.
Amigo calls this “balance reductions” in its Scheme.
The right of set-off also exists in administration, see point 12 of Amigo’s PSL https://www.amigoscheme.co.uk/practice-statement-letter.
It is common for a debt adviser to suggest that someone should stop paying an unaffordable debt if they have a claim in, see for example this page https://www.stepchange.org/brighthouse.aspx
[Wonga debts]were sold to a further debt agency.
No they weren’t. See the Wonga administrators progress report dated 25 October 2019 (available from Companies House – look up WDFC UK LIMITED) which explains why the remaining loan book was not sold.
I don’t think this would be likely to happen in the case of Amigo, but your reference to Wonga is simply wrong.
The ONLY way anyone gets their loan paid off, gets their credit rating unaffected and May receive a settlement is to vote for the scheme.
People can get their loan “paid off” (which is not a term I would normally use) through the right of set-off in administration.
If a claim is upheld in administration, negative marks are removed from the credit record or the record is deleted.
My article above is quite clear that there will not be any cash refunds in administration.
No-one has to vote for the Scheme in order to be able to make a claim to it.
Could it possibly be that I know more about this subject than you do? Have you actually read the article above?
Mike says
I find it funny all these people are suddenly appearing attacking Sara and encouraging people to vote for the scheme… they are probably the same ones who are all over Twitter who have a financial interest in Amigo, backing them to come back ripping off people in desperate need for them to make a quick buck from.
Sara’s information has been great and I’ll be voting no, I hope Amigo do go insolvent and save 1000’s of people in the future the stress and pain they’ve put so many others through in the past.
Kyle says
Their voting system is most likely rigged. Their voting system the way they calculate how much your vote is worth is weird. I voted against it and it said some jibber jabber about how your vote is calculated, and it could be equal to £1. So they are doing the vote based on monetary value? They should have got a third party that has no loyalty to amigo or anyone to do it for it to be fair. This is a big shambles to start with and will set a president for other companies to get away with this. Absolutely disgusting from the courts and from FCA.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I agree on the voting system.
Arguments that it is unfair can be raised at the second court hearing.
In the meanwhile, customers have a chance to say they think the scheme is unfair by voting against it.
Ruth says
I would just like to thank Sara for everything she does. She tirelessly supports those who are vulnerable to get out of debt and I truly believe in some cases she has saved people from depression and anxiety (myself included) which has been caused by predatory companies such as Amigo who have caused serious financial difficulties for untold numbers. She is one of the few unbiased people with absolutely zero to gain except to help people get out of debt. She often refers to charities such as Stepchange (who also helped me lot) and she gives all this advice and templates for free! How on earth anyone could accuse her of being unlawful is laughable. It is shameful the people coming on here to attack her! It is Amigo who are shameful and those who come on here to discredit her because they want people like us not to get a resolution in our favour. I have been taking Sara’s advice for years to help me get out of debt, thanks to Sara I have not only got rid of nearly 20 payday loans and high interest loans which were stupidly given to me when I was in a severe financial and mental state. She has helped me reclaim thousands which has helped get my life back on track. You can decide whether to take her advice or leave it, that is up to you. I personally will be voting against the scheme as even if I get nothing back if it shuts these terrible companies down, it stops other people living the horrible anxiety filled life that I did for years.
Mark says
Hi sara, I have had my complaint upheld on September last year, they removed the interest and the guarantor or from my loan. Would this still affect me? I’m I better voting for NO scheme or better voting for?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
You won’t be affected by the Scheme. If you make a claim to the Scheme, you will not get any more redress so it doesn’t matter how you vote.
Joe says
My question is what happens to an outstanding loan if the scheme does not go ahead and Amigo enter into insolvency?
Kind regards,
Joe
Sara (Debt Camel) says
See my previous reply to you https://debtcamel.co.uk/amigo-scheme-timetable-approval-how-work/comment-page-4/#comment-415113.
In administration you and the borrower can put in Claims. With multiple top-ups and the borrower going for insolvency, it is likely that the borrower should never have been given the last top-up, and you would be released as guarantor.
Joe8389 says
Hi Sara,
Sorry to clarify I meant that if Amigo go into insolvency what happens to the borrowers debt?
Joe
Sara (Debt Camel) says
you said your borrower was going into an IVA? What happens with the Scheme or Amigo in insolvency should have no effect on that.
Michelle says
Hi Sara ,
So I won my complaint to amigo in dec didn’t go to FOS , they upheld 2 out 3 of my loans the middle loan being the one the didn’t uphold , my balance was around £9000 so they took off £6000 and left me with around £3000 to pay in unpaid interest ? I called the complaints department at the time as I didn’t understand what this was , they didn’t explain anything and just pushed me to accept the offer , as I paid off the 2nd loan with the 3 rd loan I don’t understand where this unpaid interest has come from , I’m now left paying this off and I don’t even understand what it is , could you help ?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
This unpaid interest is an unfair deduction that only Amigo makes. See https://debtcamel.co.uk/amigo-unpaid-interest-remove-ccjs/.
It is a shame you didn’t take the complaint to FOS. Now I don’t think you will be able to make a claim in the Scheme about this which unfair – you may want to consider voting No.
Michelle says
Will I be able to do anything about it if the scheme is voted NO ? I didn’t go to the FOS because they pressured me into taking the offer and I was out of work so the reduction in the amount owed seemed like a god send at the time , and I couldn’t risk losing at the FOS seems a silly mistake now
Sara (Debt Camel) says
oh, interesting, no-one has asked this so far…
Yes if the Scheme is voted down and Amigo goes into insolvency you could make a claim to have this deduction removed. It isn’t definite it would be upheld but I would be surprised if the administrators think this deduction is fair as they typically try to follow what FOS does for affordability redress.
Also it is possible the administrators may uphold more of your loans than Amigo did. Not all administrations allow you to make a claim about that but many do.
So you may well be better off in administration so you may want to vote No. I can’t see how you can be worse off in administration.
Michelle says
Ohhhh so there is hope ! Thank you Sara always so helpful
Mal says
Hi Sara I took out a loan with Amigo in 2013, £5000 over 5years repaying a total of £11800. However in 2017 I reduced my repayments and in 2019 they sold my debt to Intrum collections. This is now in a DMP. Where would I stand regarding claim against Amigo?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
You can make a claim in the Scheme.
The details Amigo has given are:
“Amigo Under the Scheme, Amigo will also use reasonable endeavours to ensure that any Redress Creditors who have a valid Redress Claim in respect of a loan that was sold to Intrum will receive the full benefit of their Redress Claim (including by the operation of ‘set off’ and/or the repayment of any amounts that may become due in respect of payments made following the Scheme Effective Date) as if their loan had not been sold to Intrum”
In practice I would be surprised if Amigo can’t sort this out with Intrum. In the Money Shop scheme where the same issue is common, there were only problem with one difficult debt collector.
Mal says
Should I stop making any further payments to intrum?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
have you repaid more than you borrowed?
are the payments affordable?
Mal says
I have repaid £4300, total amount to be repaid on loan was £11800. I pay DMP £110 pm but both Amigo and Provident are on this and I am tempted to cancel both and wait for outcome.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
So you are making quite small payments through your DMP and you haven’t yet repaid more than you borrowed. This means even your complaint is upheld, you will still owe a balance.
If the DMP payments are affordable then it’s usually better to carry on with them in this case. You are only “wasting money” if you have repaid more than you borrowed.
What about the provident loan? Have you repaid there more than you borrowed?
Mal says
Yes, I borrowed £1250 interest 600 and I owe 1000
Sara (Debt Camel) says
how many provident loans did you have before that one?
Mal says
About 10 from Provident from 2007. Also with Amigo would customers not be able to get the 8% interest included in the claim?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
ok so it’s likely (but not certain as provident haven’t given details of how they will decide claims) that a refund from Provident in their Scheme would clear the balance. In that case you will be better off if you can get your DMP provider (who is it?) to take Provident out of your DMP.
The way Amigo calculate 8% interest, you wont get any if you still owe a balance :(
Mal says
It’s Stepchange. If Provident is taken out would that mean all my DMP payments go to Amigo?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
yes it would if these are the only two debts in your DMP (really? you don’t even have an overdraft?). Perhaps just let it run as at present then look again in a few months? We may know more about the provident situation then.
Anon79 says
Ho I took an amigo loan out in august 2017 for 7750, this was unaffordable and in June 2018 I needed up having multiple defaults for 15+ creditors. My loan is affordable now as I have plans, I always prioritized amigo as I couldn’t put my guarantor through the stress of trying to cover this so on the surface looks fine to amigo. I have roughly 2k to pay, I’ve never lodged a complaint. What should I do just vote and let the scheme take its course whilst I continue to pay? I was going to look to pay it off sooner as it’s £306 a month but not sure now with everything that’s going on with them
Sara (Debt Camel) says
You can’t send in a complaint now, so you have to wait until the Scheme starts and then Claim. (Exactly the same applies if Amigo goes into administration – you claim then).
My comments here are based on what you have said that the loan was originally unaffordable but your situation has improved and it is now affordable. Also that you have repaid more than you borrowed already. these comments may not be right for other people in different situations.
If you pay off the balance now, you save very little interest as this is in the last year of the loan. By paying say 2k now to close it, you will only be able to get back 10% of that amount in the Scheme (it may be less, that is using Amigo’s optimistic number!). So you will be down about £1800.
If you don’t pay this now but carry on making the payments, if Amigo upholds your complaint in the Scheme you will be repaid in full all the payments you have made during the Scheme. So you get your 2000 back. Much better! (Exactly the same applies if Amigo goes into administration.)
So are you better off in the Scheme or in Administration?
In a Scheme if your complaint is upheld you will get a full refund of the payments you have made during the Scheme, say 2k, plus 10% (possibly) of the interest you have paid.
In administration if your complaint is upheld you will get a full refund of the payments you have made during administration, say 2k. But no extra small cash refund.
So are you better off with the scheme because of the small cash refund? Only if Amigo upholds your complaint… and it isn’t clear if it will. I would expect administrators to try to roughly mimic what the ombudsman does, and the Ombudsman has been upholding 88% of Amigo cases. But won’t say anything about this and it’s “10%” figure makes it look to me as though it is going to uphold fewer claims.
You have a difficult decision to make. Because that 2k back for the payments you make in administration is much more important to you than the much lower cash refund of the interest you have paid is.
Gene says
I have no idea what to put in the boxes 1 2 or 3 can someone help…
I took out a loan of £5000 then raised it to £7500 in 2017 my repayments were £296
And I paid this up till March 2020, Apr at 29.9%
Then i paid off £5750 remaining balance what do I put in these boxes…
1) Affordability claim value
2) All other claim balues
3) why the vote should be different (provide an answer)
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Are you going to make a claim saying the loan was unaffordable – that you could not repay it without taking out more debt or getting behind with bills?
If you are then this is an affordability claim and you do not need to complete these boxes.
Gene says
Yes I fell behind on other bills. So I just leave the boxes and don’t submit anything?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I don’t think you need to complete those boxes.
Keeley says
Can I ask, I have an affordability claim in already as the time I took out my loan I was only part time and this wasn’t checked as I don’t think I would have ever been able to afford the £5000 they allowed me. I have since been made redundant Will it affect my guarantor if i phone them to reduce my payments? Also voted no to the scheme don’t think they should be allowed to continue to give out such unaffordable loans.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Will it affect my guarantor if i phone them to reduce my payments?
Yes, Amigo will ask your guarantor to pay.
Can you explain to your guarantor why you need to stop and how if you win your complaint in the Scheme or in administration your guarantor will be released?
Your guarantor can then cancel their direct debit to Amigo (or a continuous payment authority if it is on a card).
This can’t affect your guarantor’s credit record as the Amigo loan doesn’t show there.
And Amigo may say they could go to court, but there is no time to do this before the Scheme starts and in the Scheme they have said they won’t go to court if someone has put a claim in until the claim has been decided.
C says
Hey Sara
I took out £5000 loan with Amigo in 2018. The payments of £197 pm have been made each month with a break during the first lockdown last year. I stopped making the payments myself due to being a sahm (I was when I took out the loan and had no financial means of being able to pay it back from the start). My husband now pays on my behalf (he is also the guarantor). I made a complaint with Amigo in February and they have written to say they are still looking into my case. Can you advise should we vote ‘yes’ or ‘no’ in the scheme and also can you explain what kind of compensation/ settlement I could be expecting based on my circumstances?
Thank you in advance!
Sara (Debt Camel) says
If you had no financial means of being able to pay it, then this is the sort of complaint that would probably have been upheld at the Ombudsman.
How many payments did you make?
How many payments has your guarantor made?
Are the payments affordable for your husband – or is making them resulting in his other debts going up or getting behind with bills?
C says
Collectively there has been 27 payments and out of those my guarantor has paid 10 starting last April. The payments have definitely forced his other debts to go up as he has been unable to settle his own bills and has experienced financial difficulty.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Between you, £5319 has been paid to the loan, £319 more than you borrowed.
In the Scheme:
If it is decided that the loan is unaffordable for you and your guarantor isnt paid a refund, the balance would be wiped and your guarantor released. You would get a tiny cash refund – perhaps £30 (thats about 10% of £319) which is unimportant compared to clearing the loan!
(Your guarantor could get a larger refund 10% (or less) of ALL the payments he has made 10% of £1970. But this would leave you owing some money so there is no real gain from that option. There is a clause in the Scheme to mean you wouldnt be worse off than you are at present, but that doesnt help you as currently you owe a lot.)
As the repayments are also unaffordable for your partner, he can also make a claim to Amigo in the Scheme. This is worth doing – it gives two ways for him to be released as guarantor, if he wins his case or you win yours.If he wins his case but you don’t win yours, as he is released, you can then make an affordable payment arrangement to repay the loan, which would be a lot lower than the current repayments. It won’t give you more cash refund than winning your claim but it improves the chances.
In administration:
If the Scheme doesnt go ahead, Amigo will go into administration.
You and your guarantor can then make claims in administration in the same that you would make claims in the Scheme. These claims are then decided by the administrators.
You have the same “right of set off” in administration – if you win your claim your balance would be cleared but you would not get the tiny cash refund.
So the key question for you is whether the administrators are more likely to uphold your claim than Amigo is. Obviously there is no definite answer to that! From my experience of seeing payday lender administration, the administrators normally try to use a process that produces roughly the same results as the Ombudsman would.
I am not convinced Amigo is aiming to produce the same results as the ombudsman. It won’t give numbers about what it expects its uphold rate to be. It has listed a lot of factors that it will look at (see Schedule 4 of its Explanatory Statement https://www.amigoscheme.co.uk/docs/ExplanatoryStatement.pdf) but not said how they would be applied in a case. So I am worried and cases like yours, with only 1 loan, may be difficult. (Cases with more than 1 loan have other issues, but they aren’t relevant to you.)
So it’s your decision on how to vote. You may not think the tiny cash refund in the scheme matters compared to getting the balance cleared, which you can get in administration if your claim is upheld. If you don’t care about the cash refund part then the only thing that matters is if you would rather Amigo decided your claim (vote Yes) or administrators (vote No).
Sorry this isn’t easy. One 100% definite point, in the Scheme or in administration both you and your guarantor should put in claims, not just you.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
And after all that I forgot to talk about continuing to make payments.
In your situation (payments unaffordable, good affordability complaint, already paid more than you borrowed) there is a strong case for you both stopping payments. Every payment made will just give you a tiny refund. if making the payments means you are getting behind with bills and running up more debts that is bad news as these claims are unlikely to be quickly resolved in the Scheme.
If you stop paying, it will hurt your credit record (but the negative mark will be removed if you win your claim in the Scheme or administration). It won’t hurt your partner’s credit record as the Amigo loan does not show on there.
Amigo will make unpleasant noises but there is no time for them to take you to court before the Scheme starts and they have said that they will not commence legal proceeding until a claim in the Scheme has been decided.
Lee N says
Hi can i ask a question and apologies of this has been covered already …..so ……
I currently have a loan it was for £3500 – current balance £3199
I had a previous loan of £5000 which was settled in 2015
So do you advise i stop my current payments for current loan until a decision is mad eon the scheme, it is preference for me to clear this loan over the poultry £500-600 compensation i would be awarded on my first loan.
is that my correct assumption ..?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
How much have you paid to the current loan?
Lee says
I’ve paid around £2200 in total. Monthly payments £148 about 15 monthsh in.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
So that looks like a 4 year loan. I assume you paid about £5000 in interest on the first loan. I guess you are using Amigo’s 10% estimate of cash payouts -I’ll use that here for easy but i think it could be more like 5%.
What would you get in the Scheme:
– If only the current loan is upheld, your balance would be reduced to 3500 – 2200 = £1300 and your guarantor released.
– If only the first loan is upheld and not the current one, the interest you paid on the first loan will clear the current balance and your refund amount would be c £1800, so reduced to about £180 in cash (or less)
– If both are upheld, your balance is cleared and you would get £3700 refund amount reduced to about £370 in cash (or less).
In administration:
– all the same calculations apply except you won’t get any cash payouts.
So what matters most for you is whether the administrators are more likely to uphold your claim than Amigo is. And there can’t be a guaranteed answer to that. But from my experience of seeing payday lender administration, the administrators normally try to use a process that produces roughly the same results as the Ombudsman would. And the Ombudsman is upholding 885 of Amigo cases.
I am not convinced Amigo is aiming to produce the same results as the ombudsman. It won’t give numbers about what it expects its uphold rate to be. It has listed a lot of factors that it will look at (see Schedule 4 of its Explanatory Statement https://www.amigoscheme.co.uk/docs/ExplanatoryStatement.pdf) but not said how they would be applied in a case. So I am worried.
Because there was a break of several years between your loans, they will be effecitvley looked at seperately. So two “1 loan” cases. I suspect these 1 loan cases are the ones Amigo is more likely to reject as I think it is accepting that a lot of its top up loans should not have been given. (Actually there are big problems with how Amigo will decide redress on top up loans, but they dont affect you.)
If you are worried about this too, you should consider voting against the Scheme and prefer to take your chances in administration.
The decision about stopping payments – how unaffordable are they at the moment? Is making them causing you to get deeper into debt else where or struggle to pay bills?
Lee says
I am struggling month to month yes and it would be a big chunk each month saving this amount to help elsewhere
Peter says
I currently have a loan with Amigo. Upon complaining Amigo agreed to release the guarantor and waive all interest payments. I am still liable for the original loan, that’s in payment arrears.
I currently have a complaint with the FOS, and I’m awaiting a reply.
Where do I stand, and what should I do next?
Thanks.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Your complaint at FOS – did you have other Amigo loans that weren’t upheld?
Peter says
I think it’s just one outstanding loan.
Because im vulnerable with ongoing mental health issues and I had a large addiction at the time and the whole loan was unaffordable and I’m long term unemployed and have requested the loan to be written off
Sara (Debt Camel) says
What other debts do you have?
Peter says
Credit cards, overdraft, rent arrears, Satsuma loan (also with FOS) , Safetynet credit, council tax arrears, Mobile phone, broadband, friends and family
Total debt about 15k
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Have you talked to a debt adviser? It can be very hard work for anyone dealing with such a large number of debts, if you have mental health problems it can be overwhelming.
Peter says
Thanks Sara.
Yes indeed but I was advised bankruptcy that costs money and would limit work options in the future for my industry.
But for now what do you suggest I do with Amigo as I’m still awaiting a response from FOS.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Is there a reason a debt relief order is not possible?
If you are long term unemployed, I suggest you should ignore worries about future employment and clear your debts even if this means bankruptcy. It is very rare for FOS to recommend a complete write off. And even if they do, at the moment Amigo may ignore them.
Peter says
I really don’t want my name to be public in a register
I may get some temp work soon.
I need to have another chat with a debt advisor. Is Stepchange or Payplan good? Or any other service you would suggest?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest you talk to your local Citizens Advice. They may be able to help you by writing letters for you which StepChange and Payplan won’t. Also they are good at dealing with “priority debts” such as council tax and rent arrears.
That also set up more debt relief orders than all the other debt advice agencies combined.
I do encourage you to revisit a debt relief order. It only costs £90 and it clears your debts in a year of making no payments. Being on the Insolvency register for only a year is no big deal compared to the peace of mind of being debt free and not having to deal with such a lot of creditors. Satsuma is also going into a Scheme like Amigo so you wont get a good refund from there either.
I hope you can get part-time work, it could be a good first step for you. But it may not leave you much better off as your benefits will fall.
mr C W says
Is it looking like amigo will go insolvent ? If they go insolvent, does that mean that any remaining amount owing, is immediately wiped off ? I currently have a balance of £6300. Would this be owed to someone else if Amigo go ? I hear all the refund etc, but if they were no longer a company, it would make things much financially better if I had that £350 a month not going out anymore
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Amigo say they will go into administration if the Scheme is not approved. This does not get rid of your current debt. The administraors will try to collect the money.
BUT you can make a claim to the administrators if your loan is unaffordable. You may get back exactly the same as you would in the Scheme…
How much did you borrow? Is this your first loan from Amigo or a top up? How much have you paid to it so far?
And you may be better off in administration if your claim is accepted than if there is a Scheme and Amigo rejects your claim.
Mr C W says
Hi. Thanks for the reply. Took out a top up in November 2018. This paid off the previous loan and the new loan was £8500. I have paid 26 payments of £363.59 totalling £9453.34 and have a current balance of £6106.81. I have been on the website as advised and instigated a claim and also voted. Whilst I have been behind a few times with payments, my guarantor has never had to step in. Thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Ok so you have repaid more than you borrowed on your current loan.
If both loans are upheld by Amigo in the Scheme then your balance will be cleared and you will get possibly 10%, possibly less, back of the interest you have paid.
If Amigo only upholds the second loan you would expect the balance would be cleared but your refund would be less… The problem here is that Amigo would apply their “unpaid interest deduction” which could be well over a thousand pounds, depends on how much remained of the first loan when you took the top up. See https://debtcamel.co.uk/amigo-unpaid-interest-remove-ccjs/ for more about this. This would leave you still owing Amigo more and no cash refund.
In this situation you may well be better if the Scheme doesnt go ahead but Amigo goes into administration.
Then your loan isnt written off, but you make a claim just as you would to the Scheme. If both loans are upheld, your balance is cleared but there wouldnt be a cash refund. If only the last loan is upheld it is VERY UNLIKELY there would be an “unpaid interest deduction” as the Ombudsmna never does this and administrators try to roughly follow what the Ombudsman would do,.
Mr C W says
Thank you for your advice. I will keep a print out, so I know what to do as this moves forward.
Mark Chassy says
Sara,
I am a guarantor who was pressured into doing so by a former employer. I have already made a complaint. I haven’t paid any money and don’t want to receive any money. I just want to be released as guarantor. Does it make any difference how I vote?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
As you haven’t paid any money, what you could get from the Amigo Scheme if your claim is upheld is exactly what you could get from administration if your claim is upheld.
But how likely are Amigo to uphold your claim? They don’t have a good track record of upholding these sort of undue influence complaints so far.
Administrators tend to follow roughly what the Ombudsman does, so you may think you are more likely to have your complaint upheld there? It’s hard to be sure with this sort of unusual complaint.
Would the loan repayments be affordable for you – could you pay them out of your income and still pay all your own bills, debts and everyday expenses? If no, then you have two complaints – an affordability complaint and an undue influence complaint. Two ways to win is better than one!
Mark Chassy says
Thanks for the advice. No unfortunately, I am much more financially responsible than my own manager was. So I can’t make the affordability complaint. The fact is that amigo are not giving any definitive answers to complaints, so I am guessing that they are waiting to see which way the wind blows.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
No Amigo will not answer your complaint know, they want it to go into the Scheme. But from last year, they didn’t have a good record of upholding this sort of guarantor complaint.
So you can hope they will be different now and vote for the Scheme. Or decide you may have more luck with administrators and vote No. It isn’t an easy decision and there is no hard evidence to base it on.
Louise says
Hi Sara,
Thank you for all of your help with this, your website has been my go-to over the past few months.
I am a guarantor and complained to Amigo last May on the basis I was coerced and it was unaffordable to me. They took ages to come back to me so I sent it off to FOS after 8 weeks. Amigo then rejected my appeal (their response to me seemed generic as it was full of inaccuracies) FOS are understandably behind and as yet I do not have a case-handler. In the meantime the borrower – whom I have not had contact with for many months – has defaulted every month for about 6 months now. Amigo used to call and email me weekly but this has stopped recently, assuming this is because of the scheme. I have sent Amigo my bank statements and payslips dating before and after the loan was paid out to prove this is not affordable to me.
I just wanted your advice on how I should continue with this and should I just vote NO to the scheme – I don’t actually want any compensation because I haven’t made any payments, I have repeatedly refused to because I do not have the money. All I want is to be removed as guarantor but I’m worried Amigo don’t actually care because ultimately they can take me to court for an attachment order on my property.
Are you able to offer any advice please on what you think is likely to happen in my situation, whether the scheme is approved or not? Thank you so much!
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Amigo has been very random with their complaint handling over the last year, and especially poor with this sort of guarantor complaint about people being pressured to be the guarantor.
FOS are stopping work on Amigo cases apart from a very few which are priority – if you don’t know you are in that category you should assume FOS won’t make any progress :(
So you will have to put a claim into the Amigo if the Scheme goes ahead and a claim into the administrators if the Scheme doesn’t go ahead.
I guess you are feeling worried that Amigo will again reject your complaint. You will be complaining on two grounds, an affordability complaint and a coercion complaint. It can be simpler to win affordability complaints, but it is unclear how well Amigo will handle these. It is worrying that it hasn’t said openly that it intends to uphold the same high percentage that the Ombudsman does.
From seeing a lot of payday lender administrations, I know administrators try to mimic roughly what FOS would have decided. Obviously, I can’t say they will uphold your complaint, but you may feel more confident that they would compared to Amigo?
As you haven’t paid anything there is nothing to be refunded. The only difference between the Scheme and Administration is the chance that your claim will be upheld. So you should vote Yes if you want to go into the Scheme and no if you prefer to take your chance in administration.
Ian says
A few questions…
Who is overseeing the Upholding or Rejection of Claims now, or can Amigo decide and arbitrarily reject virtually everything?
Who is counting or overseeing the vote count, or do we have to take Amigo on trust?
In the event of Administration, would the insolvency Practitioner really pursue those who defaulted? What if everyone did? Presumably they would have to manage the affairs of Amigo for years or could it be sold?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Who is overseeing the Upholding or Rejection of Claims now, or can Amigo decide and arbitrarily reject virtually everything?
So Amigo has published some vague guidelines as to how it will uphold or reject claims – they are in Schedule 4 of the Explanatory Statement (https://www.amigoscheme.co.uk/docs/ExplanatoryStatement.pdf) – they aren’t much help in guessing what will happen to your case. they could be great or dreadful – as Amigo isn’t saying what % of claims it expects to uphold, who knows?
If Amigo rejects a claim, you can appeal it to “the Scheme Adjudicator” – this will be some firm like Grant Thornton, they haven’t been appointed yet.
Who is counting or overseeing the vote count, or do we have to take Amigo on trust?
I think Amigo is rigging the vote against people with current loans, but I do expect them to count this correctly.
In the event of Administration, would the insolvency Practitioner really pursue those who defaulted?
You can then put in a claim to the administrators, just as you would have done to Amigo.
They will “expect” you to pay. If you don’t it will harm your credit record – but any negative marks on your credit record will be deleted if you win your claim.
I haven’t seen a guarantor loan company go through administration. My guess is if you don’t pay they will ask your guarantor to pay, but if your guarantor cancels their direct debit, then there won’t be a lot the administrators will do until they have sorted out your claim. Your guarantor’s credit record cant be harmed as the Amigo debt isn’t there. The administrators aren’t going to take either of you to court with an outstanding claim.
Presumably they would have to manage the affairs of Amigo for years or could it be sold?
They will not want to “collect out” the loan book, waiting for everyone to pay. That worked ok for payday loans but Amigo loans are too long term. So they will want to sell the loan book.
It may be hard to do that until they have sorted out the claims as they would have to say they will buy back the ones where the claim is upheld. In a the odd case that’s fine, but if it’s going to be a LOT of the loans then the debt purchaser will see this as a major hassle and offer less money accordingly.
I think people should be happy if their loans are sold. Debt purchasers are usually a lot nicer to deal with than Amigo! Much easier to reach a good agreement about an affordable monthly repayment.
Johnny says
Hi Sara,
Thanks again for all your help. I see that some of the shareholders are trying to give you and us the creditors a bad name on their website forums. Not really what I would want to read if they wanted creditors to vote in favour of the SOA. Remember shareholders we can read your forums as well!
As well as writing to Amigo, FOS, FCA in relation to my complaint for redress I have written to my local MP as I feel that this now needs pressure to come from the bench’s of parliament. And I would encourage others to do the same. I don’t want to see people losing their jobs with the closure of a company but their will be more Amigos in the future and hopefully more tightly regulated. My vote would be No for the scheme as I know that my case will be better in an administration. And I’ll be honest I really don’t want to see the Amigo Board take a pay day of £7million because they have done a great job while we are paid 10% of our claims in final settlement.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
I suggest you ignore investor forums. They have no idea of the psychological pressure of having an Amigo loan, or Amigo’s aggressive debt collection practices. They just look at the interest rate and think it’s not so bad. No need to get worked up by reading them.
Nadia says
having read the information on amigos site I am absolutely appalled at their offering!
I have had various loans with amigo over the years and have paid approximately 13k in interest to them! I still have one Loan outstanding and owe them 11k as I have had to drastically reduce the repayment as it’s unaffordable.
Would I be right in saying that if they agreed to redress on all loans past and present then I would get a full refund on all loans (not reduced by the scheme) the 11k would be repaid by them?
Or would the previous loans fall under the reduced amount under the scheme? Just thinking if I said no then I may only get redress on the current Loan which would not be enough to clear the balance?
Is it only cash payments that fall under the scheme?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
would I be right in saying that if they agreed to redress on all loans past and present then I would get a full refund on all loans (not reduced by the scheme) the 11k would be repaid by them?
That depends how much you have borrowed and how much you have repaid. It sounds very likely that if all the loans are upheld, then either the balance would be cleared or massively reduced. The balance may well be cleared but I can’t be 100% sure without the detailed numbers.
Or would the previous loans fall under the reduced amount under the scheme?
The “balance reduction” part is paid “in full”. This is exactly what would happen in administration.
The “get paid 10% (or less possibly) of your refund” only applies to the cash payout in the Scheme, not the balance reductions.
The very big problem for you is, what if Amigo doesn’t uphold all your loans? There may be some loans that only ran for a few months where there wasn’t much interest paid. You might assume it wouldn’t matter much if Amigo didn’t uphold those…
But in this situation Amigo makes a deduction “for unpaid interest” where a loan wasn’t upheld but was settled by a top-up loan that was upheld. They are trying to say the previous loan was never properly settled (even though it was) and so they charge you the extra interest on it.
For some people these deductions are only a few hundred, but other people have had their refunds reduced by thousands, and been left owing a large balance because of this.
The Ombudsman never applies these deductions. So I don’t think administrators would.
The result is, that if you had 5 loans and Amigo upheld 3 of them, and the administration the same 3 were upheld, you would be faced with a larger balance in the Scheme than in administration ☹
PS I shortened your rather long comment, hope thats OK
Tom says
Dear Sara/All,
I just want to do a final check that I have a clear understanding of this situation before I cast my vote.
I had a loan of approx £6500 in Sept 2018. I’ve paid back approx £9500.
I actually had a complaint with FOS upheld and was awaiting a response from Amigo but they didn’t respond and chose to put into the scheme, I’m one of the very unlucky few who missed out by a matter of days despite FOS upholding my complaint.
Anyway, I’m unsure it’ll be appropriate for the Guarantor to cancel their direct debit in this situation, but would try if you felt it was best.
As the cash refund amount would be somewhere between 5% and 10% this has little bearing on my decision. If Amigo went into administration, would it actually be easier to stop payments at this point until the Administrators were appointed and looked at my claim? Would they hound and harass less than Amigo themselves?
At the moment, I am on the side of NO, but I just want to clarify before I actually out in my vote.
For clarity,
Paying approx £317 p/m until Sept 2021.
Have already paid off the balance (plus around £3.5k-£4K more.
Thanks,
Tom
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Unlucky :(
how affordable are the repayments at the moment? Obviously they were unaffordable at the point the loan was taken, that was the FOS decision, but your situation may have improved or got worse since then?
Tom says
Hi Sara,
The financial situation is dramatically improved and I’m in a position to continue making payment until the end of the loan if required.
Tom
Sara (Debt Camel) says
As the payments are affordable, there is little harm* in continuing to make them.
In the Scheme, if your claim is upheld then you will get the balance cleared (because you have paid more than you borrowed), plus a tiny amount (perhaps 10% Amigo says, I think that’s optimistic and it may well be less) of the interest you have paid, plus ALL the repayments you make during the scheme back in full.
In Administration you get much the same if your claim is upheld – the balance cleared plus ALL the repayments you make during the scheme back in full. But there will be no cash element paid.
So as you will be getting the repayments back if your claim is uphled, there is no reason to stop paying them unless they are unaffordable.
* I said “little harm” not “no harm”. That is because any payments you make before the scheme or Administration starts will not be repaid in full. So there is case for stopping paying these and then starting again in the Scheme / administration. It’s up to you if you think this is worth the hassle for you and the aggro you will get and your guarantor being informed.
Tom says
Thanks for the explanation, I really do appreciate it. Can I finally just confirm, as it’s probably the major defining point, if I pay, let’s say £2000 in payments whilst the scheme is ongoing, only then for my claim to be upheld, I’d receive the £2000 payments, in cash and in full) (because balance already cleared), plus the 5-10% interest in cash?
If so, then I will continue making payments as from my May payment onwards, my cash will effectively be coming back to me (obviously providing they also uphold/if the administrators uphold).
Thanks,
Tom
Sara (Debt Camel) says
yes that is correct. (It’s probably obvious but the payments you are getting back in full will obviously not have increased the interest you have paid.)
And the same applies in administration. This causes huge confusion as no-one expects it! So when they get those refunds in full and they think it’s the % payout but it looks much too large!
For you the only difference is the chance of your loan being upheld by Amigo v the chance of it being upheld in administration as you say the small cash refund isnt that important.
Tom says
Thank you for that!
I think for me, that settles my decision on NO. My belief is that if the administrators would do what FOS would likely do, that gives me a better pathway.
Thanks again,
Tom
Sean Brooker says
Hi
What does value of vote mean? I voted no, and it stated it could be worth a £1. I really don’t believe this voting system, will be a fair vote. I voted no.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
All the votes are counted in two ways – one “by number” where everyone’s vote is the same. And then by a weighting factor. I agree the weighting doesn’t look fair but that is a matter that can be raised in the second court hearing.
Sean Brooker says
Why is it not just yes and no? What is a weighting factor!
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Because there are two tests, one by number of votes and a second weighted by a size factor.
I didn’t make this up, it’s very bizarre what Amigo is using.
Sean Brooker says
So if the first vote is no, can the weighted vote overturn the first?
Almost making sure they get two chances to get it through!
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Amigo didn’t invent this voting, it’s standard. You could equally argue it gives Amigo two ways to lose, if either goes against them.
Amigo did invent the weighting system which is just weird, but the fairness of that can be argued at the second court hearing which will consider the voting.
Scott says
Hi All,
I have just received my message about voting and have like some others voted no.
It gives me a cash vote of £1 and it will allow me to change my vote if I wish to.
Have any readers voted yes ( we are not here to judge what is best for you) and been given a higher cash vote and no option to change your vote?
Scott
Kayla says
I took a 2000 loan out then 2 months later I topped up to 10,000 on the 10,000 loan so far iv paid around 13,000 and I still currently owe just over 7000 no more interest is now being added as iv reached maximum amount of interest.
My repayments are 427 a month iv struggled to pay, I do believe I have a valid complaint. Payslips and bank statements was not checked, iv had times iv had to ring and pay less, one payment was taken from guarantor. My guarantor is also my partner who I live with.
Should I continue to make these 427 payments my credit rating is very low anyway and has been since before I took out the loan.
I think I’ll be voting against as cant see how voting for will help me.
if my complaint is agreed will anything be taken of my balance as I still owe 7 grand so would stopping the payments cause more problems in the long run thanks
Sara (Debt Camel) says
if my complaint is agreed will anything be taken of my balance as I still owe 7 grand
From those numbers, if you win both loans your balance will be cleared.
Should I continue to make these 427 payments my credit rating is very low anyway and has been since before I took out the loan.
– So every payment you struggle to make now, means you will get very little back, possibly 10%, possibly less, in the Scheme.
– If you stop paying it will harm your credit record – but that doesn’t bother you. the default would anyway be removed if you win the affordability complaint to the Amigo Scheme (or you win the claim in administration – exactly the same).
– If you stop paying your guarantor also has to – as it’s your partner he presumably know all about this. His credit record isn’t affected as the Amigo loan isn’t on there.
– You will get some hassle from Amigo – there is no time for them to go to court before the Scheme starts and they have said that they will not commence legal proceedings in the Scheme until your claim has been decided.
In your situation apart from the hassle, it makes a lot of sense to stop paying if making the payments is difficult.
I think I’ll be voting against as cant see how voting for will help me.
So you are effectively choosing between the Scheme (vote Yes) and administration (vote No).
As your balance is so large, the most important thing is probably to get that cleared.
So what matters is whether the administrators are more likely to uphold your claim than Amigo is.
– Obviously there is no guaranteed answer. I have seen several payday lender administrations and the administrators normally try to do roughly what the Ombudsman might.
– Will Amigo? It won’t give numbers about what it expects its uphold rate to be. It gives a lot of factors that it will look at in Schedule 4 of its Explanatory Statement https://www.amigoscheme.co.uk/docs/ExplanatoryStatement.pdf but not said how they would be applied in a particular case.
One other issue for you is what if Amigo doesn’t uphold the first much smaller loan? It did that quite a lot last year when people has several loans. You might assume it wouldn’t matter much as you hardly paid any interest on it, but in this situation Amigo makes a deduction “for unpaid interest” on your first loan. They are trying to say it was never properly settled (even though it was) and so they charge you the extra interest on it. A couple of years interest on £2000 would be a buig deduction from your refund and could well leave you still owing money :(
The Ombudsman doesn’t do this so I don’t think administrators would. The result is, you could have a better result in administration if they only uphold the second loan that you might in the Scheme if they only uphold the second loan and then take money off for “unpaid interest”..
Your partner should also make a claim in the Scheme or in administration, and vote. This gives two ways for him to be released as guarantor – if he wins his case or you win yours.
If he wins his case but you don’t win yours, as he is released, you can then make an affordable payment arrangement to repay the loan, which would be a lot lower than the current repayments.
It won’t give you more cash refund than winning your claim but it improves the chances.
Amandeep says
Hi Sara
Long story short I had taken a loan put for £10,000 and I’m paying every month instalment of £396. I have put in a complaint with resolver since October 2019
It feel like amigo are modern day bandits.
I have around 15months left to pay of high instalments
What should I do?
If I don’t pay will my guarantor be affected?
The reason I ask is normally I’d get a email or text from amigo saying I have not paid my monthly instalments
They normally contact me however since I raised the complnt they go straight to my guarantor and threat him
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Was your complaint rejected by Amigo? Was it then sent to the ombudsman?
It looks as though you had a 5 year loan:
– the remaining balance is nearly £6000
– you have so far paid nearly 8000 in interest. Amigo thinks you may get 10% of that back in the Scheme, so £800 (I think it could be less than that!).
In the Scheme, if your claim is upheld you would get your £6000 balance cleared and possibly that £800.
In administration, if your claim is upheld you would get your balance cleared but no cash payout.
Getting that large balance cleared looks much more important than a tiny cash amount… so the key question is, is your complaint more likely to be upheld by Amigo in the Scheme or the Administrators if Amigo fails?
Obviously there is no certain answer to that! I have seen several payday lender administrations and the administrators normally try to use a process that produces roughly the same results as the Ombudsman would. The Ombudsman is upholding 88% of Amigo cases.
I am not convinced Amigo is aiming to produce the same results as the ombudsman because it won’t give numbers about what it expects its uphold rate to be. It has listed a lot of factors that it will look at (see Schedule 4 of its Explanatory Statement https://www.amigoscheme.co.uk/docs/ExplanatoryStatement.pdf) but it hasn’t explained how they would be applied in a case. I am worried. One loan cases like yours may be difficult.
You may decide you would prefer to take the chance of your complaint being upheld in administration and so vote against the Scheme.
In your situation (payments unaffordable, already paid more than you borrowed) there is a strong case for you stopping payments. If making the payments means you are getting behind with bills and running up more debts that is bad news as these claims are unlikely to be quickly resolved in the Scheme.
If you stop paying, it will hurt your credit record (but the negative mark will be removed if you win your claim in the Scheme or administration).
Your guarantor will need to cancel their direct debit to Amoiugo (or Continous Payment Authority if they are paying by card.) It won’t hurt their credit score as the Amigo loan does not show on there.
Amigo will make unpleasant noises but there is no time for them to take you or your guarantor to court before the Scheme starts and they have said that they will not commence legal proceeding until a claim in the Scheme has been decided.
PS your guarantor also has right to complain that the loan was unaffordable for you. And possibly also for them? This is worth doing – it gives two ways for your guarantor to be released – if they win their complaint or you win yours.
Amandeep says
Hi Sara
Thank you for the reply 🙏
Apologies but the complaint was made in October 2020 not 2019.
I have put in a complaint but amigo had taken months to reply so I escalated it to Financial Ombudsman
Tbh they never checked my situation when I had taken out the loan.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
ok, I wondered how the complaint could have been going on for so long!
It doesn’t change what I wrote about your options now.
STACEY MCWILLIAMS says
Hello
I’ve only just become aware of this situation with amigo loans. I took a loan in 2016 and gave been trying and failing to get a full detail of what I’ve paid. I’ve emailed, called etc. The website doesn’t recognize my mobile number and there doesn’t seem to be anyway to login without that information. I therefore cant vote
Does anyone have any advice on this?
Thank you very much
Mal says
Hi, I have same problem. I emailed them and they got back to me saying they would get an engineer to sort it and someone from their team will call me when sorted. That was yesterday so I don’t suppose any will be done over holiday weekend.
Nika says
Hi I was the guarantor for my mum. Within the first two months of her having the loan from amigo loans she was finding it difficult to pay back the loan. In the end myself and my siblings had to make the final 6 payments. I think they whole loan was over a couple of years or so. Can’t remember off the top of my head now. Anyway. Will I get any money back? If so. Do I need to complete a form or is it too late now that the scheme may come into play. Also. If I do win and they refund me the money I have paid for the loan. Will my mum then owe the outstanding amount to amigo loans? The loan was paid in full about a year ago now.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
Will I get any money back?
You may, if you complain that the loan was unaffordable for you or your mum, it depends on whether Amigo uphold the complaint or not… No-one knows as Amigo haven’t really given any useful information about this. If Amigo reject the complaint you will get nothing.
If you do get some money back it will only be a very small percentage of what you have paid – Amigo say possibly 10%, I think it could be a lot less, maybe under 5%. (See https://debtcamel.co.uk/amigo-scheme-estimated-numbers-not-good/ for the details.)
Your choice is whether to agree with the Amigo Scheme giving you such a very small amount (in which case vote Yes) or if you think that’s so low as to be insulting and it’s better that Amigo goes bust and don’t take advantage of people like your mum in future (in which case vote No.)
Will my mum then owe the outstanding amount to amigo loans?
She won’t be worse off than she is at the moment, ie not owing any money. But that is because you aren’t getting a proper refund, just scraps.
Debs says
I got a email but I don’t know if this scheme will help me. I was guarantor and got a ccj from amigo long story my friend was stupid to get a topup when the first loan was difficult to pay 😒 all it did was give her some cash to pay it for a bit longer. Now she’s in an iva and im paying interum the amount amigo said was too low. Can I claim or is it too late as loan sold? I’ve not paid much and I want the large amount left gone or reduced.
Sara (Debt Camel) says
It probably doesn’t matter that the loan is sold. Amigo says it will try to sort things out with Intrum so you get the full benefit of the Scheme. In other Schemes and administrations this has happened but it depends on the debt purchaser co-operating. So in the Money Shop’s Scheme, there were several debt purchasers and all but one let the Money Shop sort things out properly. I would be surprised if Intrum chose to be difficult about this. Sorry no certainty though.
If we assume Intrum will be helpful…
In the Scheme you can complain either because the loan was unaffordable for the borrower OR because it was unaffordable for you. It sounds as though both may be the case? In which case complain about both, it’s two ways to win.
If your claim is upheld in the Scheme, then balance you owe will be written off completely as you were the guarantor, so there is no reason why you have to repay the amount borrowed as it wasn’t borrowed by you. You would also get a refund in cash of a small percentage of the amount you have paid, Amigo says possibly 10%, I think it may be less.
The borrower’s debt won’t be increased by you making this claim. As she is in an IVA there is no point in her bothering to make a claim at all. If she isnt sure about this she should talk to her IVA firm.
You can also make a claim if Amigo go into administration. Same points apply as in the Scheme except you would not get the tiny cash refund amount.
So what matters to you is if Amigo is more likely to uphold your claim or the administrators would be? This concerns me – I have seen several lender administrations and the administrators typically try to decide on the claims in a way that produces roughly the same results as the Ombudsman would, and the Ombudsman has been upholding 88% of Amigo claims.
I am not convinced Amigo is intending to uphold all the claims the ombudsman wopuld have. If that is right, you could be better off in administration rather than the Scheme, so you may want to vote No?
Sara (Debt Camel) says
PS Amigo is not intending to remove CCJs even if it upholds a claim. I have no idea why not. In this situation the money Shop has been removing CCJs in their scheme. I hope Amigo will change their mind about this… but if they don’t, then come back here after your claim has been accepted and I can talk about your options for the CCJ.